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 Topic: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?

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  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #30 - November 02, 2008, 11:36 PM
    Gratitude towards Islam? No. Probably gratitude for a good brain.  Smiley
    "Poor human nature, what horrible crimes have been committed in thy name!"
    - Emma Goldman
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #31 - November 03, 2008, 10:11 AM
    Quote from: Iris on November 02, 2008, 02:02 PM

    Its my history and life experiences that made me who i am today (whether or not that is a good  thing is another matter  Smiley  )

    Im not sure about gratitude though... why be grateful? Sure I've generally had a great life, Im grateful for that, but how much of that is directly due to Islam?  I would say its bitterness versus acceptance.



    Yeah I see what you mean. You're right, you can't be grateful to Islam as a corrupt ideology as a whole, but it's influence on your life, via your parents and family, a part of your life experience, I bet there is some gratitude due if you look hard enough. I'm not saying you should, and certainly most people won't want to look hard enough, but for those that find the bitterness welling up, I think it helps to look at it like that. Look at alcoholism or drug addiction, there wouldn't be much there to feel grateful for you would think, yet you speak to most recovering addicts/bozo's and they'll tell you, despite the losses, it has made them wiser and stronger and they are grateful for that. They don't need to be, they could join Christians against drugs or whatever and use up their time railing against the ills of intoxication (and many do) - but as you say, acceptance is necessary and to accept something gratefully rather than with a sneer, works.
    Ha Ha.
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #32 - November 03, 2008, 10:18 AM
    Quote
    you can't be grateful to Islam as a corrupt ideology as a whole, but it's influence on your life, via your parents and family, a part of your life experience, I bet there is some gratitude due if you look hard enough.


    Thanks mum for running out on me when I was 4, you made me a person with abandonment issues.

    Thanks dad for beating me senseless, you made me see love and violence as connected.

    Thanks step mum for the coma, you made me normal and took away my silly chance to go to NASA and be someone special.

    Thanks big sis for your racism, you helped me see that my skin colour was disgusting.

    Thanks lil sis for your betrayels, you wised me up to what people are really like.

    Thanks ex hubby, you showed me that love was a fairy tale and again reaffirmed that love and violence are connected.

    Thanks Imam for telling me my place was with my hubby no matter what he did.

    Thanks moroccan girls, you taught me what a bitch looked like, now I know what to avoid.

    Thanks cousin, you taught me that I was so unworthy no one would ever believe you raped me.

    Thanks Islam, your lessons taught me that everything above was what life was about.

    Thank you all, for all you have given me, without you I might actually be happy, I am so grateful to you for the psychological issues you gifted me with.

    I am so grateful for it all.  Afro
    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #33 - November 03, 2008, 10:24 AM
    I realise Berbs, you are the one person in the world who has nothing whatsoever to be grateful for. You make sure you hang on to that anger if it makes you feel better Afro
    Ha Ha.
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #34 - November 03, 2008, 10:26 AM
    Quote from: Jack Torrance on November 03, 2008, 10:24 AM
    I realise Berbs, you are the one person in the world who has nothing whatsoever to be grateful for. You make sure you hang on to that anger if it makes you feel better Afro


    Righteous fury and anger signmuahaha

    And your sarcasm is duly noted and dismissed.  Wink
    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #35 - November 03, 2008, 10:29 AM
    Quote from: BerberElla on November 03, 2008, 10:26 AM
    Quote from: Jack Torrance on November 03, 2008, 10:24 AM
    I realise Berbs, you are the one person in the world who has nothing whatsoever to be grateful for. You make sure you hang on to that anger if it makes you feel better Afro


    Righteous fury and anger signmuahaha

    And your sarcasm is duly noted and dismissed.  Wink


    No sarcasm, I believe you Cry
    Ha Ha.
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #36 - November 03, 2008, 10:39 AM
    Jack, I doubt your sarcasm will help Berbs out of her bitterness... it´s just the way she feels right now, and feelings aren´t to be argued with - they just have to be borne, until they run their course.
    Berbs, you shouldn´t feed your bitterness, though, Jack is right on that. Whenever there are good memories, cherish them. Am sure, even in your past, there were good moments - when you felt love for your husband, before he turned into the wife-beating monster, when you first felt your children, first looked into their eyes... and many more, no? Let those images and memories happen, don´t focus only on the bad, which makes itself remembered anyway... Life is like a box of chocolates, after all  Wink
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #37 - November 03, 2008, 11:02 AM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 10:39 AM
    Jack, I doubt your sarcasm will help Berbs out of her bitterness... it´s just the way she feels right now, and feelings aren´t to be argued with - they just have to be borne, until they run their course.
    Berbs, you shouldn´t feed your bitterness, though, Jack is right on that. Whenever there are good memories, cherish them. Am sure, even in your past, there were good moments - when you felt love for your husband, before he turned into the wife-beating monster, when you first felt your children, first looked into their eyes... and many more, no? Let those images and memories happen, don´t focus only on the bad, which makes itself remembered anyway... Life is like a box of chocolates, after all  Wink


    You know I feel myself doing it, I sometimes find myself remembering the good moments, but I get so angry with myself for it.  What Jack doesn't realise ( I think ) is that I am aware and I am trying very hard to work past it all. 

    It's like how upset and angry I feel when I dream of a good time between me and my ex, it's irrational to be angry with yourself over a dream, but I'm still hurting.  I'm trying not to, but I am.
    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #38 - November 03, 2008, 11:06 AM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 10:39 AM
    Jack, I doubt your sarcasm will help Berbs out of her bitterness..


    Repeat - not being sarky. She's made it perfectly clear that she looks at her life like this. I have spent time on other posts trying to encouarge her to see the positive side, she won't - so I capitualte and I agree, she is the exception to the rule.
    Ha Ha.
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #39 - November 03, 2008, 11:13 AM
    Quote from: Jack Torrance on November 03, 2008, 11:06 AM


    Repeat - not being sarky. She's made it perfectly clear that she looks at her life like this. I have spent time on other posts trying to encouarge her to see the positive side, she won't - so I capitualte and I agree, she is the exception to the rule.


    Guess I was right when I said this:

    Quote from: BerberElla on November 03, 2008, 11:02 AM

    You know I feel myself doing it, I sometimes find myself remembering the good moments, but I get so angry with myself for it.  What Jack doesn't realise ( I think ) is that I am aware and I am trying very hard to work past it all. 

    It's like how upset and angry I feel when I dream of a good time between me and my ex, it's irrational to be angry with yourself over a dream, but I'm still hurting.  I'm trying not to, but I am.


    But like you said, it simply boils down to "She won't".

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #40 - November 03, 2008, 11:31 AM
    Quote from: BerberElla on November 03, 2008, 11:02 AM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 10:39 AM
    Jack, I doubt your sarcasm will help Berbs out of her bitterness... it´s just the way she feels right now, and feelings aren´t to be argued with - they just have to be borne, until they run their course.
    Berbs, you shouldn´t feed your bitterness, though, Jack is right on that. Whenever there are good memories, cherish them. Am sure, even in your past, there were good moments - when you felt love for your husband, before he turned into the wife-beating monster, when you first felt your children, first looked into their eyes... and many more, no? Let those images and memories happen, don´t focus only on the bad, which makes itself remembered anyway... Life is like a box of chocolates, after all  Wink


    You know I feel myself doing it, I sometimes find myself remembering the good moments, but I get so angry with myself for it.  What Jack doesn't realise ( I think ) is that I am aware and I am trying very hard to work past it all. 

    It's like how upset and angry I feel when I dream of a good time between me and my ex, it's irrational to be angry with yourself over a dream, but I'm still hurting.  I'm trying not to, but I am.


    As I said, Berbs - feelings are just there, no reasoning them away. Keep trying to see BOTH sides, and if and when the bitterness comes, don´t feed it - weather it like a storm. Eventually, the sun will come out again, no?  Wink
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #41 - November 03, 2008, 11:38 AM
    True, anyway I think I am better now than I was when I first came to FFI, I was seething with anger back then.  Now I am mellowing, it's a process and not one that can be fixed by suggesting gratefulness as an alternative and then getting all sarcy about it.

    I mean after all, inspite of my bitterness towards to my ex, I can now see that he should have regular contact with the children and actually feel more positive about it now than I did last year.

    If that's not progress then I don't know what is.  Afro
    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #42 - November 03, 2008, 11:50 AM
    Soon you'll be a hug monster. Undeniable.

  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #43 - November 03, 2008, 12:02 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 11:50 AM
    Soon you'll be a hug monster. Undeniable.




    I'll never be a hug monster lol even at my most happiest and peaceful I still had personal space issues, I didn't give hugs, I recieved them under duress.  Cheesy
    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #44 - November 03, 2008, 12:15 PM
    Quote from: BerberElla on November 03, 2008, 12:02 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 11:50 AM
    Soon you'll be a hug monster. Undeniable.




    I'll never be a hug monster lol even at my most happiest and peaceful I still had personal space issues, I didn't give hugs, I recieved them under duress.  Cheesy


    Ive heard this all before. I know you will be, Dio's turning you over to the super-light side.
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #45 - November 03, 2008, 12:17 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:15 PM


    Ive heard this all before. I know you will be, Dio's turning you over to the super-light side.


    No one can ever turn me into a huggy monster signmuahaha I'll die defending my personal space.  finmad
    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #46 - November 03, 2008, 12:19 PM
    Quote from: BerberElla on November 03, 2008, 12:17 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:15 PM


    Ive heard this all before. I know you will be, Dio's turning you over to the super-light side.


    No one can ever turn me into a huggy monster signmuahaha I'll die defending my personal space.  finmad


    You'll die an be reborn as a hug monster. Dio can actually do that.
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #47 - November 03, 2008, 12:30 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:19 PM
    Quote from: BerberElla on November 03, 2008, 12:17 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:15 PM


    Ive heard this all before. I know you will be, Dio's turning you over to the super-light side.


    No one can ever turn me into a huggy monster signmuahaha I'll die defending my personal space.  finmad


    You'll die an be reborn as a hug monster. Dio can actually do that.


    Yeah, watch out, M, sweetie... I have my eyes on hug-converting YOU, and am making great progress!! Big hug  whistling2
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #48 - November 03, 2008, 12:33 PM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 12:30 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:19 PM
    Quote from: BerberElla on November 03, 2008, 12:17 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:15 PM


    Ive heard this all before. I know you will be, Dio's turning you over to the super-light side.


    No one can ever turn me into a huggy monster signmuahaha I'll die defending my personal space.  finmad


    You'll die an be reborn as a hug monster. Dio can actually do that.


    Yeah, watch out, M, sweetie... I have my eyes on hug-converting YOU, and am making great progress!! Big hug  whistling2


    You wish. Good progress my ass.  Cheesy

    How do you feel about having to eat your own eyes?
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #49 - November 03, 2008, 12:40 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:33 PM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 12:30 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:19 PM
    Quote from: BerberElla on November 03, 2008, 12:17 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:15 PM


    Ive heard this all before. I know you will be, Dio's turning you over to the super-light side.


    No one can ever turn me into a huggy monster signmuahaha I'll die defending my personal space.  finmad


    You'll die an be reborn as a hug monster. Dio can actually do that.


    Yeah, watch out, M, sweetie... I have my eyes on hug-converting YOU, and am making great progress!! Big hug  whistling2


    You wish. Good progress my ass.  Cheesy

    How do you feel about having to eat your own eyes?


    yerch! I´ll scratch yours out, hugging, unless you think of something more tasty!  Afro
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #50 - November 03, 2008, 12:42 PM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 12:40 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:33 PM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 12:30 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:19 PM
    Quote from: BerberElla on November 03, 2008, 12:17 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:15 PM


    Ive heard this all before. I know you will be, Dio's turning you over to the super-light side.


    No one can ever turn me into a huggy monster signmuahaha I'll die defending my personal space.  finmad


    You'll die an be reborn as a hug monster. Dio can actually do that.


    Yeah, watch out, M, sweetie... I have my eyes on hug-converting YOU, and am making great progress!! Big hug  whistling2


    You wish. Good progress my ass.  Cheesy

    How do you feel about having to eat your own eyes?


    yerch! I´ll scratch yours out, hugging, unless you think of something more tasty!  Afro


    You- scratch my eyes out? I'll kick your ass to Naboo before that happens.

    Tasty? You like shit on a stick?
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #51 - November 03, 2008, 01:16 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:42 PM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 12:40 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:33 PM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 12:30 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:19 PM
    Quote from: BerberElla on November 03, 2008, 12:17 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:15 PM


    Ive heard this all before. I know you will be, Dio's turning you over to the super-light side.


    No one can ever turn me into a huggy monster signmuahaha I'll die defending my personal space.  finmad


    You'll die an be reborn as a hug monster. Dio can actually do that.


    Yeah, watch out, M, sweetie... I have my eyes on hug-converting YOU, and am making great progress!! Big hug  whistling2


    You wish. Good progress my ass.  Cheesy

    How do you feel about having to eat your own eyes?


    yerch! I´ll scratch yours out, hugging, unless you think of something more tasty!  Afro


    You- scratch my eyes out? I'll kick your ass to Naboo before that happens.

    Tasty? You like shit on a stick?


    what´s it with you and bodily fluids today, M? You scare me!  Cheesy
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #52 - November 03, 2008, 01:26 PM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 01:16 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:42 PM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 12:40 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:33 PM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 12:30 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:19 PM
    Quote from: BerberElla on November 03, 2008, 12:17 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:15 PM


    Ive heard this all before. I know you will be, Dio's turning you over to the super-light side.


    No one can ever turn me into a huggy monster signmuahaha I'll die defending my personal space.  finmad


    You'll die an be reborn as a hug monster. Dio can actually do that.


    Yeah, watch out, M, sweetie... I have my eyes on hug-converting YOU, and am making great progress!! Big hug  whistling2


    You wish. Good progress my ass.  Cheesy

    How do you feel about having to eat your own eyes?


    yerch! I´ll scratch yours out, hugging, unless you think of something more tasty!  Afro


    You- scratch my eyes out? I'll kick your ass to Naboo before that happens.

    Tasty? You like shit on a stick?


    what´s it with you and bodily fluids today, M? You scare me!  Cheesy


    What bodily fluids?

    I scare you? You scare me with your hug monsterness. I would rather have my throat slashed by a bloodsucking vampire
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #53 - November 03, 2008, 01:35 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 01:26 PM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 01:16 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:42 PM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 12:40 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:33 PM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 12:30 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:19 PM
    Quote from: BerberElla on November 03, 2008, 12:17 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:15 PM


    Ive heard this all before. I know you will be, Dio's turning you over to the super-light side.


    No one can ever turn me into a huggy monster signmuahaha I'll die defending my personal space.  finmad


    You'll die an be reborn as a hug monster. Dio can actually do that.


    Yeah, watch out, M, sweetie... I have my eyes on hug-converting YOU, and am making great progress!! Big hug  whistling2


    You wish. Good progress my ass.  Cheesy

    How do you feel about having to eat your own eyes?


    yerch! I´ll scratch yours out, hugging, unless you think of something more tasty!  Afro


    You- scratch my eyes out? I'll kick your ass to Naboo before that happens.

    Tasty? You like shit on a stick?


    what´s it with you and bodily fluids today, M? You scare me!  Cheesy


    What bodily fluids?

    I scare you? You scare me with your hug monsterness. I would rather have my throat slashed by a bloodsucking vampire


    MORE bodily fluids!  Huh?
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #54 - November 03, 2008, 01:36 PM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 01:35 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 01:26 PM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 01:16 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:42 PM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 12:40 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:33 PM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 12:30 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:19 PM
    Quote from: BerberElla on November 03, 2008, 12:17 PM
    Quote from: MSinghK on November 03, 2008, 12:15 PM


    Ive heard this all before. I know you will be, Dio's turning you over to the super-light side.


    No one can ever turn me into a huggy monster signmuahaha I'll die defending my personal space.  finmad


    You'll die an be reborn as a hug monster. Dio can actually do that.


    Yeah, watch out, M, sweetie... I have my eyes on hug-converting YOU, and am making great progress!! Big hug  whistling2


    You wish. Good progress my ass.  Cheesy

    How do you feel about having to eat your own eyes?


    yerch! I´ll scratch yours out, hugging, unless you think of something more tasty!  Afro


    You- scratch my eyes out? I'll kick your ass to Naboo before that happens.

    Tasty? You like shit on a stick?


    what´s it with you and bodily fluids today, M? You scare me!  Cheesy


    What bodily fluids?

    I scare you? You scare me with your hug monsterness. I would rather have my throat slashed by a bloodsucking vampire


    MORE bodily fluids!  Huh?


    Can't help my bloodlust.
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #55 - November 03, 2008, 01:46 PM
    Wow.

    How off-topic can one go?
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #56 - November 03, 2008, 02:08 PM
     Cheesy got to admit I was thinking the same thing.
    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #57 - November 03, 2008, 02:10 PM
    Quote from: BerberElla on November 03, 2008, 02:08 PM
    Cheesy got to admit I was thinking the same thing.

    Rubbish - bloodlust and bitterness are related!  Afro
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #58 - November 03, 2008, 02:12 PM
    Quote from: diotima on November 03, 2008, 02:10 PM
    Quote from: BerberElla on November 03, 2008, 02:08 PM
    Cheesy got to admit I was thinking the same thing.

    Rubbish - bloodlust and bitterness are related!  Afro


    No they're not.
  • Re: Bitterness/Gratitude - which is the virtue?
     Reply #59 - November 03, 2008, 02:14 PM
    I love to disagree
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