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 Topic: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad

 (Read 114988 times)
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  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #30 - November 19, 2009, 03:33 PM

    Just read the article from the link on your facebook account

    http://www.quranclub.net/2009/11/cleaning-up-kimdonesias-mess.html

    particularly this bit:
      Cheesy

    Its a shame that you only get to see the true colours of these people after leaving islam, if you seen it before you might have bolted earlier.


    I find it funny that she is labelled as rude when one considers that her life was under constantly scrutiny and attack by Muslims online; I remember seeing comments made by Muslims commenting that she should do this and that.

    I'm going to make a video tomorrow about ex-Muslims and the responses by Muslims.

    "It's just a job. Grass grows, birds fly, waves pound the sand. I beat people up." - Muhammad Ali
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #31 - November 19, 2009, 03:56 PM

    Fantastic - if you are a virgin to producing youtube videos, then there are some tips & pointers on this thread http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=6681.msg178666#msg178666.  

    Dont forget, if you need any helps & tips just post them up there, and I and others will try our best to help

    P.S If you wish to reference it, I also like to point muslims to this video when they state the No True Scotsan fallacy & claim no muslims leave Islam

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLiMlQzTHlQ

    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #32 - November 19, 2009, 04:47 PM

    Welcome KimDonesia, I mean EX-KimDonesia lol. I know this was late. We are all glad you joined here and not that stupid faith freedom website. If you need any help from us, please let us know and we would love to be of help Smiley

    "The more I study religions the more I am convinced that man never worshiped anything but himself."
    ~Sir Richard Francis Burton

    "I think religion is just like smoking: Both invented by people, addictive, harmful, and kills!"
    ~RIBS
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #33 - November 19, 2009, 05:23 PM

    Welcome, ExKimDonesia. If you still feel like you need spirituality in your life, we have the makings of the Church of the Kalashnikitty here: http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=7418.0

    "There is no God but the Kalashnikitty, and Mikhail is her prophet"

    fuck you
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #34 - November 19, 2009, 05:45 PM

    Welcome ExKimDonesia. I think you're very brave for making such a public statement that's in line with your conscience. Many others can't do that (yet). Looking forward to seeing your posts and glad you found us Smiley

    (edited to add the Ex... congrats again, the grass actually *is* greener on this side of the fence Wink )

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #35 - November 19, 2009, 07:56 PM

    Welcome Kim to the Den of the Godless ones..........never easy leaving islam..but dont worry you will be fine..........i still have fear of hell fire....but i think that is solved now bcos in one of my dreams i stole the key to hell fire and Allah and Mo are out looking for it.... Cheesy Cheesy dance....

    "There aint no devil, it's just God when he's drunk"- Tom Waits
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #36 - November 19, 2009, 08:19 PM

    Just read the article from the link on your facebook account

    http://www.quranclub.net/2009/11/cleaning-up-kimdonesias-mess.html

    particularly this bit:
      Cheesy

    Its a shame that you only get to see the true colours of these people after leaving islam, if you seen it before you might have bolted earlier.


    Its Muslims like this that make me sick to my stomach, and they are so fucking hypocritical. I GUARANTEE you, that maybe 1 month before she left Islam, the same people who wrote that article said things about KimDonesia such as "MASHALLAH she is an amazing muslim, Alhumdulilah, she is knowledgable and so sincere MASHALLAH MASHALLAH MASHALLAH" But when she left they say the exact opposite. Those motherfucking cunts, it just shows their true colours.

    "The more I study religions the more I am convinced that man never worshiped anything but himself."
    ~Sir Richard Francis Burton

    "I think religion is just like smoking: Both invented by people, addictive, harmful, and kills!"
    ~RIBS
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #37 - November 19, 2009, 08:20 PM

    in one of my dreams i stole the key to hell fire and Allah and Mo are out looking for it.... Cheesy Cheesy dance....

    in that case why dont you chuck them in instead and throw away the key?

    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #38 - November 19, 2009, 08:25 PM

    Welcome, Kim - I really like your video - very honest and sincere - good to see you here Smiley
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #39 - November 19, 2009, 08:28 PM

    Yeah granted, but what was it in Islam that appealed to you, when you first were exposed to it?  


    Ras, many people convert because they meet some very nice Muslims and feel attracted by the warmth, and love that many Muslims display. They only tend to see the actual beliefs through the prism of the nice Muslims they know.
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #40 - November 19, 2009, 08:44 PM

    in that case why dont you chuck them in instead and throw away the key?


    i woke up before i thought of what i was going to do with the key grin12

    "There aint no devil, it's just God when he's drunk"- Tom Waits
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #41 - November 19, 2009, 08:51 PM

    Ras, many people convert because they meet some very nice Muslims and feel attracted by the warmth, and love that many Muslims display. It is only later they start to take on the beliefs - though some then may leave as they start to see it clearly - many only see it through the prism of the nice Muslims they know.


    There are people like that in all cultures and societies though..  Why should an Islamic society be anything special?  I am Mediterranean and I am quite familiar with such things.

    Is it because of the perceived unity and cohesion of the community perhaps?

    "Modern man's great illusion has been to convince himself that of all that has gone before he represents the zenith of human accomplishment, but can't summon the mental powers to read anything more demanding than emoticons. Fascinating. "

    One very horny Turk I met on the net.
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #42 - November 19, 2009, 08:58 PM

    There is then the flipside to why muslims are reluctant to leave islam. This may have to do with nothing more than the trust they have placed in Muhammad, and the thought that they have been lied to, might be a notion they are not willing to entertain.
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #43 - November 19, 2009, 08:59 PM

    There are people like that in all cultures and societies though..  Why should an Islamic society be anything special?  I am Mediterranean and I am quite familiar with such things.

    Is it because of the perceived unity and cohesion of the community perhaps?


    I think some Europeans/Americans just want to explore outside their own comfort zone - something new and unfamiliar. I think that actually shows a lot of courage. For many it is a part of growing and exploring and for others it reflects a disillusionment or alienation from their own culture/faith etc... or just simply naivety.

    I think a lot of it is just that many people get bored of the familiar and want to try something new. Unfortunately before they know it many are trapped into it as Islam tends to suck you in bit by bit and deeper and deeper, without one realising it.
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #44 - November 19, 2009, 09:01 PM

    There are people like that in all cultures and societies though..  Why should an Islamic society be anything special?  I am Mediterranean and I am quite familiar with such things.

    Is it because of the perceived unity and cohesion of the community perhaps?


    Can't remember where I read it, but a poster wrote that she almost converted to islam because she liked the food the muslim family, she knew, produced. What she probably also liked was perhaps the 'unity and cohesion of the community'. Different people gets attracted for different reasons. If asked "why do you belong to 'such and such' religion?", many will simply answer "cause it's nice, and I have a sense of belonging".
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #45 - November 19, 2009, 09:04 PM

    Is it because of the perceived unity and cohesion of the community perhaps?


    Yes, I think so in some cases. The sense of being part of a supportive community with a strong sense of unity.

  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #46 - November 19, 2009, 09:07 PM

    I think some Europeans/Americans just want to explore outside their own comfort zone - something new and unfamiliar. I think that actually shows a lot of courage. For many it is a part of growing and exploring and for others it reflects a disillusionment or alienation from their own culture/faith etc... or just simply naivety.

    I think a lot of it is just that many people get bored of the familiar and want to try something new. Unfortunately before they know it many are trapped into it as Islam tends to suck you in bit by bit and deeper and deeper, without one realising it.



    i agree with you hassan, sometimes its about trying something new, when i was a muslim i met new converts who kind of felt elevated by simple things in islam like "washing their private parts with water after they urinated"..or one convert to islam from christianity i know said the reason he converted to islam was that in christianity he only went to church on sundays and he thought to himself God deserves to be worshiped more than once a week so he embraced islam because he gets to praise his "creator" 5 times a day... wacko wacko

    "There aint no devil, it's just God when he's drunk"- Tom Waits
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #47 - November 19, 2009, 09:10 PM

    I think a lot of it is just that many people get bored of the familiar and want to try something new. Unfortunately before they know it many are trapped into it as Islam tends to suck you in bit by bit and deeper and deeper, without one realising it.


    I recall an article which argued that conversion to islam would be a new kind of childrens revolt against their parents in western countries Smiley . So being muslim is like doing drugs?!?

    Quote
    I think some Europeans/Americans just want to explore outside their own comfort zone - something new and unfamiliar. I think that actually shows a lot of courage. For many it is a part of growing and exploring and for others it reflects a disillusionment or alienation from their own culture/faith etc... or just simply naivety.


    Well I don't think that islam is so exotic for many new converts, cause they practically have grown up side by side with muslims. I think that most converts are due to personal relationship with muslims. And as you stated mane of these converts probably "tend to see the actual beliefs through the prism of the nice Muslims they know". And there is a lot those, nice muslims Smiley more than the cultural bigots would like it to portray it
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #48 - November 19, 2009, 09:17 PM

    Can't remember where I read it, but a poster wrote that she almost converted to islam because she liked the food the muslim family, she knew, produced. What she probably also liked was perhaps the 'unity and cohesion of the community'. Different people gets attracted for different reasons. If asked "why do you belong to 'such and such' religion?", many will simply answer "cause it's nice, and I have a sense of belonging".


    That is what I admire about the Islamic communities that surround us in neighbouring countries, the way family is important to them.  Traditionally we are also like that, although things are changing.

    "Modern man's great illusion has been to convince himself that of all that has gone before he represents the zenith of human accomplishment, but can't summon the mental powers to read anything more demanding than emoticons. Fascinating. "

    One very horny Turk I met on the net.
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #49 - November 19, 2009, 09:19 PM

    i agree with you hassan, sometimes its about trying something new, when i was a muslim i met new converts who kind of felt elevated by simple things in islam like "washing their private parts with water after they urinated"..or one convert to islam from christianity i know said the reason he converted to islam was that in christianity he only went to church on sundays and he thought to himself God deserves to be worshiped more than once a week so he embraced islam because he gets to praise his "creator" 5 times a day... wacko wacko


    Clearly demonstrates that they have turned to Islam in search of a meaning and awareness in their own lives

    "Modern man's great illusion has been to convince himself that of all that has gone before he represents the zenith of human accomplishment, but can't summon the mental powers to read anything more demanding than emoticons. Fascinating. "

    One very horny Turk I met on the net.
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #50 - November 19, 2009, 09:20 PM

    Welcome and well done on leaving Islam!

    I'm not gonna lie, I had never heard of you previously but I just looked you up on youtube!

    Could I ask you how old you are? And how old were you when you became Muslim? Its just you seem quite young and seem to have had some remarkable experiences for one so young!

    People say "you need God, He doesn't need you". Doesn't seem like it.



    That is so true!

    Religion - The hot potato that looked delicious but ended up burning your mouth!

    Knock your head on the ground, don't be miserly in your prayers, listen to your Sidi Sheikh, Allahu Akbar! - Lounes Matoub
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #51 - November 19, 2009, 10:32 PM

    One of the most common reasons I've heard for Christians converting to Islam, is that they have a hard time coming to terms with the trinity and original sin. Islam offers them a pure monotheism without any other mystery attached to it. There is also the notion that every child is born without sin and hence there is no need to accept the blood of Christ.
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #52 - November 19, 2009, 10:39 PM

    People say "you need God, He doesn't need you". Doesn't seem like it.

    Ditto  Afro

    Also welcome to the forums. Well done on publicising about your apostasy, I wish I could do it as well. It will make people understand that there are indeed apostates and that they have experienced Islam and didn't like it. Cuz all of them will say that people who apostate are those who has not experienced Islam.

    "In every time and culture there are pressures to conform to the prevailing prejudices. But there are also, in every place and epoch, those who value the truth; who record the evidence faithfully. Future generations are in their debt." -Carl Sagan

  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #53 - November 19, 2009, 10:52 PM

    Its Muslims like this that make me sick to my stomach, and they are so fucking hypocritical. I GUARANTEE you, that maybe 1 month before she left Islam, the same people who wrote that article said things about KimDonesia such as "MASHALLAH she is an amazing muslim, Alhumdulilah, she is knowledgable and so sincere MASHALLAH MASHALLAH MASHALLAH" But when she left they say the exact opposite. Those motherfucking cunts, it just shows their true colours.

    Reminds me of this, which I predict would happen to me if I came out:

    Bukhari, 55. Kitab al-Anbiya, #546

    Narrated Anas:
    ...
    "O Allah's Apostle! The Jews are liars, and if they should come to know about my conversion to Islam before you ask them (about me), they would tell a lie about me." The Jews came to Muhammad and 'Abdullah went inside the house. Muhammad asked (the Jews), "What kind of man is 'Abdullah bin Salam amongst you?" They replied, "He is the most learned person amongst us, and the best amongst us, and the son of the best amongst us." Muhammad said, "What do you think if he embraces Islam?" The Jews said, "May Allah save him from it." Then 'Abdullah bin Salam came out in front of them saying, "I testify that there is no god but God, and that Muhammad is the Messenger of God." Thereupon they said, "He is the evilest among us, and the son of the evilest amongst us," and continued talking badly of him.



    I converted because I believed in Tawheed and everything that came with it. Don't dismiss that for Kim or anyone else.

    I chose to get circumcised at 17, don't tell me I never believed.
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #54 - November 19, 2009, 11:52 PM

    Just read the article from the link on your facebook account

    http://www.quranclub.net/2009/11/cleaning-up-kimdonesias-mess.html

    particularly this bit:
    Cleaning up KimDonesia's mess
     
    by The Soul Of A Rose on Wednesday, November 18, 2009
    Photo source.As Salamu Alaykoum dear brothers and sisters!

    What is going on?
    Quote
    Two YouTube users, KimDonesia and TheVintageGoth, left Islam. We don't know much about TheVintageGoth, so here we'll talk about Kim.

    This incident wouldn't be worth writing about if it wasn't for its potential to create fitnah and confusion.

    About KimDonesia
    KimDonesia produced a lot of loose Islamic material, built a large audience around her looks, and then all of a sudden dropped Islam.

    She was advised by many, whilst she was a 'Muslim', not to put up videos that attract the male audience to her physical assets. We did our best to advise her about her un-Islamic behavior, yet she responded with rude and offensive comments.

    Why did she exactly convert to Islam?
    It is not clear, but we know that she didn't know much about the religion. Our guess is that:

    ?She either converted for personal reasons (to please someone or a group of people).
    ?Or all of this was a set up to harm Islam. The Quran mentions this old trick.

      Cheesy

    Its a shame that you only get to see the true colours of these people after leaving islam, if you seen it before you might have bolted earlier.


    The same old same old.  She / he never believed, she was a fitnah / sinner, and it was a conspiracy anyway.  I honestly don't know how the west gets anything done, seeing as how we are all engaged, at all times, in conspiracies large and small against Islam.

    [this space for rent]
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #55 - November 20, 2009, 12:03 AM

    I think some Europeans/Americans just want to explore outside their own comfort zone - something new and unfamiliar. I think that actually shows a lot of courage. For many it is a part of growing and exploring and for others it reflects a disillusionment or alienation from their own culture/faith etc... or just simply naivety.

    I think a lot of it is just that many people get bored of the familiar and want to try something new. Unfortunately before they know it many are trapped into it as Islam tends to suck you in bit by bit and deeper and deeper, without one realising it.



    Islam is "new" and different in the sense that it isn't Christianity, but it's still very much a comfort zone thing.  Islam is Abrahamic - the same characters, the same stories (or so you think), the same invisible sky friend.  The beliefs as far as the five pillars and the articles of faith really aren't that far off at all. It's the traditions and practices and the social constructs that are really out there.  Becoming Wiccan or getting into Theravada Buddhism or even Mormonism is really, really different than what you are familiar with, as the average westerner.

    A lot of us were told that we could "still be Americans / British / etc and be Muslim" and that our lives didn't require that much change - just don't drink or eat pork.  People who convert to Islam by and large do not know how much change is demanded - not just by dominant versions of Islam, but by the Muslims themselves.  If you look at our dawahganda societies, the literature they give out, the "conversations" they have with people don't cover these issues at all.  You certainly aren't told, as an interested non-muslim, that some Muslims consider sitting on couches & chairs to be bida, that TV, music, etc are haram or considered very doubtful, that racism is rife in the community and that as a convert you will be held to stricter standards of behaviour.  I don't know about Kim or others, but I certainly was told many, many times that wearing hijab is a private choice and that it wasn't that important, that faith was, etc. and then suddenly once you're past the shahada you're slammed as a whore, fake Muslim, disobedient, etc for not wearing jilbab your first day out the gate.

    http://ofglitnir.wordpress.com/2008/09/17/for-what-reason/


    [this space for rent]
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #56 - November 20, 2009, 12:08 AM



    Excellent article - thanks  Afro
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #57 - November 20, 2009, 12:10 AM

    Yes, I think so in some cases. The sense of being part of a supportive community with a strong sense of unity.


    I think the fairy tale of unity can be quite interesting to some people, but in reality you see a lot more cohesion and support in different Christian sects than you do in Muslim ones.  Although, when people weren't paying attention to Islam that much, the Muslims did a good job of selling the image of the ummah to people.  I think now that divisions are more out in the open.

    I was Muslim for many years before I ever had anything to do with Muslims.  It was clear from the start that I was not going to be welcomed, and any time I tried to approach the masjid I was rebuffed due to gender or race.   It was the salafis who proved to be most accepting and striving for that true brotherhood, in my life experience (of course, then they fell a part in a storm of recrimination and mutual condemnation and bayans and all that -- but it was based on ideology and not gender or race or economic status, like in the other masjids).

    [this space for rent]
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #58 - November 20, 2009, 12:16 AM

    i agree with you hassan, sometimes its about trying something new, when i was a muslim i met new converts who kind of felt elevated by simple things in islam like "washing their private parts with water after they urinated"


    When I first learned about istinja, I thought 'What the fuck?' but now I see how sensible it is.  The thing is, even though Islam teaches it, it's fairly widespread in Eastern cultures, from what I know.  I don't know if bidets are used widely in Europe, but they're definitely not on this side of the pond.  It just makes sense.  In America, they now market these wipes to clean yourself with.  So you pay $3 for a box of wipes, using paper, plastic, and the chemicals, when you could install a hose like in the Arab countries or use a lota and use the water from your sink for free - without the packaging and plastic and purchasing refills. 

    Quote
    ..or one convert to islam from christianity i know said the reason he converted to islam was that in christianity he only went to church on sundays and he thought to himself God deserves to be worshiped more than once a week so he embraced islam because he gets to praise his "creator" 5 times a day... wacko wacko


    I think seeing the hypocrisy of many Christians and Christian churches - sinning six days a week, then turning around and getting all pious on Sunday - is something that drives people away, and some of those people see in Islam a vision where you connect with god everyday, not just on Sundays.  Of course, they don't know or realize that a lot of Muslims are hypocrites too - hypocrisy doesn't know a religion, but I can see where people who believe in god get fed up with the attitudes of some members of different sects that they can do whatever they want and treat people however they like as long as they ask Jebus for forgiveness on Sunday. 

    [this space for rent]
  • Re: Famous Muslim to infamous Murtad
     Reply #59 - November 20, 2009, 12:18 AM

    Excellent article - thanks  Afro


     Smiley

    [this space for rent]
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