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Theme Changer

 Topic: antisemitism cause?

 (Read 2153 times)
  • 1« Previous thread | Next thread »
  • antisemitism cause?
     OP - November 25, 2017, 11:42 PM

    i ve always been curious what cause it? learnt today that the Jews in Germany during the early C20th where the most integrated Jews in known history to western German culture yet the holocaust still happened?

    Religious hated is a good reason but i know atheists and non-religious conspiracy theorists that hate them too? 

    the only explanation ive seen is jealousy of over all Jewish wealth and/or success ect

    the Jewish explanation is of course that it is the truth of Judaism that creates the hatred but that can apply to muslims and other religious groups to.

    thoughts? Huh?
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #1 - November 26, 2017, 06:12 AM

    i ve always been curious what cause it? learnt today that the Jews in Germany during the early C20th where the most integrated Jews in known history to western German culture yet the holocaust still happened?

    Religious hated is a good reason but i know atheists and non-religious conspiracy theorists that hate them too?  

    the only explanation ive seen is jealousy of over all Jewish wealth and/or success ect

    the Jewish explanation is of course that it is the truth of Judaism that creates the hatred but that can apply to muslims and other religious groups to.

    thoughts? Huh?

    Some Jews  also hate Juicily   Jews ............  





    by the way .,Christians and Muslims  they may shout that they are different from Jews BUT IN PRINCIPLE THEY ARE ALSO JEWISH SECTS

    and  Atheists  who hate faiths and faith heads are NOT Atheists,    A  real  Atheist  will not hate  faiths and faith heads............ S/he (the atheist) will pity the fools

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #2 - November 26, 2017, 06:50 AM

    Look up "the Jewish question" to get a better insight  into the way Jews were viewed at the time. See what Churchill had to say about Jews and integration; a lot of people claimed that Jews refused to integrate. There were conspiracy theories about how Jews held too much power and that there was an undercover Jewish plot to take over the world (featured in the Protocols of the Elders of Zion if you can stomach reading through a bunch of racist lies). Anti-Semites would claim that Jews were sly and dishonest because their religion taught them to be that way, conveniently forgetting that their own religion is just a tweaked copy of Judaism.

    Bottom line is that people have always found a way to blame the "other" for their society's woes. We see it now in almost every society; there is always a group that is hated above all other groups. There are times when other factors as economic hardship may lead to the hatred getting out of hand. This is what happened in Europe in the 20th century. Bear in mind that there were already pogroms against Jews before the Nazis came into power.
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #3 - November 27, 2017, 08:09 AM

    Hating Jews is a over a millenium old Catholic and then later also Orthodox and Protestant tradition.

    So it became ingrained into European cultures as a part of religious indoctrination and stayed there even as the religions lost control.

    It was how the secular post-revolution France handled the Dreyfus (Dreyfus was a French patriot who happened to be of Jewish heritage) affair that made Theodor Herzl, the guy considered the founder of Zionism, conclude that the Jews needed to have their own nation state to protect them.

    Also I think that how some Jewish groups/families have shown exceptional skills in banking, business and international organising - perhaps out of necessity because of their history of always risking to become the scapegoat - and also in modern times science, journalism and art has and is a source for jealousy over one's own lot in life.

    I can't imagine that if Northern Europe had stayed non-Christian that Jews would have been hated for a millenium here. Vikings would likely respect a skilled trader or craftsman (and of course plunder them if they didn't have the proper assurances set up, but that would not be because of anti-semitism...)

    So my personal conclusion is that it is primarily because of more than thousand years of religious intolerance which was easy to exploit politically.

    There used to be other groups to lash out against, but they weren't as useful as a scapegoat for a religious empire because they were local and eventually got christianised as Catholics (Vends, Prussians, Slavs, Cathars and likely many others).

    An interesting anecdote given the above is that we still use "kætter" as an everyday Danish word, meaning "unbeliever" or "blasphemer" here 800 years after the Cathars and their Catholic allies who stood by them were all drowned in their own blood in the Albigensian Crusade launched by the Catholic Church in the south of France. And the Cathars never had a presence in Denmark. But we still use that word daily. Because it entered our culture though religious indoctrination.

    Another anecdote I've come across (can't remember the source) was something about how wealthy Jewish businessmen around 1900 withdraw some funding for public accessible hospitals for the poor in London and instead funded Jewish hospitals set up to help Jews fleeing pogroms in Russia. I guess that didn't help their reputation, but that reputation was only there to be exploited because of the hundreds of years of religious indoctrination.

    My 2 øre.

    Danish Never-Moose adopted by the kind people on the CEMB-forum
    Ex-Muslim chat (Unaffliated with CEMB). Safari users: Use "#ex-muslims" as the channel name. CEMB chat thread.
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #4 - November 29, 2017, 07:26 PM

    http://www.aish.com/sem/wtj/?mobile=yes

    This Jewish website seams to think that the truth of Judaism is the cause of the hatred....but i belive it does not go into nuances of some of the ideas it critisies
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #5 - December 20, 2017, 07:33 AM

    The idea of jews controlling the banks (I'm mentioning this because jews and banks seems to always be the central theme) came from the idea that interest was a sin, so put the jews in banks, as they don't have souls, and even if they do, they have jewish souls, so who cares.

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #6 - December 28, 2017, 10:51 PM

    Well, as Nikolaj said antisemitism has anchored in Christianity like it is in Islam.

    It was Judas and the Jews who betrayed Jesus.

    Also in the past it was forbidden for Jews to work with skilled trades, such as, shoemaker, carpenter and so on. However, they were allowed to take interest, which was forbidden for Christians. So Christians were borrowing money from them. And since they took interest and worked with money they soon got the label of greedy Jews.

    Actually Martin Luther the founder of the evangelical faith could be consider an antisemit these days.
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #7 - December 30, 2017, 02:53 PM

    ^ Cheesy

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #8 - January 01, 2018, 03:07 PM

    Why Quoad did I write something wrong ?
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #9 - January 01, 2018, 03:12 PM

    Anti-Semitism definitely has it's origins in religion - both Christianity & Islam. Things like wealth, influence, politics are just elements that have been used to confirm/rationalise this phenomenon. Even those who are not religious can be subject to this deep rooted mentality that has existed for two millennia.

    Hell is an absurd & wicked fiction. You're not a bad person for rejecting something that's cruel, irrational, unjust & lacks evidence. You have nothing to fear. Nothing to feel ashamed about. Enjoy your life. Do the best you can. Make yourself & others happy.
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #10 - January 02, 2018, 01:50 PM

    Quote
    Well, as Nikolaj said antisemitism has anchored in Christianity like it is in Islam.

    It was Judas and the Jews who betrayed Jesus.

    Quote
    Also in the past it was forbidden for Jews to work with skilled trades, such as, shoemaker, carpenter and so on. However, they were allowed to take interest, which was forbidden for Christians. So Christians were borrowing money from them. And since they took interest and worked with money they soon got the label of greedy Jews.


    Actually Martin Luther the founder of the evangelical faith could be consider an antisemit these days.

    ^ Cheesy


    Why Quoad did I write something wrong ?



    hi ElToro  ...I would appreciate some references  of  old  literature  on those words of yours ...  also your comments on  these wiki links


    Antisemitic canards

    Antisemitic publications

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #11 - February 06, 2018, 03:08 PM

    Why Quoad did I write something wrong ?

     Let's start with Judas. Can we agree he's a mythic figure?

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #12 - February 10, 2018, 08:50 AM

    Yes, for sure. I think that Jesus is a mythic figure as well.
    However, that does my statement invalid, because Christians believe in Jesus and Judas.
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #13 - February 10, 2018, 03:16 PM

    Yes, for sure. I think that Jesus is a mythic figure as well.
    However, that does my statement invalid, because Christians believe in Jesus and Judas.


    no.....nooo........noooooooo.,    that  belief of  Christians does NOT make your statement invalid.,  but what it makes is faith heads believe lots of silly stories and it goes to all faiths...  

    Anyways on the same  note  I can easily say Moses of Exodus  and Muhammad of  Quran also  mythic figures.......
    Quote
    “Moses himself has about as much historic reality as King Arthur,”......  

    and that that the exodus was “at best a refracted folk memory of earlier expulsions of Levantine people” following the reconquest of the Nile delta by the Egyptian king Ahmose around 1530BC. This date is about 900 years earlier than the period in which the Hebrew Bible is supposed to have been codified and written down, including its first five books that were supposedly written by Moses himself.

    " There is no archaeological evidence for the biblical story, and certainly no extra-biblical evidence, in Egyptian inscriptions. Not even the Bible account claims that the Israelites were employed as slaves to build the pyramids as they are in Hollywood. They are simply slaves."



    i didn't say that but as a kid i used to run around graves and dargahs and believe tons  of nonsense...

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #14 - February 20, 2018, 09:23 AM

    Long story.  First off, Jews were the only ones in Catholic controlled europe who were allowed to be non-catholic.  They lived in segregated communities and had their own culture and were secretive about it.

    Second-  The Catholic church forbade charging interest on loans for catholics.  So the only ones who could be bankers were jews.   Naturally, being surrounded by people who hated and feared them, they would rip off catholics.  And despite being isolated minorities, some were much more wealthy then your avergae catholic.

    After the Protestant reformation, German bankers started competing with them, and spread anti-jewish propaganda. 

    All these factors made them easy targets for old tie versions of conspiracy theorists.  You want to make a new movement, like the enlightnement look bad, say it was a jewish plot.

    Finally, a particular Jewish family, the Rothschilds, who grew very influential and powerful, were legitimately pretty shady.  The Nazis used them as the model for what all jews were like.


    Also generally, jews were highly educated and successful in business, and people tend to hate when minorities in their own countries do better then them.
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #15 - February 20, 2018, 09:29 AM

    My theory on wh jews had better education.business success.  Two things.

    1.  Circumcision.  Back in the day this would have been a form of natural selection, as only babies with strong immune systems would survive the process without dying of infection.

    2.  Kosher laws.  Basically old hygiene laws.  Though silly today, at the time before anyone knew anything about germs, it would have prevented people from getting sick.

    Combine 1 and 2 above, and people live longer,m which means more accumulated wisdom is passed down.

    3.  The torah.  Literacy was taught at an early societal stage, increasing edcuation levels.

    4.  Strict cultural rules, preserving a distinct cultural identity which allowed jews to idenitfy each other and in the context of a larger non-jewish society, establish business contacts out of neccesity, which combined with education and banking, creating networks of skilled middle class before such a thing exited in europe.

  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #16 - February 20, 2018, 01:58 PM

    “Whenever a Jew is killed, it is for the benefit of Islam.”....  
    by   Ahmad al-Fārūqī al-Sirhindī (1564–1624)   Naqshbandī Sufi order  .


     


    Wherever and whenever  there was a antisemitism  on  this earth,  
    there was a viral strain of Islam behind it..

       .... yeezevee 2018...

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #17 - February 23, 2018, 01:25 PM

    Coming from an arab country hatred of Jews is embedded into the Arab and Muslim mind by the hateful ideology of Islam. I find all the myths of Jews being evil and prophet and child killers and rulers of the world infact fit with the Muslims more then anyone else. You can't even insult Muslims on the media yet Israel and Jews are constantly on the front page that's something to think about. Also another fact why no US president while he was actually president never defied Saudi in any way.
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #18 - February 23, 2018, 01:34 PM

    the term antisemitism itself refers to critics based on ideology but surely it comes out of the hatred that comes out of bible and quran but the strange thing i see is that once you be critical about islam it wont be refered as anti-islamism it becomes islamophobia and anti-muslim i think if some one come up with the same argument he or she should be dealing with the analogy of islamophobia and homophobia so that the islamophobia term can actually be discussed with honesty but as long as antisemitism is concerned its a broad context and could be argued with jews and they wont back off on this rather i think they will come up with constructive argument and debate the causes ofcourse in my eyes in muslim world comes out of quran and in western world because of their financial position and control over american politics and wall street
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #19 - February 23, 2018, 01:37 PM

    I'm against the term anti Semite since I myself am a Semite I personally use the term anti Jewish or anti Jewist to refer to people who have anti Jewish ideas or feelings.
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #20 - May 25, 2018, 12:16 AM

    Why not anti-judaism?

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #21 - May 25, 2018, 02:52 PM

    Anti-Semitism definitely has it's origins in religion - both Christianity & Islam. Things like wealth, influence, politics are just elements that have been used to confirm/rationalise this phenomenon. Even those who are not religious can be subject to this deep rooted mentality that has existed for two millennia.


    Well, antisemitism has its roots in very Judaism as well. I don't want to justify any kind of hatred, but Judaism is not free of faults Christianity and Islam have. Just in contrary, Judaistic religious tradition has actually invented the tribalistic religious fervor which later religions adopted and applied to global level.

    The very concept of intracommunal morality (where it is unlawful to harm members of your sect, but perfectly fine to exploit "infidels", i. e. others) was actually formulated by Jewish religious law. Christianity & Islam (especially the latter one) just entitled the Goyim (non-Jews) to act in same way Jews treated them by assuring them that they are the legitimate successors of Jewish religious tradition (through Jesus and Muhammed, legitimacy of Abraham's and Moses' religion passed to peoples of the World). So they could molest the others and, from time to time, the very followers of the original Religion of the Book (i. e. Jews), which they regarded as obsolete and trivial since new "revelations" came and those bastards didn't accept them  Cheesy.

    Jewish successfulnes in financial, social and cultural fields can be attributed to their very dedicated intracommunal solidarity, which flourished especially under persecution. These are also sources of the envy many felt and still feel against them. Those are foolish assumption of the populistic antisemitism: that it is immoral to be successful more than others, by condition that you are a Jew.

    However, Jewish closedness and dedication to their own communal cause, and sometimes very brutal carelessnes for the others has its very religious roots. That's the actual concept of Judaism.
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #22 - May 25, 2018, 02:54 PM

    “Whenever a Jew is killed, it is for the benefit of Islam.”....  
    by   Ahmad al-Fārūqī al-Sirhindī (1564–1624)   Naqshbandī Sufi order  .


     


    Wherever and whenever  there was a antisemitism  on  this earth,  
    there was a viral strain of Islam behind it..

       .... yeezevee 2018...



    Sorry, this is bullsh*t. European (and Christian) antisemitism even predates Islam chronologically. And many Muslims actually helped Jews (and others persecuted them), just like followers of other religions did.
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #23 - May 26, 2018, 05:49 PM

    Sorry,  this is bullsh*t. European (and Christian) antisemitism even predates Islam chronologically. And many Muslims actually helped Jews (and others persecuted them), just like followers of other religions did.


    Hello Al.. hello Razi...  you got a point there and YOU DON'T NEED TO BE SORRY for what you said dear Al-Razi26..   but first greetings & my good wishes to you ..  So in that post by me   ..there is indeed some bullshit .. but I write so much.. so much nonsense there bound have some bullshit  because it hard to explain everything in one post

    so  let us discuss and learn about  Antisemitism and its origins.  
    And  and you are right .,  Antisemitism predates  Islam  and   some Muslim  folks did indeed help persecuted Jewish folks in troubled times..THERE IS NO DOUBT ABOUT THAT.. So now  would you agree with this little article on the origins of Antisemitism ??

    Yes rascal wrote nonsense there   .. thank you  for pointing that out and please help me to   clean  that up dear Al-Razi26..

    So in that post  I guess you will not question this  
    Quote
    “Whenever a Jew is killed, it is for the benefit of Islam.”....  
    by   Ahmad al-Fārūqī al-Sirhindī (1564–1624)   Naqshbandī Sufi order  


    and you will not question these pictures
    Quote


     but you question this
    Quote
    Wherever and whenever  there was a antisemitism  on  this earth,  
    there was a viral strain of Islam behind it..

     


    right?? Now if  I change that to this

    Quote
    "Wherever and whenever  there was a antisemitism  on  this earth   AFTER PROPHET MUHAMMAD MIGRATED TO YATHRIB IN THE YEAR  622 WHICH THE YEAR OF BEGINNING OF VIRAL STRAIN OF ISLAM  AND THAT  strain of Islam is  behind this modern antisemitism .."  


    would that make any sense dear dear Al-Razi26??  and would you like to  help  me more  to modify that ??

    with best wishes
    yeezevee

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #24 - June 02, 2018, 09:19 AM


    The Devil and the Jews  by  Joshua  Trachtenberg  


    Quote
    [2.40] O children of Israel! call to mind My favor which I bestowed on you and be faithful to (your) covenant with Me, I will fulfill (My) covenant with you; and of Me, Me alone, should you be afraid.

    [2.62] Surely those who believe, and those who are Jews, and the Christians, and the Sabians, whoever believes in Allah and the Last day and does good, they shall have their reward from their Lord, and there is no fear for them, nor shall they grieve.

    [2.83] And when We made a covenant with the children of Israel: You shall not serve any but Allah and (you shall do) good to (your) parents, and to the near of kin and to the orphans and the needy, and you shall speak to men good words and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate. Then you turned back except a few of you and (now too) you turn aside.

    [2.88] And they say: Our hearts are covered. Nay, Allah has cursed them on account of their unbelief; so little it is that they believe.

    [2.98] Whoever is the enemy of Allah and His angels and His apostles and Jibreel and Meekaeel, so surely Allah is the enemy of the unbelievers. /font]

    [2.111] And they say: None shall enter the garden (or paradise) except he who is a Jew or a Christian . These are their vain desires. Say: Bring your proof if you are truthful.

    [2.113] And the Jews say: The Christians do not follow anything (good) and the Christians say: The Jews do not follow anything (good) while they recite the (same) Book . Even thus say those who have no knowledge, like to what they say; so Allah shall judge between them on the day of resurrection in what they differ.

    [2.120] And the Jews will not be pleased with you, nor the Christians until you follow their religion . Say: Surely Allah's guidance, that is the (true) guidance. And if you follow their desires after the knowledge that has come to you, you shall have no guardian from Allah, nor any helper.

    [2.135] And they say: Be Jews or Christians, you will be on the right course. Say: Nay! (we follow) the religion of Ibrahim, the Hanif, and he was not one of the polytheists.

    [2.140] Nay! do you say that Ibrahim and Ismail and Yaqoub and the tribes were Jews or Christians? Say: Are you better knowing or Allah? And who is more unjust than he who conceals a testimony that he has from Allah? And Allah is not at all heedless of what you do.

    [2.211] Ask the Israelites how many a clear sign have We given them; and whoever changes the favor of Allah after it has come to him, then surely Allah is severe in requiting (evil).

    [2.246] Have you not considered the chiefs of the children of Israel after Musa, when they said to a prophet of theirs: Raise up for us a king, (that) we may fight in the way of Allah. He said: May it not be that you would not fight if fighting is ordained for you? They said: A nd what reason have we that we should not fight in the way of Allah, and we have indeed been compelled to abandon our homes and our children. But when fighting was ordained for them, they turned back, except a few of them, and Allah knows the unjust.

     
    [3.23] Have you not considered those (Jews) who are given a portion of the Book? They are invited to the Book of Allah that it might decide between them, then a part of them turn back and they withdraw.

    [3.24] This is because they say: The fire shall not touch us but for a few days; and what they have forged deceives them in the matter of their religion.


    [3.67] Ibrahim was not a Jew nor a Christian but he was (an) upright (man), a Muslim,. and he was not one of the polytheists
     
    [4.46] Of those who are Jews (there are those who) alter words from their places and say: We have heard and we disobey and: Hear, may you not be made to hear! and: Raina, distorting (the word) with their tongues and taunting about religion; and if they had said (instead): We have heard and we obey, and hearken, and unzurna it would have been better for them and more upright; but Allah has cursed them on account of their unbelief, so they do not believe but a little.

    [4.47] O you who have been given the Book! believe that which We have revealed, verifying what you have, before We alter faces then turn them on their backs, or curse them as We cursed the violaters of the Sabbath, and the command of Allah shall be executed.

    [4.50] See how they forge the lie against Allah, and this is sufficient as a manifest sin.

    [4.160] Wherefore for the iniquity of those who are Jews did We disallow to them the good things which had been made lawful for them and for their hindering many (people) from Allah's way.

    [4.161] And their taking usury though indeed they were forbidden it and their devouring the property of people falsely, and We have prepared for the unbelievers from among them a painful chastisement.

     
    [5.12] And certainly Allah made a covenant with the children of Israel, and We raised up among them twelve chieftains; and Allah said: Surely I am with you; if you keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate and believe in My apostles and assist them and offer to Allah a goodly gift, I will most certainly cover your evil deeds, and I will most certainly cause you to enter into gardens beneath which rivers flow, but whoever disbelieves from among you after that, he indeed shall lose the right way.

    [5.13] But on account of their breaking their covenant We cursed them and made their hearts hard; they altered the words from their places and they neglected a portion of what they were reminded of; and you shall always discover treachery in them excepting a few of them; so pardon them and turn away; surely Allah loves those who do good (to others).

    [5.18] And the Jews and the Christians say: We are the sons of Allah and His beloved ones. Say: Why does He then chastise you for your faults? Nay, you are mortals from among those whom He has created, He forgives whom He pleases and chastises whom He pleases; and Allah's is the kingdom of the heavens and the earth and what is between them, and to Him is the eventual coming.

    [5.32] For this reason did We prescribe to the children of Israel that whoever slays a soul, unless it be for manslaughter or for mischief in the land, it is as though he slew all men; and whoever keeps it alive, it is as though he kept alive all men; and certainly Our apostles came to them with clear arguments, but even after that many of them certainly act extravagantly in the land.

    [5.33] The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His apostle and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement,

    [5.41] O Apostle! let not those grieve you who strive together in hastening to unbelief from among those who say with their mouths: We believe, and their hearts do not believe, and from among those who are Jews; they are listeners for the sake of a lie, listeners for another people who have not come to you; they alter the words from their places, saying: If you are given this, take it, and if you are not given this, be cautious; and as for him whose temptation Allah desires, you cannot control anything for him with Allah. Those are they for whom Allah does not desire that He should purify their hearts; they shall have disgrace in this world, and they shall have a grievous chastisement in the hereafter.

    [5.42] (They are) listeners of a lie, devourers of what is forbidden; therefore if they come to you, judge between them or turn aside from them, and if you turn aside from them, they shall not harm you in any way; and if you judge, judge between them with equity; surely Allah loves those who judge equitably.

    [5.43] And how do they make you a judge and they have the Taurat wherein is Allah's judgment? Yet they turn back after that, and these are not the believers.

    [5.44] Surely We revealed the Taurat in which was guidance and light; with it the prophets who submitted themselves (to Allah) judged (matters) for those who were Jews, and the masters of Divine knowledge and the doctors, because they were required to guard (part) of the Book of Allah, and they were witnesses thereof; therefore fear not the people and fear Me, and do not take a small price for My communications; and whoever did not judge by what Allah revealed, those are they that are the unbelievers.

    [5.51] O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people.

    [5:57] O you who believe! do not take for guardians those who take your religion for a mockery and a joke, from among those who were given the Book before you and the unbelievers; and be careful of (your duty to) Allah if you are believers.

    [5.59] Say: O followers of the Book! do you find fault with us (for aught) except that we believe in Allah and in what has been revealed to us and what was revealed before, and that most of you are transgressors?

    [5.60] Say: Shall I inform you of (him who is) worse than this in retribution from Allah? (Worse is he) whom Allah has cursed and brought His wrath upon, and of whom He made apes and swine, and he who served the Shaitan; these are worse in place and more erring from the straight path.

    [5.63] Why do not the learned men [rabbis] and the doctors of law prohibit them from their speaking of what is sinful and their eating of what is unlawfully acquired? Certainly evil is that which they work.

    [5.64] And the Jews say: The hand of Allah is tied up! Their hands shall be shackled and they shall be cursed for what they say. Nay, both His hands are spread out, He expends as He pleases; and what has been revealed to you from your Lord will certainly make many of them increase in inordinacy and unbelief; and We have put enmity and hatred among them till the day of resurrection; whenever they kindle a fire for war Allah puts it out, and they strive to make mischief in the land; and Allah does not love the mischief-makers.

    [5.69] Surely those who believe and those who are Jews and the Sabians and the Christians whoever believes in Allah and the last day and does good-- they shall have no fear nor shall they grieve.

    [5.70] Certainly We made a covenant with the children of Israel and We sent to them apostles; whenever there came to them an apostle with what that their souls did not desire, some (of them) did they call liars and some they slew.

    [5.72] Certainly they disbelieve who say: Surely Allah, He is the Messiah, son of Marium; and the Messiah said: O Children of Israel! serve Allah, my Lord and your Lord. Surely whoever associates (others) with Allah, then Allah has forbidden to him the garden, and his abode is the fire; and there shall be no helpers for the unjust.

    [5.73] Certainly they disbelieve who say: Surely Allah is the third (person) of the three; and there is no god but the one God, and if they desist not from what they say, a painful chastisement shall befall those among them who disbelieve.

    [5.78] Those who disbelieved from among the children of Israel were cursed by the tongue of Dawood and Isa, son of Marium; this was because they disobeyed and used to exceed the limit.

    [5.79] They used not to forbid each other the hateful things (which) they did; certainly evil was that which they did.

    [5.80] You will see many of them befriending those who disbelieve; certainly evil is that which their souls have sent before for them, that Allah became displeased with them and in chastisement shall they abide.

    [5.81] And had they believed in Allah and the prophet and what was revealed to him, they would not have taken them for friends but! most of them are transgressors.

    [5.82] Certainly you will find the most violent of people in enmity for those who believe (to be) the Jews and those who are polytheists, and you will certainly find the nearest in friendship to those who believe (to be) those who say: We are Christians; this is because there are priests and monks among them and because they do not behave proudly.

    [5.86] And (as for) those who disbelieve and reject Our communications, these are the companions of the flame.

    [5.110] When Allah will say: O Isa son of Marium! Remember My favor on you and on your mother, when I strengthened you I with the holy Spirit, you spoke to the people in the cradle and I when of old age, and when I taught you the Book and the wisdom and the Taurat and the Injeel; and when you determined out of clay a thing like the form of a bird by My permission, then you breathed into it and it became a bird by My permission, and you healed the blind and the leprous by My permission; and when you brought forth the dead by My permission; and when I withheld the children of Israel from you when you came to them with clear arguments, but those who disbelieved among them said: This is nothing but clear enchantment.

     
    [6.146] And to those who were Jews We made unlawful every animal having claws, and of oxen and sheep We made unlawful to them the fat of both, except such as was on their backs or the entrails or what was mixed with bones: this was a punishment We gave them on account of their rebellion, and We are surely Truthful.

     
    [7.105] (I am) worthy of not saying anything about Allah except the truth: I have come to you indeed with clear proof from your Lord, therefore send with me the children of Israel.

    [7.134] And when the plague fell upon them, they said: O Musa! pray for us to your Lord as He has promised with you, if you remove the plague from us, we will certainly believe in you and we will certainly send away with you the children of Israel.

    [7.137] And We made the people who were deemed weak to inherit the eastern lands and the western ones which We had blessed; and the good word of your Lord was fulfilled in the children of Israel because they bore up (sufferings) patiently; and We utterly destroyed what Firon and his people had wrought and what they built.

    [7.138] And We made the children of Israel to pass the sea; then they came upon a people who kept to the worship of their idols. They said: O Musa! make for us a god as they have (their) gods. He said: Surely you are a people acting ignorantly:

     
    [9.30] And the Jews say: Uzair is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!

    [9:34] O you who believe! most surely many of the doctors of law [rabbis] and the monks eat away the property of men falsely, and turn (them) from Allah's way; and (as for) those who hoard up gold and silver and do not spend it in Allah's way, announce to them a painful chastisement....

     
    [10.90] And We made the children of Israel to pass through the sea, then Firon and his hosts followed them for oppression and tyranny; until when drowning overtook him, he said: I believe that there is no god but He in Whom the children of Israel believe and I am of those who submit.

    [10.93] And certainly We lodged the children of Israel in a goodly abode and We provided them with good things; but they did not disagree until the knowledge had come to them; surely your Lord will judge between them on the resurrection day concerning that in which they disagreed.

     
    [16.118] And for those who were Jews We prohibited what We have related to you already, and We did them no injustice, but they were unjust to themselves.

     
    [17.2] And We gave Musa the Book and made it a guidance to the children of Israel, saying: Do not take a protector besides Me;

    [17.4] And We had made known to the children of Israel in the Book: Most certainly you will make mischief in the land twice, and most certainly you will behave insolently with great insolence.

    [17.101] And certainly We gave Musa nine clear signs; so ask the children of Israel. When he came to them, Firon said to him: Most surely I deem you, O Musa, to be a man deprived of reason.

    [17.104] And We said to the Israelites after him: Dwell in the land: and when the promise of the next life shall come to pass, we will bring you both together in judgment.

     
    [19.58] These are they on whom Allah bestowed favors, from among the prophets of the seed of Adam, and of those whom We carried with Nuh, and of the seed of Ibrahim and Israel, and of those whom We guided and chose; when the communications of the Beneficent God were recited to them, they fell down making obeisance and weeping.

     
    [20.47] So go you both to him and say: Surely we are two apostles of your Lord; therefore send the children of Israel with us and do not torment them! Indeed we have brought to you a communication from your Lord, and peace is on him who follows the guidance;

    [20.48] Surely it has been revealed to us that the chastisement will surely come upon him who rejects and turns back.

    [20.80] O children of Israel! indeed We delivered you from your enemy, and We made a covenant with you on the blessed side of the mountain, and We sent to you the manna and the quails.

    [20.94] He said: O son of my mother! seize me not by my beard nor by my head; surely I was afraid lest you should say: You have caused a division among the children of Israel and not waited for my word.

    The Pilgrimage
    [22.17] Surely those who believe and those who are Jews and the Sabeans and the Christians and the Magians and those who associate (others with Allah)-- surely Allah will decide between them on the day of resurrection; surely Allah is a witness over all things.

    [22.40] Those who have been expelled from their homes without a just cause except that they say: Our Lord is Allah. And had there not been Allah's repelling some people by others, certainly there would have been pulled down cloisters and churches and synagogues and mosques in which Allah's name is much remembered; and surely Allah will help him who helps His cause; most surely Allah is Strong, Mighty.

     
    [26.17] Then send with us the children of Israel.

    [26.22] And is it a favor of which you remind me that you have enslaved the children of Israel?

    [26.59] Even so. And We gave them as a heritage to the children of Israel.

    [26.197] Is it not a sign to them that the learned men of the Israelites know it?

     
    [27.76] Surely this Quran declares to the children of Israel most of what they differ in.

     
    [32.23] And certainly We gave the Book to Musa, so be not in doubt concerning the receiving of it, and We made it a guide for the children of Israel.

     
    [40.53] And certainly We gave Musa the guidance, and We made the children of Israel inherit the Book,

     
    [43.59] He was naught but a servant on whom We bestowed favor, and We made him an example for the children of Israel.

     
    [44.30] And certainly We delivered the children of Israel from the abasing chastisement,

     
    [45.16] And certainly We gave the Book and the wisdom and the prophecy to the children of Israel, and We gave them of the goodly things, and We made them excel the nations.

     
    [46.10] Say: Have you considered if it is from Allah, and you disbelieve in it, and a witness from among the children of Israel has borne witness of one like it, so he believed, while you are big with pride; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people.

     
    [59.2] He it is Who caused those who disbelieved of the followers of the Book to go forth from their homes at the first banishment you did not think that they would go forth, while they were certain that their fortresses would defend them against Allah; but Allah came to them whence they did not expect, and cast terror into their hearts; they demolished their houses with their own hands and the hands of the believers; therefore take a lesson, O you who have eyes!

    [59.3] And had it not been that Allah had decreed for them the exile, He would certainly have punished them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have chastisement of the fire.

     
    [61.6] And when Isa son of Marium said: O children of Israel! surely I am the apostle of Allah to you, verifying that which is before me of the Taurat and giving the good news of an Apostle who will come after me, his name being Ahmad, but when he came to them with clear arguments they said: This is clear magic.

    [61.7] And who is more unjust than he who forges a lie against Allah and he is invited to Islam, and Allah does not guide the unjust people.

    [61.14] O you who believe! be helpers (in the cause) of Allah, as~ Isa son of Marium said to (his) disciples: Who are my helpers in the cause of Allah? The disciples said: We are helpers (in the cause) of Allah. So a party of the children of Israel believed and another party disbelieved; then We aided those who believed against their enemy, and they became uppermost.


    [62.6] Say: O you who are Jews, if you think that you are the favorites of Allah to the exclusion of other people, then invoke death If you are truthful.

    get rid of them... you preach hate against people you breed hate  for them

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • antisemitism cause?
     Reply #25 - June 02, 2018, 10:13 AM

    Luther's work entitled "The Jews & their Lies":
    Quote
    I had made up my mind to write no more either about the Jews or against them. But since I learned that these miserable and accursed people do not cease to lure to themselves even us, that is, the Christians, I have published this little book, so that I might be found among those who opposed such poisonous activities of the Jews who warned the Christians to be on their guard against them. I would not have believed that a Christian could be duped by the Jews into taking their exile and wretchedness upon himself. However, the devil is the god of the world, and wherever God's word is absent he has an easy task, not only with the weak but also with the strong. May God help us. Amen.

    * * *
    He did not call them Abraham's children, but a "brood of vipers" [Matt. 3:7]. Oh, that was too insulting for the noble blood and race of Israel, and they declared, "He has a demon' [Matt 11:18]. Our Lord also calls them a "brood of vipers"; furthermore in John 8 [:39,44] he states: "If you were Abraham's children ye would do what Abraham did.... You are of your father the devil. It was intolerable to them to hear that they were not Abraham's but the devil's children, nor can they bear to hear this today.

    * * *
    Therefore the blind Jews are truly stupid fools...

    * * *
    Now just behold these miserable, blind, and senseless people ... their blindness and arrogance are as solid as an iron mountain.

    * * *
    Learn from this, dear Christian, what you are doing if you permit the blind Jews to mislead you. Then the saying will truly apply, "When a blind man leads a blind man, both will fall into the pit" [cf. Luke 6:39]. You cannot learn anything from them except how to misunderstand the divine commandments...

    * * *
    Therefore be on your guard against the Jews, knowing that wherever they have their synagogues, nothing is found but a den of devils in which sheer self­glory, conceit, lies, blasphemy, and defaming of God and men are practiced most maliciously and veheming his eyes on them.

    * * *
    Moreover, they are nothing but thieves and robbers who daily eat no morsel and wear no thread of clothing which they have not stolen and pilfered from us by means of their accursed usury. Thus they live from day to day, together with wife and child, by theft and robbery, as arch­thieves and robbers, in the most impenitent security.

    * * *
    However, they have not acquired a perfect mastery of the art of lying; they lie so clumsily and ineptly that anyone who is just a little observant can easily detect it. But for us Christians they stand as a terrifying example of God's wrath.

    * * *
    If I had to refute all the other articles of the Jewish faith, I should be obliged to write against them as much and for as long a time as they have used for inventing their lies­­ that is, longer than two thousand years.

    * * *
    ...Christ and his word can hardly be recognized because of the great vermin of human ordinances. However, let this suffice for the time being on their lies against doctrine or faith.

    * * *
    Did I not tell you earlier that a Jew is such a noble, precious jewel that God and all the angels dance when he farts?

    * * *
    Alas, it cannot be anything but the terrible wrath of God which permits anyone to sink into such abysmal, devilish, hellish, insane baseness, envy, and arrogance. If I were to avenge myself on the devil himself I should be unable to wish him such evil and misfortune as God's wrath inflicts on the Jews, compelling them to lie and to blaspheme so monstrously, in violation of their own conscience. Anyway, they have their reward for constantly giving God the lie.

    * * *
    No, one should toss out these lazy rogues by the seat of their pants.

    * * *
    ...but then eject them forever from this country. For, as we have heard, God's anger with them is so intense that gentle mercy will only tend to make them worse and worse, while sharp mercy will reform them but little. Therefore, in any case, away with them!

    * * *
    Over and above that we let them get rich on our sweat and blood, while we remain poor and they such the marrow from our bones.

    * * *
    I brief, dear princes and lords, those of you who have Jews under your rule­­ if my counsel does not please your, find better advice, so that you and we all can be rid of the unbearable, devilish burden of the Jews, lest we become guilty sharers before God in the lies, blasphemy, the defamation, and the curses which the mad Jews indulge in so freely and wantonly against the person of our Lord Jesus Christ, this dear mother, all Christians, all authority, and ourselves. Do not grant them protection, safe­conduct, or communion with us.... .With this faithful counsel and warning I wish to cleanse and exonerate my conscience.

    * * *
    Let the government deal with them in this respect, as I have suggested. But whether the government acts or not, let everyone at least be guided by his own conscience and form for himself a definition or image of a Jew.

    * * *
    However, we must avoid confirming them in their wanton lying, slandering, cursing, and defaming. Nor dare we make ourselves partners in their devilish ranting and raving by shielding and protecting them, by giving them food, drink, and shelter, or by other neighborly

    * * *
    Therefore we Christians, in turn, are obliged not to tolerate their wanton and conscious blasphemy.

    * * *
    Accordingly, it must and dare not be considered a trifling matter but a most serious one to seek counsel against this and to save our souls from the Jews, that is, from the devil and from eternal death.

    * * *
    What shall we Christians do with this rejected and condemned people, the Jews? Since they live among us, we dare not tolerate their conduct, now that we are aware of their lying and reviling and blaspheming. If we do, we become sharers in their lies, cursing and blasphemy. Thus we cannot extinguish the unquenchable fire of divine wrath, of which the prophets speak, nor can we convert the Jews. With prayer and the fear of God we must practice a sharp mercy to see whether we might save at least a few from the glowing flames. We dare not avenge ourselves. Vengeance a thousand times worse than we could wish them already has them by the throat. I shall give you my sincere advice:

    First to set fire to their synagogues or schools and to bury and cover with dirt whatever will not burn, so that no man will ever again see a stone or cinder of them. This is to be done in honor of our Lord and of Christendom, so that God might see that we are Christians, and do not condone or knowingly tolerate such public lying, cursing, and blaspheming of his Son and of his Christians. For whatever we tolerated in the past unknowingly ­ and I myself was unaware of it ­ will be pardoned by God. But if we, now that we are informed, were to protect and shield such a house for the Jews, existing right before our very nose, in which they lie about, blaspheme, curse, vilify, and defame Christ and us (as was heard above), it would be the same as if we were doing all this and even worse ourselves, as we very well know.

    Second, I advise that their houses also be razed and destroyed. For they pursue in them the same aims as in their synagogues. Instead they might be lodged under a roof or in a barn, like the gypsies. This will bring home to them that they are not masters in our country, as they boast, but that they are living in exile and in captivity, as they incessantly wail and lament about us before God.

    Third, I advise that all their prayer books and Talmudic writings, in which such idolatry, lies, cursing and blasphemy are taught, be taken from them. (remainder omitted)

    Fourth, I advise that their rabbis be forbidden to teach henceforth on pain of loss of life and limb. For they have justly forfeited the right to such an office by holding the poor Jews captive with the saying of Moses (Deuteronomy 17 [:10 ff.]) in which he commands them to obey their teachers on penalty of death, although Moses clearly adds: "what they teach you in accord with the law of the Lord." Those villains ignore that. They wantonly employ the poor people's obedience contrary to the law of the Lord and infuse them with this poison, cursing, and blasphemy. In the same way the pope also held us captive with the declaration in Matthew 16 {:18], "You are Peter," etc, inducing us to believe all the lies and deceptions that issued from his devilish mind. He did not teach in accord with the word of God, and therefore he forfeited the right to teach.

    Fifth, I advise that safe­conduct on the highways be abolished completely for the Jews. For they have no business in the countryside, since they are not lords, officials, tradesmen, or the like. Let they stay at home. (...remainder omitted).

    Sixth, I advise that usury be prohibited to them, and that all cash and treasure of silver and gold be taken from them and put aside for safekeeping. The reason for such a measure is that, as said above, they have no other means of earning a livelihood than usury, and by it they have stolen and robbed from us all they possess. Such money should now be used in no other way than the following: Whenever a Jew is sincerely converted, he should be handed one hundred, two hundred, or three hundred florins, as personal circumstances may suggest. With this he could set himself up in some occupation for the support of his poor wife and children, and the maintenance of the old or feeble. For such evil gains are cursed if they are not put to use with God's blessing in a good and worthy cause.

    Seventh, I commend putting a flail, an ax, a hoe, a spade, a distaff, or a spindle into the hands of young, strong Jews and Jewesses and letting them earn their bread in the sweat of their brow, as was imposed on the children of Adam (Gen 3[:19]}. For it is not fitting that they should let us accursed Goyim toil in the sweat of our faces while they, the holy people, idle away their time behind the stove, feasting and farting, and on top of all, boasting blasphemously of their lordship over the Christians by means of our sweat. No, one should toss out these lazy rogues by the seat of their pants.

    * * *
    But what will happen even if we do burn down the Jews' synagogues and forbid them publicly to praise God, to pray, to teach, to utter God's name? They will still keep doing it in secret. If we know that they are doing this in secret, it is the same as if they were doing it publicly. for our knowledge of their secret doings and our toleration of them implies that they are not secret after all and thus our conscience is encumbered with it before God.

    * * *
    Accordingly, it must and dare not be considered a trifling matter but a most serious one to seek counsel against this and to save our souls from the Jews, that is, from the devil and from eternal death. My advice, as I said earlier, is:

    First, that their synagogues be burned down, and that all who are able toss in sulphur and pitch; it would be good if someone could also throw in some hellfire. That would demonstrate to God our serious resolve and be evidence to all the world that it was in ignorance that we tolerated such houses, in which the Jews have reviled God, our dear Creator and Father, and his Son most shamefully up till now but that we have now given them their due reward.

    * * *
    I wish and I ask that our rulers who have Jewish subjects exercise a sharp mercy toward these wretched people, as suggested above, to see whether this might not help (though it is doubtful). They must act like a good physician who, when gangrene has set in, proceeds without mercy to cut, saw, and burn flesh, veins, bone, and marrow. Such a procedure must also be followed in this instance. Burn down their synagogues, forbid all that I enumerated earlier, force them to work, and deal harshly with them, as Moses did in the wilderness, slaying three thousand lest the whole people perish. They surely do not know what they are doing; moreover, as people possessed, they do not wish to know it, hear it, or learn it. There it would be wrong to be merciful and confirm them in their conduct. If this does not help we must drive them out like mad dogs, so that we do not become partakers of their abominable blasphemy and all their other vices and thus merit God's wrath and be damned with them. I have done my duty. Now let everyone see to his. I am exonerated. "

    * * *
    My essay, I hope, will furnish a Christian (who in any case has no desire to become a Jew) with enough material not only to defend himself against the blind, venomous Jews, but also to become the foe of the Jews' malice, lying, and cursing, and to understand not only that their belief is false but that they are surely possessed by all devils. May Christ, our dear Lord, convert them mercifully and preserve us steadfastly and immovably in the knowledge of him, which is eternal life. Amen.


    Martin Luther, O.S.A.  10 November 1483[2] – 18 February 1546) was a German professor of theology, composer, priest, monk  and a seminal figure in the Protestant Reformation.

    Luther came to reject several teachings and practices of the Roman Catholic Church. He strongly disputed the Catholic view on indulgences. Luther proposed an academic discussion of the practice and efficacy of indulgences in his Ninety-five Theses of 1517. His refusal to renounce all of his writings at the demand of Pope Leo X in 1520 and the Holy Roman Emperor Charles V at the Diet of Worms in 1521 resulted in his excommunication by the Pope and condemnation as an outlaw by the Emperor

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
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