zulqarnain in Quran

Previous page 1 2 3 4« Previous thread | Next thread »
- cosmicdancer
- Pub Regular
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #90 - April 19, 2010, 12:46 PM

Quote from: shoaib on April 19, 2010, 12:42 PM
Asking questions to you is a part of my research. Please don't think that i want you to convince me or convert me if i ask any quesiton to you. I just want to know ex muslim's point of view about miracles of quran

Sure that's fine, Shoaib and if you want to ask me about any specific verse or issue I am more than happy to give my opinion - just don't ask me to go digging for "scientific mistakes" to present to you - I have neither the time nor the inclination
- shoaib
- Member
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #91 - April 19, 2010, 12:48 PM

Quote from: TheRationalizer on April 19, 2010, 11:02 AM
1: All of the miracle claims come into the following categories

A: The information was already known and plagiarised.
B: The words have been mistranslated deliberately to be favourable, and any conflicting verses ignored.
C: The claimant lies.

2: There are lots of places where the Quran seems to be echoing false beliefs of the time, people dismiss the simple explanations (Muhammad thought the Sun orbited the Earth) in favour of complex ones (God exists, God spoke to Muhammad, for some reason God told Muhammad the Sun orbits the Milky Way which takes 225 million years).

so what is the most clear scientific mistake in quran?
- shoaib
- Member
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #92 - April 19, 2010, 12:51 PM

Quote from: Hassan on April 19, 2010, 12:46 PM
Sure that's fine, Shoaib and if you want to ask me about any specific verse or issue I am more than happy to give my opinion - just don't ask me to go digging for "scientific mistakes" to present to you - I have neither the time nor the inclination

Thanks a lot friend. As i have told you that my purpose is to study islam as a neural person. I know what muslims think about islam but i don't know what non-muslims think about islam and i think those people are fool who just want to listen to only one side of debate.
- cosmicdancer
- Pub Regular
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #93 - April 19, 2010, 12:55 PM

Quote from: shoaib on April 19, 2010, 12:51 PM
Thanks a lot friend. As i have told you that my purpose is to study islam as a neural person. I know what muslims think about islam but i don't know what non-muslims think about islam and i think those people are fool who just want to listen to only one side of debate.

I admire your courage - good luck!
- Saif Rahman
- Ex-Muslim
- Je suis Haram
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #94 - April 19, 2010, 01:45 PM

Quote from: shoaib on April 19, 2010, 12:48 PM
so what is the most clear scientific mistake in quran?

Its complete account of embrology, sperm coming from the spine, not mentioning the female egg?

Here are 2 vids I did on the subject..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-k4COBCnnE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LK7-kZwa1IY

My Book
My Blog
- TheRationalizer
- Pub Regular
- Gone - due to unfair moderation
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #95 - April 19, 2010, 02:07 PM

Quote from: shoaib on April 19, 2010, 12:48 PM
so what is the most clear scientific mistake in quran?

Use QuranSearch.com and search for "Sun" - read all of the verses which mention the Sun and you will find that many of them mention the orbit of the sun in relation to the coming/going of days. It's pretty clear that the Quran author thought the Sun orbited the Earth every 24 hours to bring the daylight.

I think that saying stars are missiles to shoot down Jinn is pretty scientifically inaccurate too, if a star came anywhere near the Earth it would utterly destroy it. If it really meant "meteors" then it is still wrong, meteors are just lumps of rock usually from the kuiper belt which have been pulled out of orbit, the very idea that God shoots them at Jinn is so laughable I cannot express it.

I don't come here any more due to unfair moderation.
http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=30785
- TheRationalizer
- Pub Regular
- Gone - due to unfair moderation
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #96 - April 19, 2010, 02:36 PM

Quote from: shoaib on April 19, 2010, 12:48 PM
so what is the most clear scientific mistake in quran?

Oh, and I think the statement that we are all created from one life and its partner scores very high on the scientific error scale too

I don't come here any more due to unfair moderation.
http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=30785
- Zebedee
- Pub Regular
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #97 - April 19, 2010, 02:45 PM

Quote from: TheRationalizer on April 19, 2010, 02:36 PM
Oh, and I think the statement that we are all created from one life and its partner scores very high on the scientific error scale too

I dunno. The idea that we're all children of inbreeding explains a lot.
- kaiwai
- Pub Regular
- Meh, could be worse
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #98 - April 20, 2010, 02:22 AM

Quote from: Zebedee on April 19, 2010, 02:45 PM
I dunno. The idea that we're all children of inbreeding explains a lot.

Explains the radicalisation:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/newsnight/4442010.stm

Quote
It is estimated that at least 55% of British Pakistanis are married to first cousins and the tradition is also common among some other South Asian communities and in some Middle Eastern countries.

"It's just a job. Grass grows, birds fly, waves pound the sand. I beat people up." - Muhammad Ali
- Zebedee
- Pub Regular
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #99 - April 20, 2010, 11:16 AM

Quote from: kaiwai on April 20, 2010, 02:22 AM
Explains the radicalisation:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/newsnight/4442010.stm

I guess that wouldn't have anything to do with it being sanctioned in Islam now, would it?

That religion is just filled to the brim with bright ideas. It has to be the solution to all the worlds problems!
- Mixu Paatelainen
- Ex-Muslim
- Rudeboy
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #100 - April 20, 2010, 11:55 AM

The Book of Common Prayer has almost exactly the same rules about who you can and cannot marry as Islam, but Anglicans almost universally do not marry cousins. I think cousin marriages are more of a cultural thing which is backed up by Islam. I wouldn't say Islam specifically encourages it; more it allows it.

Religion - The hot potato that looked delicious but ended up burning your mouth!

Knock your head on the ground, don't be miserly in your prayers, listen to your Sidi Sheikh, Allahu Akbar! - Lounes Matoub
- kaiwai
- Pub Regular
- Meh, could be worse
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #101 - April 20, 2010, 11:56 AM

Quote from: Zebedee on April 20, 2010, 11:16 AM
I guess that wouldn't have anything to do with it being sanctioned in Islam now, would it?

That religion is just filled to the brim with bright ideas. It has to be the solution to all the worlds problems!

Who cares whether it is or isn't sanctioned; what it tells me is that Pakistani's would be marrying their cousins even without Islam; it is a practice that pre-dates Islam.

As for encouraging, it never does - there are numerous hadiths that talk about that it is best to marry outside the tribe to build up a larger web of interdependent and thus make the 'collective' stronger. Muhammad might have been a 7th century war lord but he wasn't dumb when it came to the benefits of marriage across tribes and between different peoples.

"It's just a job. Grass grows, birds fly, waves pound the sand. I beat people up." - Muhammad Ali
- Zebedee
- Pub Regular
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #102 - April 20, 2010, 12:16 PM

Quote from: kaiwai on April 20, 2010, 11:56 AM
Who cares whether it is or isn't sanctioned; what it tells me is that Pakistani's would be marrying their cousins even without Islam; it is a practice that pre-dates Islam.

As for encouraging, it never does - there are numerous hadiths that talk about that it is best to marry outside the tribe to build up a larger web of interdependent and thus make the 'collective' stronger. Muhammad might have been a 7th century war lord but he wasn't dumb when it came to the benefits of marriage across tribes and between different peoples.

That's long been understood as being a way of developing strong ties with other groups and tribes. Hence why even European royal families all married into each other.

Quote from: Mixu Paatelainen on April 20, 2010, 11:55 AM
The Book of Common Prayer has almost exactly the same rules about who you can and cannot marry as Islam, but Anglicans almost universally do not marry cousins. I think cousin marriages are more of a cultural thing which is backed up by Islam. I wouldn't say Islam specifically encourages it; more it allows it.

Yes, but of course, Islam is itself something that's heavily influenced by the culture of 7th century Arabia. Religion and culture are inextricable.

The only thing is, it's slightly odd for the so-called perfect religion, which is the solution to all human problems, to permit such a potentially harmful practice as inbreeding among a family. I would imagine that Allah, being omniscient, would have known the dangers of such cultural practices and would have subsequently banned it outright, rather than giving it direct sanction in the Qur'an (33:50).

It's particularly ironic as Islam strictly prohibits things which are comparatively quite harmless, like chess or eating pork.
- TheRationalizer
- Pub Regular
- Gone - due to unfair moderation
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #103 - April 20, 2010, 12:25 PM

Chess? Where?

I don't come here any more due to unfair moderation.
http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=30785
- Zebedee
- Pub Regular
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #104 - April 20, 2010, 12:35 PM

Muslim, Book 28, Number 5612:

"Buraida reported on the authority of his father that Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) said : He who played chess is like one who dyed his hand with the flesh and blood of swine."

Just google 'Chess in Islam.' It's largely regarded as being prohibited.

EDIT: here's a fatwa on it:

http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/14095
- Cool Canadian
- Ex-Muslim
- Don't mess with raccoon Mario
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #105 - April 20, 2010, 01:48 PM

Well on Islam QA, I remember one sheikh saying its not chess thats forbidden, but backgammon. Hmm, one says it haram, the other one, nope

"The more I study religions the more I am convinced that man never worshiped anything but himself."
~Sir Richard Francis Burton

"I think religion is just like smoking: Both invented by people, addictive, harmful, and kills!"
~RIBS
- Zebedee
- Pub Regular
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #106 - April 20, 2010, 02:13 PM

Quote from: Cool Canadian on April 20, 2010, 01:48 PM
Well on Islam QA, I remember one sheikh saying its not chess thats forbidden, but backgammon. Hmm, one says it haram, the other one, nope

Welcome to the world of Islamic jurisprudence.

But in any case, I think it's universally regarded as being makruh.
- kaiwai
- Pub Regular
- Meh, could be worse
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #107 - April 21, 2010, 12:26 AM

Quote from: Zebedee on April 20, 2010, 02:13 PM
Welcome to the world of Islamic jurisprudence.

But in any case, I think it's universally regarded as being makruh.

From what I understand those who do consider it haraam also bundle gambling in with it; I guess it would come under the rubric of 'games of chance'.

"It's just a job. Grass grows, birds fly, waves pound the sand. I beat people up." - Muhammad Ali
- kimo
- Ex-Muslim
- offline
Re: zulqarnain in Quran
Reply #108 - April 21, 2010, 02:34 AM

Quote from: kaiwai on April 18, 2010, 01:57 AM
On the matter of Ibn Rushd I found this tit bit on wikipedia:

Is this the future of a moderate/liberal Islam?

Actually kaiwai he was basically talking about ijtihad, which we all hope will result in a more liberal islam. so the answer in my opinion is yes.
Previous page 1 2 3 4« Previous thread | Next thread »