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 Topic: France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society

 (Read 1679 times)
  • 12 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     OP - October 02, 2020, 04:45 PM

    France  Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society _ France President  says BBC news  with this picture



    Quote
    French President Emmanuel Macron has announced plans for tougher laws to tackle what he called "Islamist separatism" and defend secular values. In a keenly awaited speech, Mr Macron said a minority of France's estimated six million Muslims were in danger of forming a "counter-society".

    His proposals include stricter oversight of schooling and control over foreign funding of mosques. He had been under pressure to address radical Islam amid security fears.

    But his comments were condemned by some Muslim activists who accused him of trying to repress Islam in the country.....


    well that is the news today..

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #1 - October 03, 2020, 01:59 AM

    Can't say I'm a fan of the French burka ban to be honest, though maybe we should look at banning grotty maulvi types who seem to be here for no reason other than to beat the Quran into kids.

    But this isn't really news, this is a challenge of the times when it comes to Islamic radicalisation, wider Islamic conservatism and how the rest of society is having to react.
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #2 - October 05, 2020, 01:12 PM

    Can't say I'm a fan of the French burka ban to be honest,


    Why not? Close religious schools, stop foreign funding, ban face coverings and leave no doubt that a state within a state will be tolerated.
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #3 - October 05, 2020, 01:16 PM

    Why not? Close religious schools, stop foreign funding, ban face coverings and leave no doubt that a state within a state will be (NOT) tolerated.

     Cheesy my goodness gracious .. what happened TODAY dear crumble?

    and did you miss that word "NOT" there??

    well Yesss.. 

    Dammit ....make France like Saudi Arabia Sand Land.. Make France like Land of Pure follow the rules of Iranian Mullah regime ... finmad finmad

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #4 - October 05, 2020, 01:24 PM

    leave no doubt followed by not  results in double negative.

    I think they call it muscular secularism - it will clear up confusion in some muslim minds at least, ie no room for mini medinas in france.
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #5 - October 05, 2020, 01:37 PM

    leave no doubt followed by not  results in double negative.


    Oh.. Oops., well I am in fighting mood today  finmad     

    So what there is double negative in a sentence?  why do you multiply them??  ADD THEM

    Quote
    I think they call it muscular secularism - it will clear up confusion in some muslim minds at least, ie no room for mini medinas in france.

    well I am not certain that is right way to eliminate mini medinas in France.  In fact indirectly you are saying France should act like Medina Story of 6th century to eliminate mini medinas in France

    but give me your opinion on another folder .. Because  I read your posts   and that folder is right above this   https://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=29109.0

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #6 - October 05, 2020, 01:55 PM

    In fact indirectly you are saying France should act like Medina Story of 6th century to eliminate mini medinas in France


    You compare the removal of a few abused liberties to religious totalitarianism? The all-or-nothing view of rights/freedoms is pretty crazy.

    I'll look at the other thread later on.
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #7 - October 05, 2020, 03:03 PM

    You compare the removal of a few abused liberties to religious totalitarianism? The all-or-nothing view of rights/freedoms is pretty crazy...............


    well..  I am looking for permanent solution without  impinging on liberties.. ." that removal of a few abused liberties"  .,


    .......Often that word  "FEW"   or...  "removal of a few abused liberties"  leads to abusing liberty itself.. So we don't to go to a slippery slope on Liberty ..

    Off course "LIBERTY COMES WITH A SIMPLE RESTRICTION ".. That is golden rule...

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #8 - October 05, 2020, 05:27 PM

    ..  "removal of a few abused liberties"  leads to abusing liberty itself.. So we don't to go to a slippery slope on Liberty ..


    And rights have to be expanded continuously to prevent the slippery slope? If a single person feels disenfranchised then the whole edifice slips down to tyranny? Of course, that is absurd.
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #9 - October 06, 2020, 06:56 AM

    Why not? Close religious schools, stop foreign funding, ban face coverings and leave no doubt that a state within a state will be tolerated.


    There are a number of things I would put above the face veil that are a threat to the secular state. Like you, I'm in favour of secularism. But I don't want to be authoritarian in the name of maintaing a secular society. The French have their muscular secularism but I prefer what ten years ago David Cameron described as muscular liberalism, if the choice comes between those two.

    Which isn't to say that the burka or face veil shouldn't be challenged, I'm no relativist. But I prefer it being challenged in civil society rather than the state infringing the liberty of the individual to wear what they want, however distasteful.
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #10 - October 06, 2020, 08:06 AM

    And rights have to be expanded continuously to prevent the slippery slope?

    No...
    Quote
    If a single person feels disenfranchised then the whole edifice slips down to tyranny? Of course, that is absurd.

      No... 

    but we have problem about the word "rights" itself .,  what rights are we talking about?  let us take examples from your own statement

    Quote
    1). Close religious schools,
    2_. stop foreign funding,
    3).  ban face coverings
    4). and leave no doubt that a state within a state will be (NOT) tolerated.


    those are the points that are from your post that you think  a government of a democratic state  should  control   with force ,..  now compare  the  rights  in those 4 points  with  universally recognized Human Rights,  such as

    Quote
    Right to self-determination
    Right to liberty
    Right to due process of law
    Right to freedom of movement
    Right to privacy
    Right to freedom of thought
    Right to freedom of religion
    Right to freedom of expression
    Right to peaceful assembly
    Right to freedom of association


    and figure out those four points whether they are trespassing  the above fundamental rights .. along with golden rule ..debate .. discuss  with those who  are opposing your views  and convince them that you are right  ..

    that is all what you need to do  Cheesy    I agree it is a tough problem but I think Human beings are intelligent enough to participate in such open discussion in this 21st century

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #11 - October 06, 2020, 08:25 AM

    human rights are arbitrary not fundamental. democracy is the force of the many over the fewer. administrative secularism should prioritise the latter over the former.
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #12 - October 06, 2020, 08:26 AM

    ie, democratic will over ideological rights gumf.
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #13 - January 21, 2021, 04:10 PM

    today's news on France & Islam says

    French Muslims at odds over Macron's 'anti-extremism' charter

    Quote
    The head of France's main Muslim organisation on Thursday slammed a “unilateral” move by three Islamic groups not to sign up to an anti-extremism charter championed by President Emmanuel Macron.

    Quote
    Macron wants French Muslim groups to sign up to the charter as he seeks to secure France's secular system in the wake of a spate of attacks blamed on radical Islamists in 2020.

    But the Committee for Coordination of Turkish Muslims in France (CCMTF) and the Milli Gorus Islamic Confederation (CMIG) — both catering to citizens of Turkish origin — as well as the Faith and Practice movement, announced late on Wednesday that they would not be signing up to the charter.

    “Through these repetitive actions, the groups ... all risk being held responsible for this situation of division,” said Mohamed Moussaoui, the president of the French Council of the Muslim Faith (CFCM), the umbrella grouping for France's Muslim groups.


    This refusal “is not likely to provide reassurance ... on the state of the representative bodies of the Muslim religion”, he added.

    A source close to the issue, who asked not to be named, said the three groups refusing to sign the charter were particularly concerned about the definition of foreign interference in religion and the definition of political Islam.

    The row comes at a time of severe diplomatic tensions between France and Turkey, whose President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has repeatedly lambasted Macron's bid to crack down on radical Muslims in the country.

    The Milli Gorus, a pan-European movement for the Turkish diaspora, is seen as inspired by the ideas of late prime minister Necmettin Erbakan, regarded as the father of political Islam in Turkey and Erdogan's mentor.

    “We believe that certain passages and formulations in the text submitted are likely to weaken the bonds of trust between the Muslims of France and the nation,” the three groups said in a statement.

    “Furthermore, some statements are prejudicial to the honour of Muslims, with an accusatory and marginalising tone.”

    'Important clarification'

    Five out of nine groups who make up the CFCM, a body set up almost 20 years ago to enable dialogue between the government and the Muslim community, have signed up to the charter after weeks of sometimes acrimonious debates.

    But the failure of the CFCM to so far show a totally united front risks robbing the initiative of the consensus within the Muslim community that it is supposed to highlight.

    A government source, however, insisted that the groups' refusal would not weaken the process, adding that “the masks are coming off”.

    “An important clarification is being made,” the source said.

    Quote
    The charter rejects “instrumentalising” Islam for political ends and affirms equality between men and women, while denouncing practices such as female circumcisions, forced marriages or “virginity certificates” for brides. These practices, though prevalent in some Muslim communities, are more cultural than based on religion.

    Macron railed against the promotion of “political Islam” in France in November last year after a teacher was beheaded outside his school.

    He had shown pupils caricatures of Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) as part of a free-speech lesson.

    The attack prompted a crackdown against alleged extremist mosques and Islamist associations, along with a vigorous defence of French secularism.


    well that is the news...

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #14 - January 21, 2021, 06:34 PM

    as posted in the other thread, the charter and the imams are a sideshow.

    the problem will be only be addressed by pushing foreign and domestic aliens to leave their cultural baggage at the border. if you leave a craphole for a better life then leave the crap in the goddamn hole - don't bring it with you!
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #15 - January 22, 2021, 11:02 AM

    well I agree to disagree with your two statements of your post dear crumble


    1_as posted in the other thread, the charter and the imams are a sideshow.

      I am not sure which thread/folder you are referring ,,  you see this

    ........"charter and the imams of Islam or for that matter charter and the priests of any faith  are side show.,   or or  may appear to be side show " ..........has built in problems   .. 

     We must realize here  THAT THOSE SIDE SHOWS CONTINUUSLY BECAME or EVEN BECOMING MAIN SHOWS throughout the human history by interacting with social, economical, religious and political shows of the society  .,    They will never go away .,  Here one must come up with better ideas to solve this faith problem of  faith preachers, faith politics and  faith heads..

    Quote
    2_  the problem will be only be addressed by pushing foreign and domestic aliens to leave their cultural baggage at the border. if you leave a craphole for a better life then leave the crap in the goddamn hole - don't bring it with you!

      Nah., you are basically  saying enforce the rules  which you consider are good for the society  through the use of brute power .,  Such ideas down the road  simply builds in to a totalitarian system which will have detrimental consequences..
     
    That line of thinking is impossible in a society in which  you would like to have freedom  of expression and freedom of thought  that you can freely express to your fellow humans..

    So you must try to come up with alternate methods  that will have inbuilt  protection   to the above highlighted words..

    The case of  Hassan Shibly of AMRIKA THE FAMOUS Florida CAIR international speaker is a perfect examples you will find everywhere in Islam as well as in other faiths

    Quote


    watch those and read this  https://www.facebook.com/groups/feministfitna/permalink/2926068281051571/?comment_id=2926789444312788


    with best wishes
    yeezevee

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #16 - January 22, 2021, 11:51 PM

      Nah., you are basically  saying enforce the rules  which you consider are good for the society  through the use of brute power .,  Such ideas down the road  simply builds in to a totalitarian system which will have detrimental consequences..


    as I said in the paris thread, those who are completely at odds with societal norms must be crushed, metaphorically. subversion must be understood by all to be a fringe endeavor.

    society is a totalitarism concept. harmony requires a consensus which necessarily stifles the ambitions of the minority. a hated minority must learn to conform as a group - or face the consequences.
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #17 - January 24, 2021, 10:14 AM

    as I said in the paris thread,   those who are completely at odds with societal norms must be crushed, metaphorically. subversion must be understood by all to be a fringe endeavor.

    society is a totalitarism concept. harmony requires a consensus which necessarily stifles the ambitions of the minority. a hated minority must learn to conform as a group - or face the consequences.


     Well I don't understand gist of  your post   but these two statements from your posts

    1.......those who are completely at odds with societal norms must be crushed, metaphorically

    2...  society is a totalitarism concept. harmony requires a consensus which necessarily stifles the ambitions of the minority

    directly leads to totalitarian systems   where society gets ruled by   Kings...queens  Caliphs,,. Generals.. and dictators .. and any one who questions those scoundrels will get crushed ..  don't get me wrong in the history of mankind one will find FEW good folks as  Kings...queens  Caliphs,,. Generals.. and dictators., but In  general history tells us the system always degrades with in one or two generations

    For me  life under such unquestionable systems will be  like living  in an  animal farm where no one questions the big kahuna  dear crumble .. and we have done that during medieval times ., we don't need to repeat it in 21st century

    Well it may be ok for you but I will not able to live in such society   and crumble please read this article of Nazir at https://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=27246.msg890110#msg890110

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #18 - January 24, 2021, 04:21 PM

    Well I don't understand gist of  your post   but these two statements from your posts


    the gist is assimilating immigrants and suppressing their cultural baggage.

    Quote from:
    Well it may be ok for you but I will not able to live in such society


    you rather live somewhere that allows free movement of people and their ideologies? better pack your bags for northern europe then!

  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #19 - January 25, 2021, 03:36 PM

    the gist is assimilating immigrants and suppressing their cultural baggage.

     why suppress? suppress with what? by force??  well if there is a clash with cultures we can always argue , debate,  reason and try to understand each culture and their values  and choose to  built a humanistic culture that fits to all  instead of individual cultures .. where one culture feeling superior to another culture . after all we are in 21st century dear crumble. where words and statements gets transmitted at the speed of light from one end of planet to another end of planet., Of course for that we need freedom of expression and protection from the governments so people can express freely with golden rule  guiding the pathways in the debate

    Quote
    you rather live somewhere that allows free movement of people and their ideologies? better pack your bags for northern europe then!

    what??  I don't get that.,   Not sure how to respond to that  dear crumble., well I am one of those guys .. I can live in north pole.. or south pole or or east pole or west pole ., makes very little difference

    On the let me give you these tubes for you to watch..

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dLIdCYmzLJw

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdtri6ZMbmQ

    if you don't like them .. watch these

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvFEe6e0lDY

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7c8bKw2W8g

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #20 - January 26, 2021, 11:25 AM

    why suppress? suppress with what? by force??  well if there is a clash with cultures we can always argue , debate,  reason and try to understand each culture and their values  and choose to  built a humanistic culture that fits to all  instead of individual cultures ..


    Humanism? You think that's what immigrants subscribe to? Or even the 2nd/3rd generation who identify as 'muslims'?  I'm afraid that this kind of naive attitude is the reason why cultural ghettos proliferate to the disadvantage of all communities.

    Quote from:
    where one culture feeling superior to another culture . after all we are in 21st century dear crumble. where words and statements gets transmitted at the speed of light from one end of planet to another end of planet.,


    necessarily, the host culture will always have primacy. the nonsense of being a global citizen does not reflect reality for the majority of the working class from both native and immigrant backgrounds. having an internet connection does not excuse separatism.

    Quote from:
    Of course for that we need freedom of expression and protection from the governments so people can express freely with golden rule  guiding the pathways in the debate


    people expressing themselves and calling for free debate - that was the defensive reaction of muslim spokesmen in france immediately in the aftermath of the murder. you have to realise it's a stalling tactic and they have no intention of engaging in a conversation that takes away their power structures.

    forget the golden rule and other idealisms. practical social policies are required to make people's lives better. as we're talking about an immigrant class then that means dispersing settlement widely rather than in centralised ghettos. integration through low pay jobs rather than unconditional benefits. incentives to abandon foreign culture rather than institutionalising and facilitating them. mandatory school syllabus for all children without opt-outs - and so on.

    the solutions are simple but do-gooder squeamishness must be put aside to implement everything.
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #21 - January 26, 2021, 02:01 PM

    what happened crumble??  you are crumbling away.... I ask you why?  I will deal with all that hidden (below) post of yours in code  later but for now..
    Humanism?

    Yesssssss....  yes to humanism

    Quote
    You think that's what immigrants subscribe to?

    why not?? they too are human like me  .,    NOT ONLY I THINK., I AM SURE ABOUT THAT., unless you consider them as Not Human and you consider me NOT a human   and / or you consider yourself also NOT human but superior to Human and Humanism ..
    Quote
    Or even the 2nd/3rd generation who identify as 'muslims'? 

    so what is wrong with that?? What is Muslim?? Are they not same as other faith heads??.. They are human they will listen they will understand .. explain them the problem with the faith .. their faith....
    Quote
    I'm afraid that this kind of naïve attitude is the reason why  cultural ghettos proliferate to the disadvantage of all communities.

    well I may be naïve ., I am be childish gullible innocent fool     BUT THEY ARE MANY OTHER REASONS FOR PROLIFERRATION OF ECONOMICAL   DOWNTRODDEN AND GHETTOS   IN  WEST AND IN EAST .. or for that matter in any country/community
    Quote
    necessarily, the host culture will always have primacy. the nonsense of being a global citizen does not reflect reality for the majority of the working class from both native and immigrant backgrounds. having an internet connection does not excuse separatism.

    people expressing themselves and calling for free debate - that was the defensive reaction of muslim spokesmen in france immediately in the aftermath of the murder. you have to realise it's a stalling tactic and they have no intention of engaging in a conversation that takes away their power structures.

    forget the golden rule and other idealisms.
    practical social policies are required to make people's lives better. as we're talking about an immigrant class then that means dispersing settlement widely rather than in centralised ghettos. integration through low pay jobs rather than unconditional benefits. incentives to abandon foreign culture rather than institutionalising and facilitating them. mandatory school syllabus for all children without opt-outs - and so on.

    the solutions are simple but do-gooder squeamishness must be put aside to implement everything.

        I will leave that code on your post  and answer later ..  But YESSSS TO GOLDEN RULE  and please realize that  I am not here to solve  every problem on earth or to solve the problems like political/economical/cultural differences  etc..etc.. of the world

    I write   for readers in the forums like this one ......to think themselves and argue with them to consider  these  religious texts that faith heads preach are NOT from some allah/god ahah hoooowhoo haha   dude  but they are text of their time written by some folks 

    So these religious based laws such as Blasphemy laws or other junk similar to it  should be thrown out of the society

    That is all my interest here   dear crumble .,  I am not interested in SOME TWITTER  links.. or some farmer gods....monkey god.. rat god.. cat god followers and their problems .

    If you could help me with that Sana Quran manuscripts  or other early Quran manuscripts and educate me with those Quran manuscripts that would be really  useful for me..

    with best wishes
    yeezevee

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #22 - January 26, 2021, 07:23 PM

    I write   for readers in the forums like this one ......to think themselves and argue with them to consider  these  religious texts that faith heads preach are NOT from some allah/god ahah hoooowhoo haha   dude  but they are text of their time written by some folks 

    So these religious based laws such as Blasphemy laws or other junk similar to it  should be thrown out of the society


    I write only for myself - which is pretty handy in a ghost town like this.

    society is the source of all problems. religion is only a symptom. there is no solution in human-isms, golden rules or long forgotten manuscripts.

    populations must be managed. cultural harmonisation includes removal of discrimination - for the sake of efficiency not the lie of racial justice or fundamental rights.

  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #23 - January 26, 2021, 10:31 PM

    I write only for myself - which is pretty handy in a ghost town like this.

    well that is wonderful crumble., You must assert and remind your own goals every day., that is indeed important in life

    Quote
    society is the source of all problems. religion is only a symptom. there is no solution in human-isms, golden rules or long forgotten manuscripts.

    populations must be managed. cultural harmonisation includes removal of discrimination - for the sake of efficiency not the lie of racial justice or fundamental rights.

       good points.... you must find the  ways and methods for that cultural harmonization  and removal of discrimination   mean while I work for the problems I think i have the ways to deal with ...  and  let me read these  links on Islam and Europe..

    Quote
    Dutch former anti-Islam MP says he's become a Muslim

    A Dutch former far-right MP and right-hand man of anti-Islam politician Geert Wilders has set tongues wagging in the Netherlands after revealing he has converted to Islam, news reports said Tuesday.

    For years Joram van Klaveren fought a relentless campaign in the Lower House against Islam in the Netherlands as a lawmaker for Wilders' Freedom Party (PVV).

    At the time, the "hardliner pleaded for banning the burqa and minarets, saying 'we don't want any Islam, or at least as little as possible in the Netherlands'," the daily tabloid Algemeen Dagblad (AD) said.

    But the 40-year-old Van Klaveren said he had changed his mind halfway through writing an anti-Islam book, which he Tuesday told the respected NRC daily "became a refutation of objections non-Muslims have" against the religion......

      that news published few hrs ago

    Quote
    France attacks show Muslims’ self-inflicted paranoia. But Quran allows freedom of expression by RAAMISH SIDDIQUI

    Three people have been killed in a knife attack in the French city of Nice. One elderly victim, who had come to pray at the church, was “virtually beheaded”, according to reports. A suspect was shot and detained shortly afterward. Thursday’s grotesque incident comes barely days after the horrific killing of Samuel Paty, a teacher, by an 18-year-old Chechen-origin man in Paris on 16 October. ..............

    The highly condemnable killings have brought back the debate on how such actions by violent extremists are countering the very values that Islam represents. Islam stands for peace and mercy, it has no place for perpetration of violence and murder of fellow human beings. There is a clear verse in the Quran that says: “Whoever killed a human being shall be regarded as having killed all mankind.” (5:32)

    Violence is forbidden in Quran

    It is mistakenly believed that Islam prescribes capital punishment for those who commit blasphemy. Nothing can be farther from the truth. According to Islam, blasphemy is simply a case of misunderstanding. Anyone who wishes to can engage in a discussion with the person who has misunderstood and make an effort to clarify it. That is the only choice a person has. The Islamic principle in this context is fully based on ‘peaceful dialogue’. God gives this injunction to the Prophet in the Quran:
    It is said that some non-believers would use abusive language against the Prophet. But the Prophet never wanted any punishment for them. Instead, his companion, Hassan bin Sabit al-Ansari, would engage in discussions with them to clear their misunderstandings, writes Islamic scholar Maulana Wahiduddin Khan. This was the Prophetic example.

    According to the Quran, man has freedom and no one can impose curbs on it. The judgement, on whether someone used or misused their freedom, is not for people to make. The Islamic way is to resort to peace and reason in all matters of life. The Prophet of Islam gave masterful advice to his companions when he said, “Do not be angry” (Sahih Bukhari 76). It is deeply hurtful that instead of adhering to this advice, Muslims keep succumbing to violence – passive or aggressive – as a result of self-inflicted paranoia. Muslim scholars and intelligentsia should come forward and condemn such acts of violence openly and highlight how negative thinking and violence are forbidden in Islam.

    lslam believes in freedom of expression for all.

     lslam believes in freedom of expression for all. It, therefore, devolves on its adherents to do whatever they can to create a world where peace and freedom of expression flourishes and constructive dialogue can be engaged in. The world has no place for extremist ideas and violent behaviour. The only way forward is for Muslims to preserve peace at all costs and shun violence at every level. This is the only choice for Muslims if they want to uphold the Islamic ideals.

      those are the nuggets from those links and let me read this
     
    The French Motto Engraved in the Holy Qur’an 1400 Years Ago

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #24 - January 30, 2021, 04:05 PM

    the harvest of separatism.

    Quote from:
    French far-right leader Marine Le Pen proposed a ban on Muslim headscarves in all public places, seeking to build on a record recent poll putting her almost neck-and-neck with President Emmanuel Macron.

    The hijab policy, which would be contested in court and almost certainly be ruled unconstitutional, saw the 53-year-old return to a familiar campaign theme 15 months from the country’s 2022 presidential election.

    “I consider that the headscarf is an Islamist item of clothing,” Le Pen told reporters at a news conference on Friday, where she proposed a new law to ban “Islamist ideologies” that she called “totalitarian and murderous”.


    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/france-e2-80-99s-le-pen-at-record-high-in-a-poll-proposes-hijab-ban/ar-BB1dejah
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #25 - February 10, 2021, 12:23 PM


    So what is French Mila affair? and how it started ?? it centers around a tweet of a 16 year old girl now 17...  https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-51369960

    Quote
    A teenager has sparked a national debate about blasphemy in France after an Instagram post calling Islam a "religion of hate".

    Mila, 16, posted her comments online after receiving homophobic abuse from a Muslim commenter.

    She received death threats and has not attended school since.

    But Mila has refused to back down, saying in her first television interview that she "wanted to blaspheme".

    She has since deactivated her Instagram account.

    The post has sparked a huge debate in France over freedom of speech. The country has no national blasphemy laws and has a rigidly secular constitution.

    Police initially opened two investigations: the first into whether Mila was guilty of hate speech, and the second into her online attackers. They have since dropped the hate speech case as Mila was expressing a personal opinion on religion and not targeting individuals.

    On Tuesday, Interior Minister Christophe Castaner told the National Assembly that Mila and her family were under police protection.

    What did Mila say?
    Appearing on the Quotidien programme on the TMC channel, Mila apologised for insulting people who practise their religion "in peace" and said she regretted the "vulgarity" of her words and their spread online.

    But she defended her remarks. "I have absolutely no regrets about what I said, it was really my thought," she told the interviewer.


    Quote
    How did the controversy start?

    The controversy began on 18 January, after Mila did a live broadcast on her Instagram account. After speaking about her sexuality she was called a "dirty lesbian" by a Muslim commenter.

    In response, Mila posted an attack on Islam. "I hate religion. The Koran is a religion of hate," she said, before using stronger words to attack Islam.

    "I am not racist. You cannot be racist towards a religion. I said what I thought, you're not going to make me regret it."


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SgM0Lq7M4EQ

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcsfRMmbaMA

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9HCN5Ba-Neo

    that is Mila....

    well more on that later but 16 year old say something about Islam ., ISLAMIC IDIOTS THINK ISLAM THE FAITH IS IN DANGER ., ISLAMIC SCOUNDRLES WITH FOSSILIZED BRAINS  ADD SOME SHIT IN TO IT IN THE NAME OF ISLAMIC HISTORY AND SOME KID FROM OTHER FAITH SAYS SOMETHING .. THESE ISLAMIC MONKEYY BECOME ENRAGED MONKEY BRIGADE ...  with Kill kill kill shouts ..

    Pathetic rogues ruined a wonderful concept of god allah.. whatever for the sake the  loot & booty

    Mock the fools and move on

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #26 - February 10, 2021, 08:35 PM

    Pathetic rogues ruined a wonderful concept of god allah.. whatever for the sake the  loot & booty


    wonderful? well that comment make me wonder what you believe... what was the line? "god made man in his own image" - meaning not as his own reflection but his single-handed creation. so which category does your unruined concept fall under?
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #27 - February 12, 2021, 10:42 AM

    crumble learned something from me..  CUTTING THE POST OF THE POSTER   Cheesy Cheesy

    wonderful? well that comment make me wonder what you believe... what was the line? "god made man in his own image" - meaning not as his own reflection but his single-handed creation. so which category does your unruined concept fall under?


     Now let me delete part of crumble post as revenge... finmad

    THERE IS NO MALE GOD.......... god is not he.. the dick head.. hence words like ...... He.. His.. Him ..........   should NOT be use for  god.. whatever god may be inside  the heads of faith heads dear crumble

    Well SOME STATEMENTS/. IDEAS ON FAITH  THAT ARE THERE  IN ISLAM?QURAN ARE WONDERFUL

    As far as my belief is concerned .,  you know that very well., we already went through this.. I run  my life on  very few ideas ...  in fact it is floating/moving under every post of mine ..lol..

    well let me  read through this .. you wrote something on this subject
    https://www.dawn.com/news/1606885/when-farmers-protest

    and going back to the folder related subject   The news say
    Turkish Muslim groups in France oppose anti-Islam bill  

    Quote
    Turkish Muslim groups in France are determined not to sign, and thereby support, France's new anti-Muslim bill on the "charter of principles" of Islam until amendments are made.

    Speaking to Anadolu Agency (AA), the chairperson of the Coordination Committee of Turkish Muslims in France (CCMTF), Ibrahim Alcı, said that they have been going through a tough period and pressure is coming from everywhere.

    Although acknowledging that the plan for the establishment of a national imam council – which will control the appointment of imams based on their knowledge of religion, educational talents and personal qualities – is an important step, Alcı said that some anti-Muslim articles of the bill prevent them from signing it.

    He said that other Muslim foundations in France also support them, adding: "Six hundred to 700 mosques and foundations back us. There are nearly 2,500 mosques in France."


    Hmm that is the news
    Quote
    As Alcı said, they delivered the results of their consultations with imams and Muslim foundations in France to the Interior Ministry and the French Council of Muslim Worship (CFCM). Alcı also condemned the bill's description of
    ...."French Islam," saying: "The Islamic religion, which is based on the Quran and sunnah, cannot be limited to any society and ideological discourse. Islam is a universal religion."

    what??.. I really do  not understand those words in italics

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #28 - February 13, 2021, 10:56 AM

    of course, it is man.who makes god in his own image - whether venge-full or love-full or wonder-full.. man sure enjoys being full of things.

    meanwhile, french politicians compete to be the toughest on the arab religion.

    https://mobile.twitter.com/DanielZamoraV/status/1360203303557226500
  • France Muslims were in danger of forming separate "counter-society
     Reply #29 - February 21, 2021, 10:27 AM

    the sticking plaster was approved.

    Quote from:
    Lawmakers in the French parliament’s lower house on Tuesday overwhelmingly approved a bill that would strengthen oversight of mosques, schools and sports clubs to safeguard France from radical Islamists and to promote respect for French values - one of President Emmanuel Macron’s landmark projects.


    https://apnews.com/article/polygamy-radicalism-secularism-elections-france-cbee2c916aa8c35380562277f0025c2b
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