Skip navigation
Sidebar -

Advanced search options →

Welcome

Welcome to CEMB forum.
Please login or register. Did you miss your activation email?

Donations

Help keep the Forum going!
Click on Kitty to donate:

Kitty is lost

Recent Posts


Qur'anic studies today
Yesterday at 11:22 PM

Satanic verses
Yesterday at 09:10 PM

Painted pious ladies
Yesterday at 07:36 PM

Climate catastrophe, sinn...
Yesterday at 03:08 PM

مدهش----- لماذا؟؟؟؟
by akay
Yesterday at 10:12 AM

NayaPakistan...New Pakist...
September 20, 2019, 09:30 PM

Kashmir endgame
September 19, 2019, 02:15 PM

Blasphemy Case of Junaid...
September 19, 2019, 12:57 PM

The Cult of Social Justic...
September 18, 2019, 03:50 PM

The Battle for British Is...
September 17, 2019, 06:28 PM

Muslim heritage?
September 17, 2019, 06:04 PM

Scientists and .............
by akay
September 17, 2019, 06:22 AM

Theme Changer

 Topic: Scientists and ..........!

 (Read 17362 times)
  • 12 3 ... 7 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Scientists and ..........!
     OP - March 07, 2018, 10:01 AM

    The following are some comments of scientists[1]  on the scientific miracles in the Holy Quran.

    1)    Dr. T. V. N. Persaud is Professor of Anatomy, Professor of Pediatrics and Child Health, and Professor of Obstetrics, Gynecology, and Reproductive Sciences at the University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada.  There, he was the Chairman of the Department of Anatomy for 16 years.  He is well-known in his field.  He is the author or editor of 22 textbooks and has published over 181 scientific papers.  In 1991, he received the most distinguished award presented in the field of anatomy in Canada, the J.C.B. Grant Award from the Canadian Association of Anatomists.  When he was asked about the scientific miracles in the Quran which he has researched, he stated the following:

    “The way it was explained to me is that Muhammad was a very ordinary man.  He could not read, didn’t know [how] to write. In fact, he was an illiterate.  And we’re talking about twelve [actually about fourteen] hundred years ago.  You have someone illiterate making profound pronouncements and statements and that are amazingly accurate about scientific nature.  And I personally can’t see how this could be a mere chance.  There are too many accuracies and, like Dr. Moore, I have no difficulty in my mind that this is a divine inspiration or revelation which led him to these statements.”


    Professor Persaud has included some Quranic verses and sayings of the Prophet Muhammad, may the mercy and blessings of God be upon him, in some of his books.  He has also presented these verses and sayings of the Prophet Muhammad at several conferences.

    2)    Dr. Joe Leigh Simpson is the Chairman of the Department of Obstetrics and Gynecology, Professor of Obstetrics and Gynecology, and Professor of Molecular and Human Genetics at the Baylor College of Medicine, Houston, Texas, USA.  Formerly, he was Professor of Ob-Gyn and the Chairman of the Department of Ob-Gyn at the University of Tennessee, Memphis, Tennessee, USA.  He was also the President of the American Fertility Society.  He has received many awards, including the Association of Professors of Obstetrics and Gynecology Public Recognition Award in 1992.  Professor Simpson studied the following two sayings of the Prophet Muhammad:

    “In every one of you, all components of your creation are collected together in your mother’s womb by forty days...”[2]

    “If forty-two nights have passed over the embryo, God sends an angel to it, who shapes it and creates its hearing, vision, skin, flesh, and bones....”[3]

    He studied these two sayings of the Prophet Muhammad extensively, noting that the first forty days constitute a clearly distinguishable stage of embryo-genesis.  He was particularly impressed by the absolute precision and accuracy of those sayings of the Prophet Muhammad.  Then, during one conference, he gave the following opinion:

    “So that the two hadeeths (the sayings of the Prophet Muhammad) that have been noted provide us with a specific time table for the main embryological development before forty days.  Again, the point has been made, I think, repeatedly by other speakers this morning: these hadeeths could not have been obtained on the basis of the scientific knowledge that was available [at] the time of their writing . . . . It follows, I think, that not only there is no conflict between genetics and religion but, in fact, religion can guide science by adding revelation to some of the traditional scientific approaches, that there exist statements in the Quran shown centuries later to be valid, which support knowledge in the Quran having been derived from God.”

    3)    Dr. E. Marshall Johnson is Professor Emeritus of Anatomy and Developmental Biology at Thomas Jefferson University, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, USA.  There, for 22 years he was Professor of Anatomy, the Chairman of the Department of Anatomy, and the Director of the Daniel Baugh Institute.  He was also the President of the Teratology Society.  He has authored more than 200 publications.  In 1981, during the Seventh Medical Conference in Dammam, Saudi Arabia, Professor Johnson said in the presentation of his research paper:

    “Summary: The Quran describes not only the development of external form, but emphasizes also the internal stages, the stages inside the embryo, of its creation and development, emphasizing major events recognized by contemporary science.”

    Also he said: “As a scientist, I can only deal with things which I can specifically see.  I can understand embryology and developmental biology.  I can understand the words that are translated to me from the Quran.  As I gave the example before, if I were to transpose myself into that era, knowing what I knew today and describing things, I could not describe the things which were described.  I see no evidence for the fact to refute the concept that this individual, Muhammad, had to be developing this information from some place.  So I see nothing here in conflict with the concept that divine intervention was involved in what he was able to write.


    4)    Dr. William W. Hay is a well-known marine scientist.  He is Professor of Geological Sciences at the University of Colorado, Boulder, Colorado, USA.  He was formerly the Dean of the Rosenstiel School of Marine and Atmospheric Science at the University of Miami, Miami, Florida, USA.  After a discussion with Professor Hay about the Quran’s mention of recently discovered facts on seas, he said:

    “I find it very interesting that this sort of information is in the ancient scriptures of the Holy Quran, and I have no way of knowing where they would come from, but I think it is extremely interesting that they are there and that this work is going on to discover it, the meaning of some of the passages.”  And when he was asked about the source of the Quran, he replied: “Well, I would think it must be the divine being.”


    5)    Dr. Gerald C. Goeringer is Course Director and Associate Professor of Medical Embryology at the Department of Cell Biology, School of Medicine, Georgetown University, Washington, DC, USA.  During the Eighth Saudi Medical Conference in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, Professor Goeringer stated the following in the presentation of his research paper:

    “In a relatively few aayahs (Quranic verses) is contained a rather comprehensive description of human development from the time of commingling of the gametes through organogenesis.  No such distinct and complete record of human development, such as classification, terminology, and description, existed previously.  In most, if not all, instances, this description antedates by many centuries the recording of the various stages of human embryonic and fetal development recorded in the traditional scientific literature.”


    6)    Dr. Yoshihide Kozai is Professor Emeritus at Tokyo University, Hongo, Tokyo, Japan, and was the Director of the National Astronomical Observatory, Mitaka, Tokyo, Japan.  He said:

    “I am very much impressed by finding true astronomical facts in [the] Quran, and for us the modern astronomers have been studying very small pieces of the universe.  We’ve concentrated our efforts for understanding of [a] very small part.  Because by using telescopes, we can see only very few parts [of] the sky without thinking [about the] whole universe.  So, by reading [the] Quran and by answering to the questions, I think I can find my future way for investigation of the universe.” 


    7)    Professor Tejatat Tejasen is the Chairman of the Department of Anatomy at Chiang Mai University, Chiang Mai, Thailand.  Previously, he was the Dean of the Faculty of Medicine at the same university.  During the Eighth Saudi Medical Conference in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, Professor Tejasen stood up and said:

    “During the last three years, I became interested in the Quran . . . . From my study and what I have learned from this conference, I believe that everything that has been recorded in the Quran fourteen hundred years ago must be the truth, that can be proved by the scientific means.  Since the Prophet Muhammad could neither read nor write, Muhammad must be a messenger who relayed this truth, which was revealed to him as an enlightenment by the one who is eligible [as the] creator.

    This creator must be God.  Therefore, I think this is the time to say La ilaha illa Allah, there is no god to worship except Allah (God), Muhammadur rasoolu Allah, Muhammad is Messenger (Prophet) of Allah (God).  Lastly, I must congratulate for the excellent and highly successful arrangement for this conference . . . . I have gained not only from the scientific point of view and religious point of view but also the great chance of meeting many well-known scientists and making many new friends among the participants.  The most precious thing of all that I have gained by coming to this place is La ilaha illa Allah, Muhammadur rasoolu Allah, and to have become a Muslim.” 



    After all these examples we have seen about the scientific miracles in the Holy Quran and all these scientists’ comments on this, let us ask ourselves these questions:

    •        Could it be a coincidence that all this recently discovered scientific information from different fields was mentioned in the Quran, which was revealed fourteen centuries ago?

    •        Could this Quran have been authored by Muhammad, may the mercy and blessings of God be upon him, or by any other human being?

    The only possible answer is that this Quran must be the literal word of God, revealed by Him.
    القرآن الكريم والعلم الحديث كاملة The Quran and Modern Science full Zakir naik
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NFO4G7zXlUI
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #1 - March 07, 2018, 11:54 AM

    Only an idiot parades Zakir a Naik around like a hero. The Qur'an says that stars (kawakib ٱلْكَوَاكِبِ) / lamps (masabih مَصَٰبِيحَ) adorn the heavens and guard against devils.

    The author of the Qur'an does not seem to know the difference between stars (giant balls of gas thousands of times larger than the earth) and meteors which are small rocky masses of debris which brighten up after entering the earth's atmosphere. Many ancient people confused the two, as meteors look like stars that are streaking across the sky; this is why there were often called shooting stars or falling stars. In the following verse, the Qur'an claims that Allah uses stars as missiles to ward away devils. This repeats a common Arab myth at the time the Qur'an was first recited. The Qur'an has statements about the end of the world that are much as one would expect if the author believed the sun and moon to be of similar size and a similar distance from Earth.

    And the moon darkens And the sun and the moon are joined,
    Qur'an 75:8-9
    The word translated "are joined" is Arabic jumi'a, a verb which means to collect together, gather together, bring together. Given that this would actually require the moon to travel 98 million miles away from Earth and into the sun, which dwarfs it by over 600 times in diameter, it seems vastly less fitting as an apocalyptic event than if the ancient conception of the cosmos was correct. Thus it is far more likely that the author had such a misconception about the sun and moon.

    The Qur'an and Hadith claim that the moon was miraculously split into two pieces and then, presumably, put back together again. There is absolutely no scientific evidence whatsoever that the moon has ever been split into two. Since the moon is visible to half the planet at any given time, we should expect to see numerous accounts from different parts of the world attesting to this event if it actually happened. The Romans, Greeks, Egyptians, Persians, Chinese and Indians had avid astronomers who should have seen this event and recorded it in their histories. The absence of historical record from other civilizations, contemporary to Muhammad, is a strong indication that this event never happened.

    The hour drew nigh and the moon did rend asunder.
    Qur'an 54:1-3
    Narrated Anas: "That the Meccan people requested Allah's Apostle to show them a miracle, and so he showed them the splitting of the moon."
    Sahih Bukhari 4:56:831

    The Qur'an and Hadith contain statements about bodily fluids and the stages of development of the human embryo. Many of these descriptions are vague and unscientific. Most bear a striking resemblance to similar descriptions found in the Jewish Talmud and the ideas of ancient Greeks such as Galen, including their errors. He is created from a drop emitted- Proceeding from between the backbone and the ribs
    Qur'an 86:6-7
    The Qur'an and Hadith depict that humans are formed from a clot of blood. There was never a stage in embryonic development where humans are formed into a clot of blood. This description is likely influenced by an unscientific and primitive understanding of human reproduction based on observations from an early-term miscarriage and a woman's menstrual cycle. While in modern times some Muslims seek to use alternative meanings for the relevant word, the mere fact that it certainly can mean clotted blood (as also is the consensus of the classical tafsirs), in a passage about a biological process (formation of a baby), is a major weakness in what should be a perfect description.

    Created man, out of a (mere) clot of congealed blood:
    Qur'an 96:2

    Narrated 'Abdullah bin Mus'ud: “Allah's Apostle, the true and truly inspired said, "(The matter of the Creation of) a human being is put together in the womb of the mother in forty days, and then he becomes a clot of thick blood for a similar period, and then a piece of flesh for a similar period.”
    Sahih Bukhari 4:54:430

    The Qur'an explains that the bones of a human embryo are formed first and then covered up with flesh. Modern scientific studies and research have shown that the cartilage models and muscles start to form at the same time and in parallel. Muscles have started to form before the cartilage models start to be replaced with bone.

    Then We made the sperm into a clot of congealed blood; then of that clot We made a (foetus) lump; then we made out of that lump bones then (not and) clothed the bones with flesh; then we developed out of it another creature. So blessed be Allah, the best to create!
    Qur'an 23:14
    The Qur'an again parallels the influential Greek physician Galen, who says:

    And now the third period of gestation has come. After nature has made outlines of all the organs and the substance of the semen is used up, the time has come for nature to articulate the organs precisely and to bring all the parts to completion. Thus it caused flesh to grow on and around all the bones...
    Galen, On semen, p.101

    The arabic word (bisaatan) used here means a thing that is spread or spread out or forth, and particularly a carpet.

    And Allah has made the earth for you as a carpet (spread out)
    Qur'an 71:19

    Quran is a joke Afro
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #2 - March 07, 2018, 03:05 PM

    akay adds more nonsense from web...
    The following are some comments of  insists   on the  sintific miracles in the Holy Quran

    .............................

      let me add  some links  for him  to  watch and read

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=4&v=upTeL3oxENQ

    The science in the Quran  CEMB  forum

     Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked. CEMB  forum

    Scientific Miracles of the Qur'an_Faith Freedom International forum
     Go Criss!

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #3 - March 07, 2018, 03:26 PM

    The following are some comments of scientists[1]  on the scientific miracles in the Holy Quran.


    4)    Dr. William W. Hay is a well-known marine scientist.  He is Professor of Geological Sciences at the University of Colorado, Boulder, Colorado, USA. .........................
     
    The Quran and Modern Science full Zakir naik
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NFO4G7zXlUI


    well  Dr. William W. Hay  gave an interview to one of the wonderful member TheRationalizer   of CEMB  let us watch rationalized videos  on Science &  Quran instead of that fool  from that  Snake land the Zakir Joker ...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bygb30gAqOs

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKa61I0_8e8

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3XM8CT0XaM

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #4 - March 07, 2018, 08:44 PM

    There are no scientific miracles in the Quran, what don't Muslims understand from this statement? I don't run around claiming my Bible has scientific facts in it. Claiming a religious book has scientific facts in it wheather it does or doesn't is pretty dumb. Even if the Quran has scientific facts in it doesn't really mean anything other then the fact Muslims plagiarized the works of other ancient scientists, which already happened considering the embryo was plagiarized from Galens and Hippocrates. Do Muslims have anything original? I'm tired of these moronic statements being repeated over and over from them. I mean come on atleast come up with something new. The atheist girl although I disagree with some of her points there she made a good point, if Muslims have had all these scientific discoveries in their books why didn't they discover the Big Bang theory and evolution theory and the theory of the flat earth, I mean they had more then one thousand years didn't they? The former mufti of my sad country even declared the earth to be flat and anyone who says otherwise is a kaafir...?
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #5 - March 08, 2018, 07:56 PM

    "The former mufti of my sad country even declared the earth to be flat and anyone who says otherwise is a kaafir...?"

    Don't get too smug there are Christians who also believe in flat earth.
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #6 - March 08, 2018, 08:35 PM

    Christians historically didn't believe the earth was flat, you might see some Christians which believe in the flat earth but it wasn't true that Christians used to believe in the flat earth, Byzantine coins depict the globe and cross the blobs represents the world and the dominion and power of Jesus over it so it wasn't really a Christian thing to believe in flat earth. I'm not denying there's morons out there. But it seems Islam actually teaches you to shut your eyes and ears and believe whatever the Quran says.
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #7 - March 08, 2018, 10:19 PM

    The Holy Qur'an, Global and Eternal
    The reputation of the Holy Qur'an cleft the bonds of time and distance and influenced beyond them. The miracles of the prophets before the Prophet of Islam (p.b.u.h.), and even his own miracles save the Qur'an, happened in a special period of time, at a definite place and for a specific group of people. For example : the utterances of the holy little child of Virgin Mary, and raising the dead by Jesus (a.s.) were done at some definite times and places before the eyes of some particular people. And we know that regarding the things that depend on time and place, the farther we move away from them correlatively the weaker they become. This is one of the properties of affairs related to time.
    But, the Holy Qur'an does not depend on time and place. Its brilliance and authority that illuminated the darkness of Arabia fourteen centuries ago continues unwaveringly to shine with its original splendor. Besides that, the passing of time, the advancement of science and the development of information have made it possible for us to understand it and take its advantages even more than the nations of former ages did. It is evident that what time and place cannot influence will continue to be everywhere in the world for eternity. It is also clear that a world-wide everlasting religion should have a world-wide everlasting document of legitimacy in its possession.
    Not only with science. It is a book of history, philosophy, laws and many more. An unique book to guide the humanity.

    Then we can discuss the Holy Qur'an :
    from the point of modern science;
    and the scientific explorations;
    and the rotation of the Earth;
    and reproduction in the plant kingdom;
    and general reproduction in all the particles of the world;
    and general gravity;
    and the surrendering of the Sun and the Moon;
    and the secrets of the creation of mountains;
    and the advent of the world;
    and the existence of life on other planets;
    and the winds, the pollinator of plants;
    and the question of the roundness of the Earth; (2)
    And many other scientific facts and knowledge about the world can be found in the Holy Qur'an, too.

    Does the Quran say the earth is flat? - YouTube

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0Gp6ecagdM


    Quote:
    Historian Bettany Hughes presents a picture of Islamic civilization in Spain and the impact that this civilization had on the development of modern Europe. Hughes also indicates how the 'European identity' was artificially constructed by the Islamic origin of the acquired civilization "ethnically cleanse", to erase.

    This false, ethnically purified image of Europe is unfortunately currently used for the Muslims to deny any contribution to European civilization and even enemies of civilization to label them.
    Added to that-
    Theft of Research Science and Muslims
    And attributed to themselves by deception and lying
    History of the Moorish Empire in Europe

    Infrastructure
    The Andalusia in the 10th century, tells mp Scott, was crossed in all directions by awesome aqueducts. Cordoba was a city of fountains, roads were miles long brightly lit, paved, well maintained and regularly visited by security patrols.

    For comparison: in London there were no paved streets until the 14th century, at night the city was plunged into blackness. It took until the reign of Charles II (in the 17th century) that even poorly active street lighting was installed in London.

    Demography
    On the death of Elizabeth England had about 4 million inhabitants. The population of Islamic Spain may have been over 30 million. No less six centuries earlier In London in 1700, was the most populous city in Christian Europe, only half the size of Cordoba in the year 900, and Almeria and Seville each had a population as large as the British capital 800 years later. (...)

    Hygiene
    In the middle of the 10th century there were 900 public baths built in the capital of Moorish Spain, in the 18th century there were not even so much in all the countries of Christian Europe together. (...) The fatal effects of the plague are convincing evidence of the appalling hygienic conditions that prevailed everywhere. The water was removed from the polluted river or from sources that stank of dirt. (...)

    Science
    Nothing illustrates the contrast in terms of science better than the importance attached to books. Scott let us know that the library Mostandir, the sultan of Egypt, 800 thousand books housed. The library of Tripoli contained 200 thousand. When Baghdad was destroyed by the Mongols in the 13th century, books were thrown into the Tigris covered the entire river, and colored water of the black ink, while an even larger share went up in flames. The caliphate of Spain had 70 public book collections, and alone the large library of Al-Hakam II contained 600 thousand books. Many private collections were correspondingly large, that of Ibn al-Mathran, the personal physician to Saladin, contained 10 thousand manuscripts.

    Four centuries later, there were only books in Christian Europe, except those were kept in monasteries. The royal library of France contained 900 books, of which two-thirds was theological content. (...)

    Education
    In Muslim countries it was difficult to even come who could not read and write. Against a farmer In the same time allowed many senior people in Europe not say this of himself.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVtpnzx52Tk
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #8 - March 08, 2018, 10:25 PM

    But it seems Islam actually teaches you to shut your eyes and ears and believe whatever the Quran says.


    all religions do that. that's why they call it faith. you have no evidence for jesus being the son of god. yet you believe it.

  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #9 - March 08, 2018, 10:28 PM

    you're happy to believe your going to heaven because your a Christian yet your god is going to send your family to burn in hell because they've not accepted christ. doesn't that bother you? how can you believe in such a god?
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #10 - March 09, 2018, 06:10 AM

    Muslims got there scientific inventions from the Byzantines and Persians and ancient Greeks. You do know that none of the Islamic scientists were even believers in Islam, if you read about their lives you'd find most of them were unorthodox Muslims and were considered heretics or were unbelievers all together. Romans had baths before the Muslims even knew how to wipe themselves so more lies from you. And the Byzantine empire centered in Constantinople had baths. Muslims destroyed their own golden age hundreds of Islamic scientists had to leave their homes due to death threats by the state and were either killed or exiled. Ibn Taymiyyah declared Chemistry to be Haram and anyone who does it a kaafir. If your Quran talked about all this then why didn't you discover it before the Europeans ever did? Yet some Muslims still be,I've the earth is flat and doesn't rotate like this Sheikh here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKSKUIjBiM0
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #11 - March 09, 2018, 06:14 AM

    you're happy to believe your going to heaven because your a Christian yet your god is going to send your family to burn in hell because they've not accepted christ. doesn't that bother you? how can you believe in such a god?

     
    Well it's my choice isn't it, also I can always pray for my family and I can always pray that they will find the truth or God will forgive them.
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #12 - March 09, 2018, 10:24 AM

    It's simple

    This monotheistic religions Science
    -Starting from Adam to Muhammad peace be upon him
    One Message
    The Oneness of Allah

    Through the prophets, not of other ways

    All the prophets Muslim

    111. And when I (Allah) put in the hearts of Al-Hawarieen (the disciples) [of 'Iesa (Jesus)] to believe in Me and My Messenger, they said: "We believe. And bear witness that we are Muslims."
    Surah Al-Ma'idah


    78. And strive hard in Allah's Cause as you ought to strive (with sincerity and with all your efforts that His Name should be superior). He has chosen you (to convey His Message of Islamic Monotheism to mankind by inviting them to His religion, Islam), and has not laid upon you in religion any hardship, it is the religion of your father Ibrahim (Abraham) (Islamic Monotheism) . It is He (Allah) Who has named you Muslims both before and in this (the Qur'an), that the Messenger (Muhammad) may be a witness over you and you be witnesses over mankind! So perform As-Salat (Iqamat-as-Salat), give Zakat and hold fast to Allah [ie have confidence in Allah, and depend upon Him in all your affairs] He is your Maula (Patron, Lord, etc.), what an Excellent Maula (Patron, Lord, etc.) and what an Excellent Helper!
    Surah Al-Hajj


    90. And We took the Children of Israel across the sea, and Fir'aun (Pharaoh) with his hosts followed them in oppression and enmity, till when drowning overtook him, he said: "I believe that La ilaha illa (Huwa): (none has the right to be worshipped but) He, "in Whom the Children of Israel believe, and I am one of the Muslims (those who submit to Allah's Will)."
    91. Now (you believe) while you refused to believe before and you were one of the Mufsidun (evil-doers, corrupts, etc.).

    92. So this day We shall deliver your (dead) body (out from the sea) that you may be a sign to those who come after you! And verily, many among mankind are heedless of Our Ayat (proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.).

    The tolerance of Islam is another factor in the spread of Islam. The British historian Toynbee praises this tolerance towards the People of the Book after comparing it with the attitude of the Christians towards Muslims and Jews in their lands. (A Historian's Approach to Religion, p.246) T. Link attributes the spread of Islam to the credibility of its principles together with its tolerance, persuasion and other kinds of attractions. (A History of Religion) Makarios, Orthodox Patriorch of Antioch in the seventeenth century, compared the harsh treatment received by the Russians of the Orthodox Church at the hands of the Roman Catholic Poles with the tolerant attitude towards Orthodox Christians shown by the Ottoman Government and prayed for the Sultans. (T. Link, A History of Religion)

    This is not the only example of preference by the followers of the religions for Muslim rule over that of their own co-religionists. The Orthodox Christians of Byzantium openly expressed their preference for the Ottoman turban in Istanbul to the hats of the Catholic cardinals. Elisee Reclus, the French traveler of the nineteenth century, wrote that the Muslim Turks allowed all the followers of different religions to perform their religious duties and rituals, and that the Christian subjects of the Ottoman Sultan were more free to live their own lives than the Christians who lived in the lands under the rule of any rival Christian sect. (Nouvelle Geographie Universelle, Vol. IX) Popescu Ciocanel pays tribute to the Muslim Turks by stating that it was luck for the Romanian people that they lived under the government of the Turks rather than the domination of the Russians and Austrians. Otherwise, he points out, "no trace of the Romanian nation would have remained." (La Crise de L'Orient)

    How did Muslims behave towards the people of the conquered lands?

    The Muslim's attitude towards the people of the conquered lands is quite clear in the instructions given by the rightly-guided Caliphs may Allaah be pleased with them:

    Always keep fear of God in your mind; remember that you cannot afford to do anything without His grace. Do not forget that Islam is a mission of peace and love. Keep the Noble Prophet sallallaahu `alayhi wa sallam ( may Allaah exalt his mention ) before you as a model of bravery and piety. Do not destroy fruit-trees nor fertile fields in your paths. Be just, and spare the feelings of the vanquished. Respect all religious persons who live in hermitages or convents and spare their edifices. Do not kill civilians. Do not outrage the chastity of women and the honor of the conquered. Do not harm old people and children. Do not accept any gifts from the civil population of any place. Do not billet your soldiers or officers in the houses of civilians. Do not forget to perform your daily prayers. Fear God. Remember that death will inevitably come to everyone of you some time or other, even if you are thousands of miles away from a battle field; therefore be always ready to face death. (Andrew Miller, Church History)

    A historical episode which Balazuri, a famous Muslim historian, tells about how pleased the native people were with their Muslim conquerors is of great significance:

    When Heraclius massed his troops against the Muslims, and the Muslims heard that they were coming to meet them, they refunded the inhabitants of Hims the tribute they had taken from them, saying: "We are too busy to support and protect you. Take care of yourselves." But the people of Hims replied: "We like your rule and justice far better than the state of oppression and tyranny in which we were. The army of Heraclius we shall indeed, with your help, repulse from the city." The Jews rose and said: "We swear by the Torah, no governor of Heraclius shall enter the city of Hims unless we are first vanquished and exhausted." Saying this, they closed the gates of the city and guarded them. The inhabitants of other cities - Christians and Jews- that had been capitulated did the same. When, by God's help, the unbelievers were defeated and Muslims won, they opened the gates of their cities, went out with the singers and players of music, and paid the tribute. (Futuh al-Buldan)

    Islamic History of Europe
    Islamic History Of Europe - BBC Documentary
    An Islamic History of Europe - BBC Documentary - Veoh

    www.veoh.com/watch/v742754pfGhKfwn
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shOF2FFuz0w
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6wE0eWSyEs
    Quote:
    Few in Europe today Realize how much they owe to Muslim Spain for that great dawn of enlightenment called the Renaissance. Many outstanding philosophers, mathematicians, scientists, astronomers and physicians from Andalusia are but obliterated memories for Europe, the forlorn buried in graveyards or oblivion.

    When the Muslims ruled Europe - BBC Documentary

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5vuTpN4WUI

    Maurice Bucaille, writing in “The Bible, the Qur’an and Science,” answers those who conclude that a human mind authored the Quran: “A totally objective examination of it [the Quran] in the light of modern knowledge, leads us to recognize the agreement between the two, as has been already noted on

    repeated occasions. It makes us deem it quite unthinkable for a man of Muhammad’s time to have been the author of such statements on account of the state of knowledge in his day. Such considerations are part of what gives the Qur’anic Revelation its unique place, and forces the impartial scientist to admit his inability to provide an explanation which calls solely upon materialistic reasoning.”

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQlqj3bt2Vc
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #13 - March 09, 2018, 10:31 AM

    dear akay   copy pasting  LARGE AMOUNT OF JUNK FROM JUNK WEBSITES AND JUNK BOOKS  in to CEMB forum will not help you and your faith..  just giving links to nonsense in your post is enough
    The Holy Qur'an, Global and Eternal
    The reputation of the Holy Qur'an cleft the bonds of time and distance and influenced beyond them. The miracles of the prophets before the Prophet of Islam (p.b.u.h.), and even his own miracles save the Qur'an, happened in a special period of time, at a definite place and for a specific group of people. For example : the utterances of the holy little child of Virgin Mary, and raising the dead by Jesus (a.s.) were done at some definite times and places before the eyes of some particular people. And we know that regarding the things that depend on time and place, the farther we move away from them correlatively the weaker they become. This is one of the properties of affairs related to time.
    But, the Holy Qur'an does not depend on time and place. Its brilliance and authority that illuminated the darkness of Arabia fourteen centuries ago continues unwaveringly to shine with its original splendor. Besides that, the passing of time, the advancement of science and the development of information have made it possible for us to understand it and take its advantages even more than the nations of former ages did. It is evident that what time and place cannot influence will continue to be everywhere in the world for eternity. It is also clear that a world-wide everlasting religion should have a world-wide everlasting document of legitimacy in its possession.
    Not only with science. It is a book of history, philosophy, laws and many more. An unique book to guide the humanity.

    Then we can discuss the Holy Qur'an :
    from the point of modern science;
    and the scientific explorations;
    and the rotation of the Earth;
    and reproduction in the plant kingdom;
    and general reproduction in all the particles of the world;
    and general gravity;
    and the surrendering of the Sun and the Moon;
    and the secrets of the creation of mountains;
    and the advent of the world;
    and the existence of life on other planets;
    and the winds, the pollinator of plants;
    and the question of the roundness of the Earth; (2)
    And many other scientific facts and knowledge about the world can be found in the Holy Qur'an, too.

    Does the Quran say the earth is flat? - YouTube

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0Gp6ecagdM


    Quote:
    Historian Bettany Hughes presents a picture of Islamic civilization in Spain and the impact that this civilization had on the development of modern Europe. Hughes also indicates how the 'European identity' was artificially constructed by the Islamic origin of the acquired civilization "ethnically cleanse", to erase.

    This false, ethnically purified image of Europe is unfortunately currently used for the Muslims to deny any contribution to European civilization and even enemies of civilization to label them.
    Added to that-
    Theft of Research Science and Muslims
    And attributed to themselves by deception and lying
    History of the Moorish Empire in Europe

    Infrastructure
    The Andalusia in the 10th century, tells mp Scott, was crossed in all directions by awesome aqueducts. Cordoba was a city of fountains, roads were miles long brightly lit, paved, well maintained and regularly visited by security patrols.

    For comparison: in London there were no paved streets until the 14th century, at night the city was plunged into blackness. It took until the reign of Charles II (in the 17th century) that even poorly active street lighting was installed in London.

    Demography
    On the death of Elizabeth England had about 4 million inhabitants. The population of Islamic Spain may have been over 30 million. No less six centuries earlier In London in 1700, was the most populous city in Christian Europe, only half the size of Cordoba in the year 900, and Almeria and Seville each had a population as large as the British capital 800 years later. (...)

    Hygiene
    In the middle of the 10th century there were 900 public baths built in the capital of Moorish Spain, in the 18th century there were not even so much in all the countries of Christian Europe together. (...) The fatal effects of the plague are convincing evidence of the appalling hygienic conditions that prevailed everywhere. The water was removed from the polluted river or from sources that stank of dirt. (...)

    Science
    Nothing illustrates the contrast in terms of science better than the importance attached to books. Scott let us know that the library Mostandir, the sultan of Egypt, 800 thousand books housed. The library of Tripoli contained 200 thousand. When Baghdad was destroyed by the Mongols in the 13th century, books were thrown into the Tigris covered the entire river, and colored water of the black ink, while an even larger share went up in flames. The caliphate of Spain had 70 public book collections, and alone the large library of Al-Hakam II contained 600 thousand books. Many private collections were correspondingly large, that of Ibn al-Mathran, the personal physician to Saladin, contained 10 thousand manuscripts.

    Four centuries later, there were only books in Christian Europe, except those were kept in monasteries. The royal library of France contained 900 books, of which two-thirds was theological content. (...)

    Education
    In Muslim countries it was difficult to even come who could not read and write. Against a farmer In the same time allowed many senior people in Europe not say this of himself.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVtpnzx52Tk



    you are pasting all that stuff from that Ayatullah Sayyid Kamal Faqih Imani



    An Enlightening Commentary into the Light of the Holy Quran: Volume 1
    Ayatullah Sayyid Kamal Faqih Imani September 7, 2014  Lulu Press, Inc

    read more JUNK from that book ...

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #14 - March 09, 2018, 10:38 AM

    let me cut the junk of akay again,,
    It's simple

    This monotheistic religions Science
    -Starting from Adam to Muhammad peace be upon him

    One

    Message
    The Oneness of Allah

    Through the prophets, not of other ways

    All the prophets Muslim


    that is it  for Islam..  that is all what i will not question and that is  the message

    Quote
    The Oneness of Allah


     that is it,............           rest of your posts are "JUNK &  GIBBERISH "

    Quote
    111. And when I (Allah) put in the hearts of Al-Hawarieen (the disciples) [of 'Iesa (Jesus)] to believe in Me and My Messenger, they said: "We believe. And bear witness that we are Muslims."
    Surah Al-Ma'idah


    78. And strive hard in Allah's Cause as you ought to strive (with sincerity and with all your efforts that His Name should be superior). He has chosen you (to convey His Message of Islamic Monotheism to mankind by inviting them to His religion, Islam), and has not laid upon you in religion any hardship, it is the religion of your father Ibrahim (Abraham) (Islamic Monotheism) . It is He (Allah) Who has named you Muslims both before and in this (the Qur'an), that the Messenger (Muhammad) may be a witness over you and you be witnesses over mankind! So perform As-Salat (Iqamat-as-Salat), give Zakat and hold fast to Allah [ie have confidence in Allah, and depend upon Him in all your affairs] He is your Maula (Patron, Lord, etc.), what an Excellent Maula (Patron, Lord, etc.) and what an Excellent Helper!
    Surah Al-Hajj


    90. And We took the Children of Israel across the sea, and Fir'aun (Pharaoh) with his hosts followed them in oppression and enmity, till when drowning overtook him, he said: "I believe that La ilaha illa (Huwa): (none has the right to be worshipped but) He, "in Whom the Children of Israel believe, and I am one of the Muslims (those who submit to Allah's Will)."
    91. Now (you believe) while you refused to believe before and you were one of the Mufsidun (evil-doers, corrupts, etc.).

    92. So this day We shall deliver your (dead) body (out from the sea) that you may be a sign to those who come after you! And verily, many among mankind are heedless of Our Ayat (proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.).

    The tolerance of Islam is another factor in the spread of Islam. The British historian Toynbee praises this tolerance towards the People of the Book after comparing it with the attitude of the Christians towards Muslims and Jews in their lands. (A Historian's Approach to Religion, p.246) T. Link attributes the spread of Islam to the credibility of its principles together with its tolerance, persuasion and other kinds of attractions. (A History of Religion) Makarios, Orthodox Patriorch of Antioch in the seventeenth century, compared the harsh treatment received by the Russians of the Orthodox Church at the hands of the Roman Catholic Poles with the tolerant attitude towards Orthodox Christians shown by the Ottoman Government and prayed for the Sultans. (T. Link, A History of Religion)

    This is not the only example of preference by the followers of the religions for Muslim rule over that of their own co-religionists. The Orthodox Christians of Byzantium openly expressed their preference for the Ottoman turban in Istanbul to the hats of the Catholic cardinals. Elisee Reclus, the French traveler of the nineteenth century, wrote that the Muslim Turks allowed all the followers of different religions to perform their religious duties and rituals, and that the Christian subjects of the Ottoman Sultan were more free to live their own lives than the Christians who lived in the lands under the rule of any rival Christian sect. (Nouvelle Geographie Universelle, Vol. IX) Popescu Ciocanel pays tribute to the Muslim Turks by stating that it was luck for the Romanian people that they lived under the government of the Turks rather than the domination of the Russians and Austrians. Otherwise, he points out, "no trace of the Romanian nation would have remained." (La Crise de L'Orient)

    How did Muslims behave towards the people of the conquered lands?

    The Muslim's attitude towards the people of the conquered lands is quite clear in the instructions given by the rightly-guided Caliphs may Allaah be pleased with them:

    Always keep fear of God in your mind; remember that you cannot afford to do anything without His grace. Do not forget that Islam is a mission of peace and love. Keep the Noble Prophet sallallaahu `alayhi wa sallam ( may Allaah exalt his mention ) before you as a model of bravery and piety. Do not destroy fruit-trees nor fertile fields in your paths. Be just, and spare the feelings of the vanquished. Respect all religious persons who live in hermitages or convents and spare their edifices. Do not kill civilians. Do not outrage the chastity of women and the honor of the conquered. Do not harm old people and children. Do not accept any gifts from the civil population of any place. Do not billet your soldiers or officers in the houses of civilians. Do not forget to perform your daily prayers. Fear God. Remember that death will inevitably come to everyone of you some time or other, even if you are thousands of miles away from a battle field; therefore be always ready to face death. (Andrew Miller, Church History)

    A historical episode which Balazuri, a famous Muslim historian, tells about how pleased the native people were with their Muslim conquerors is of great significance:

    When Heraclius massed his troops against the Muslims, and the Muslims heard that they were coming to meet them, they refunded the inhabitants of Hims the tribute they had taken from them, saying: "We are too busy to support and protect you. Take care of yourselves." But the people of Hims replied: "We like your rule and justice far better than the state of oppression and tyranny in which we were. The army of Heraclius we shall indeed, with your help, repulse from the city." The Jews rose and said: "We swear by the Torah, no governor of Heraclius shall enter the city of Hims unless we are first vanquished and exhausted." Saying this, they closed the gates of the city and guarded them. The inhabitants of other cities - Christians and Jews- that had been capitulated did the same. When, by God's help, the unbelievers were defeated and Muslims won, they opened the gates of their cities, went out with the singers and players of music, and paid the tribute. (Futuh al-Buldan)

    Islamic History of Europe
    Islamic History Of Europe - BBC Documentary
    An Islamic History of Europe - BBC Documentary - Veoh

    www.veoh.com/watch/v742754pfGhKfwn
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shOF2FFuz0w
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6wE0eWSyEs
    Quote:
    Few in Europe today Realize how much they owe to Muslim Spain for that great dawn of enlightenment called the Renaissance. Many outstanding philosophers, mathematicians, scientists, astronomers and physicians from Andalusia are but obliterated memories for Europe, the forlorn buried in graveyards or oblivion.

    When the Muslims ruled Europe - BBC Documentary

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5vuTpN4WUI

    Maurice Bucaille, writing in “The Bible, the Qur’an and Science,” answers those who conclude that a human mind authored the Quran: “A totally objective examination of it [the Quran] in the light of modern knowledge, leads us to recognize the agreement between the two, as has been already noted on

    repeated occasions. It makes us deem it quite unthinkable for a man of Muhammad’s time to have been the author of such statements on account of the state of knowledge in his day. Such considerations are part of what gives the Qur’anic Revelation its unique place, and forces the impartial scientist to admit his inability to provide an explanation which calls solely upon materialistic reasoning.”


    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #15 - March 09, 2018, 10:49 AM

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQlqj3bt2Vc

    Top 8 Reasons why Jesus Christ is not the "Son of God" - ...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FdUXJoRqhyY
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #16 - March 09, 2018, 11:49 AM

    First of all all those reasons are poor and proves they have no understanding of the Christian faith.
    The word sin is used many times in the Bible but Jesus is referred to as the only begotten son of God no one else in the Bible is called the only begotten son of God. And at the same time Jesus says I and my father are one no other person in the Bible says this or calls God a father. Jesus did actually have stones thrown at him and the Jews said you claim to be Gods son. The Jews even accused him of blasphemy for claiming to be God. Son of Man itself proves he's God since it means he has dominion over mankind, Muslims need to learn the meaning of words in the Bible before they can claim to refute it. Jesus is the only person in the Bible born from a virgin. When Jesus prays to God the father it just highlights the relationship between he and his father it in no way means he is not God. You also do realize this isn't a Christian site aswell. Sorry everyone just needed to refute akay.
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #17 - March 09, 2018, 11:54 AM

    "Allah said, (until they pay the Jizyah), if they do not choose to embrace Islam, (with willing submission), in defeat and subservience, (and feel themselves subdued.), disgraced, humiliated and belittled. Therefore, Muslims are not allowed to honor the people of Dhimmah or elevate them above Muslims, for they are miserable, disgraced and humiliated. Muslim recorded from Abu Hurayrah that the Prophet said, (Do not initiate the Salam to the Jews and Christians, and if you meet any of them in a road, force them to its narrowest alley.) This is why the Leader of the faithful `Umar bin Al-Khattab, may Allah be pleased with him, demanded his well-known conditions be met by the Christians, these conditions that ensured their continued humiliation, degradation and disgrace."
    This is Umar Ibn Al Khattab promised the non Muslims and here are the terms to agreement:
    The ruler would provide security for the Christian believers who follow the rules of the pact.
    Prohibition against building new churches, places of worship, monasteries, monks or a new cell. (Hence it was also forbidden to build new synagogues, although it is known that new synagogues were built after the occupation of the Islam, for example in Jerusalem and Ramle. The law that prohibits to build new synagogues was not new for the Jews, it was applied also during the Byzantines. It was new for the Christians.)
    Prohibition against rebuilding destroyed churches, by day or night, in their own neighborhoods or those situated in the quarters of the Muslims.
    Prohibition against hanging a cross on the Churches.
    Muslims should be allowed to enter Churches (for shelter) in any time, both in day and night.
    Obliging the call of prayer by a bell or a kind of Gong (Nakos) to be low in volume.
    Prohibition of Christians and Jews against raising their voices at prayer times.
    Prohibition against teaching non-Muslim children the Qur'an.
    Christians were forbidden to show their religion in public, or to be seen with Christian books or symbols in public, on the roads or in the markets of the Muslims.
    Palm Sunday and Easter parades were banned.
    Funerals should be conducted quietly.
    Prohibition against burying non-Muslim dead near Muslims.
    Prohibition against raising a pig next to a Muslims neighbor.
    Christian were forbidden to sell Muslims alcoholic beverage.
    Christians were forbidden to provide cover or shelter for spies.
    Prohibition against telling a lie about Muslims.
    Obligation to show deference toward Muslims. If a Muslim wishes to sit, non-Muslim should be rise from his seats and let the Muslim sit.
    Prohibition against preaching to Muslims in an attempt to convert them from Islam.
    Prohibition against preventing the conversion to Islam of some one who wants to convert.
    The appearance of the non-Muslims has to be different from those of the Muslims: Prohibition against wearing Qalansuwa (kind of dome that was used to wear by Bedouin), Bedouin turban (Amamh), Muslims shoes, and Sash to their waists. As to their heads, it was forbidden to comb the hair sidewise as the Muslim custom, and they were forced to cut the hair in the front of the head. Also non-Muslim shall not imitate the Arab-Muslim way of speech nor shall adopt the kunyas (Arabic byname, such as "abu Khattib").
    Obligation to identify non-Muslims as such by clipping the heads' forelocks and by always dressing in the same manner, wherever they go, with binding the zunar (a kind of belt) around the waists. Christians to wear blue belts or turbans, Jews to wear yellow belts or turbans, Zoroastrians to wear black belts or turbans, and Samaritans to wear red belts or turbans.
    Prohibition against riding animals in the Muslim custom, and prohibition against riding with a saddle.
    Prohibition against adopting a Muslim title of honor.
    Prohibition against engraving Arabic inscriptions on signet seals.
    Prohibition against any possession of weapons.
    Non-Muslims must host a Muslim passerby for at least 3 days and feed him.
    Non-Muslims prohibited from buying a Muslim prisoner.
    Prohibition against taking slaves who have been allotted to Muslims.
    Prohibition against non-Muslims to lead, govern or employ Muslims.
    If a non-Muslim beats a Muslim, his Dhimmi is removed.
    The worship places of non-Muslims must be lower in elevation than the lowest mosque in town.
    The houses of non-Muslims must not be taller in elevation than the houses of Muslims.
    I don't see any difference to Isis and Islamic terrorists, do you?
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #18 - March 09, 2018, 12:04 PM

    As part of the dhimma system, a Muslim “officer of protection” regulated all affairs related to Christians.

    The dhimma system, then, was a gangster-like “protection racket” (pay “protection” or else) that was quite profitable for the Muslim rulers. Muhammad’s father-in-law, companion, and second caliph, Umar (a caliph so just and pious that he was known as al-Farooq, “one who distinguishes between right and wrong”), made clear that this was a profitable system of extortion: dhimmis were even more productive for Muslims than slaves and therefore should be kept “protected” as dhimmis rather than parceled out as slaves precisely because Muslims could live off them much better. After citing the verses from Quran 9:29 (“Fight against those who do not believe in God nor in the Last Day, who do not hold forbidden what God and His Apostle have forbidden, who do not practice the religion of truth but are of those to whom a Book has been given, until they pay the poll tax from their hand, they being humbled”), Umar admonished his followers (bracketed material is the translator’s):

    Have you considered, if we take them [as slaves] and share them out, what will be left for Muslims who come after us? By God, the Muslims would not find a man to talk to and profit from his labors. The Muslims of our day will eat [from the work of] these people as long as they live, and when we and they die, our sons will eat their sons forever, as long as they remain, for they are slaves to the people of the religion of Islam as long as the religion of Islam shall prevail.

    Plenty of other examples can be recited. A Muslim must not initiate the greeting when meeting a Christian. A Muslim judge must not hire a Christian as secretary. A Muslim must feed a poor Muslim, but he must not feed a poor Christian. A Muslim had an obligation to free, at some point, Muslim slaves, but not an obligation to free Christian slaves. A Muslim man could marry a free Christian woman, although this was not advisable, but a Christian man could not marry or fornicate with a Muslim woman, free or not, under penalty of death. The children of Muslim men and Christian women had to be raised as Muslims—a not-too-subtle instrument to further the decline of the Christian population and the growth of the Muslim one. The Muslim master of a Christian slave man could marry him to a Christian slave woman owned by the Muslim master, but if the woman converted to Islam, the Christian slave man was forbidden to have sex with the now-Muslim slave woman. A Muslim man could not marry Christian slave women but could marry Muslim slave women.

    Muslims celebrated their religion publicly, but Christians could not hold processions on the streets and must discreetly celebrate their religion within their churches and neighborhoods. In Umayyad Córdoba, Christians must not walk through Muslim cemeteries because their presence would pollute the Muslim tombs. Water, food, garments, and utensils touched by a Christian became polluted. As late as the fifteenth century in Christian-held territory, Muslim law told the mudéjares (Muslims under Christian domination): “water touched by an infidel, a wine-drinker, a cat, or a dog cannot be used for ablution; do not adopt ways of speaking, manners or customs of the Christians, nor their clothing, nor those of sinners.” New mosques could be freely built and old ones repaired, but Christians could rarely build new churches or even repair old ones, and never without the Muslims’ authorization. Mosques could stand proudly in Islamic cities, but Christian churches must not challenge the mosques by opening to main thoroughfares. Mosques and other Muslim buildings could be as high as architecturally feasible, but no Catholic church or other Christian buildings could tower above Muslim buildings. Mosques could not be converted into churches, but churches could be, and often were, converted into mosques. Muslims could have the muezzin loudly proclaim the call to prayer, but Christians could not ring their church bells. Muslims could proselytize, but Christians could not. Christians could be placed under Muslim law if they wished, but Muslims were forbidden to do the opposite. Christians could not display crosses on themselves. Christians could not display crosses on the outside or on top of their churches. Christians could not display figurative art on the outside walls of their churches. Christians could not wear Muslim-like clothes. Christians must wear distinctive signs. Christians must stand up in the presence of Muslims.

    Christians could not exercise political sovereignty in any form. They must not carry weapons. They must not ride horses in Muslim areas—a notable prohibition repeated by Muslim Turks during their occupation of Greece, when the Greek Orthodox raya (flock) could not ride horses, only donkeys, and had to ride sideways so they could readily dismount and genuflect before Muslims. Imam Malik, agreeing with the second caliph, Umar, observed: “I think that Christians should be compelled to wear belts, and that used to be required of them of old. I think that they should be compelled to be humble. Umar wrote that they should be mounted sideways [like women] on donkeys.” During a certain period of Umayyad rule in Spain, Muslim authorities even decreed the forced circumcision of male Christians.

    To these ways of oppressing and intentionally humiliating the dhimmi population, one must add the taxes that Muslim rulers could at any time arbitrarily pile up on top of the jizya, prompted by the rulers’ perennial need for cash to maintain their ostentatious lifestyle, poets, intellectuals, slaves, palaces, harems, and city-embellishment programs. Even Spanish Arabists sympathetic to Islamic Spain recognize that the harsh measures listed by jurist Ibn Abdun in eleventh- and twelfth-century Seville agreed with the teachings of medieval Maliki jurisprudence regarding the proper way to keep the dhimmis in a “condition of humiliation and subservience (sigar) or tolerated discrimination.”

    In short, contrary to what is commonly believed, the institution of the dhimma in Islamic Spain did not generously grant religious autonomy to Christians. It actually limited their religious practices in numerous ways, and it left the subject Christians without any possibility of attaining political power. Eventually reduced to minority status, Christian dhimmis saw their numbers slowly decline as a result of conversions that promised an escape from Islamic law’s humbling limitations and special taxation and also as a result of Islamic laws that, for example, forced the children of a Muslim man and a Christian woman to be raised as Muslims, and allowed a Muslim man to have children with up to four wives and as many sexual slaves as he could keep.

    The much-praised “tolerance” of al-Andalus was thus part of Islam’s imperialist system of separation from and subordination of Christians. Christians could practice their religion, but only on Islam’s terms. Islamic clerics and rulers remained effectively in control in matters of religion, and because religion informed everything, they remained effectively in control of everything.
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #19 - March 09, 2018, 12:05 PM

    Akay if your really serious and not joking or trolling this forum, you should know people aren't buying the bullshit your apologists sell anymore.
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #20 - March 10, 2018, 11:57 AM

    these are good posts  from you dear Mishael
     
    https://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=31424.msg876175#msg876175
    https://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=31424.msg876230#msg876230
    https://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=31424.msg876231#msg876231

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #21 - March 10, 2018, 09:00 PM

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NGinvU_b_ug

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rl_VVivr1dc
    \\
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWiGcenmYFA
    \\\\

  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #22 - March 10, 2018, 09:02 PM

    Your words are incorrect
    You must study Islam
    by
    Islamic Centers
    To know true Islam
    Non-Muslims have many rights in Islam. We will limit our discussion to the most important of them, such as the freedom of belief, right to work, housing, freedom of movement, and education.

    Islam does not compel non-Muslims citizens living in Muslim lands to be ruled by Islamic Laws. They are exempt from paying the zakah[1]. Under Islamic Law, a Muslim who does not pay the zakah and refuses its obligation becomes an unbeliever. Also, Islamic Law requires military duty from able Muslims, but non-Muslims are exempt from it, even though it is of benefit to Muslims and non-Muslims alike. In return for these two exemptions, non-Muslim citizens pay a nominal tax known as jizya. Sir Thomas Arnold wrote, ‘The jizya was so light that it did not constitute a burden on them, especially when we observe that it exempted them from compulsory military service that was an obligation for their fellow citizens, the Muslims.’[2]

    Islam also permitted non-Muslims to observe their civil law in matters such as marriage and divorce. Regarding criminal justice, Muslim jurists would pass sentences on non-Muslims in issues considered sinful in their religion such as theft, but exempted them from issues they held to be permissible such as drinking wine and eating pork.[3] This is based clearly of the practice of the Prophet himself when he first came to Medina and established a ‘constitution’. He allowed for individual tribes who were not Muslims to refer to their own religious scriptures and their learned men in regards to their own personal affairs. They could though, if they opted, ask the Prophet to judge between them in their matters. God says in the Quran:

    "…If they do come to you, either judge between them or decline to interfere…" (Quran 5:42)

    Here we see that Prophet allowed each religion to judge in their own matters according to their own scriptures, as long as it did not stand in opposition to articles of the constitution, a pact which took into account the greater benefit of the peaceful co-existence of the society.

    Umar ibn Abdulaziz, a Muslim ruler, found it hard to accept how non-Muslims continued to follow their social regulations that went against the Islamic injunctions. He wrote a letter to Hasan al-Basri[4] seeking his legal advice, saying, ‘How is it that the Rightly-Guided Caliphs before us left the People of the Covenant as they did, marrying close relatives[5], and keeping pigs and wine?’ Hasan’s responded, ‘They paid the jizya so that they could be left to practice what they believed, and you may only follow the Islamic Law, not invent something new.’[6]

    The People of the Covenant had their own courts to settle their disputes, but if they wished, they could resort to Islamic courts. God commanded His Prophet:

    "So if they come to you, (O Muhammad), judge between them or turn away from them. And if you turn away from them never will they harm you at all. And if you judge, judge between them with justice. Indeed, God loves those who act justly." (Quran 5:42)

    Adam Metz, a Western historian, writes in the Islamic Civilization in the Fourth Century of the Hegira:

    "Since the Islamic Law was specifically for Muslims, the Islamic state allowed the people of other religious affiliations to their own courts. What we know about these courts is that they were church courts and prominent spiritual leaders were the chief justices. They wrote a great number of books on canon law, and their rulings were not confined to matters of personal status. They included such problems as inheritance and much of the litigations between Christians that did not involve the state."[7]

    Therefore, it can be seen that Islam did not punish non-Muslims for doing what they viewed as permissible according to their religious law, such as consuming alcohol or eating pork, even though they are forbidden in Islam. The tolerance extended by Islam towards non-Muslims is unmatched by any other religious law, secular government, or political system in existence even today. Gustav LeBon writes:

    "The Arabs could have easily been blinded by their first conquests, and committed the injustices that are usually committed by conquerors. They could have mistreated their defeated opponents or forced them to embrace their religion, which they wished to spread all over the world. But the Arabs avoided that. The early caliphs, who had a political genius that was rare in proponents of new religion, realized that religions and systems are not imposed by force. So they treated the people of Syria, Egypt, Spain, and every country they took over with great kindness, as we have seen. They left their laws, regulations, and beliefs intact and only imposed on them the jizya, which was paltry when compared to what they had been paying in taxes previously, in exchange for maintaining their security. The truth is that nations had never known conquerors more tolerant than the Muslims, or a religion more tolerant than Islam."[8]




    Non-Muslims have the right not to have their religious beliefs mocked. It may not be an exaggeration to state that no other religion or sect in the world is as fair as Islam to people of other faiths. For example, let us look at a verse from the Quran:

    "Say, ‘Who gives you sustenance from the heavens and the earth?’ Say, ‘It is God; and it is certain that either we or you are on the right guidance or in manifest error.’" (Quran 34:24)

    The second example is the treaty of Umar ibn al-Khattab with the people of Iliya of Jerusalem:

    ‘This is the security given by the slave of God, Umar, the Commander of the Faithful, to the people of Iliya: they are guaranteed the security if their persons, possessions, churches, crucifixes, and everyone within, whether sick or in good health, as well as everyone in their community. Their churches will not be occupied or demolished, nor will anything be taken from them: neither furnishings nor crucifixes or money. They will not be forced away from their religion, or harmed because of it. They will not be occupied by the Jewish settlers in Iliya.

    As a result, since the era of the rightly-guided caliphs, Jews and Christians have held their services in freedom and security.

    Muslims protected Christian churches in the lands they occupied from being harmed. In a letter to Simeon, the Archbishop of Rifardashir and leader of all the bishops of Persia, the Nestorian Patriarch Geoff III wrote:

    ‘The Arabs, to whom God has given power over the whole world, know how wealthy you are, for they live among you. In spite of this, they do not assail the Christian creed. To the contrary, they have sympathy with our religion, and venerate our priests and saints of our Lord, and they graciously donate to our churches and monasteries.’[1]

    One of the Muslims caliphs, Abdul-Malik, took the Church of John from the Christians and made it part of a mosque. When Umar bin Abdulaziz succeeded him as the new Caliph, the Christians complained to him about what his predecessor had done to their church. Umar wrote to the governor that the portion of the mosque that was rightfully theirs be returned to them if they were unable to agree with the governor on a monetary settlement that would satisfy them.[2]

    The Wailing Wall in Jerusalem is known to historians to be the one of the holiest places of worship in Judaism. Some time ago, it was completely buried under rubble and heaps of debris. When the Ottoman caliph Sultan Sulayman came to know of this, he ordered his governor in Jerusalem to remove all the rubble and debris, clean the area, restore the Wailing Wall, and make it accessible for Jews to visit.[3]

    Unbiased Western historians acknowledge these facts. LeBon writes:

    ‘The tolerance of Muhammad towards the Jews and Christians was truly grand; the founders of other religions that appeared before him, Judaism and Christianity in particular, did not prescribe such goodwill. His caliphs followed the same policy, and his tolerance has been acknowledged by skeptics and believers alike when they study the history of the Arabs in depth.’[4]

    Robertson wrote:

    ‘The Muslims alone were able to integrate their zeal for their own religion with tolerance for followers of other religions. Even when they bore swords into battle for freedom for their religion to spread, they left those who did not desire it free to adhere to their own religious teachings.’[5]

    Sir Thomas Arnold, an English Orientalist, wrote:

    ‘We never heard of a report of any planned attempt to compel non-Muslim minorities to accept Islam, or any organized persecution aimed at uprooting the Christian religion. If any of the caliphs had chosen any of these policies, they would have overwhelmed Christianity with the same ease with which Ferdinand and Isabella exiled Islam from Spain, or with which Louis XIV made following Protestantism a punishable crime in France, or with which the Jews were exiled from England for 350 years. A that time Eastern churches were completely isolated from the rest of the Christian world. They had no supporters in the world as they were considered heretical sects of Christianity. Their very existence to this day is the strongest evidence of the policy of Islamic government’s tolerance towards them.’[6]
     
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #23 - March 10, 2018, 09:02 PM

    The American author, Lothrop Stoddard wrote, ‘The caliph Umar took the utmost care to tend to the sanctity of the Christian holy places, and those who became caliph after him followed his footsteps. They did not harass the many denominations of pilgrims who came annually from every corner of the Christian world to visit Jerusalem.’[7]

    The reality is that non-Muslims were treated with more tolerance among the Muslims than anything they experienced with other sects of their own religion. Richard Stebbins spoke of the Christian experience under the rule of the Turks:

    ‘They (the Turks) allowed all of them, Roman Catholics and Greek Orthodox, to preserve their religion and follow their consciences as they chose: they allowed them their churches to perform their sacred rituals in Constantinople and many other places. This is in contrast to what I can testify to from living in Spain for twelve years; not only were we forced to attend their Papist celebrations, but our lives and the lives of our grandchildren were in danger also.’[8]

    Thomas Arnold mentions in his ‘Invitation to Islam’ that there were many people in Italy at that time who longed for Ottoman rule. They wished they could be granted the same freedom and tolerance that the Ottomans gave to their Christian subjects, for they had despaired of achieving it under any Christian government. He also mentions that a great many Jews fled persecution in Spain at the end of the 15th century and took refuge in Ottoman Turkey.[9]
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #24 - March 10, 2018, 09:03 PM

    "And the sky He has raised; and He has set the Balance (of justice), that you may not exceed the (due) balance. But observe the measure strictly, nor fall short thereof." (Quran 55:7-10)

    Muslims are divinely ordained to act with justice, even if it means acting against themselves or those close to them, as the Quran states:

    "O you who have believed, persistently stand firm in justice, witnesses for Allah, even if it be against yourselves or parents and relatives. Whether one is rich or poor, Allah is more worthy of both. So follow not [personal] inclination, lest you not be just. And if you distort [your testimony] or refuse [to give it], then indeed Allah is Ever-Acquainted with what you do." (Quran 4:135)

    God requires that we apply justice at all times:

    "Indeed, Allah commands you to render trusts to whom they are due, and when you judge between people, to judge with justice. Excellent is that which Allah instructs you. Indeed, Allah is ever Hearing and Seeing." (Quran 4:58)

    Islamic justice towards non-Muslims is multifaceted. Islam gives them the right to go before their own courts; it also guarantees them equality in seeking justice with Muslims, if they choose to present their case in an Islamic court. God says:

    "So, if they come to you, (O Muhammad), judge between them, or turn away from them. And if you turn away from them – never will they harm you at all. And if you judge, judge between them with justice. Indeed, Allah loves those who act justly." (Quran 5:42)

    If a Muslim were to steal from a non-Muslim dhimmi, he would be liable to the same punishment as the dhimmi would have been had he stolen from the Muslim. Similarly, a Muslim is liable to receive a sentence for defamation if he slanders a man or woman protected under the covenant.[1]

    Islamic history has some beautiful examples of justice meted out by Muslims towards non-Muslims. A man named Ta’ima stole a suit of armor from Qataada, his neighbor. Qataada had hidden the armor inside a sack of flour so, when Ta’ima took it, the flour leaked out of the sack through a hole, leaving a trail up to his house. Ta’ima then left the armor in the care of a Jewish man named Zayed, who kept it in his house, in order to conceal his crime. Thus, when the people searched for the stolen armor, they followed the trail of flour to Ta’ima’s house but did not find it there. When confronted, he swore to them he had not taken it and knew nothing about it. The people helping the owner also swore that they had seen him breaking into Qataada’s house at night, and had subsequently followed the tell-tale trail of flour, which had led them to his house. Nevertheless, after hearing Ta’ima swearing he was innocent, they left him alone and looked for further clues, finally finding a thinner trail of flour leading to the house of Zayed, and so arrested him.

    The Jewish man told them that Ta’ima had left the armor with him, and some Jewish people confirmed his statement. The tribe to which Ta’ima belonged sent some of their men to the Messenger of God to present his side of the story, and asked them to defend him. The delegation was told, ‘If you do not defend our clansman, Ta’ima, he will lose his reputation and be punished severely, and the Jew will go free.’ The Prophet was subsequently inclined to believe them, and was about to punish the Jewish man when God revealed the following verses of the Quran to vindicate the Jew.[2] The verse continues to be recited by Muslims today as a reminder that justice must be served for all:

    "Indeed, We have revealed to you, (O Muhammad), the Book in truth so you may judge between the people by that which God has shown you. And do not be an advocate for the deceitful. And seek forgiveness of God. Indeed, God is ever Forgiving and Merciful. And do not argue on behalf of those who deceive themselves. Indeed, God loves not one who is a habitually sinful deceiver. They conceal [their evil intentions and deeds] from the people, but they cannot conceal [them] from God, and He is with them (in His knowledge) when they spend the night in such as He does not accept of speech. And God ever is encompassing of what they do. Here you are – those who argue on their behalf in [this] worldly life – but who will argue with God for them on the Day of Resurrection, or who will [then] be their representative?" (Quran 4:105-109)
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #25 - March 10, 2018, 09:03 PM

    Modern welfare states provide social benefits to their poor citizens, but Islam preceded all nations in establishing social security services. Islamic law set up financial provisions for needy Muslims through zakah (obligatory charity) and sadaqa (voluntary charity). Zakah was made obligatory on wealthy Muslims to take care of the poor, whereas sadaqa was left on individual discretion to help the needy. Social security provided by Islam includes non-Muslims as well. Islamic Law requires the state to provide for its citizens with disabilities – Muslim or non-Muslim - that prevent them from employment. They are provided for by the public treasury and the ruler is negligent if he does not do so. Many instances of Muslims providing social security to the non-Muslim citizens are recorded in history. Umar ibn al-Khattab the second caliph of Islam, once passed by a old, blind man begging in front of a house. Umar asked him which religious community he belonged to. The man said he was Jewish. Umar then asked him, ‘What has brought you to this?’ The old man said, ‘Do not ask me; ask …poverty, and old age.’ Umar took the man to his own home, helped him from his personal money, and then ordered the head of the treasury, ‘You must look after this man and others like him. We have not treated him fairly. He should not have spent the best years of his life among us to find misery in his old age.’ Umar also relieved him and others in his situation of paying the jizya.[1]

    Another example is found in Khalid ibn al-Walid’s letter to the people of the Iraqi city of Hira. It contains the terms of truce he offered them:

    ‘If God gives us victory, the people of the covenant will be protected. They have rights promised to them by God. It is the strictest covenant God has made incumbent on any of His prophets. They are also held by the duties that it places upon them and must not violate it. If they are conquered, they will live comfortably with everything due to them. I am commanded to exempt from jizya the elderly who cannot work, the disabled, or the poor who receive charity from their own community. The treasury will provide for them and their dependants as long as they live in Muslim lands or in the communities of Muslim emigrants. If they move outside of Muslim lands, neither they nor their dependants shall be entitled to any benefits.’[2]
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #26 - March 10, 2018, 09:04 PM

    In another instance, Umar ibn al-Khattab, the Muslim Caliph, was visiting Damascus. He passed by a group of Christian lepers. He ordered that they be given charity and regular stipends for food.[3]

    Umar ibn Abdul-Aziz, another Muslim Caliph, wrote to his agent in Basra, Iraq, ‘Search for the people of the covenant in your area who may have grown old, and are unable to earn, and provide them with regular stipends from the treasury to take care of their needs.’[4]

    Some of the early Muslims[5] used to distribute part of their post-Ramadan charity (zakat ul-fitr) to Christian monks, based on their understanding of the verse of Quran:

    "God does not forbid you from those who do not fight you because of religion and do not expel you from your homes – from dealing kindly and justly with them. Indeed, God loves those who act justly. God only forbids you from those who fight you because of religion and expel you from your homes and aid in your expulsion – (forbids) that you make allies of them. And whoever makes allies of them, then it is those who are the wrongdoers."(Quran 60:8-9)

    Finally, there are other rights that we have not discussed here, because of the assumption that they are elementary and taken for granted, such as the right to work, housing, transportation, education, and so forth.[6] However, before concluding, I would like to make the following observation. Our discussion has clarified how non-Muslims living in Muslim countries enjoy rights that they might not be granted in non-Muslim countries. Some readers may respond with the objection that these rights might have existed in history, but the experience of non-Muslims living in Muslim countries today is different. The author’s personal observation is that non-Muslims still enjoy many of these same rights today, perhaps even more. Allah Almighty has commanded us to be truthful, in the verse:

    "O you who believe! Stand out firmly for justice, as witnesses to Allah, even though it be against yourselves, or your parents, or your kin, be he rich or poor, God is a Better Protector to both (than you). So follow not the lusts (of your hearts), lest you avoid justice; and if you distort your witness or refuse to give it, verily, Allah is Ever Well-Acquainted with what you do."(Quran 4:135)

    Further, when we compare the conditions of non-Muslims living in Muslim countries to the status of Muslim minorities living in non-Muslim countries, whether now or in history, we see a profound difference. What happened to Muslims during the Crusades, under the Spanish Inquisition, in Communist China, or the Soviet Union? What is happening to them today in the Balkans, Russia, Palestine, and India? It would be worthwhile to reflect in order to give an answer based on fairness and declaration of truth and justice. Allah is the best of Judges, and He states:

    "O you who believe! Stand out firmly for God as just witnesses; and let not the enmity hatred of others make you avoid justice. Be just: that is nearer to piety; and fear God. Verily, God is Well-Acquainted with what you do."(Quran 5:Cool
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #27 - March 10, 2018, 09:04 PM

    Non-Muslim citizens have a similar right to be protected from external enemies just as a Muslim fellow citizen does. The payment of jizya ensures protection against outside aggression, defense against enemies, and ransom to be paid on their behalf if they are taken captive by an enemy.[1]

    Writing a few centuries ago, Ibn Hazm, a classical scholar of Islam, said:

    ‘If we are attacked by an enemy nation who is targeting the People of the Covenant living among us, it is out duty to come fully armed and ready to die in battle for them, to protect those people who are protected by the covenant of God and His Messenger. Doing any less and surrendering them will be blameworthy neglect of a sacred promise.’[2]

    History has recorded many examples of Muslims fulfilling their sacred promise towards the dhimmis. The companion of Prophet Muhammad, Abu Ubayda al-Jarrah, was the leader of the army that conquered Syria. He made agreement with its people to pay the jizya.

    Realizing the faithful loyalty of the Muslims, the Syrian people of the covenant resisted Muslim enemies and aided the Muslims against them. The residents of each town would send some of their people to spy against the Byzantines, who conveyed the news of the gathering of Byzantine army to Abu Ubayda’s commanders. Finally, when the Muslims feared they would not be able to guarantee their protectect ,Abu Ubayda wrote to his commanders to return all the money they had collected as jizya with the following message for the Syrians:

    ‘We are returning your money to you because news has reached us of the awaiting armies. The condition of our agreement is that we protect you, and we are unable to do so, therefore, we are returning what we have taken from you. If God grants us victory, we will stand by out agreement.’

    When his commanders returned the money and conveyed his message, the Syrian response was:

    ‘May God bring you back safely to us. May He grant you victory. If the Byzantines had been in your place, they would not have returned anything, they would have taken everything we own and left us with nothing.’

    The Muslims were victorious in the battle. When people of other towns saw how their allies were defeated, they sought to negotiate a truce with the Muslims. Abu Ubayda entered into a truce with all of them with all the rights he had extended in the first treaties. They also requested that the Byzantines hiding among them be given safe passage back home, with their families and possessions, without any harm, which Abu Ubayda agreed to.

    Then the Syrians sent the jizya and opened their cities to welcome Muslims. On the way back home, Abu Ubayda was met by the representatives of townspeople and villagers requesting him to extend the treaty to them as well, to which he happily complied.[3]

    Another example of Muslims’ defending the non-Muslim citizens can be seen in the actions of Ibn Taimiyya. He went to the Tartar leader after they had sacked Syria for release of their captives. The Tartar leader agreed to release the Muslim prisoners, but Ibn Taimiyya protested:

    ‘We will only be satisfied if all the Jewish and Christian prisoners are released as well. They are people of the covenant. We do not abandon a prisoner whether from our own people or from those under a covenant.’

    He persisted until the Tartars released all of them.[4]

    Furthermore, Muslim jurists have stated that protecting non-Muslims from external aggression is a duty just as their protection from internal harassment. Al-Mawardi stated:

    ‘The payment of the jizya entitles the people of the covenant to two rights. First, that they be left undisturbed. Second, that they be guarded and protected. In this way, they can be secure in society and protected from outside threats.’[5]

    Islam considers abandoning the protection of its non-Muslim citizens a form of wrongdoing and oppression that is forbidden. God says:

    "…And whoever commits injustice among you — We will make him taste a great punishment." (Quran 25:19)

    Therefore, harming or oppressing people of the covenant is considered a serious sin. Upholding treaties with them is an obligation on the Muslim Caliph and his representatives. The Prophet promised to argue on the Day of Judgment on behalf of the dhimmi against someone who harms him:

    "Beware! Whoever is cruel and hard on a non-Muslim minority, curtails their rights, burdens them with more than they can bear, or takes anything from them against their free will; I (Prophet Muhammad) will complain against the person on the Day of Judgment." (Abu Dawood)

    All evidence in Islamic Law points towards protecting the people of the covenant. Al-Qarafi, another classical Muslim scholar, wrote:

    ‘The covenant is a contract that has conditions that are compulsory for us, for they are under our protection as neighbors, and the covenant of God and His Messenger, and the religion of Islam. If someone harms them with inappropriate speech, defamation, any type of harassment, or is an accomplice to such actions, then he has made light of the covenant of God, His Messenger, and Islam.’[6]

    Umar, the second Caliph of Islam, would inquire from the visitors coming to meet him from other provinces about the situation of the people of the covenant and would say, ‘We may know that the treaty is still being upheld.’[7] On his deathbed, Umar is reported to have said, ‘Command whoever becomes Caliph after me to treat well the people of the covenant, to uphold the treaty, to fight whoever wants to harm them, and not to overwhelm them with burden.’[8]

    The writings of Muslim scholars and the actions of many Muslim rulers demonstrate the Islamic commitment from the earliest times to this right of non-Muslims.
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #28 - March 12, 2018, 05:32 AM

    If you can answer me one question correctly with truth in it ill agree with everything you say, could a non muslim preach in an islamic state. Again you ignored everything I said in favour of an apologetic argument, can you ignore what the pact of Umar says. Dhimmi status gives muslims the right to harass or oppress the non muslims of their state. Lol jizyah was so light, then why did the main revenue of the khilafat come from jizyah, without it the Khilafat couldn't function. Stop giving apologetic arguments since your a liar everyone who reads this will know your a liar. If a non muslim preaches his religion or an apostate leaves Islam what would happen in the Islamic state? The Arabs needed the non muslims of the state not all conquerers force their religion directly some subjugate like how the arabs subjugated all non muslims they came across. Arabs used the non muslims of their realm as slaves since all their revenues came from Jizyah, Zakat wasn't enough so in a way they needed a large population of non muslims in their realm once again like all muslims you lie. Also the argument the the Caliphs could genocide them hd they wanted to firstly genocide is never perfect no matter how many you kill you can never kill them all. The caliphs also depended on a non muslim population that they could readily abuse and extort money from. Also have you ever heard of how the ancient maronite christians or the Spanish christians fought the arabs for centuries how the persians resisted the arabs for hundreds for years. Once again I have no interest in watching liars like deedat who called for the death of renowned writer Salman Rushdie is this how peaceful you Muslims are?
  • Scientists and ..........!
     Reply #29 - March 12, 2018, 05:42 AM

    Crusades were a response to Islamic invasions, inquisitions were a heavily exaggerated event and only 6000-5000 people died most of whom were other christians, Muslims riot and cause problems in communist china and join terrorist groups to carry out attacks on people and the authorities. Everyone offered in the Soviet Union more so the christians since they were the majority of Russia. Palestine...? You mean when muslims murder jewish kids and teach their kids to carry out stabbing attacks on Israeli citizens and carry out suicide bombings, yeah I'm sure you guys are such victims to the evil zionists lol. In the balkans there are about three muslim majority countries, four actually if you include Turkey. All of these count tires are now muslims due to invasions by muslims, can you deny the suffering of middle eastern christians at the hands of muslims, can you deny the suffering of hindus in Kashmir and Pakistan, or the suffering of Bahai and other minorities in Iran, can you deny the suffering of bhuddists in Afghanistan. Just stop lying its pathetic.
  • 12 3 ... 7 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »