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 Topic: Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.

 (Read 158772 times)
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  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #420 - February 26, 2014, 05:54 PM

    I couldn't even find the Hadith about Mo doing that. Link to that Hadith? Or is it just so far stretched that it's unrecognizable?

    I ask many stupid questions frequently.
    I am curious, that's why I ask many questions.
    I am overly curious, that's why I ask stupid questions.
    I lack patience, that's why I ask frequently.
    So forgive me and answer me Smiley
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #421 - February 26, 2014, 06:27 PM

    Care to inform more?


    The tradition is about blessing the child, not preventing health issues. There are no references, I can find, that even suggest this practice was done for health benefits. This is merely cherry picking the date from the practice and applying it to the article about medicine. I can do this with cultures that prefer fish over white meat. "How did the Polynesians who ate fish know that fish were more health than red meat? It must be a miracle"
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #422 - February 26, 2014, 09:23 PM

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pcmpI1gsOkI

    Dr. Knut Pfeiffer: Islam's Zamzam water positive effect on human cells


    Its obvious he doesn't really believe this nonsense, as like Maurice Bucaille, he didn't convert to islam.

    I am better than your god......and so are you.

    "Is the man who buys a magic rock, really more gullible than the man who buys an invisible magic rock?.......,...... At least the first guy has a rock!"
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #423 - February 26, 2014, 09:25 PM

    Any (reasonably clean) water has a positive effect on human cells. They don't tend to work well without it.

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #424 - February 26, 2014, 09:49 PM



    When I mention that to my relatives they react by denying that the ancient egyptians or other civilizations had any knowledge of the benefits of these foods.

    But then again these are the same people that believe that the exorcisms performed by mullahs on TV talkshows are real.

    There is no hope for people who just deny had evidence even when it is presented to them and just blindly follow religious authority.

    That's not how Truth works, silly. Truth means the stuff in the Quran. Any insight or discovery not in the Quran is wrong.

    Of course, those insights and discoveries might become True later, if some apologist or preacher manages to find a string of words in the Quran that has some kind of tenuous likeness with the insight or discovery. That's how Real True things are invented. They are invented by someone else and then loosely matched with some words in the Quran by a Muslim. This is the only way things can be Truly discovered and the only way Truefacts can be verified. Until then, they are lies and wrong stuff. Aka, demon farts.

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #425 - February 27, 2014, 12:02 AM

    Its obvious he doesn't really believe this nonsense, as like Maurice Bucaille, he didn't convert to islam.

    yes.. BUT THAT SCOUNDREL makes money through such stupid programs and his stupid experiments..  Worse is high school Muslim kids get  brain washed with such nonsense..

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #426 - March 01, 2014, 12:42 PM

    peer reviewed academic paper on the topic of Bucailleism (declaring and promoting scientific foreknowledge in the quran)

    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1467-9744.2011.01218.x/abstract
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #427 - March 02, 2014, 02:48 AM

    Hello dr_sloth.

    Thanks a lot for the reference, I will be sure to go through it at a later date.

    My mind runs, I can never catch it even if I get a head start.
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #428 - March 03, 2014, 02:17 AM

    Reading through my bible today and I came across this:

    "You set the earth on its foundations,
    so that it shall never be shaken.
    You cover it with the deep as with
    a garment;
    the waters stood above the
    mountains.
    At your rebuke they flee;
    at the sound of your thunder they
    take to flight.
    They rose up to the mountains, ran down to the valleys
    to the place that you appointed for them.
    You set a boundary that they may not
    pass,

    so that they might not again cover
    the earth"(Psalms 104:5-104:9)

    This is the source of where the author of the Quran got the idea of two bodies of waters not mixing. This verse refers to the story of creation in Genesis where it talks about a firmament being created to separate the waters of the sky from the waters of the sea. As it specifically named the water under the dome of the sky as sea, it would make sense that it would be referred to as salty while the water in the sky would be referred to as fresh water that is sweet and palatable because rainwater(which comes from the sky) is drinkable freshwater.

    Also, these verses imply the belief that the Earth would shake if there was nothing holding it still. Thus, ancient belief was that  the Earth had foundations to hold it in place. I would guess that this is because they believed the Earth to be flat and that the winds would shake the Earth if nothing held it in place or anchored it. The author of the Quran talks about mountains steadying the Earth(instead of foundations) copying the erroneous notion that the Earth would shake if nothing was holding it in its place.

    "I moreover believe that any religion that has anything in it that shocks the mind of a child, cannot be a true system."
    -Thomas Paine
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #429 - March 03, 2014, 02:55 AM

    Reading through my bible today and I came across this:

    Quote
    "You set the earth on its foundations,
    so that it shall never be shaken.
    You cover it with the deep as with
    a garment;
    the waters stood above the
    mountains.
    At your rebuke they flee;
    at the sound of your thunder they
    take to flight.
    They rose up to the mountains, ran down to the valleys
    to the place that you appointed for them.
    You set a boundary that they may not
    pass,

    so that they might not again cover
    the earth"
    (Psalms 104:5-104:9)


    This is the source of where the author of the Quran got the idea of two bodies of waters not mixing. This verse refers to the story of creation in Genesis where it talks about a firmament being created to separate the waters of the sky from the waters of the sea. As it specifically named the water under the dome of the sky as sea, it would make sense that it would be referred to as salty while the water in the sky would be referred to as fresh water that is sweet and palatable because rainwater(which comes from the sky) is drinkable freshwater.

    Also, these verses imply the belief that the Earth would shake if there was nothing holding it still. Thus, ancient belief was that  the Earth had foundations to hold it in place. I would guess that this is because they believed the Earth to be flat and that the winds would shake the Earth if nothing held it in place or anchored it.
    The author of the Quran talks about mountains steadying the Earth(instead of foundations) copying the erroneous notion that the Earth would shake if nothing was holding it in its place.

     
    beautifully done justperusing.,  except that " it should be "Authors of Quran".,  It is clear from reading that book, plenty of it is plagiarized from other sources and  it is put together by many authors. I guess those  fools never EDITED  it and once it became a book I  guess our harem holding caliphs never  allowed any one to edit  it.  

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #430 - March 03, 2014, 08:39 AM

    Haha thanks yeez. I've noticed you're very adamant about the Quran's plural authorship in your posts. I probably should've said "author/authors of the Quran" to leave open that valid possibility

    "I moreover believe that any religion that has anything in it that shocks the mind of a child, cannot be a true system."
    -Thomas Paine
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #431 - March 03, 2014, 11:02 AM

    Justperusing

    You might want to have a look at Job 10 as well.
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #432 - March 03, 2014, 07:11 PM

    I see bones being clothed with flesh and humans being made from clay. Good catch Josephus

    "I moreover believe that any religion that has anything in it that shocks the mind of a child, cannot be a true system."
    -Thomas Paine
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #433 - March 24, 2014, 08:06 PM

    "Hail is frozen rain or stones of frozen water. This ayah very clearly states that Allah sends down from the heavens mountains containing balls or comets of ice."

    That right there is a classic example of the 'hidden handover' moment, (in illusionists terms) the 'palming' moment, or sleight of hand, 'Hail' has transformed (mutated/evolved?) into 'Comets' in one short sentence, to the point where (just like in evolution) it has transformed into something that no longer resembles the original word or its original intended meaning.

    "Hail=frozen rain=stones of frozen water=mountains containing balls of ice=comets"

    Conclusion: Hail=Comets

    TADAAA!!! MIRACLE PROVED!!!! Applause applause  thnkyu


    This is the dishonest part of the trick and believers wont even notice, but its staring us right in the face.

    I am better than your god......and so are you.

    "Is the man who buys a magic rock, really more gullible than the man who buys an invisible magic rock?.......,...... At least the first guy has a rock!"
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #434 - June 28, 2014, 03:28 PM

    Quote from: koran 24:40
    Or (the Unbelievers' state) is like the depths of darkness in a vast deep ocean, overwhelmed with billow topped by billow, topped by (dark) clouds: depths of darkness, one above another: if a man stretches out his hands, he can hardly see it! for any to whom Allah giveth not light, there is no light!

    Talking about the darkness in the deep sees and this is what scientists have recently discovered and it wasn't known at the time of the coming down of Quran.

    Quote from: Harun Yahya (link)
    However, that the depth of the sea is dark was revealed in the Qur'an 1,400 years ago. It is certainly one of the miracles of the Qur'an that such information was given at a time where no equipment to enable man to dive into the depths of the oceans was available.

    The author of the funny Epistle of Barnabas, which is almost a part of the bible, somehow got that information. Just as in the koran he likens the darkness of the sea to the mental state of the unbeliever:
    But David received knowledge concerning the same three doctrines, and says: "Blessed is the man who has not gone in the counsel of the ungodly" as the fishes go in darkness in the deep waters, ...

  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #435 - June 28, 2014, 03:44 PM

    Isn't it obvious that the deeper you go down anywhere the darker it gets? You can tell that cause you can't see the bottom of the oceans, whereas you can see the bottom of a valley at least when there are no clouds cause air is not water.
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #436 - July 03, 2014, 07:44 AM

    Just finished reading all 15 pages and wanted to say thanks to everyone who contributed. Good stuff here.
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #437 - October 12, 2014, 01:32 PM

    Please share with anyone seeking (or in need of!) the truth...

    It will hopefully be part of a larger document so feedback, positive & negative welcome..



    Scientific Untruths of the Quran (by Council of Ex-Muslim forum members)

    How is man created?

    There are many contradictory accounts of how this occurred.

    It tells us "we are created from earth (11:61), sometimes from dry clay (15:26,28,33, 17:61, 32:7), sometimes from nothing (19:67), sometimes not from nothing (52:35), sometimes from wet earth (23:12), or from mire (38:71), sometimes from water (25:54, 21:30, 24:45), sometimes from dust (3:59, 30:20, 35:11) or even sometimes from the dead (30:19, 39:6)".

    The beauty of such multifaceted philosophy is no matter what scientists discover, Muslims will have a verse to refer to that verifies the miraculous knowledge of the Qur'an.

    Human Reproduction
    Starting with Muhammad's account of embryology, we can easily determine its scientific inaccuracy in addition to its obvious plagarisation from earlier works by Greek philosophers and scientists such as Galen, Hippocrates and Aristotle, or Indian theses on the subject by Charaka and Susruta.

    The account that follows the four stages described by the Greek physician Galen, writing around 150 CE. It should also be noted that one of Muhammad's companions, Harith ben Kalada, studied at the school of Jandi-Shapur in Persia and would have been well acquainted with the teachings of Aristotle, Hippocrates, and Galen.

    Sura 23:12-14 says God created man from "wet earth, then placed him as (a drop of) sperm (nutfah) in a safe lodging; then We made the sperm into a clot of congealed blood (alaqa); then out of that clot We made a (foetus) lump (mudghah), then We made out of that lump bones and clothed the bones with flesh; then We developed out of it another creature."

    Nowhere in this description, nor the Quran, is the females egg mentioned. The Quran says a baby is born by a sperm turning into a blood clot, and then into a lump. Out of the lump, bones are formed and then on the bones flesh is placed.
    Actually organs and flesh are the first that begin cellular division and formation. Later, as the child grows, bone structures begin to develop along with organs and flesh.
     
    'Nutfah' (semen) is mentioned in verse 86:6, is the fluid issued from between the loins and ribs, not, as we know today, from the testicles. This reflects the mistaken view of Hippocrates still prevalent at the time of Muhammad.

    In particular lauded examples of the Quran are when it states that the embryo behaves like a leech, or is similar to "a piece of chewing gum" etc.  Having read these quotes without bias, i.e. in the same way that you would expect from proper research, then there really does not appear to be very much to them.   Leech like behaviour would be inherently obvious during birth with to the umbilical cord being attached to the baby, and the bleeding when it is removed.  Regarding chewed gum, I wonder if any small organism not yet formed could be described in this way.
    None of these facts would be considered as miraclulous event if they were read with the same integrity as you would expect from a serious piece of research. 

    Sahih Bukhari 54:430 has Muhammad saying, "A human being is put together in the womb of the mother in forty days, and then he becomes a clot of thick blood for a similar period, and then a piece of flesh for a similar period." ; That is a total of 120 days before becoming a foetus twice as long as we now know it to be.

    In Sahih Muslim 33:6395 Muhammad says, "The semen stays in the womb for forty nights, then the angel, gives it a shape and decides whether he would be male or female. Then the angel says: Would his limbs be full or imperfect? And then the Lord makes them full and perfect. Then he says: My Lord, what about his livelihood, and his death and what about his disposition? And then the Lord decides about his misfortune and fortune."  So according to Muhammad, an angel comes down forty days after the semen enters the womb and decides on the gender of the child and whether it should be deformed in anyway and Allah will decide on the future fortunes of the child. "

    Haram Foods and prevention of disease
    A believer eats in one intestine whereas a non-believer eats in seven intestines?. Muslim Vol. III, Nos. 5113, chapter DCCCLXII

    What really is so wrong with eating pork, and drinking alcohol? The west eats pork, and suffers no more long term damage from it than it does with other meats such as beef.  In fact the BMA are yet to issue guidelines against the eating of pork, as they did with beef after BSE.  Provided alcohol is consumed sensibly then it can be enjoyed as it is by the majority of non-Muslims in the world today.  In fact, scientific research has demonstrated an association between moderate alcohol consumption and a lower risk of cardiovascular disease.

    Prophet Mohammed believes that certain types of food provide protection against all types of diseases. This applies in particular to honey; dates as well as black seed, all were his favourite food.  Number 663: Saud: The Prophet said, "If somebody takes seven 'Ajwa dates every morning, he will not be affected by poison or magic on that day till night." Number 592: Narrated Abu Huraira: I heard Allah's Apostle saying, "There is healing in black seed for all diseases except death."
    Prophet Mohammed advocated using camels? urine and milk as medicine.

    According to Anas, Volume 8, Bk 82, No794: Some people from the tribe of 'Ukl came to the Prophet and embraced Islam. The climate of Medina did not suit them, so the Prophet ordered them to go to the (herd of milch) camels of charity and to drink, their milk and urine. They did so, and after they had recovered from their ailment (became healthy) they turned renegades (reverted from Islam) and killed the shepherd of the camels and took the camels away. The Prophet sent (some people) in their pursuit and so they were (caught and) brought, and the 90 Prophets ordered that their hands and legs should be cut off and that their eyes should be branded with heated pieces of iron, and that their cut hands and legs should not be cauterized, till they die.

    The discovery of the healing properties of dipping flies in one?s food as described in this hadith: Number 673: Narrated Abu Huraira: Allah's Apostle said, "If a fly falls in the vessel of any of you, let him dip all of it (into the vessel) and then throw it away, for in one of its wings there is a disease and in the other there is healing (antidote for it) i e. the treatment for that disease."

    Psychiatric Disorders
    Muslims believe that invisible spirits called jinn influence our lives. The non-Muslim jinn cause trouble to Muslim humans. The bizarre behaviour of patients with psychiatric disorders is explained by a kafir jinni that rides the human Muslim and influencing his/her behaviour. The Arabic word for a mad man is majnoon which means ridden (or influenced) by a jinn. The treatment now becomes straight forward, to beat the jinni (by beating the patient) and the jinni will leave!  Psychiatric disorders are still treated in this way in many Islamic countries, as per the Quran.

    Can there really be a spirit inside us that will rise when we are dead.  Certainly scientifically there appears to be nothing to show that we have one.  Also if ghosts/invisible beings/magic are real and acceptable notions, then why in the real world are they derided and seen as a sign of lunacy when taken out of context of religion?

    The Earth 
    2.22: "Who has made the earth your couch, and the heavens your canopy; and sent down rain from the heavens?; 
    Rain is sent from the heavens, as opposed to being part of a natural process called the water-cycle.  I am sure many scholars could find ways to attempt to justify these clauses as I am sure that I could if I felt obligated to try.  But would it be justification for justification?s sake? This would be left for the fair & honest reader to decide. 

    There was a time when Muslims clerics would establish fatwa?s against those claiming the earth to be spherical. Although the Qur'an describes a flat earth we find Muslims today adamant that the Qur'an portrays a round one. However no verse exclaiming this planet is round can be found in the Qur'an.

    21:31-32 And We have set on the earth mountains standing firm, lest it should quake with them, and We have made therein broad highways between mountains for them to pass through. And we have made the sky a roof withheld from them.  13:2 Allah raised the heavens without any pillars that ye can see; He is firmly established on the throne; and has subjected the sun and the moon each one to run its course for a term appointed. 18:86 Until, when he reached the setting of the sun, he found it set in a spring of murky water: Near it he found a People.

    Reading these verses together provides an image of a very primitive understanding of the cosmos. A heaven that is raised with pillars that we cannot see, a sky put as a roof above our heads, mountains placed as pegs to hold the earth down thereby preventing earthquakes, a sun that sets in a muddy spring with people living nearby; all nonsensical concepts having no alignment with modern science. There is no description of a great explosion and the formation of solar systems with orbiting planets around centric stars, no black holes, no corona, no ionosphere or quasars, but a heaven on invisible pillars.

    It is also possible to categorically disprove several myths that are quoted by Muslims in terms of the age and origin of the Earth and universe - sadly too complicated to go into here.

    Other arguments I have heard are that is impossible to prove that there is a no God; in the same way that it is impossible to prove that there is a God.  This is only because it is impossible prove that something, that shows no tangible sign of existence (i.e. cannot be seen, touched or heard) and defies all scientific logic, can actually proven to exist by scientific means. In the same way as it is impossible to disprove that the fairy at the bottom of my garden created us, and will banish to hell those who do not believe in it.   

    The future
    In the last 250,000 years since man has existed, science has largely played little part in finding out the answers.  Only in the last 100 years has science made its exponential rise. Replacing a human heart with a pigs heart, travelling to outer space, manufacturing of artificial limbs are all recent successes, what will the next 1000 years bring?  We will certainly further our understanding and continue to answer the remaining unanswered questions.  It would not surprise me how far this may eventually go?

    Artificial creation of human beings?   



    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #438 - October 12, 2014, 02:12 PM

    ^ Great addition.
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #439 - October 13, 2014, 08:01 PM

    "Do they not see the birds suspended in mid-air up in the sky? Nothing holds them there except Allah. There are certainly signs in that for people who believe. (Surat an-Nahl, 79)"

    ^^ Theory of Aerodynamics ^^ (according to our friend Harun Yahyah was first revealed in the Quran)

    Look how the birds float by god's magic= Aerodynamic theory

    http://www.harunyahya.com/en/Books/47517/miracles-of-the-quran-/chapter/14368

    It was so clear and useful to the muslims of centuries ago, who read this verse many times over, but somehow they managed to miss this obvious golden nugget of innovation (haraam?) so much so that it only took another 1400 years for the first powered flight by the Wright Brothers who used something called 'science'....... those silly billies, when they could have just read the quran and prayed instead. Roll Eyes

    I am better than your god......and so are you.

    "Is the man who buys a magic rock, really more gullible than the man who buys an invisible magic rock?.......,...... At least the first guy has a rock!"
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #440 - October 13, 2014, 08:14 PM

    Actually the bible got there waaaaay before with this highly detailed formulae for the principles of flight, which have been used by aerospace and military engineers and co-opted from the first transatlantic passenger airliner, which was probably built by Noah from gopher wood......or summink.

    Genesis 1:20.

    "And God said, “Let the waters swarm with swarms of living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the expanse of the heavens.”"

    So, sorry Mo, Jeebus got their first.

    I am better than your god......and so are you.

    "Is the man who buys a magic rock, really more gullible than the man who buys an invisible magic rock?.......,...... At least the first guy has a rock!"
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #441 - November 24, 2014, 10:03 PM

    Big bang
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1kJENqY7kyc

    moonlight is reflected light
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ag-vaK_gLI4

    mountains as pegs
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=blVXY7yqZzQ
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #442 - November 24, 2014, 10:07 PM

    In the first vid, is that iERA actually debunking it? Why would they bother?

    "I moreover believe that any religion that has anything in it that shocks the mind of a child, cannot be a true system."
    -Thomas Paine
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #443 - November 24, 2014, 10:08 PM

    tzortzis in all  three vids. He wants people to move over to the 'new approach' to scientific miracles, and so he is pointing out problems with the 'old approach'
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #444 - November 24, 2014, 10:11 PM

    You mean he is telling his followers what his critics have been telling him for years.
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #445 - November 24, 2014, 10:14 PM

    Well at least they are making baby steps towards honesty

    "I moreover believe that any religion that has anything in it that shocks the mind of a child, cannot be a true system."
    -Thomas Paine
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #446 - November 24, 2014, 10:20 PM

    I wouldn't call it honesty. Honesty would be testing one's own hypothesis to see if the idea stands up to criticism before publishing a paper. Not changing one's tune years later. However this standard is probably expecting too much from apologists. 
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #447 - November 26, 2014, 10:03 PM

    Here's another claim to divine knowledge....this time the quran contains "The sequence of microbiology"

    http://mostmerciful.com/?p=548

    Its the usual retranslation of ancient words into modern scientific concepts.

    ie "mate" becomes "cell"

    or "mate" can also mean "gene"

    and "one after another" becomes "Gene Duplication"

    So vague its "not even wrong"

    Oh and the author still believes that Adam was the first man, so his claim to scientific accuracy is somewhat......er.........overstated.


    I am better than your god......and so are you.

    "Is the man who buys a magic rock, really more gullible than the man who buys an invisible magic rock?.......,...... At least the first guy has a rock!"
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #448 - December 02, 2014, 04:27 PM

    do islamic proseltysers still use this?
  • Scientific Miracles in the Qur'an Debunked.
     Reply #449 - December 04, 2014, 09:49 AM

    barrier between waters/seas

    http://youtu.be/RZYtSwKjEBg?t=19m10s
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