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Theme Changer

 Topic: Fuck Saudi Arabia

 (Read 27632 times)
  • 12 3 4 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     OP - November 27, 2015, 02:24 AM

    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-34931205

    اللهم عليك بهم فانهم لايعجزونك


    "Amnesty International has expressed alarm at reports that the authorities in Saudi Arabia are planning to execute dozens of people in a single day.,"

    Maybe our new strategy for ISIS should just be to wait another hundred years. That way they'll be so drunk off power that we can just treat them like we do our "allies" Al-Saud. They're the same people.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #1 - November 27, 2015, 02:30 AM

    Yeah, fuck that. But this isn't really a new thing I don't think. We see these sorts of predictable behaviors time and time again...

    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #2 - November 27, 2015, 06:58 AM

    I know an ex-muslim there right now, and he said a protester is getting 1000 lashes and 10 years in prison.

    "If you don't like your religion's fundamentalists, then maybe there's something wrong with your religion's fundamentals."
    "Demanding blind respect but not offering any respect in reciprocation is laughable."
    "Let all the people in all the worlds be in peace."
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #3 - November 27, 2015, 08:25 AM

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWb07Xh4jaA

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #4 - November 27, 2015, 11:04 AM

    happy_M says  says"Fuck Saudi Arabia" with a horrible nightmare news..
    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-34931205

    اللهم عليك بهم فانهم لايعجزونك
    ..............


    No..No,,,,,, Happy_M...  That heading should be " FUCK AMRIKA, FUCK ENGLAND.. FUCK FRANCE .. FUCK WEST & EAST .. FUCK UN.. who does business  with  BRUTAL REGIME  THE SAUDS OF SAND LAND.."

    In Short it should be

    "FUCK EVERYONE &  ELIMINATE  3000 or so Saud clowns of sand land. "


    Palestinian poet gets death sentence for ‘abandoning Islam’ in Saudi Arabia - HRW _ 21 Nov, 2015 09:35

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znZQrWMXs90

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-txyBgqn5q8
     


    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #5 - November 27, 2015, 12:04 PM

    Indeed.

    Saudi court sentences poet to death for renouncing Islam

    Quote
    The religious police first detained Fayadh in August 2013 after receiving a complaint that he was cursing against Allah and the prophet Muhammad, insulting Saudi Arabia and distributing a book of his poems that promoted atheism. Fayadh said the complaint arose from a personal dispute with another artist during a discussion about contemporary art in a cafe in Abha.

    He was released on bail after one day but the police arrested him again on 1 January 2014, confiscating his ID and detaining him at a police station until he was transferred to the local prison 27 days later. According to Fayadh’s friends, when the police failed to prove that his poetry was atheist propaganda, they began berating him for smoking and having long hair.

    “They accused me [of] atheism and spreading some destructive thoughts into society,” said Fayadh. He added that the book, Instructions Within, published in 2008, was “just about me being [a] Palestinian refugee … about cultural and philosophical issues. But the religious extremists explained it as destructive ideas against God.”



    "Belief can blunt human reason and common sense, even in learned scholars. What is needed is more impartial study." - Ali Dashti

    https://certainlydoubtful1.wordpress.com/

    https://twitter.com/certainlydoubt1
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #6 - November 27, 2015, 12:17 PM

    What is so incredible, and depressing, about this whole affair is not just the fact that he has been condemned to death (and in the most barbaric and sadistic manner imaginable), but that his peers have been reduced to justifying the moral foundation of his conviction, by insisting that he is not an atheist- as if the premise of the entire prosecution is legitimate, but it just happens to have mistakenly concluded with Ashraf's guilt.

    "Belief can blunt human reason and common sense, even in learned scholars. What is needed is more impartial study." - Ali Dashti

    https://certainlydoubtful1.wordpress.com/

    https://twitter.com/certainlydoubt1
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #7 - November 27, 2015, 12:47 PM



    The Arabs of the desert are the worst in Unbelief and hypocrisy, and most fitted to be in ignorance of the command which Allah hath sent down to His Messenger: But Allah is All-knowing, All-Wise. 9:97
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #8 - November 27, 2015, 01:02 PM

    Considering the shit they murder people for, I may actually have to agree with the quran, miracle of miracles. Well, everything before the comma anyway.

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #9 - November 27, 2015, 01:05 PM

    Just in case this is a cultural thing lost in translation, the miracle is me agreeing with the quran, not agreeing the quran is a miracle. Grin

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #10 - November 27, 2015, 01:24 PM

    Saudi Arabia will never be held accountable until she stops being useful to world powers. I'm waiting for the day when Saudi runs out of oil or when oil decreases in value. Arrogant Saudis believe in the fairy tale that Abraham prayed to Allah to make their country safe and prosperous. Because of this they can't seem to grasp the idea that the oil will eventually run out and that they will have nothing to fall back on once it does.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #11 - November 27, 2015, 01:37 PM



    That boy is Ali Mohammed al-Nimr., and the fucking BRUTAL SAUD REGIME OF SAND LAND is justifying their court order and  is preparing to behead Ali Mohammed al-Nimr for his pro-democracy protests.

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #12 - November 27, 2015, 02:31 PM

    Saudi Arabia will never be held accountable until she stops being useful to world powers. I'm waiting for the day when Saudi runs out of oil or when oil decreases in value. Arrogant Saudis believe in the fairy tale that Abraham prayed to Allah to make their country safe and prosperous. Because of this they can't seem to grasp the idea that the oil will eventually run out and that they will have nothing to fall back on once it does.


    You reminded me of Surah Ibrahim and how prevalently you hear it recited in mosques in Saudi Arabia. The Saudis couldn't have written a better piece of national propaganda if they tried. It really is a beautiful piece, even if you stop short of claiming its divinity.

    The irony is that the precincts of the Kaabah, that were once a place of peace filled with the tribal deities of ancient Arab clans, then united under the name of Allah and closed off to pagans, are now towered over by the names of Saudi tyrants who execute their opponents just outside the sanctuary.

    Perhaps the next great Arab prophet and hero will be the one who rids Makkah of its King Fahd Gate and King Abdul Aziz tower. And perhaps the "Thalimun" (oppressors, wrongdoers) referred to in the Surah will be understood as the ones who kill people for thinking differently.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #13 - November 27, 2015, 04:15 PM



    Yaa Ali...Yaa Muhammad...Yaa Nimr  .

    Quote
    Ali Mohammed al-Nimr: Sentenced to death

    Ali Mohammed Baqir al-Nimr,[1] على محمد باقر النمر, is a Saudi Arabian who as a teenager participated in the Saudi Arabian protests during the Arab Spring. He was arrested in February 2012, sentenced to death in May 2014, and as of 23 September 2015, awaited ratification of his sentence by King Salman of Saudi Arabia, to be carried out by beheading and crucifixion

     Al-Nimr participated in the 2011–12 Saudi Arabian protests during the Arab Spring. According to a court judgment, he "encouraged pro-democracy protests  using a BlackBerry"

    Ali al-Nimr is a nephew of Sheikh Nimr al-Nimr, an independent Shia Sheikh, popular among youth and critical of the Saudi Arabian government,  who was arrested on 8 July 2012  and sentenced to death by the Specialized Criminal Court on 15 October 2014 for anti-government activities.[  Ali al-Nimr's family believes that this relationship is the reason for his arrest and sentencing


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZBmTNrfsOM

    .....Yes......
    Yaa Ali...Yaa Muhammad...Yaa Nimr
    .....
    Yaa Ali...Yaa Muhammad...Yaa Nimr.........
    Yaa Ali...Yaa Muhammad...Yaa Nimr
    ....

    Ha! Minsitro........Mastro Mr. Prime Minister says ..... says ... .".National security..   .UK National security is first". ...  and that means selling bombs and fighter planes to ROGUES OF ISLAM.. THE FUCKING SAUDS OF  SAND LAND....

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #14 - November 27, 2015, 04:33 PM

    this was a great video. "Why Wahabbism was funded by America in the 80s"

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmbkoiI5IYg


    "If you don't like your religion's fundamentalists, then maybe there's something wrong with your religion's fundamentals."
    "Demanding blind respect but not offering any respect in reciprocation is laughable."
    "Let all the people in all the worlds be in peace."
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #15 - November 27, 2015, 06:44 PM

    You reminded me of Surah Ibrahim and how prevalently you hear it recited in mosques in Saudi Arabia. The Saudis couldn't have written a better piece of national propaganda if they tried. It really is a beautiful piece, even if you stop short of claiming its divinity.

    The irony is that the precincts of the Kaabah, that were once a place of peace filled with the tribal deities of ancient Arab clans, then united under the name of Allah and closed off to pagans, are now towered over by the names of Saudi tyrants who execute their opponents just outside the sanctuary.

    Perhaps the next great Arab prophet and hero will be the one who rids Makkah of its King Fahd Gate and King Abdul Aziz tower. And perhaps the "Thalimun" (oppressors, wrongdoers) referred to in the Surah will be understood as the ones who kill people for thinking differently.


    It was a beautiful piece, but I found it to be contradictory. I was always told that Allah did not favour one tribe over another yet here he was favouring the Saudis by supposedly protecting their land.

    That's true, if the Saud family cannot be classified as the oppressors then I don't know who can be.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #16 - November 27, 2015, 09:38 PM

    Are the Saud family seen as legitimate rulers? I thought they are only in position because they were imposed by the Sykes-Picot agreement. Or am I wrong about that? I suppose I should look it up.

    How much of the brutality of the Saudi regime is down to religious leaders? Are the rulers manipulating Islamic laws in order to keep their position or is it also the case that, if they did try reform, they'd be in danger of losing their authority because of the influence of the Mullahs?
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #17 - November 27, 2015, 10:23 PM

    Monarchies are against Islam, apparently. The Saud family gives the religious leaders lots of power, who in return support their position as rulers. Having lived in Saudi I saw that (sadly) most of the people there are extremely patriotic and won't speak a word against their royal family. There are a few exceptions but they are too afraid to speak out. The governments keep citizens happy by giving them lots of wealth and a generally high living standard.

    It's a fragile system and things are bound to change now that the population is increasing dramatically and as a result poverty in Saudi is on the rise. The little brainwashing bubble the Saudi people have been living in will eventually burst.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #18 - November 27, 2015, 10:30 PM

    Well, initially the plan was to have the Sharif of Makkah take control of the holy sites after the war. The Wahhabi chieftain ibn Saud was a staunch enemy of the Hashemite Sharif and considered him to be a kafir.

    The British agent Abdullah Philby, who allegedly converted to wahhabism, was key in directing ibn Saud not to attack the Hashemites right away, but instead to focus his attention on the Shammari Emir of Hael of the Al Rashid clan, who was allied with the Ottomans, who were in turn of course allied with Germany.

    After ibn Saud defeated the Al Rashid and killed their Emir, (and had a son, who would be the late King Abdullah, with the Emir's widow), he turned his attention on the Hejaz.

    His advisor, Philby, was instrumental in convincing the British to break with policy regarding the Hashemites and instead to throw their support behind ibn Saud, arguing that he had real control of the hinterlands anyhow, and that a unified Arabia from coast to coast would be in everyone's best interest.

    Ibn Saud was given instruction on how far he could go without incurring the wrath of the British. Aden was off limits due to the strategic ports, as were the Trucial Emirates that have since become the UAE, and Iraq and Syria to the north as those were being carved up among the victors of the war. The rest of the desert was fair game and he and his gang of Ikhwan zealots went about  marauding and conquering their way through the tribes.

    It was said that ibn Saud had two swords, one he fought with and the other he reconciled with. The latter, of course, was a euphemism for his habit of impregnating the daughters of conquered tribes with his future heirs, earning their support.

    Once he had no more need for the ikhwan fanatics, he turned on them with modern weapons and destroyed them, claiming the entire kingdom for himself.

    When I lived in the UAE, I had conversations with people whose parents and grandparents lived through the Wahhabi invasions of the desert. Apparently people lived in constant fear of a surprise attack the way Europe might have feared the Norsemen.

    And for good reason, as well. Just like ISIS, when the Wahhabis attacked, they destroyed ancient shrines, captured women, and killed anyone who disagreed with them.

    So, yeah, maybe we should just give daesh another hundred years.  Roll Eyes
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #19 - November 27, 2015, 10:57 PM

    Dang happymurtad you know quite a bit.

    Coming from that salafi background (ex muslim now of course), they started educating us about the ottoman empire and how evil it was on the internet. Of course all Salafi "course material" was extremely biased and painted how evil those who didn't adhere to " pure tawheed" really were.

    If anyone can expand on the Saudi kingship, please do.. I was always indoctrinated to "obey all the rulers" and never question the authority. It was only for the "scholars" to do so.


    "If you don't like your religion's fundamentalists, then maybe there's something wrong with your religion's fundamentals."
    "Demanding blind respect but not offering any respect in reciprocation is laughable."
    "Let all the people in all the worlds be in peace."
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #20 - November 27, 2015, 11:07 PM

    I was a salafi myself and the official narrative of Allah just blessing Al Saud because they implemented tawhid just never satisfied me. Abdullah Philby actually wrote a book called Arabia of the Wahhabis that gives great insight into ibn Saud's mindset. There is loads of material written about the time, it's just never a part of Saudi propaganda.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #21 - November 27, 2015, 11:57 PM

    Well, initially the plan was to have the Sharif of Makkah take control of the holy sites after the war....


    Thank you, genuinely interesting.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #22 - November 28, 2015, 12:56 AM

    Monarchies are against Islam, apparently...


    Thanks for the reply. I can see the logic, though the difference between a caliphate and a monarchy seems fairly subtle to me.
    From what you say, I think it would be reasonable to postulate that the Saudi regime would find it difficult to implement Liberal reforms should a future king decide it would be desirable to do so.  Also, anyone wishing to advocate for reform would have to contend with the inerests of both the monarchy and the religious leaders. It isn't going to happen, is it? If the monarchy were to be deposed it would simply be replaced by a theocracy and nothing would change.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #23 - November 28, 2015, 02:50 AM

    Fascinating stuff happymurtad.  Afro

    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #24 - November 28, 2015, 07:51 AM

    ^ Yes.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #25 - November 28, 2015, 09:35 AM

    I don't get why it's acceptable to reduce an entire country to its ruling class, and going so far as to reduce it to a terrorist organization that is mass-slaughtering anyone and everyone who isn't in line with its narrow religious dogma.

    Does Saudi have a terrible religious ideology? Certainly, and in fact it's the ideology that inspires Daesh.

    Does Saudi commit horrible crimes against human rights? Undeniably.

    But equating it with Daesh is absurd and shows a lack of nuanced understanding of the Saudi political system. I can take that summary of Saudi history at face value, but that doesn't by default mean Saudi today is Daesh. Today we recognize the scientific and political and all kinds of progress countries like the US have made, despite their horrific origins in genocide and ethnic cleansing. No one with a shred of nuanced political understanding compares the US to Daesh or the Nazis, because that would be silly.

    One fact that many anti-Saudis seem oblivious of is how progressive King Abdullah was, and how much he invested in science and technology. Now, Saudi is far from being a haven of science and progress and reason, but it's been making some pretty big steps in the right direction (or it was, under King Abdullah, at least). He also fought against the religious scholars in pushing for women's rights in education, and he opened the first coed university in Saudi Arabia.

    Al-Saud are not the crazy religious fundamentalists they're made out to be. The problem in Saudi is that the ruling family shares power with the religious scholars. That's how it has been since the establishment of the country, because that's how they came to power.

    So when we stop looking at Saudi like one big monolithic monster, and start looking at the different political forces in Saudi, and how they change through time, we can start having a proper discussion about the country. Until then, it's an anti-Saudi circle jerk that sweeps the works of progressive Saudis under the rug. When we talk about Saudi Arabia, we're talking about the likes of Raif Badawi as much as we're talking about the Wahhabis in power.


    Quote
    The College of American Pathologists (CAP) has ranked the laboratory of the National Guard’s King Abdulaziz Medical City (KAMC) in Riyadh as one of the “best in the world.”

    ArabNews.com

    Quote
    However, few would dispute the progress on women’s education during King Abdullah’s reign. Other notable achievements included opening Saudi Arabia’s first coed university, The King Abdullah University of Science and Technology (KAUST), near the coastal city of Jeddah, in 2009, and the world’s largest female-only university, the Princess Nora Bint Abdulrahman University, in the more conservative capital of Riyadh.

    MEI.edu
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #26 - November 28, 2015, 12:38 PM

    hello Absurdist.......
    I don't get why it's acceptable to reduce an entire country to its ruling class, and going so far as to reduce it to a terrorist organization that is mass-slaughtering anyone and everyone who isn't in line with its narrow religious dogma.

    who said that?? ..who is reducing entire country in to terrorist organization  Absurdist.??

    .. people are talking about some 3000  saud clowns along with some 3000 Islam preaching clowns that are controlled by Sauds and +3000 judges that are controlled by Saud king... that are responsible what saudi regime does inside the country  as well as outside the country.,  All these actors also  are supported by the west and some eastern countries just because of that oil and oil wealth that is controlled by these  3000 or so sauds ......

    Quote
    Does Saudi have a terrible religious ideology? Certainly, and in fact it's the ideology that inspires Daesh.

    Does Saudi commit horrible crimes against human rights? Undeniably
    .

    Those two statements of yours are enough to remove the regime from the face of the earth...

    Quote
    But equating it with Daesh is absurd and shows a lack of nuanced understanding of the Saudi political system. I can take that summary of Saudi history at face value, but that doesn't by default mean Saudi today is Daesh. Today we recognize the scientific and political and all kinds of progress countries like the US have made, despite their horrific origins in genocide and ethnic cleansing. No one with a shred of nuanced political understanding compares the US to Daesh or the Nazis, because that would be silly.

    One fact that many anti-Saudis seem oblivious of is how progressive King Abdullah was, and how much he invested in science and technology. Now, Saudi is far from being a haven of science and progress and reason, but it's been making some pretty big steps in the right direction (or it was, under King Abdullah, at least). He also fought against the religious scholars in pushing for women's rights in education, and he opened the first coed university in Saudi Arabia.

    Al-Saud are not the crazy religious fundamentalists they're made out to be. The problem in Saudi is that the ruling family shares power with the religious scholars. That's how it has been since the establishment of the country, because that's how they came to power.

    So when we stop looking at Saudi like one big monolithic monster, and start looking at the different political forces in Saudi, and how they change through time, we can start having a proper discussion about the country. Until then, it's an anti-Saudi circle jerk that sweeps the works of progressive Saudis under the rug.

     irrelevant and no one is doing that ..  No it is NOT anti saudi Arabia and people living in it.,  

    but   IT IS ANTI SAUD CLOWN CIRCLE
    That is because they support inhuman beheadings in public for the crimes such as opposing the regime,read this and tell me who is responsible for such actions in Saudi Arabia if Not SAUDS...
     
    Quote
    When we talk about Saudi Arabia, we're talking about the likes of Raif Badawi as much as we're talking about the Wahhabis in power

    .NO WE ARE NOT... we are talking about the scoundrels who hold the power in the country in the name of allah .. in the name of religion with the help of oil ....AMRIKA and what not...

    Quote

    Not a big deal it could have done millions times better than that without Sauds..

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #27 - November 28, 2015, 12:53 PM

     
    Quote
    Doubtful reforms

    Freedom House also reported a similar result from a study conducted by Saudi Arabia itself. Presented in December 2003, it came to the following conclusion: The religious instruction of Saudi Arabia "encouraged violence against others and mislead the schoolchildren to believe that, in order to protect their religion, they had to oppress others with violence and even destroy them psychologically."

    Saudi Arabia never reacted to the Freedom House report. However, the Saudi Foreign Minister Saud al-Faisal, in 2006, said that the whole educational system of the kingdom had to be reviewed. To what extent this actually happened is unclear. In the years 2012/2013 the US State Department carried out a further study of Saudi school text books. The results have still not been published.

    Money and faith

    Saudi Arabia exports its version of Sunni Islam with the utmost consequence. In the last 25 years a former US ambassador estimated in a published study in 2007 that the kingdom had invested at least 87 billion dollars in religious propaganda worldwide. This sum, he thinks, may even have increased further due to the high price of oil over an extended period. The funds went towards the construction of mosques, Madrassa Koran schools and religious institutions, and helped finance the training of Imams, publishing houses and Wahhabi text books.

    A large part of the funds go to economically weak, but populous Islamic countries in south and southeast Asia, such as Pakistan, Indonesia, the Philippines, or Malaysia. Proselytizing for Wahhabism is also done in parts of Africa. For many people in these parts of the world it is the only possibility of getting a school education. There they learn how to read and write and are also given access to the Wahhabi teachings. But there are also Saudi Arabian financed institutions in the West.

    Financing terror

    The ideological closeness to "Islamic State" (IS) is reflected in concrete economic aid. It's hard to say how money is channeled to IS: The funds are transferred in the so-called Hawala System, an informal transfer system, where the money is not transferred in official bank notes, but via trusted third parties. Also here it's not clear, how far the Saudi state supports the IS directly or indirectly.

    US Vice President Joe Biden grabbed headlines in the Fall of 2014 when he criticized the decisions of America's allies in the war on IS – Biden named Turkey, Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates – for their not intentional but negligent support for IS: "They were so determined to overthrow Assad and to lead a Sunni-Shiite war – what did they do? They pumped hundreds of millions of dollars and thousands of tons of weapons to anyone who wanted to fight Assad. But they also supplied people from al-Nusra and al-Qaeda and extremist elements of the Jihadists from all parts of the world," Biden said.



    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #28 - November 28, 2015, 12:56 PM

    I don't get why it's acceptable to reduce an entire country to its ruling class, and going so far as to reduce it to a terrorist organization that is mass-slaughtering anyone and everyone who isn't in line with its narrow religious dogma.

    Does Saudi have a terrible religious ideology? Certainly, and in fact it's the ideology that inspires Daesh.

    Does Saudi commit horrible crimes against human rights? Undeniably.

    But equating it with Daesh is absurd and shows a lack of nuanced understanding of the Saudi political system. I can take that summary of Saudi history at face value, but that doesn't by default mean Saudi today is Daesh. Today we recognize the scientific and political and all kinds of progress countries like the US have made, despite their horrific origins in genocide and ethnic cleansing. No one with a shred of nuanced political understanding compares the US to Daesh or the Nazis, because that would be silly.

    One fact that many anti-Saudis seem oblivious of is how progressive King Abdullah was, and how much he invested in science and technology. Now, Saudi is far from being a haven of science and progress and reason, but it's been making some pretty big steps in the right direction (or it was, under King Abdullah, at least). He also fought against the religious scholars in pushing for women's rights in education, and he opened the first coed university in Saudi Arabia.

    Al-Saud are not the crazy religious fundamentalists they're made out to be. The problem in Saudi is that the ruling family shares power with the religious scholars. That's how it has been since the establishment of the country, because that's how they came to power.

    So when we stop looking at Saudi like one big monolithic monster, and start looking at the different political forces in Saudi, and how they change through time, we can start having a proper discussion about the country. Until then, it's an anti-Saudi circle jerk that sweeps the works of progressive Saudis under the rug. When we talk about Saudi Arabia, we're talking about the likes of Raif Badawi as much as we're talking about the Wahhabis in power.

    ArabNews.com
    MEI.edu



    Surely there are two sides to every coin. Nothing ever stays static, not even an ideology. Saudi Arabia is changing rapidly and those progressive forces within the kingdom, even within the ruling family itself, will continue to drive that change.

    In reality, even that word "progressive" is simplistic because there are many factors at play. The kingdom is a place filled with many wonderful people who deserve better than their current political system. I think it should go without saying that they were not the object of the fucks I invoked. In the same way that the abolitionist movements that existed in the area during the civil war would not be what I was considering if I were to speak of The South, nor would some English farmer be what I was talking about if discussing British colonialism.

    It doesn't show a lack of nuanced understanding, it just assumes the audience can infer what is meant based on the context. ( Smiley strategic smiley because I do love you, absurdist)

    But without a doubt, the Wahhabi/Salafi creed that has been used to maintain power is the monozygotic twin of the creed of ISIS. The differences you see in the people who hold that ideology only exists because of the evolution that time allows. And for sure, not everyone in Saudi Arabia is a salafi.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #29 - November 28, 2015, 06:07 PM

    Those two statements of yours are enough to remove the regime from the face of the earth...


    Although I have no idea how it ought to be done, I would tend to agree with yeez on this point.

    At the very least, I think its clear that the Saudi regime doesn't receive nearly the censure and outcry for their wrongdoings from "the West" as is merited by their actions. Its obviously not the only case, (China comes to mind as well due to their economic power, as does Israel), but I think its a particularly brazen example of where Western rhetoric about supporting "freedom", self-determination, human rights, etc. simply falls flat in its face in comparison to the actual support that is given to those that do terrible things.

    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
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