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 Topic: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.

 (Read 37335 times)
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  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #150 - April 05, 2009, 09:38 AM

    Quote from: Ansar al-Zindiqi
    Even Nikita Khruschev hypocritically understood that the Taj Mahal was built by slave labor which resulted in  thousands of deaths. Sure, it is truly a beautiful structure and much is made of the story of love behind it but someone like me has a tendency to ponder the human costs. The love story behind it is great for tourist brochures and other things but it sure is a mega-project that speaks of one man's vanity. It's great to peddle a love story of two aristocrats but why should a story of love blind later generations to what was done in order to build the thing?

    There is nothing I disagree with here. But other civilisations had similar monumental projects carried out at the expense of the greater good and the welfare of the common citizen. Why were the pyramids built? Anything other than to appease the vanity and god complex of some theocratic tyrants? This didn't stop me from admiring the pyramids when I've been to Egypt.

    I am aware that the cultural achievements of "Islamic civilisations" pale in contrast to those of other civilisations, but they nevertheless exist. I am also aware that these cultural and/or scientific achievements (which can never be attributed to the inherent glory of Islam, nor evoked to exonerate Islam from blame) were often carried out despite the opposition of Islamic fundamentalists. So I think our positions are not too divergent.


    I'm basically focusing on claims of "Islamic originality" here. In my view, "enjoying" the splendour and majesty of an architectural wonder requires some balance that will offset the typical affect disorders we have seen at work here. (Pleas "to be left alone" are an obvious symptom:D). When people ignore the material conditons and the social realities that led up to those conditions that allowed for slave labour to build such wonders and are simply awestruck then this is a case of basking in the light without appreciating the role of the dark side. In this case, the use of slave labour, wasted lives and casual cruelty that relegates the memories of the victims to being a mere footnote of history.

    Carl Jung was a great man who contributed a lot in his lifetime. However, he was as human as any of us and this is a case of him not being conscious of his own shadow much less historical materialism. The last bit itself (historical materialism) being insufficient on it's own to explain the role of religion and the power of beliefs  but which serves as a tremendous heuristic for understanding how societies organize themselves to make such works possible. "Islamic" or otherwise.
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #151 - April 05, 2009, 09:38 AM

    Well, this thread derailed.
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #152 - April 05, 2009, 09:44 AM

    Well, this thread derailed.


    For an apologist for Islam like you it sure did. Cheesy It just goes to show that the material world is a mother****** and people have to learn to accept that.
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #153 - April 05, 2009, 09:55 AM

    Well, this thread derailed.


    For an apologist for Islam like you it sure did. Cheesy It just goes to show that the material world is a mother****** and people have to learn to accept that.

    I'm no apologist for islam, just hoping we could get this thread back on topic. Tongue
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #154 - April 05, 2009, 04:05 PM

    Well, this thread derailed.


    For an apologist for Islam like you it sure did. Cheesy It just goes to show that the material world is a mother****** and people have to learn to accept that.

    I'm no apologist for islam, just hoping we could get this thread back on topic. Tongue


    It is on topic and has gone deeper that the surface features that a lot of people point to as evidence of something "good" about Islam. Now if you can find something "good" about Islam please let us know We can take of that delusion right here and it's very convenient. Wink
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #155 - April 05, 2009, 04:11 PM

    Well, this thread derailed.


    For an apologist for Islam like you it sure did. Cheesy It just goes to show that the material world is a mother****** and people have to learn to accept that.


    Frollo has not made nearly enough posts for you to jump to the conclusion he is an apologist for Islam.

    fuck you
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #156 - April 05, 2009, 05:34 PM

    Well, this thread derailed.


    For an apologist for Islam like you it sure did. Cheesy It just goes to show that the material world is a mother****** and people have to learn to accept that.


    Frollo has not made nearly enough posts for you to jump to the conclusion he is an apologist for Islam.


    This coming from someone who thinks Paul Robeson was cool. It just goes to show that someone who admires an apologist for Stalin can't recognize an apologist for Islam. Cheesy

    Quote
    It is personally painful to me to realize that so gifted a man as Robeson should have been tricked by his own bitterness and by a total inability to understand the nature of political power in general, or Communist aims in particular, into missing the point of his own critique... - James Baldwin


    http://www.wpunj.edu/newpol/issue25/finger25.htm

    What a sick joke you are. Now how about finding something good about Islam? I know you can do it.
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #157 - April 05, 2009, 07:28 PM

    What a sick joke you are.


    Go fuck yourself

    fuck you
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #158 - April 05, 2009, 07:59 PM

    It most likely that there are many more Indians who fully understand that a lot of slave labour went into building the thing. These building projects required a lot of manpower in a time when unions and human rights were not even considered at all. Especially by the Muslim rulers of India and in this case the guy who commissioned it was a foreigner.  Good ol' Shah Jahan. Roll Eyes At least he may have understood that his beloved had died after giving birth to her fourteenth child.

    Yes I am aware of that but it makes no difference to the architectural and aesthetic qualities of the result. Exactly the same could be said about most of the old buildings that are admired today. None of them were built under modern health and safety regulations.

    Take the ancient Roman buildings as examples. People have no qualms about admiring them for what they are, even though they were built with slave labour. People talk about the legacy of Roman culture that modern Europe was largely founded on even though in many ways Rome was utterly barbaric by our standards.

    Quote
    To top it off there was going to be an identical structure in black marble but it never went beyond the preliminary stages. That would have meant double the beauty and majesty as well as double the death rate. So there you have it. It should be expected of me since I'm a goddamn anarchist who engaged in labour organizing in my younger years. We tend to be able to look beyond the exterior appearances and oftentimes find something that reveals horrible truths.

    I know about the second building he planned for his own tomb. Fine. This still makes no difference to the beauty of the Taj. The building itself is inanimate and innocent.

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #159 - April 06, 2009, 04:06 PM

    What a sick joke you are.


    Go fuck yourself


    My oh my! Getting called on your hypocrisy sure gets the blood pressure up don't it? Now how about getting this thread back on it's rails by telling us about something "good" in Islam? Cheesy
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #160 - April 06, 2009, 04:43 PM

    It most likely that there are many more Indians who fully understand that a lot of slave labour went into building the thing. These building projects required a lot of manpower in a time when unions and human rights were not even considered at all. Especially by the Muslim rulers of India and in this case the guy who commissioned it was a foreigner.  Good ol' Shah Jahan. Roll Eyes At least he may have understood that his beloved had died after giving birth to her fourteenth child.

    Yes I am aware of that but it makes no difference to the architectural and aesthetic qualities of the result. Exactly the same could be said about most of the old buildings that are admired today. None of them were built under modern health and safety regulations.

    Take the ancient Roman buildings as examples. People have no qualms about admiring them for what they are, even though they were built with slave labour. People talk about the legacy of Roman culture that modern Europe was largely founded on even though in many ways Rome was utterly barbaric by our standards.


    The fact that these things were built by slave labour should be considered and not just in passing. Knowing that history is what is written down and the past is what happened is absolutely crucial when taking onto account the claims of tourist brochures and shills. Sure. Go ahead and enjoy the architectural and aesthetic qualities of a building but if nobody had ever taken the human costs into consideration it's quite likely that  the social changes that have led up to secular democracy (however flawed it is) may have never happened.

    Quote
    To top it off there was going to be an identical structure in black marble but it never went beyond the preliminary stages. That would have meant double the beauty and majesty as well as double the death rate. So there you have it. It should be expected of me since I'm a goddamn anarchist who engaged in labour organizing in my younger years. We tend to be able to look beyond the exterior appearances and oftentimes find something that reveals horrible truths.

    I know about the second building he planned for his own tomb. Fine. This still makes no difference to the beauty of the Taj. The building itself is inanimate and innocent.


    Did I ever say it was guilty of something? Of course not. The upshot of all this is that looking beyond surface features is something that has catalyzed social change and collective perceptions for the better. So we shouldn't be surprised as more people in India start understanding that the times of Muslim occupation are glorified on the bones of their ancestors. Majestic buildings may be inanimate and innocent on their own but taking the human costs into account leads to a "coming to consciousness" that is definitely lacking amongst Muslims and something that we in the West take for granted and what is the result? We have a fine example of that right here on this thread with a guy proclaiming admiration for someone who took guided tours of the USSR, gawked at the material improvements of brutal Five Year Plans and lived a cozy life of privilege while being a houseguest of Stalin.

    Contemplating dialectical materialism
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #161 - April 06, 2009, 04:54 PM

    The "Golden Age" of Islam was pretty freaking sweet.



    I love reading about it and hope to visit Cordova one day.


    Whatever you're reading I'm sure is pretty bogus. But then again lots of people see history though the reading the history of victors but don't reflect upon the fact they are even more eager to do so if the "victors" were not white Europeans.

    And Islamic architecture is cool too.


    I repeat. There is no such thing as Islamic architecture.
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #162 - April 06, 2009, 05:14 PM

    I agree that the Golden Age of Islam is pretty much a myth.

    Islam: where idiots meet terrorists.
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #163 - April 06, 2009, 05:30 PM

    Positive stereotypes are as irrelevant as negative stereotypes.

    Technically, saying that "Muslims are hospitable" isn't much different from saying that "Muslims are terrorists." Of course, we can always wax lyrical about how "tolerant" we are to produce such positive stereotypes, but such delusions do not validate the afore-mentioned stereotypes at all.

    I have met plenty of "inhospitable" Muslims.


    I was thinking that as I'm reading this thread, and I know these posts are older.  First of all, I know Christians from the Middle East who have the same traditions of hospitality and giving you everything, so it's not just Muslims.  Second of all, I know plenty of Muslims from the Middle East and here (the West) who are selfish, mean, inhospitable, and I have had shit stolen from me so many times by Muslims, problems I never had with 'kufaar'. So it's not a "Muslim" thing or a good thing about Islam, although it might be a good thing about Arabian or Middle Eastern culture that people are hospitable. 

    [this space for rent]
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #164 - April 06, 2009, 05:54 PM

    I don't see anything good that came out of Islam itself, meaning from the doctrines and rules of Islam.  OK other than getting the Bedouins to stop burying their baby girls alive.  A lot of this is subjective to. I don't find Islamic poetry (I mean the old stuff, not that claptrap we have today) particularly beautiful or inspiring; I don't like religious / spiritual poetry in general.  I can see where some of the older calligraphy is very aesthetically appealing and requires a lot of training and discipline to make it look the way it does, but I'm not into calligraphy myself.  Also, seeing how the art form has devolved with today's mass produced neon glitter wall hangings kind of takes away from the majesty - for me

    As for good things from Muslim cultures, I will say that some of the older music is good. Not the crap that passes for popular music today, but the old music, which sometimes grew out of Sufi religious devotion as well as simple folk traditions.  I also like Rai, which isn't Islamic, but comes from a Muslim culture and is sung by people with some connection, however nominal, to Islam.  Ditto with shebbo music (the form that many rai singers sung before rai developed, I don't remember the other name for this, but many started out as quasi-religious singers, they would sing at weddings and such).  There is a 7 CD set called Music of Islam that traces these different folk versions, with the thing being that it isn't Islamic at all, really, but the music of different cultures that happen to be Muslim, or the result of Islam and Muslims coming into contact with other cultures and what grew out of that. Anyway, if you're into world music and that sort of thing, it's a pretty decent set.

    I also like the foods of many cultures which happen to be Muslim majority.  Again, this is something of the people that has nothing to do with Islam.  I'm just trying to think of something good that I like that happens to be from places where Muslims dominate the culture.  I don't like to say that this is a result of Muslim culture, any more than soda bread is the result of a Catholic culture.  Do you know what I mean?

    [this space for rent]
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #165 - April 06, 2009, 06:36 PM

    Well said fading. Afro
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #166 - April 06, 2009, 07:50 PM

    What a sick joke you are.


    Go fuck yourself


    My oh my! Getting called on your hypocrisy sure gets the blood pressure up don't it?


    No, but being insulted by some arrogant snot-nosed punk does. I sincerely hope you act the same way offline as you do online, because if you do it would likely lead to regular beatings and social estrangement.

    Quote
    Now how about getting this thread back on it's rails by telling us about something "good" in Islam? Cheesy


    Already did upthread.

    fuck you
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #167 - April 06, 2009, 10:06 PM

    What a sick joke you are.


    Go fuck yourself


    My oh my! Getting called on your hypocrisy sure gets the blood pressure up don't it?


    No,


    Yeah right. As I said before, denial ain't just a river in Egypt.

    but being insulted by some arrogant snot-nosed punk does.


    Then you need to quit reading your own postings.

    I sincerely hope you act the same way offline as you do online, because if you do it would likely lead to regular beatings and social estrangement.


    Oh wow! How about doing a lil' ol' ritual in your living room by begging the Gods for my ultimate demise? Or maybe a fatwa? C'mon, how about it?

    Quote
    Now how about getting this thread back on it's rails by telling us about something "good" in Islam? Cheesy


    Already did upthread.


    Hmmm . . . let's see . . . . . looks like you got blown out over your praise of the call to prayer.

    Your claims about halal meat were deflated.

    and the wonderous references about "Islamic" architecture were hung out to dry.

    Have any more ideas about the "good things" in Islam you want to talk about?

  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #168 - April 06, 2009, 10:24 PM


    Yeah right. As I said before, denial ain't just a river in Egypt.


    1. I am in fact a hypocrite. Everybody is. Anybody who claims otherwise is a liar and a hypocrite.

    2. I never explained exactly WHY I think Robeson was cool, nor have I commented on his politics. So actually, you have no fucking clue what I think about his "Stalinist apologism". As usual, you are making ignorant assumptions, which is what started this little pissing match in the first place. If you hadn't made assumptions about a new member and displayed extreme discourtesy by calling him an epithet on the basis of a few short posts which could not possibly sustain your negative conclusions about him, we wouldn't be having this discussion now.

    Quote
    Then you need to quit reading your own postings.


    I'll cop to the arrogant part only.

    Quote
    Oh wow! How about doing a lil' ol' ritual in your living room by begging the Gods for my ultimate demise? Or maybe a fatwa? C'mon, how about it?


    All I'm saying is that either (a) you act this way in real life and nobody likes you and regularly get your ass beat or otherwise shit on by other people, or (b) you only act this way online because the anonymity and distance the internet provides allows you to do so with little fear of real-world consequences.

    Either way it speaks poorly about your character. And yes, it does annoy me a bit when people say things online that I'm pretty certain they would not have the balls to say to my face.

    Quote
    Hmmm . . . let's see . . . . . looks like you got blown out over your praise of the call to prayer.


    Blown out? I offered an entirely subjective opinion and others disagreed with it.

    Quote
    Your claims about halal meat were deflated.


    See above.

    Quote
    and the wonderous references about "Islamic" architecture were hung out to dry

    .

    See above. I think you're taking the topic waaay too seriously. Believe it or not, I really don't give a fuck. I just offered some opinions off the top of my head.

    Quote
    Have any more ideas about the "good things" in Islam you want to talk about?


    Objection. Asked and answered.

    Judge: Sustained.

    fuck you
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #169 - April 06, 2009, 11:19 PM

     
    Yeah right. As I said before, denial ain't just a river in Egypt.

     
    1. I am in fact a hypocrite. Everybody is. Anybody who claims otherwise is a liar and a hypocrite.


    That's a pretty good job of relativizing that you've done here. Did you do a lot of practice at this before you started posting on these forums? Roll Eyes

    2. I never explained exactly WHY I think Robeson was cool, nor have I commented on his politics. So actually, you have no fucking clue what I think about his "Stalinist apologism". As usual, you are making ignorant assumptions.


    Wrong. Not too many people who understand who he was and what he stood for will excuse him for being so lacking in conscience. But then again he helped start off a cottage industry of apologetics for the excesses of Stalinism that then contracted out for jihadis by the late Sixties. So he is a pioneer but of dubious value.

    Quote
    Then you need to quit reading your own postings.


    I'll cop to the arrogant part only.


    You've copped out to a hugely arrogant part way before you ever got here.

    Quote
    Oh wow! How about doing a lil' ol' ritual in your living room by begging the Gods for my ultimate demise? Or maybe a fatwa? C'mon, how about it?


    All I'm saying is that either (a) you act this way in real life and nobody likes you and regularly get your ass beat or otherwise shit on by other people, or


    More silly imprecations ad nauseam.

    (b) you only act this way online because the anonymity and distance the internet provides allows you to do so with little fear of real-world consequences.


    This sure sounds like a phishing ploy to elicit personal information by taking part in a flame war. Maybe you can infer my ethnic origins also. Cheesy

    Either way it speaks poorly about your character.


    LOL! Cheesy This is great. Before you go away can you tell me how you got so self-slamdunking in you choice of words?

    And yes, it does annoy me a bit when people say things online that I'm pretty certain they would not have the balls to say to my face.


    Who needs balls when instincts serve as a warning?

    Quote
    Hmmm . . . let's see . . . . . looks like you got blown out over your praise of the call to prayer.


    Blown out? I offered an entirely subjective opinion and others disagreed with it.


    By destroying your subjective opinion. Which is still pretty lame.

    Quote
    Your claims about halal meat were deflated.


    See above.


    I have and your subjective little opinions were shown to be masterpieces of shilling for Islam.

    Quote
    and the wonderous references about "Islamic" architecture were hung out to dry

    .

    See above. I think you're taking the topic waaay too seriously. Believe it or not, I really don't give a fuck. I just offered some opinions off the top of my head.


    Yeah right. This coming from someone who so easily slips into insults and then finally admits that he "doesn't give a f**k" . It's obvious that you did indeed "give a f**k and then found out that the wave you were riding on was not going to be such a fine surf but instead hit the rocks.

    Quote
    Have any more ideas about the "good things" in Islam you want to talk about?


    Objection. Asked and answered.

    Judge: Sustained.


    It was answered but with a view to evading the fact that I've caught you out on your words and shown how deeply ignorant you are of how a totalitarian system of thought control can sell baubles for the gullible to gaze at. So don't go pretending that you are a judge and jury rolled into one. The only thing about your position that is sustained is the effort to avoid feeling the full impact of gravity.
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #170 - April 06, 2009, 11:31 PM

    Ansar I'm not really impressed with the contemptuous way you are attacking anyone who suggests they like something about Islam, nor am I greatly impressed by this bout of posting between you and Q man.

    This is an ex muslim website, do you understand this?  meaning quite frankly that many of us will be able to say that we still like specific things.

    TBH I am getting sick and tired of seeing members being attacked for their personal likes.

    Why are you wasting your time attacking the already deconverted?

    I would hate to do this, but you best pull back some of the venom, otherwise myself or one of the other members of staff will have no choice but to issue a smite.

    If you have nothing nice to say about Islam, stay out of the thread.


    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #171 - April 07, 2009, 01:04 AM

    What a sick joke you are.

    Go fuck yourself

    My oh my! Getting called on your hypocrisy sure gets the blood pressure up don't it? Now how about getting this thread back on it's rails by telling us about something "good" in Islam? Cheesy

    Well I can tell you something good about Islam: it doesn't turn all Muslims into snarky bastards.

    Seriously, no matter what anyone said you would claim it had nothing to do with Islam but was due to other factors. You'd have a point too, of course. The thing is that you wouldn't be so strict on other groups, so rather than being logical and rational about your assessments you are in fact being rather bigoted.

    Islam promotes a certain amount of charity as being a good thing. So do some Christians. Now you would probably claim that a/ other groups also promote charity so it isn't exclusively Islamic and b/ it isn't necessarily even religious and c/ Islam might have nicked a pre-existing idea off the Christians and d/ most Muslims only do it because they think it will help them get to jannah.

    None of this matters. It's irrelevant to the central point of this thread. If a certain amount of charity is a good thing, and you can argue about that if you like, and if Islam promotes a certain amount of charity then that is a good thing about Islam. Period. Get the fuck over it.

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #172 - April 07, 2009, 01:07 AM

    So don't go pretending that you are a judge and jury rolled into one.  


    Oh, but I am. For my own principles and beliefs, I am indeed judge and jury...and it is up to the lawyers to convince me, and you have done a poor job, counselor.

    As to the rest of your post, I do find insanity interesting-- up to a point. I have now become bored so I will unilaterally terminate the discussion. For the time being, I will not be responding to your posts. If you want to learn how to be strident, arrogant and still disagree with people sanely, read Zaephon's posts (or mine for that matter, or half a dozen other assholes on this forum who manage to be slightly fucked-up assholes without being totally insane gaping assholes). Everybody, to one degree or another, is hateful, an asshole, crazy, arrogant, paranoid, hypocritical and a liar. But there is a line-- some are closer to it than others, but you have crossed over, in at least the first four. Like I said, I'll be effectively ignoring your posts from this point on, as this little debate is getting tiresome and going nowhere (yeah I'll take the blame for that as much as you), but if you get a grip and want to debate/discuss sensibly, just drop me a PM and we can continue, but on another topic-- as I stated before I only have subjective opinions on this, it's not a burning issue for me.

    fuck you
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #173 - April 07, 2009, 04:08 PM

    What a flat tire this turned out to be. Cheesy  Keep trying to find something nice about Islam instead of what is doesn't do in regards to the behavior of its followers.
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #174 - April 07, 2009, 07:47 PM

    You're pathetic, Ansar. Fair enough if you want to criticise Islam for its faults. We all do that and there is plenty of material for sure. However people like you sort of give me the impression that you sneak off home at night rubbing your hands together like Monty Burns and go to sleep with a smirk on your face happy that you have managed to scrape through another day without admitting that Islam is not 100% pure, unadulterated evil.

    Now it that's what you get off on then whatever, but for anyone less obsessive about the topic it does make you seem rather troppo. Perhaps monomaniacal would be a better word if you aren't familiar with Australian colloquialisms. I have no emotional attachment to Islam so I have nothing to defend here, but on the other hand I have no reason to deliberately avoid seeing any good in it at all. This is particularly the case when you take into account the diversity of opinions within Islam.

    Yes, the book on which it is based is a pile of insane medieval twaddle and the bloke who started it was a thoroughly nasty individual but he did fuck up occasionally and throw in a few little good bits. Nobody's perfect.

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #175 - April 07, 2009, 08:29 PM

    Oi, here is something that is good that was in Islam. 

    So the prophet (LMAO) was playing with Hasan and Husayn and he was kissing them and this old Bedouin man was like 'Dude, the fuck? I've had 60 kids and I never once kissed them becoz I'm a fucking real man, rawr'. And the prophet (LMAO) turned to him and said, 'If Big Al didn't put mercy in your heart, that's too bad you sodding loser 'coz your kids are totally gonna throw your body in a Hefty bag and have a big party when you die'.  Or something like that. 

    Anyway, it's a 'good thing' because when you're in a culture where men have to display this machismo all the time, at least a wife, a mother, someone can use this hadith to show a man who might be cold towards his children that 'Big Al wants you to kiss and play with them', and if people only behave good and don't kill or steal because their religion tells them, then ... I'm all for them at least having that religion to stop them. 

    But also I did see a more open, general love for children among Muslims from the Middle East than I did in my home culture, including men, which I think is a good thing.  To have a group of 19 year old 'cool guys' cooing over your baby and playing with him and not worrying about looking like 'fags' or dorks is nice. 

    All this is said while acknowledging the dreadful sicknesses of abuse and pederasty that also go on, and knowing how those predators take advantage of the culture's attitude of love towards kids to use that to touch kids and do things without their warning signs going off until it's too late. 

    [this space for rent]
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #176 - April 07, 2009, 08:39 PM

    So the prophet (LMAO) was playing with Hasan and Husayn and he was kissing them and this old Bedouin man was like 'Dude, the fuck? I've had 60 kids and I never once kissed them becoz I'm a fucking real man, rawr'. And the prophet (LMAO) turned to him and said, 'If Big Al didn't put mercy in your heart, that's too bad you sodding loser 'coz your kids are totally gonna throw your body in a Hefty bag and have a big party when you die'.

    That's an awesome hadith.  grin12

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #177 - April 07, 2009, 08:45 PM

    So the prophet (LMAO) was playing with Hasan and Husayn and he was kissing them and this old Bedouin man was like 'Dude, the fuck? I've had 60 kids and I never once kissed them becoz I'm a fucking real man, rawr'. And the prophet (LMAO) turned to him and said, 'If Big Al didn't put mercy in your heart, that's too bad you sodding loser 'coz your kids are totally gonna throw your body in a Hefty bag and have a big party when you die'.

    That's an awesome hadith.  grin12


    I somehow knew you guys would appreciate my scholarly finesse.

    [this space for rent]
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #178 - April 08, 2009, 11:49 PM

    Afro

    I chose to get circumcised at 17, don't tell me I never believed.
  • Re: Nice things about Islam and Muslim culture.
     Reply #179 - August 10, 2009, 08:25 AM

    Reading a couple of peoples' posts on this forum, you would think that all Muslims and Islam emerged directly from Satans backside and there is not an ounce of good in anything that Islam says or in any Muslims!

    I wanted to show that the Islamic world is not all amputations, being horrible to women and honour killings but there are actually some nice things about it as well.

    I'll start it off by saying Muslims are some of the most hospitable people I have ever met! If you go to stay at a Muslim's house, they will give you their bed and sleep on the floor.

    Anybody else got any suggestions?


    When I left Islam I took the religion as a whole with it's good and bad points and judged it that way. My issue was theological with religion (all religions) in general coming second. Anyway there are and still to this day certain things both at a personnal and public level that I like about Islam:-

    1 - An emphasis on personal hygiene for both males and females which includes the shaving of the pubic hair and wiping the backside properly. For those people who know the difference between wiping with toilet paper or using a "lota". They will feel the difference. Both these practices are good and I still do them. I have heard though that this is not just exclusive to muslims but people from Indo/Pak of all religions.

    2 - Respect for the elderly and for ones parents. This I think is severely lacking in the west. These things are important with or without religion and I have always wondered whether or not muslims without the veil of religion would still respect their elders and parents.

    3 - Family solidarity. Again this is something that I find lacking and it shows a rather selfish streak. I would have thought that once the veil of religion is lifted, people would cherish these relationships more. I have always been at odds with putting elderly particularly parents in an old folks home.

    4 - Even though I don't believe in any "higher" significance in the Jumma or Eid prayers. It's a great oppurtunity to meet your friends, family and be part of the community. I don't go to the Jumma prayers, but I don't mind going to Eid prayers. You only have to put up with it twice a year. I think Eid is part of my cultural heritage and because of the busy lives we lead in the west this is a good oppurtunity to see people who you might not see otherwise.

    5 - Islamic architecture. Aesthetically it is probably one of the best things I have seen. I remember when I was still a muslim I went to Istanbul and was awe struck by the mosques. The architecture is amazing.

    6 - The short period of scientific and philosophical progress in Islamic civilisation. Although this period was extremely short, it would be foolish to deny it. But now that I'm on the outside I can clearly see that the scholars of this period were considered heterodox and I think if Al-Ghazali hadn't stuck his oar in, maybe we would have been looking at a very different Islamic civilisation.
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