Fundamentalism and the Fear of Truth

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- TomTom
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Fundamentalism and the Fear of Truth
OP - December 22, 2008, 04:26 AM

Good insight in this pod cast!

The speaker explores differences between his religiosity and that of fundamentalists, especially in terms of truth claims, and the values of honesty and knowledge. He describes the response he has received in the Orthodox Jewish community as a result of his views. He describes the psychology of the fundamentalist, and mechanisms such as confirmation bias, selective interpretation, and ad hominem attacks of critics. He explores various views of truth, including that the value of religion is not necessarily in the truth value of its claims. And he debates the value of reason versus emotion, and the role of authority when evaluating truth claims. He explores ways that rationalists can challenge fundamentalism, both in terms of argumentation and community, and in terms of focusing on the harms of fundamentalism.

http://www.pointofinquiry.org/solomon_schimmel_-_fundamentalism_and_the_fear_of_truth/
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Re: Fundamentalism and the Fear of Truth
Reply #1 - December 22, 2008, 04:40 AM

Yep. I've known for years that the primary appeal of fundamentalism is the certainty it provides. Basically it appeals to people who cannot live with uncertainty, and because of this they cling to their beliefs even when they are obviously not tenable. The more they feel threatened the more they cling to them and the more extreme their reaction is likely to be.

It's also obvious that many of them would be fundamentalists of whatever religion they were surrounded with. Many of them know nothing other than what they were raised with.

Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West.
- brucepig
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Re: Fundamentalism and the Fear of Truth
Reply #2 - December 22, 2008, 05:43 AM

Point of Inquiry is a great podcast. I like DJ's interview style and they always have interesting guests.

PS:Fundamentalists and truth! they don't mix. Fundamentalists and conspiracy theories are a match made in heaven.

Dr. Schimmel, Isn't that a Jewish name? He must be part of the Zionist crusader conspiracy sent to blacken the name of our pious brothers and sisters.
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Re: Fundamentalism and the Fear of Truth
Reply #3 - December 22, 2008, 05:49 AM

Schimmel is a GERMAN name (meanning "white horse" or "mould" - need context to tell difference). It?s not particularly jewish, as far as I know.
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Re: Fundamentalism and the Fear of Truth
Reply #4 - December 22, 2008, 06:33 AM

German Jews didn't they initiate the holocaust (Which never happened) so that Israel could be created?

Some of the conspiracies I have heard could make your toes curl.
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Re: Fundamentalism and the Fear of Truth
Reply #5 - December 22, 2008, 07:14 AM

Quote from: brucepig on December 22, 2008, 06:33 AM
German Jews didn't they initiate the holocaust (Which never happened) so that Israel could be created?

Some of the conspiracies I have heard could make your toes curl.

Yes I have heard that one before, could the people who invent these conspiracies be anymore more retarded?

Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
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Re: Fundamentalism and the Fear of Truth
Reply #6 - December 22, 2008, 07:24 AM

Quote from: BerberElla on December 22, 2008, 07:14 AM
Quote from: brucepig on December 22, 2008, 06:33 AM
German Jews didn't they initiate the holocaust (Which never happened) so that Israel could be created?

Some of the conspiracies I have heard could make your toes curl.

Yes I have heard that one before, could the people who invent these conspiracies be anymore more retarded?

retarded? People make MONEY from such crap!
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Re: Fundamentalism and the Fear of Truth
Reply #7 - December 22, 2008, 07:26 AM

Quote from: diotima on December 22, 2008, 07:24 AM

retarded? People make MONEY from such crap!

True, there are other retarded people out there so they need to cater for them.

Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
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Re: Fundamentalism and the Fear of Truth
Reply #8 - December 22, 2008, 07:41 AM

Quote from: BerberElla on December 22, 2008, 07:26 AM
Quote from: diotima on December 22, 2008, 07:24 AM

retarded? People make MONEY from such crap!

True, there are other retarded people out there so they need to cater for them.

as the old saying goes - there?s a new sucker born every minute. And btw - I?ve got some really nice seafront property for sale in Arizone... cut-rate!
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Re: Fundamentalism and the Fear of Truth
Reply #9 - December 22, 2008, 07:47 AM

He is off Jewish origin and also a critic fundamentalist Judaism.

The fear of Truth seems very simple on the surface, breaking the fear of the truth is very hard and complex, Dio, your contribution seems limited to insults at this moment.

For some of such change comes easy and we have broken the chains of organized religion, it is hard to see how your comments will help someone break these chains?
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Re: Fundamentalism and the Fear of Truth
Reply #10 - December 22, 2008, 07:58 AM

Pray, what insult did I say? Could it be you didn?t read my messages properly? I was clearing up a German name (am German, after all) and then share a joke with Berbs- a joke about nobody in particular, just suckers in general. What?s your problem?
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Re: Fundamentalism and the Fear of Truth
Reply #11 - December 22, 2008, 08:02 AM

Quote from: TomTom on December 22, 2008, 07:47 AM
Dio, your contribution seems limited to insults at this moment.

Where?

Because I am just as guilty if that is your criteria of limited to insults. It's quite easy to follow the flow of the conversation and see how it became a joke about retarded people who fall for such nonsense, so everything is in context as far as I can see.

Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
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Re: Fundamentalism and the Fear of Truth
Reply #12 - December 22, 2008, 08:02 AM

Oh, and btw - fundamentalism is a state of mind and/or personality. There ARE "fundie" atheists, rationalists etc.
- gonzo
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Re: Fundamentalism and the Fear of Truth
Reply #13 - December 22, 2008, 08:52 AM

Fundamentalism is one of those terms like "extremism" that is commonly thrown about, mostly by so-called free-thinkers, as a smear, without any consideration for what it actually means. Like the term "extremism", fundamentalism is merely a measure of the degree to which one sticks to a set of ideological principles, it is not an ideology in itself. Just as you can have an individual who is extremely good or even extremely bad, you can have an individual who is fundamentally good or fundamentally bad - or even more relative to the topic an individual who adheres to what is fundamentally true or conversly what is fundamentally false. The problem with attacking fundamentalism and extremism in themselves is that you are not only attacking what is extremely or fundamentally bad/false but also that which is extremely and fundamentall good/true, with the ideal being some form of moderate compromise between good and evil/truth and falsity.

Of course this all stems from the popular - yet false - notion that the human mind is incompetent and incapable of determining the facts of reality, which leads to the prominance of skepticism - the belief that we don't really know anything for sure and all that "maybe existence is merely a dream" or "a wise man knows he knows nothing" psuedointellectual crap.

Regards,
Gonzo

"The spread of evil is the symptom of a vacuum. Whenever evil wins, it is only by default: by the moral failure of those who evade the fact that there can be no compromise on basic principles" - Ayn Rand
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Re: Fundamentalism and the Fear of Truth
Reply #14 - December 22, 2008, 09:23 AM

Quote from: gonzo on December 22, 2008, 08:52 AM
Fundamentalism is one of those terms like "extremism" that is commonly thrown about, mostly by so-called free-thinkers, as a smear, without any consideration for what it actually means. Like the term "extremism", fundamentalism is merely a measure of the degree to which one sticks to a set of ideological principles, it is not an ideology in itself. Just as you can have an individual who is extremely good or even extremely bad, you can have an individual who is fundamentally good or fundamentally bad - or even more relative to the topic an individual who adheres to what is fundamentally true or conversly what is fundamentally false. The problem with attacking fundamentalism and extremism in themselves is that you are not only attacking what is extremely or fundamentally bad/false but also that which is extremely and fundamentall good/true, with the ideal being some form of moderate compromise between good and evil/truth and falsity.

Of course this all stems from the popular - yet false - notion that the human mind is incompetent and incapable of determining the facts of reality, which leads to the prominance of skepticism - the belief that we don't really know anything for sure and all that "maybe existence is merely a dream" or "a wise man knows he knows nothing" psuedointellectual crap.

Regards,
Gonzo

Indeed. We should all be 'middle of the road'. Of course, our heroes now seem to be celebreties who are otherwise very average apart from the attention they are given.

I have a friend who spent several years living as a single woman in Kandahar. It would be hard to interpret the choices that resulted from her Christian beliefs as other than 'extreme' - there certainly don't seem to be many people rushing to Kandahar. She also believed that she was aiming to reflect the priorities of a 2000 year old bloke who thought that helping poor people was even more important than your own life. Pretty fundamental in anyone's book.

Does that make her a dangerous extremist/fundamentalist?

Or these guys: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6988551.stm They are Christian extremists/fundamentalists too!
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Re: Fundamentalism and the Fear of Truth
Reply #15 - December 22, 2008, 11:10 AM

Quote from: BerberElla on December 22, 2008, 08:02 AM
Quote from: TomTom on December 22, 2008, 07:47 AM
Dio, your contribution seems limited to insults at this moment.

Where?

Because I am just as guilty if that is your criteria of limited to insults. It's quite easy to follow the flow of the conversation and see how it became a joke about retarded people who fall for such nonsense, so everything is in context as far as I can see.

Maybe I miss understood the postings; I understood the retard comments are linked to the OP.

Also agree that you can have fundie atheists etc... Stalin would be one crazy one!
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