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Theme Changer

 Topic: Welcome to Marleya

 (Read 20591 times)
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  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #30 - March 25, 2009, 10:24 AM

    Marleya,

    The debates can wait, remember that you can always call a cease-fire if you don't feel like arguing all the time.

    Would you care to tell us a bit more about yourself?

    Islam: where idiots meet terrorists.
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #31 - March 25, 2009, 11:44 AM

    Welcome aboard Marleya. Hope you have fun and widen yours and our understanding of Islam, scriptures and the prophet.

    Knowing Islam is the only true religion we do not allow propagation of any other religion. How can we allow building of churches and temples when their religion is wrong? Thus we will not allow such wrong things in our countries. - Zakir Naik
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #32 - March 25, 2009, 05:36 PM

    Greetings everybody!

    Thanks to BarberElla for moving the thread to introductions,and I will take Zaephons advice,to tell you about myself.

    I am born in the Gambia,and are 25 years old.My mother is a norwegian,and a convert,and lived in the Gambia,with my father for many years,before I was born.

    My father is from a sunni family,that comes from Mali,and they are sunni muslim and musicians.My father is a born musician and me too. dance

    I play Kora,a twentyone string instrument,the vest africas harp.
    I lived my childhood years in Gambia,and was free as the bird.My mother is a nurse,and have had a little clinic,in my hometown,that still is without electricity.She is a good person,and very bright,and my example in life.Many own her their life there.As normal,Gambia have no healthcare,and it is very difficult to get sick,if you dont have money,so you can go to the tourists doctors.

    My father is playing music,and travel around the world.Me,I am now living in Norway,in my grandparents home,in the countryside,where I work,with underage refugee children,from everywhere.

    My awareness of Islam,started of course in Gambia.My fathers father,was a musician and also an schoolar,in Quran.In Africa,the drum,is not used in religous seremonies,but the Kora is.In the middle east,saudia,the arab muslim nation,the drum is the only instrument,that is legal when it comes to learned ones.
    I have never been introduced to hadith as Gods words,only the Quran.
    I was shocked when I as 15 moved here to go to school,the aggressiveness in other muslims as onced they "smelled" that.
    And me I got shocked when I got older,and investigate more,how Islam was practised around in muslim countries.I was in saudia with my parents,to visit a friend of my father,and for me to belive in God,in this way,could not be right.

    So here I am,and I know your arguments,and recognize them as important,but I do not think the image you have,is right.I dont think that the message in the Quran,is what we see today.

    I found this place,throug somebody that sent me an personal message,in a other forum,and with the signature of this side,and thats how I found you.The message,of course,was like my thoughts into words. Smiley

    It was difficult to make it short Smiley
    Hope I did not bore you.I hope to come back to your questions soon.


    I also want to thank all of you,for the real welcome.It say something about you people here.Thanks
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #33 - March 25, 2009, 05:50 PM



    I found this place,throug somebody that sent me an personal message,in a other forum,and with the signature of this side,and thats how I found you.The message,of course,was like my thoughts into words. Smiley

    It was difficult to make it short Smiley
    Hope I did not bore you.I hope to come back to your questions soon.


    I also want to thank all of you,for the real welcome.It say something about you people here.Thanks

    I am refreshed to hear it is possible for Islam to reform, and for people to come out of its spin cycle, as well rounded as you appear to be.  Sadly, as you will have noticed on Muslim forums, this is not always the case.

    Which Muslim site were you on, and which member invited you to our centre of sensibility?

    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Mohammad, the Pedophile
     Reply #34 - March 25, 2009, 05:53 PM

    Hello marleya,

    You may want to open your own introduction thread. Welcome.  Afro

    Quote from: marleya
    You use a lot of hadith,when you critize Islam,but you should know there is many of us,who have thrown hadith to the fish,and only use the Quran as guiding.

    This is not always the case, since "Quran Only" Muslims are considered heterodox by mainstream Islam.

    Quote from: marleya
    Historic details show Aischas age to be from 17-19,when she was married to the Prophet.

    Care to elaborate? Also, child marriages are widespread in some Islamic countries, how can this be possible if Aisha was married to Mohammad at the age of 17-19, as you assert?


    Thank you Zaephon.

    I know that the Quran alone is looked at as kafir by mainstream Islam( hadith idolaters.)
    I hope it will change,and in many muslim countries,there is a lot of discussion in to of translations and hadith.Jamal Al-Banna,the brother of Hassan Al-Banna,that started the muslim brotherhood in Egypt,have openly said that many hadith is clearly false,and should be taken out of hadith books.

    Of course Zaephon,I always care to elaborate Smiley

    http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?HD=7&ID=4604&CATE=1


    If you read this thoroughly, it is clear that GF Haddad and the people at Sunnipath did not format it properly.  Being familiar with Haddad's work, he is making a clear argument that Aishah was 9 at consummation, based on hadith.  He is arguing against someone who says she was 17, but that person's arguments are not bolded or quoted to differentiate them.  GF Haddad is, and Sunnipath.com as well, extremely orthodox Sunni Muslims, who are very firm on the position that Aishah's marriage was consummated when she was a girl of 9.

    Also, just to keep it down to one post, welcome and it's exciting that you're a musician!  It must be kind of strange to go from living in West Africa to Norway.  Did you find it difficult to deal with the changes in climate and weather?

    [this space for rent]
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #35 - March 25, 2009, 06:23 PM

    Cool background, marleya!

    fuck you
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #36 - March 25, 2009, 06:25 PM

    Have you got a Youtube clip, where we can listen to your music in its glory?  You never know, we could have people in the music industry visiting this website  Wink

    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #37 - March 25, 2009, 06:41 PM

    Velkommen Marleya
    Det er sa hyggelig a treffe deg.
    du er min sol, mane og stjerner
    det var godt ? se deg

    BKissB

    My style is impetuous, my defense is impregnable and I'm just ferocious. I want your heart. I want to eat your children. Praise be to Allah." -- Mike Tyson
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #38 - March 25, 2009, 07:08 PM

    Velkommen Marleya
    Det er sa hyggelig a treffe deg.
    du er min sol, mane og stjerner
    det var godt ? se deg

    BKissB


    Tusen Takk Submissive Bob.

    Det var veldig fine ord.

    You can not write the letter that should be where the question mark comes.Norgwegians have three ekstra letters in their alphabet,and not possible to write,here.When I used the letter,a question mark appear,when it comes in here.If you understand.

    Jaja,det var fint ? h?re noen ord p? norsk.

  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #39 - March 25, 2009, 07:12 PM

    Marleya, enjoy your stay  here:)


  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #40 - March 25, 2009, 08:09 PM

    Maa ngi joghe les Connecticut

    BSmileyB

    My style is impetuous, my defense is impregnable and I'm just ferocious. I want your heart. I want to eat your children. Praise be to Allah." -- Mike Tyson
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #41 - March 25, 2009, 08:13 PM

    ikke skap deg sann Submissive BoB!

    ("Stop showing off Submissive Bob"!)

    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #42 - March 25, 2009, 08:22 PM

    That's as bout as far as I can go with the online phrase books. If the conversation continued, I'd have no choice but to ask her for directions to the bus station.

    Bgrin12B

    My style is impetuous, my defense is impregnable and I'm just ferocious. I want your heart. I want to eat your children. Praise be to Allah." -- Mike Tyson
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #43 - March 25, 2009, 09:10 PM

    You could always ask her for the location of a hospital or a toilet, just to broaden the conversation. Wink

    Welcome to the forum, Marleya. It's interesting to read your perspective. West African Islam is very different to orthodox Saudi Islam and always has been. Even back in the 16th century Arabian trader and ambassadors were horrified to see African women walking around topless and considering themselves to be perfectly good Muslims.

    The African delight in music is another thing that differentiates the two traditions. Personally I prefer the African version but the Salafis do make a very strong case for theirs being the "Islamically correct" one.

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #44 - March 25, 2009, 09:31 PM

    Even back in the 16th century Arabian trader and ambassadors were horrified to see African women walking around topless and considering themselves to be perfectly good Muslims.

    Damn those traders!

    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #45 - March 25, 2009, 11:28 PM

    Peace.

    Ibn Batuta was one of the traders.He wrote many books on his travells in Africa,and was very shocked to find men having female friends.Once in Mali,he talked with an scoolar there,and told him about his concerns of this.The schoolar looked at him and said:Our women,is not like your women.Batuta was speachless.

    Have any of you read anything of Parwez,a pakistani sunni muslim?
    He started Tolu-e Islam.He is looked upon as a devil,from the mainstream Islam,but nevertheless,he has written a lot of books of Quran and different wievs.

    Sura 2,vers 256 say.

    "There is no compulsion in religion.The truth stand out clear against error"

    Muslims that belive in force in religion,do not follow their God.

    When we think of marrige in the history of us humans,in many cultures they married women away early.The romans beetween 12 and 15,(this are all easy things to find if you google it,I dont put any link)

    One of Norways old Kings,married his Queen when she was 13.All over the world women was married before their menses.And because they did not get their period yet,they did not get pregnant.Today,in some cultures,not only muslims,girls are still married away early,but today they can have babies,even though the body is not ready.

    Do you understand what I mean?

    Sura 63,vers 1 say:

    "when the hypocrits come to you,they say,we bear witness that you are indeed the messenger of Allah.Allah knows that you are indeed His messenger,and Allah bear witness that the hypocrits are liars"

    As you all know,this is the words that mainstream Islam,use as their shahada,the same line Allah in the Quran tell us is the hypocrits that use.

    Some asked me,sorry I dont remember who,right know,why God had let Bukhari invent all this lies against the Prophet.

    Sura 6,vers 112 say:

    "And so we have appointed for every Prophet enemies,among mankind and jinn,inspiring one another with adorned speech as a delusion or by deception.If your Lord had so willed,they wouldnt do it,so leave them alone with their fabrications"

    I think as you in a way,beacuse my enemy as a muslim too,is Islam,the way you see it.My Islam,and many others with me,progressive muslims,in the world today,want to get rid of old dead mens grip on the religion.

    It is late here in Norway know,have to go to bed.

    Submissive Bob,nice with norwegian and wolof words.My native language is mandinka,and is only spoken.Thats why I love to WRITE endless posts Smiley
    It is late here in Norway now,I have to say goodnight.

    Take care everybody!
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #46 - March 26, 2009, 04:53 AM

    Welcome aboard marleya, i am curious to know how do u know of the 5 corners of islam. How and from where do u know how to practice them.

    "Ask the slave girl; she will tell you the truth.' So the Apostle called Burayra to ask her. Ali got up and gave her a violent beating first, saying, 'Tell the Apostle the truth.'"
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #47 - March 26, 2009, 01:01 PM

    Marleya
    I invite you to visit my friend PM's blog. She is a very nice, clever and reform minded Muslim, I think you would appreciate each other very much.

    http://peacefulmuslimah.wordpress.com/

    I think if I were a Islamic hardliner, I would hate the reformers more than I hate the apostates.

    BWinkB

    My style is impetuous, my defense is impregnable and I'm just ferocious. I want your heart. I want to eat your children. Praise be to Allah." -- Mike Tyson
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #48 - March 26, 2009, 01:19 PM

    Me too,my sympathies lie with Marleya.  In fact Marleya has the same desires as us, in spite of her differing belief pattern, i.e.the reformation of Islam, and as a Muslim she is more likely to achieve it.

    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #49 - March 26, 2009, 03:04 PM

    Sura 2,vers 256 say.

    "There is no compulsion in religion.The truth stand out clear against error"

    Muslims that belive in force in religion,do not follow their God.


    So you the above verse means that one can believe in whatever religion they want?

    Although the next verse clearly condemns their God(s) as false deities. They are in darkness and that they will burn in fire.
     
    2:257 As for those who disbelieve, their patrons are false deities. They bring them out of light into darkness. Such are rightful owners of the Fire. They will abide therein.

    Do you know the context under which the 'No compulsion' verse was revealed. Well you may not want to because it is explained in a hadith. But the only way to truly understand much of the context of the Qur'an is by studying the hadiths.

    Verse 3:85 states that one who chooses a religion other than Islam should not be accepted. Where is the no compulsion principle.

    3:85 And whoso seeketh as religion other than the Surrender (to Allah) it will not be accepted from him, and he will be a loser in the Hereafter.

    Do you know that some of the Qur'an was revealed in Mecca when Muhammad was weak in numbers and the rest in Medina from where he started to gain ascendency over the Meccans by raiding their caravans? The verses revealed in Medina, much more intolerant, abrogates the earlier ones.

    If religion is not to be spread by force, how do you explain,

    9:5 Then, when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolaters wherever ye find them, and take them (captive), and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-due, then leave their way free.

    9:29 Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture (Christians and Jews) as believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, and forbid not that which Allah hath forbidden by His messenger, and follow not the Religion of Truth, until they pay the tribute readily, being brought low.

    The above verse says to fight those who:
     - believe not in Allah nor the Last Day
     - allow things that Allah has forbidden
     - do not follow Islam
    You are to fight them until they pay the protection tax and kept in a lowly position.

    How do you think Islam spread to Africa for your ancestors to become Muslims? Did the caliph send out pamphlets to convince them about the truth of Islam? Did missionary stations get set up all around to spread the word? Or did Arab armies invade all these territories and force Islam on the population? I know how my ancestors in India got coverted. An estimated 70 million people killed during Islamic rule.

    Knowing Islam is the only true religion we do not allow propagation of any other religion. How can we allow building of churches and temples when their religion is wrong? Thus we will not allow such wrong things in our countries. - Zakir Naik
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #50 - March 26, 2009, 03:29 PM


    How do you think Islam spread to Africa for your ancestors to become Muslims? Did the caliph send out pamphlets to convince them about the truth of Islam? Did missionary stations get set up all around to spread the word?



    good point

    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #51 - March 26, 2009, 03:39 PM

    Marleya - If you only accept the quran, and not the hadith, do you drink alcohol then or think its acceptable in Islam? 

    The Quran does not state anywhere that alcohol is disallowed (only the hadith), so according to you it should be OK for Muslims to drink (provided they dont get intoxicated as a result!)

    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #52 - March 26, 2009, 05:27 PM

     Marleya, what do you do with the principle of abrogation, put forward in the Quran itself?

    016.101
    YUSUFALI: When We substitute one revelation for another,- and Allah knows best what He reveals (in stages),- they say, "Thou art but a forger": but most of them understand not.
    PICKTHAL: And when We put a revelation in place of (another) revelation, - and Allah knoweth best what He revealeth - they say: Lo! thou art but inventing. Most of them know not.
    SHAKIR: And when We change (one) communication for (another) communication, and Allah knows best what He reveals, they say: You are only a forger. Nay, most of them do not know.
    None of Our revelations do We abrogate or cause to be forgotten, but We substitute something better or similar (2:106, AYA)


    Likewise the verses preaching tolerance have, according to the Quran itself, been abrogated by the verses preaching intolerance & violence, which come later.  Tongue

    World renowned historian Will Durant"...the Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex order and freedom can at any moment be overthrown..."
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #53 - March 26, 2009, 05:47 PM

    Abrogation is another thing I have never understood.  Would an omnipotent God change his mind?

    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #54 - March 27, 2009, 04:40 PM

    Welcome Marleya.  Afro


    Me too,my sympathies lie with Marleya.  In fact Marleya has the same desires as us, in spite of her differing belief pattern, i.e.the reformation of Islam, and as a Muslim she is more likely to achieve it.


    Yes, its easier to remform Islam, than have people leave Islam.
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #55 - March 27, 2009, 04:44 PM

    Welcome to you also Balthier!  Would you like to start another thread so we can get to know you too?

    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #56 - March 28, 2009, 09:40 AM

    Marleya
    I invite you to visit my friend PM's blog. She is a very nice, clever and reform minded Muslim, I think you would appreciate each other very much.

    http://peacefulmuslimah.wordpress.com/

    I think if I were a Islamic hardliner, I would hate the reformers more than I hate the apostates.

    BWinkB


    Thank you so much,SubmissiveBob,for the blog.You are right,it is something for me.

     thnkyu
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #57 - March 28, 2009, 10:30 AM

    Sura 2,vers 256 say.

    "There is no compulsion in religion.The truth stand out clear against error"

    Muslims that belive in force in religion,do not follow their God.


    So you the above verse means that one can believe in whatever religion they want?

    Although the next verse clearly condemns their God(s) as false deities. They are in darkness and that they will burn in fire.
     
    2:257 As for those who disbelieve, their patrons are false deities. They bring them out of light into darkness. Such are rightful owners of the Fire. They will abide therein.

    Do you know the context under which the 'No compulsion' verse was revealed. Well you may not want to because it is explained in a hadith. But the only way to truly understand much of the context of the Qur'an is by studying the hadiths.

    Verse 3:85 states that one who chooses a religion other than Islam should not be accepted. Where is the no compulsion principle.

    3:85 And whoso seeketh as religion other than the Surrender (to Allah) it will not be accepted from him, and he will be a loser in the Hereafter.

    Do you know that some of the Qur'an was revealed in Mecca when Muhammad was weak in numbers and the rest in Medina from where he started to gain ascendency over the Meccans by raiding their caravans? The verses revealed in Medina, much more intolerant, abrogates the earlier ones.

    If religion is not to be spread by force, how do you explain,

    9:5 Then, when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolaters wherever ye find them, and take them (captive), and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-due, then leave their way free.

    9:29 Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture (Christians and Jews) as believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, and forbid not that which Allah hath forbidden by His messenger, and follow not the Religion of Truth, until they pay the tribute readily, being brought low.

    The above verse says to fight those who:
     - believe not in Allah nor the Last Day
     - allow things that Allah has forbidden
     - do not follow Islam
    You are to fight them until they pay the protection tax and kept in a lowly position.

    How do you think Islam spread to Africa for your ancestors to become Muslims? Did the caliph send out pamphlets to convince them about the truth of Islam? Did missionary stations get set up all around to spread the word? Or did Arab armies invade all these territories and force Islam on the population? I know how my ancestors in India got coverted. An estimated 70 million people killed during Islamic rule.



    Peace A-Ghazali.

    I belive truly,that people can belive in any religion they want to,and that is not against Gods will.

    In many suras God say oppression is worse than murder.

    2.225 sier:

    "God does not hold you responsible for the mere utterance of oaths.He holds you responsible for your innermost intention"

    2.257 you have qouted,but not all the verse.

    "God is the whaali(protector or guardian)of those who belive.He brings them out from darkness to light.But as for those who disbelive,their Auliya(supporters,helpers) are Taghut(false deities,or false leaders),they bring them out from light into darkness.Those are the dwellers of the Fire,and they will abide therein forever"

    I can not see that this verse,say every person that is not a muslim,will go to hell.He warns all of us,to go from light to darkness,and to follow bad leaders.Again our innermost intention.

    You ask me some hard question,A.Ghazali.I wish I could answer everything with selfsurance,but I dont know if I can.

    I will come back to you.

    And of course I know how Islam came to Africa.I have studied the slave trade,started by arab muslim,many hundred years before the white men,started their slavetrade.

    The arab slave trade,I call it that,was a little different than the white trade.The arab took two females for every one male.The white was opposite,they took two males for every one female.

    The brutality and hardship put on africans from arabmuslim,are the same as the westerne slave trade.And they castrated the male,even though hadith say that any one that castrate their slaves,will be castrated in the hearafter.
    The white male slaves,the balls were cut of,the black men,got everything sliced off.
    In year 900,a black slave called Zanj,lead an upprise from the african slaves,and they was at brink to take Baghdad,but was beaten down,From that time,tha arabs got more carefull,to have a lot of slaves in one place.

    The arab muslims are big racists,many of them,and if I can be so blunt,so is a lot of white people too.

    As an african,if I should hate anybody laying us in chains,there would be no one left to love.
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #58 - March 28, 2009, 10:33 AM

    Me too,my sympathies lie with Marleya.  In fact Marleya has the same desires as us, in spite of her differing belief pattern, i.e.the reformation of Islam, and as a Muslim she is more likely to achieve it.



    Thank you IsLame. Smiley
  • Re: Welcome to Marleya
     Reply #59 - March 28, 2009, 10:53 AM

    Marleya - If you only accept the quran, and not the hadith, do you drink alcohol then or think its acceptable in Islam? 

    The Quran does not state anywhere that alcohol is disallowed (only the hadith), so according to you it should be OK for Muslims to drink (provided they dont get intoxicated as a result!)


    I dont drink often,but with good friends,we sometimes drink a little wine.The Quran say that we should not come drunk to prayer,but wait,unntil we have sobered up.

    But me,I like better m......a,must be my african vibrations dance


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