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 Topic: I made a mistake

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  • I made a mistake
     OP - June 03, 2009, 05:20 AM
    ok so i have always been a free thinker i grew up in a not so common faith,but i loved it all the same. i always studied what others belived b/c i have always felt that it was the only way to peace. through learning about how others belive you gain understanding. so someone in my family converted to islam around that time i had never read anything about islam. when this family member would get a new book or info i would read it. all the info about islam was very uplifing and nice soon enough i met friends of my family member of course other muslims they would ask me when i would convert and i would say never. soon enough i found myself going to friday prayer all on my own free will just trying see wht it was all about. soon enough i converted and the next day i knew i had made a very big mistake. i realized this when people that were other muslims would tell me what i had to give up. the list of things that i would have to live without let me know that islam was a child of str8 men looking for power (sorry if that makes you mad). i thought about it for a while and told myself "ok lets give it a chance maybe im just freaking out" ,so i made up in my mind to read the koran with a open mind. Before then i had  three princeapals that i would never brake or be apart of anybody or group that broke them. i had read some of the koran and in the beginning was pretty nice love this and love that but when i read the parts that pretty much said kill everybody but muslims a big what the fuck went across my mind. then came the killing of gay people. I had to close the book, right then and there i knew islam is not for me.The bottom line is i dont belive God whats anybody to hate anybody.Then i read of Aisa the 6yr old girl that the prophat married and abused when she was 9 and that just truned me totally off to islam.But anyway now im kinda stuck on one hand nothing is muslim about me i dont pray and i dont belive in anything that islam teaches.  right now i kinda pretend to be muslim to the people that know i did take shahada. I dont belive im going hell, i have always belived God/dess has many path ways. 
    God is in the music.
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #1 - June 03, 2009, 06:22 AM
    Welcome freethinking1

    Alot of converts actually end up doing and feeling what you have, I remember back when I was muslim being told NOT to tell potential new muslims all the rules until after they became muslims, so as not to frighten them or put them off.  Roll Eyes

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #2 - June 03, 2009, 07:01 AM
    Welcome to our safe abode, no need to hide here!

    Quote from: freethinking1 on June 03, 2009, 05:20 AM
    ok so i have always been a free thinker i grew up in a not so common faith,but i loved it all the same.

    Which religion is that?
    Quote
    then came the killing of gay people.

     
    Where did you read this?  I dont think its in the Quran
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  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #3 - June 03, 2009, 07:21 AM
    Quote from: IsLame on June 03, 2009, 07:01 AM
    Welcome to our safe abode, no need to hide here!
    Which religion is that?
    Where did you read this? I dont think its in the Quran



    The story of Lot, when he killed an entire city of people for being gay, inspite of the fact that not everyone there was gay, the mere fact that they allowed it meant death to them too.

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #4 - June 03, 2009, 07:37 AM
    Quote from: BerberElla on June 03, 2009, 07:21 AM
    The story of Lot, when he killed an entire city of people for being gay, inspite of the fact that not everyone there was gay, the mere fact that they allowed it meant death to them too.




    I think you mean when Allah killed an entire city.

    And welcome Freethinking1
    Knowing Islam is the only true religion we do not allow propagation of any other religion. How can we allow building of churches and temples when their religion is wrong? Thus we will not allow such wrong things in our countries. - Zakir Naik
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #5 - June 03, 2009, 08:17 AM
    Of course that is what I meant lol and I don't think in a place like this anyone would have mistaken who I was talking about.  Wink
    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #6 - June 03, 2009, 08:22 AM
    The whole village was wiped out, but how could this race of people been self-sustaining if everyone, as claimed (apart from Lot's family & an old woman), had been practising in 'sodomy'.  If everyone wasn't then God accepted the 'innocents' were just collateral damage.  With all Gods powers and in order to achieve what he wanted, he could at least killed those who he set out to eliminate?

    Quote
    Allah the Almighty revealed: The people of Lot (those dwelt in the towns of Sodom in Palestine) belied the Messengers when their brother Lot said to them: "Will you not fear Allah and obey Him? Verily! I am a trustworthy Messenger to you. SO fear Allah, keep your duty to Him, and obey me. No reward do I ask of you for it (my Message of Islamic Monotheism) my reward is only from the Lord of the Alamin (mankind, jinn and all that exists). Go you in unto the males of the Alamin (mankind), and leave those whom Allah has created for you to be your wives? Nay, you are a trespassing people!"

    They said: "If you cease not, O Lot! Verily, you will be one of those who are driven out!"

    HE said: "I am indeed, of those who disapprove with severe anger and fury your (this evil) action (of sodomy). My Lord! Save me and my family from what they do."

    SO We saved him and his family, all except an old woman (this wife) among those who remained behind. (Ch 26:160-171 Quran) http://www.islamawareness.net/Prophets/lut.html

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  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #7 - June 03, 2009, 10:25 AM
    Quote from: BerberElla on June 03, 2009, 08:17 AM
    Of course that is what I meant lol and I don't think in a place like this anyone would have mistaken who I was talking about.  Wink


    Sorry just being a bit pedantic.
    Knowing Islam is the only true religion we do not allow propagation of any other religion. How can we allow building of churches and temples when their religion is wrong? Thus we will not allow such wrong things in our countries. - Zakir Naik
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #8 - June 03, 2009, 10:33 AM
    Quote from: IsLame on June 03, 2009, 08:22 AM
    The whole village was wiped out, but how could this race of people been self-sustaining if everyone, as claimed (apart from Lot's family & an old woman), had been practising in 'sodomy'.  If everyone wasn't then God accepted the 'innocents' were just collateral damage.  With all Gods powers and in order to achieve what he wanted, he could at least killed those who he set out to eliminate?


    Well that's nothing compared to flooding of the entire earth just because some were sinful. Killing innocent children the animals makes Sodom pale in comparison.

    Some of the wars against the Hitites, Amalekites, Jebusites, and Amorites would have been even grander in scale as compared to Sodom burning. Entire cities destoyed even children and livestock killed at the behest of god.

    Apparently God couldn't just single out the wrong doers. Nor could he reform them from their co-called 'sinful' behaviour.
    Knowing Islam is the only true religion we do not allow propagation of any other religion. How can we allow building of churches and temples when their religion is wrong? Thus we will not allow such wrong things in our countries. - Zakir Naik
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #9 - June 03, 2009, 12:29 PM
    What's the penalty for someone who is caught practising homosexuality under the glorious Shariah?

    And welcome, Freethinker.   Smiley
    "Befriend them not, Oh murtads, and give them neither parrot nor bunny."  - happymurtad's advice on trolls.
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #10 - June 03, 2009, 01:03 PM
    I've heard that under Shariah, homosexual practise is a religious crime that carries the death sentence. I wonder what happens to them in Saudi Arabia & Iran? 
    Is there any state in the world that carries out Shariah Law to the full?
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  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #11 - June 03, 2009, 03:50 PM
    Quote from: Cheetah on June 03, 2009, 12:29 PM
    What's the penalty for someone who is caught practising homosexuality under the glorious Shariah?

    And welcome, Freethinker.   Smiley


    The Sharia pronouncement regarding sodomy is that those who are confirmed to be homosexuals are to be executed.
    SAD 38:4447 If you find anyone doing as Lot's people did (homosexual acts), kill the one who does it, and the one to whom it is done.

    The following hadith passage says that homosexuals should be burned alive or have a wall pushed onto them:
    Muhammad said, "Accursed is he who does what Lot's people did." In a version on the authority of Ibn Abbas it says that Ali had two people burned and that Abu Bakr had a wall thrown down on them. (Mishkat, vol. 1, p. 765, Prescribed Punishments)

    The punishment of toppling a wall onto those guilty of homosexuality was used by the Taliban in Afghanistan. However, currently in most Islamic states hanging, usually from a crane in a public square, is the preferred method.
    Knowing Islam is the only true religion we do not allow propagation of any other religion. How can we allow building of churches and temples when their religion is wrong? Thus we will not allow such wrong things in our countries. - Zakir Naik
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #12 - June 03, 2009, 04:19 PM
    Sheesh!
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  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #13 - June 04, 2009, 01:42 AM
    You seriously didnt know that they execute gays in Iran and Saudi Arabia? They also do in many many other Sharia countries. There is a list of which countries punish homosexuality and by which methods.

    In India, homosexuality is illegal by law, but gay people are able to live their lives unpunished, yet the hindu culture hates and ridicules GLBT people just as much as in a lot of Muslim countries, as does the recent power creep of stupid Christians in America.

    I call them stupid because when chatting with them, they werent a very clever lot. They basically believe that the bible is 100% literal truth, and that the whole country should have to abide to its rules, including illegalising sodomy in the USA.  

    My conversations revealed that Christians attending churches in the USA were taught to fully oppose and hate homosexuality, I spoke to one such person who was repeating lines he was taught in church and from his bible over and over again - they feel the need to tell everyone that they are sinning and are going to burn in hell if they disagree with what they do. Also, they are easilly pushed beyond their limits into speaking hateful insults and death threats if you carry on pressuring them.  

    Yet, many christians and muslims dont even know that sodomy includes all forms of non vaginal intercourse, also between any gender. By the rules of the holy book, a woman giving oral to a man is just as much guilty as two men having anal ...

    Christians and Muslims must be quite terrible in bed.

    My christian friends at university said that they were taught that ...

    'While the bible disapproves of homosexuality, we must still love them because they are our neighbors', and also that the people that follow Christianity in a hateful way such as those examples from America are not true Christians and are doing nothing more then sinning themselves.

    Yet common churches that are intended for the stupids are very very different and hateful towards everything that disagrees with the bible.
    We keep hearing about how Jack Straw or the French government have mentioned the veil and our doing so puts us in the same boat as them. How so? I want a ban on the burka, neqab and child veiling.

    you can either defend women or you must defend Islam. You can’t defend both

    - Maryam Namaze
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #14 - June 04, 2009, 03:08 AM
    well it was LOt and the phrophat said to kill the people that do sodomy. one big thing that stuck out with me is that even the phrophat broke one of the laws in the koran but coverd it up by saying God told him to. As i have come to understand a girl is not a woman intill she has frist blood so Aisa was still a girl anyway you cut it, but the phorapht had a "dream that God had said hears your wife".plus he had dreams with a union with her. i checked this out (with todays meaning of things) and found that this is a Big sign of pedofilia. On a side note the people of that day and beyond belived that the sprit could be spread through touch (hence why you see all the demons or whatever jump from person to person by touch) so what alot of the men did was get naked and hold each other or more. What really gets me is that everybody alway says LOT is why gay is a sign or whatever,but they always forget that they were not killed for being gay, yes they were raping and doing things with animals,but they were killed for rejecting God by there own mouths.I always bring this up when some holyer than tho person trys to tell me why im not "gay" i just think i am. I think the reason why gays are oftan hated is b/c they are some of the only ones that can prove that alot of these "God said writhings" are for shit think about what if a gay pesron is in chruch or whatever and hears the preacher say God hates all gay people? Hewould prob think "thats not true im gay and i feel gods love all the time, in fact he has blessed me with my partner.Now what if he told people this fact, and they belived him? Alot of people whould have a crises of fatih.
    Fact is that when someone is trying unite a group of people they have to make there case seem good and pure so they have to pick on what most people hate already. Back in those days the kings of the land would take young girls and boys as love slaves,plus your kids having kids was very important, so if your sons gay then goodbye grandkids and also the family name, and family land. So people hearing that gay is wrong and God dosent like it to just makes sense to the people at that time. Sorry i just had to vent about that.
    God is in the music.
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #15 - June 04, 2009, 03:13 AM
    O sorry someone asked what faith i was and am LOL dance im pagan. I was born into paganism  I belive in a goddess and a god,but that are two halfs to a whole. so i can say i am a practising witch or wiccan whatever people like to call it, i have been practicing since i was a kid. and i love it more than ever now.~Blessed Be~
    God is in the music.
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #16 - June 04, 2009, 05:18 AM
    Quote from: freethinking1 on June 04, 2009, 03:13 AM
    O sorry someone asked what faith i was and am LOL dance im pagan. I was born into paganism  I belive in a goddess and a god,but that are two halfs to a whole. so i can say i am a practising witch or wiccan whatever people like to call it, i have been practicing since i was a kid. and i love it more than ever now.~Blessed Be~


    Wow, you went from being Wiccan to being a Muslim convert? Sheesh! That's a bit of a big leap off the altar and into horse manure (no offense to horses). Glad you found your way out. I've studied Wicca and Paganism's various teachings and have always thought it to be a much better alternative to the 3 monotonous, monolithic, monotheistic religions.

    Good for you. Welcome!
    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #17 - June 04, 2009, 08:32 AM
    Quote from: freethinking1 on June 04, 2009, 03:13 AM
    O sorry someone asked what faith i was and am LOL dance im pagan. I was born into paganism  I belive in a goddess and a god,but that are two halfs to a whole. so i can say i am a practising witch or wiccan whatever people like to call it, i have been practicing since i was a kid. and i love it more than ever now.~Blessed Be~

    from what I remember you are not the only one - belladonnasix here is a wiccan too
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  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #18 - June 04, 2009, 08:36 AM
    I've dabbled with the idea of paganism, at one time I found it very appealing, but the only way to make it acceptable too, is to create your own mish mash of things.

    If that's the case then I'd rather create a mish of mash of beliefs that tell me that when I die I will travel through a portal to take me to some far away fantasy land full of unicorns, elves and dragons.  cool2

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #19 - June 04, 2009, 02:09 PM
    Quote from: BerberElla on June 03, 2009, 07:21 AM
    The story of Lot, when he killed an entire city of people for being gay, inspite of the fact that not everyone there was gay, the mere fact that they allowed it meant death to them too.




    I don't know the Muslim version of this story, but in the Christian and Jewish versions:

    1) The people of Sodom were committing many more sins than just mind-blowing anal sex. Jewish religious tradition is even clearer on this point than the Christians-- though in all versions/translations of Genesis, sins other than buttfucking can be found.

    2) In the Christian and Jewish version God told Abraham he would spare the city if even ten righteous could be found among them, so as not to "punish the righteous along with the wicked", and, in the Christian version, when the people gathered around Lot's house to demand to rape the angels disguised as men, it was not just a few, but every man in the city. The Tanankh version goes even further saying it was everyone in the city, without reference to gender. So in either version it could be interpreted that Lot was the only righteous man in the city and God spared him.
    fuck you
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #20 - June 04, 2009, 09:22 PM
    Welcome!

    But please learn to use the Return key on your keyboard, or my internet-powered ADHD kicks in and I stop reading your posts at line #2
    Do not look directly at the operational end of the device.
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #21 - June 07, 2009, 07:19 PM
    Quote from: freethinking1 on June 03, 2009, 05:20 AM
    ok so i have always been a free thinker i grew up in a not so common faith,but i loved it all the same. i always studied what others belived b/c i have always felt that it was the only way to peace. through learning about how others belive you gain understanding. so someone in my family converted to islam around that time i had never read anything about islam. when this family member would get a new book or info i would read it. all the info about islam was very uplifing and nice soon enough i met friends of my family member of course other muslims they would ask me when i would convert and i would say never. soon enough i found myself going to friday prayer all on my own free will just trying see wht it was all about. soon enough i converted and the next day i knew i had made a very big mistake. i realized this when people that were other muslims would tell me what i had to give up. the list of things that i would have to live without let me know that islam was a child of str8 men looking for power (sorry if that makes you mad). i thought about it for a while and told myself "ok lets give it a chance maybe im just freaking out" ,so i made up in my mind to read the koran with a open mind. Before then i had  three princeapals that i would never brake or be apart of anybody or group that broke them. i had read some of the koran and in the beginning was pretty nice love this and love that but when i read the parts that pretty much said kill everybody but muslims a big what the fuck went across my mind. then came the killing of gay people. I had to close the book, right then and there i knew islam is not for me.The bottom line is i dont belive God whats anybody to hate anybody.Then i read of Aisa the 6yr old girl that the prophat married and abused when she was 9 and that just truned me totally off to islam.But anyway now im kinda stuck on one hand nothing is muslim about me i dont pray and i dont belive in anything that islam teaches.  right now i kinda pretend to be muslim to the people that know i did take shahada. I dont belive im going hell, i have always belived God/dess has many path ways. 



    nowhere in the quran that say kill gay



    you caught red handed
    please read my blog, read how islam will win
    the clash of civilization.

    http://www.xanga.com/hfghj23458654fgha
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #22 - June 07, 2009, 07:42 PM
    Quote from: kope on June 07, 2009, 07:19 PM

    nowhere in the quran that say kill gay



    you caught red handed

    Dont you believe in Shariah Law?  In accordance with Shariah Law homosexual practise is a religious crime that carries the death sentence  If you find anyone doing as Lot's people did (homosexual acts), kill the one who does it, and the one to whom it is done source: SAD 38:4447
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  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #23 - June 07, 2009, 08:16 PM
    Quote from: IsLame on June 07, 2009, 07:42 PM
    Dont you believe in Shariah Law?  In accordance with Shariah Law homosexual practise is a religious crime that carries the death sentence  If you find anyone doing as Lot's people did (homosexual acts), kill the one who does it, and the one to whom it is done source: SAD 38:4447




    yes, but he lied
    please read my blog, read how islam will win
    the clash of civilization.

    http://www.xanga.com/hfghj23458654fgha
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #24 - June 07, 2009, 08:19 PM
    Quote from: kope on June 07, 2009, 08:16 PM

    yes, but he lied

    Why?  The story of Lot is not a lie
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  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #25 - June 07, 2009, 08:49 PM
    Quote from: IsLame on June 07, 2009, 08:19 PM
    Why?  The story of Lot is not a lie

     quran does not say to kill gay
    please read my blog, read how islam will win
    the clash of civilization.

    http://www.xanga.com/hfghj23458654fgha
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #26 - June 07, 2009, 09:01 PM
    Quote from: BerberElla on June 04, 2009, 08:36 AM
    I've dabbled with the idea of paganism, at one time I found it very appealing, but the only way to make it acceptable too, is to create your own mish mash of things.

    If that's the case then I'd rather create a mish of mash of beliefs that tell me that when I die I will travel through a portal to take me to some far away fantasy land full of unicorns, elves and dragons.  cool2


    I found it kind of appealing too when I first felt that I had left Islam. Probably because to me, it seemed like a religion without any religion, if that makes any sense. It seemed like I get all the good bits of religion but without any of the dogma.
    Religion - The hot potato that looked delicious but ended up burning your mouth!

    Knock your head on the ground, don't be miserly in your prayers, listen to your Sidi Sheikh, Allahu Akbar! - Lounes Matoub
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #27 - June 07, 2009, 09:28 PM
    Quote from: aliadiere on June 07, 2009, 09:01 PM
    I found it kind of appealing too when I first felt that I had left Islam. Probably because to me, it seemed like a religion without any religion, if that makes any sense. It seemed like I get all the good bits of religion but without any of the dogma.


    When I was young and still thought I was Muslim, I was shocked to learn about the Pagans and Wiccans. I had thought the only religions in the world were (in order of importance and with all the incorrect statements attached to them):
    Islam (the right religion, if only people understood the "real" Islam)
    Christianity (the incomplete religion)
    Hinduism (the crazy monkeys and snakes worshipping religion)
    Judaism (the old, outdated desert roamers)
    Buddhism (worship of Buddha)

    This is the bias most Muslims, especially the majority from South Asia are raised with.

    Paganism, Wicca, Native American Shamanisms, Zoroastrianism, Taoism, and others were all different philosophies I learned about when I actively began to try to understand how other people in the world live and think. It was a shock to me to know that most regions of the world were matriarchal for most of human history. The "earth-based" paths attracted the part of me that was sick of religion and philosophy being so rooted only in the mind and the sexual repression of the major religions.

    I still respect earth based religions a lot more than the Abrahamic (god loves you and makes you suffer and you can go ahead and rape the planet because you are the shit but do hate the world as you rape it and you'll star in god's eternal porn) religions.

    I don't follow any religion but I think there's a lot of wisdom in all those non-Abrahamic religions that can be incorporated and utilized in a secular, naturalistic, philosophy. Like respect for other sentient beings, respect for nature, celebration of sexuality and the body, egalitarianism in gender, acceptance of sexual diversity, etc. Not every non-Abrahamic religion is equal in all these aspects, but at least they're not as cancerous as the Abrahamic 3.
    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #28 - June 07, 2009, 09:42 PM
    Quote from: allat on June 07, 2009, 09:28 PM
    Paganism, Wicca, Native American Shamanisms, Zoroastrianism, Taoism, and others were all different philosophies I learned about when I actively began to try to understand how other people in the world live and think. It was a shock to me to know that most regions of the world were matriarchal for most of human history. The "earth-based" paths attracted the part of me that was sick of religion and philosophy being so rooted only in the mind and the sexual repression of the major religions.

    I still respect earth based religions a lot more than the Abrahamic (god loves you and makes you suffer and you can go ahead and rape the planet because you are the shit but do hate the world as you rape it and you'll star in god's eternal porn) religions.

    I don't follow any religion but I think there's a lot of wisdom in all those non-Abrahamic religions that can be incorporated and utilized in a secular, naturalistic, philosophy. Like respect for other sentient beings, respect for nature, celebration of sexuality and the body, egalitarianism in gender, acceptance of sexual diversity, etc. Not every non-Abrahamic religion is equal in all these aspects, but at least they're not as cancerous as the Abrahamic 3.


    I too was very surprised to learn that most religions in the world were matriarchal and I was also surprised to learn that these earth based pagan religions were not as full of shit as made out by Islam. I do believe they are full of shit but no more than Islam  and Christianity and Judaism and they have proved to be certainly less damaging than these religions.

    What appealed to me was there was none of this "don't do that! don't do that! put that away! don't touch that! don't look at that! don't look at that! don't look at THAT!" and they were more spiritual than Islam ever was. I felt that I never ever got any spiritual fulfilment from Islam and it was just a set of rules and dogma which I had to agree with, even if I wouldn't normally agree with it. Pagan religions on the other hand, seemed like the complete opposite, where you could get a lot of spirituality but still be yourself.

    However, this interest was very short lived and I realised that I did not really need spirituality!

    Quote from: allat on June 07, 2009, 09:28 PM
    When I was young and still thought I was Muslim, I was shocked to learn about the Pagans and Wiccans. I had thought the only religions in the world were (in order of importance and with all the incorrect statements attached to them):
    Islam (the right religion, if only people understood the "real" Islam)
    Christianity (the incomplete religion)
    Hinduism (the crazy monkeys and snakes worshipping religion)
    Judaism (the old, outdated desert roamers)
    Buddhism (worship of Buddha)


    That is exactly what I thought about these religions!
    Religion - The hot potato that looked delicious but ended up burning your mouth!

    Knock your head on the ground, don't be miserly in your prayers, listen to your Sidi Sheikh, Allahu Akbar! - Lounes Matoub
  • Re: I made a mistake
     Reply #29 - June 07, 2009, 09:45 PM
    Quote from: kope on June 07, 2009, 08:49 PM
    quran does not say to kill gay

    well thats what it did
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