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 Topic: Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed

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  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #60 - February 12, 2015, 08:47 AM

    If he views himself as an atheist I'm happy to call him one. It's no reflection on me.

    That is another important to note in that post QSE...   But AMRIKA appears to be great country..  when I was trying to get that  news of  A Rogue killing 3 Muslim Students Neighbors in Heads & Kills Them  from horse mouth ., this news pops up http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-31349262   and that news is caught on this video..

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IwOJ5TgrPLg

    my goodness  gracious, AmriKA appears to be driving in a wrong direction..   any ways your point need to be kept in mind..

    "What people call themselves should not have any refection on others"

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #61 - February 12, 2015, 04:32 PM

    Thousands gather with Candle lights  for slain Muslim students in Chapel Hill
     


    Quote
    CHAPEL HILL: Thousands of people gathered Wednesday in Chapel Hill to mourn three Muslim students killed by an anti-religion gunman who shot them in the head, rocking the tight-knit university town.

    Friends and family poured onto the University of North Carolina campus to remember Deah Shaddy Barakat, 23, his new wife Yusor Mohammad, 21 and her 19-year-old sister Razan Mohammad Abu-Salha. The three were allegedly killed by neighbour Craig Stephen Hicks, 46, whose Facebook page espoused his anti-religious views

    Quote
    “We lost three great citizens of this world and of this country. But I think they've inspired thousands,” Farris Barakat, Deah's brother said before a tearful crowd.

    He remembered his younger brother, a UNC dentistry student, as passionate about sports, his profession and the odd Chris Rock joke, as photos of the slain students flashed on a large screen. But he urged restraint and said the murder should not provoke further violence.

    “Do not fight fire with fire... it is quite possible that this was an act based off of evil and a scared ignorant man, do not let ignorance propagate in your life, do not reply ignorance with ignorance,” he said.


    I hope AMRIKA and Americans learn something  from that total senseless brutal tragedy .  

    Americans must realize that Easy Guns.. drugs , anger , frustration and mental problems ...... A deadly combination..,  well.. life goes away and life goes on... So QSE  Help me out here
    If he views himself as an atheist I'm happy to call him one. It's no reflection on me.

    what do you  mean by that.. I was trying to elaborate that .. don't have time.. please elaborate bit more

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #62 - February 12, 2015, 05:10 PM

    I still consider it a very likely possibility that the difference between him in a rage pulling the trigger and him NOT pulling the trigger MIGHT have something to do with the young ladies wearing head scarves.

    That's more or less what I thought.

    Might, maybe, will never know. But whatever the truth, another kidney punch to cohesion.
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #63 - February 12, 2015, 06:41 PM

    Quote
    Alleged Chapel Hill Shooter Had History of Parking Disputes, Tow-Truck Driver Says

    By
    Valerie Bauerlein
    Feb. 11, 2015 9:02 p.m. ET

    CHAPEL HILL, N.C.—A local tow-truck driver said that the man accused of killing three Muslim students Tuesday night had a history of reporting neighbors for parking in spaces that weren’t theirs and creating “a lot of drama.”

    Christopher Lafreniere said his company had a contract for towing in the Finley Forest neighborhood where the alleged shooter, Craig Stephen Hicks, and two of the three victims lived. Mr. Lafreniere said the company was called “every day, or at least several times a week” for more than a year by Mr. Hicks with requests to tow cars that Mr. Hicks said weren’t parked in the proper spaces. In one incident, Mr. Hicks had a gun, Mr. Lafreniere said.

    “This guy towed an obscene amount of cars,” Mr. Lafreniere said. “It got to the point where we stopped answering his calls.”

    Mr. Hicks is charged with three counts of murder in the deaths of Deah Shaddy Barakat, 23 years old; his wife, Yusor Mohammad, 21, of Chapel Hill; and Yusor’s sister, Razan Mohammad Abu-Salha, 19, of Raleigh. They were found Tuesday shot in the head and pronounced dead at the condominium complex.

    Chapel Hill police have said the Tuesday shootings were prompted by a parking dispute between Mr. Hicks and the married couple, his closest neighbors.

    A lawyer for Mr. Hicks, 46, didn’t immediately respond to request for comment.

    The killings were quickly condemned as hate crimes by the victim’s family and some Muslim groups, and multiple vigils were held Wednesday night to mourn the victims. Mohammad Abu-Salha, father of the sisters, said Yusor had told him that a neighbor was harassing them because of their faith and was motivated by hate of Muslim people.

    Mr. Lafreniere said he was shocked when he saw coverage of Tuesday’s fatal shootings in the quiet neighborhood. “The news is saying, ‘hate crime, hate crime,’ but then I found out it was that guy and I thought, ‘Hmm, it actually might have been a parking issue,’ ” Mr. Lafreniere said. “He was all about towing.”

    Mr. Hicks brought a gun into the small parking lot outside his condominium during a parking dispute on the night of Dec. 14, 2013, Mr. Lafreniere said. A report in the online database of the Chapel Hill Police Department naming Mr. Lafreniere and Mr. Hicks confirms that there was an argument that night involving a tow that Mr. Lafreniere had been called in to make in the small parking lot outside Mr. Hicks’s apartment.

    Mr. Lafreniere said he went to Finley Forest that night to tow a Toyota Prius parked in the wrong spot. The request was called in “for once” by a different neighbor, he said. The Prius owner was upset about being towed, and Mr. Hicks called the police to report noise in the parking lot, Mr. Lafreniere said.

    “He comes out with a gun and says, ‘I’ve called the police,’ ” Mr. Lafreniere said. “I heard sirens from miles away.”

    No charges were filed, according to the report. Mr. Hicks had reported the altercation, but wasn’t a suspect.

    A Chapel Hill police spokesman said he couldn’t comment on whether Mr. Hicks had a gun in that incident, but noted that Mr. Hicks was a witness, not a suspect, and that he had a permit to carry a concealed handgun.

    Spaces in the Finley Forest condos are assigned and it was inconvenient for people coming home at night to have a car in their space, Mr. Lafreniere said. Mr. Hicks was by far the most frequent person to request a car be towed in the sprawling neighborhood dotted by small lots.


    But still - would he have killed them if they were to him just annoyingly Presbyterian?

    But then it IS 'Murica...:

    A Random Collection of Shootings Over Parking Spaces, and What They Tell Us About Violence and Beliefs

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  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #64 - February 12, 2015, 07:36 PM

    But still - would he have killed them if they were to him just annoyingly Presbyterian?

     ..............

    You can not predict what NUT CASES do with guns in their hand Nikolaj .. In fact sometimes  it is difficult to predict  what sane people such as police officers with adrenaline flowing in their brain do  with guns in their hand in the spur of the moment..

    AMRIKA and its gun culture, couple that too  Mental disorders in US of A., Medications  and ...freeeeeeeeeeeeeedom ... you have a problem in hand .  

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #65 - February 12, 2015, 10:09 PM

    And cars for parking spot disputes

    (Clicky for piccy!)

    To quote Rob Delaney:

    Guns don’t kill people. People who say “Guns don’t kill people” kill people. With guns.


  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #66 - February 13, 2015, 01:04 AM

    So QSE  Help me out here what do you  mean by that.. I was trying to elaborate that .. don't have time.. please elaborate bit more

    The fact the murderer was an atheist is no reflection on myself or other atheists whatsoever.

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #67 - February 13, 2015, 11:32 AM

    I wonder if the view of atheism has nothing to do with mental health issues is a cold shouldered response


    Good post, bogart.

    Imho religion has fullfilled needs in man over the 100,000 years or so of his evolution. Mental health has been one of them. But with the decline of religion in recent times (and yes I do believe the bigger picture shows a decline, despite it's violent last violent death throws) humanity has yet to find a satisfying and fulfilling alterantive. As I say if you look at the bigger picture of human evolution, man is at a crossroads, unsure of where we go from here. I do believe that many non-religious people are facing mental health issues (just as religious people are but for different reasons)
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #68 - February 13, 2015, 11:42 AM

    I don't think all atheists are responsible for what this lunatic did, but I do think that the extremists of the new atheist movement need to have a long, hard thinking-over of their extremist rhetoric. Average religious people are not the enemy, but you wouldn't know that listening to the rhetoric of Dawkins et al.


    I pretty much agree with you here, countjulian. I do think some of what we call the 'new atheists' movement have lost a balanced perspective.

    I personally would exclude Dawkins from this though, as vociferous as he is, I can't fault much of what he says.
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #69 - February 13, 2015, 11:44 AM

     Chapel Hill shootings: Erdogan criticises US response  says BBC news




     
    Quote
    Turkey's President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has criticised US leaders' responses to the murder of three Muslim students in North Carolina.  Speaking on a visit to Mexico, Mr Erdogan said he had called US President Obama, Vice-President Biden and Secretary of State John Kerry about the deaths, and criticised their "silence" on the case.

    More than 5,000 people attended the students' funeral on Thursday. Initial indications are that the gunman, Craig Hicks, acted in a dispute over a parking space, but the victims' family claims it was a hate crime.

    He said politicians were responsible for events in their countries and had to clarify their stance over them.


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Co2dVZmvc1I

    Normally I don't agree with that guy but here I have to agree.,   indeed politicians and public officials are responsible for events in their countries

    holy cow ..look at this news from that BBC   Jittery police force...

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #70 - February 13, 2015, 04:48 PM

    Interview with Deah Barakat's sister
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2rVLYyfn8XY&feature=youtu.be
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #71 - February 13, 2015, 05:05 PM


    AMRIKA is so lucky to get these highly educated , highly motivated wonderful people from all over the world .. Well these people move to that  country because of these STUPID ISLAMIC NATIONS THAT  HAVE THESE AUTOCRATIC RULERS WHO BEND THEIR ASS UP IN TO THE SKY AND HEAD IN TO THE SAND ..

    so good people loose their lives to some gun slinging nut cases 

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #72 - February 13, 2015, 07:50 PM

    Video statement by family of Deah Barakat

    https://mobile.twitter.com/katz/status/565650746272911361
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #73 - February 17, 2015, 12:41 PM

    So Khaled A. Beydoun and Margari Hill published this on Al-Jazeera:

    Double standard. Double standards everywhere! finmad

    #AbeedLivesMatterToo lipsrsealed

    Quote
    The colour of Muslim mourning

    Mustafa Mattan was killed the day before the Chapel Hill executions. However, unlike Deah Barakat, Yusor and Razan Abu-Salha, few Muslims are familiar with the name Mustafa Mattan.

    Mustafa is black and Somali Canadian. The 28-year-old Ottawa native travelled to Fort McMurray, a far off but economically booming city in northeast Alberta, Canada. Like many upstart and ambitious Canadian men, Mattan travelled westward for opportunities unavailable at home. Several weeks later, he was found in his apartment dead. Alone and motionless on the floor, 3,700km away from his parents, family and friends.

    While #MuslimLivesMatter trended for Deah, Yusor and Razan, there were sporadic tweets linked to Mattan's story, and few questions as to why Mattan's death received little attention. The Chapel Hill shootings have inspired a broad, diverse and lurid chorus of support and solidarity; Mattan's name, however, has been met with relative silence. 

    Muslim and black

    What, if anything, colours the disparity in alarm and organising, amplification and action encircling the two tragedies? The curious case of Mustafa Mattan is as much a story of intra-racial division and anti-black racism within the Muslim population as it is a narrative about the neglected death of a young man seeking a better life far from home.     

    Roughly 16 hours before Craig Hicks executed Barakat and the Abu-Salhas sisters in North Carolina, Mustafa Mattan was shot and killed in the Fort McMurray apartment he shared with his brother. Mattan moved to Alberta to help his family back home in Ottawa, and to "save money for a wedding".

    Hardworking and family-oriented, Mattan harmonised his Somali and Muslim values with his Canadian identity, pulled westward by the promise of a better tomorrow.
    That same dream lured Deah and Yusor - who was scheduled to start in fall - to dental school at the University of North Carolina, and Razan Abu-Salha to North Carolina State University. Like Mattan, the three Chapel Hill shooting victims, dubbed "Our Three Winners" by their parents and on social media, embodied a seamless integration of Muslim and western values.

    They balanced a love for basketball with a critique of foreign policy in Arab states. They took selfies and raised funds for Syrian refugees, and most vividly, pursued dreams that any Muslim American or Canadian can identity with.

    Outpour of support

    The outpouring of support and eulogies that followed their deaths revealed that Deah, Yusor and Razan were, in life and in death, archetypes of young, Muslim Americans. Lives neglected by the media, but ones that mattered greatly for Muslims inside and outside of the US.   

    Therefore, global Muslim support, sympathy and solidarity emerged rapidly around the three young Arab-American victims. Social media erupted with condolences and tributes; vigils were held from North Carolina to California; there were calls for a federal investigation into the hate crime, and there was an immediate mobilisation of Muslim advocacy organisations.

    Although killed a day before, not even a fraction of concern has rallied around the Somali-Canadian victim, Mattan.

    Deah's fundraiser for dental supplies for Syrian refugees went from $20,000 before his death to $380,000. In contrast, Mattan's family still is struggling to raise $15,000 for his burial costs.

    Mourning is as much an act of honour as it is remembrance. A primitive act, communal mourning symbolises that the dead's life had value and meaning. The overwhelming, global mourning for the three Chapel Hill victims testified to their value to Muslims everywhere.

    On the other hand, the silence surrounding Mattan's death also speaks volumes about the value of his life - and those who look like him - to the global Muslim population.     

    In life and in death, Arab and South Asian Muslim lives seem to matter far more than the lives of black Muslims.

    According to the mosque president, Mattan was a "popular role model to younger members of the Ottawa mosque he attended regularly".
    Young and industrious, beloved by many and blessed with the promise of a bright tomorrow, Mattan shared plenty with the fallen victims in Chapel Hill.

    Black Muslims devalued

    However, the one item Mattan did not share with Deah, Yusor and Razan was Arab identity. A commodity that seems to enhance the value of Muslim life; while blackness remains devalued.

    Critics will contend: "Mattan was Canadian, which explains why Muslims in the US were ignorant of his death."

    However, following his murder in December 2014, the Muslim-American community and its institutions were relatively hush about Abdisamad Sheikh-Hussein. Although the 15-year-old Kansas City teen of Somali origin was, like the victims in Chapel Hill, a target of a hate crime in the US.

    Unlike Mattan, Sheikh-Hussein was killed inside America's heartland. Yet, like Mattan, young Sheikh-Hussein's brutal murder was met with silence and neglect, with outrage largely confined inside the bounds of Somali mosques and community centres.

    The remainder of the Muslim community, particularly Arab and South Asian elements and organisations, did little.

    Despite a few vocal critics, Mattan's erasure in the discussion of Islamophobia in North America is evident. The exclusion of Mattan and Sheikh-Hussein perpetuates a harmful hierarchy that privileges Arab narratives and excludes black/African Muslims.
    This racial stratification relegating black Muslim lives is evident as much in death as it is in life.

    Khaled A Beydoun is an assistant professor of law at the Barry University Dwayne O Andreas School of Law.

    Margari Hill is an adjunct professor and co-founder/director of the Muslim Anti-Racist Collaborative.

    The views expressed in this article are the author's own and do not necessarily reflect Al Jazeera's editorial policy.


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  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #74 - February 17, 2015, 03:40 PM

    That's a really depressing piece.

    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #75 - February 17, 2015, 08:24 PM

    Dehumanization of Muslims writes  RAMZY BAROUD  On that Tragedy

    Quote
    The murder of three American Muslims at a University of North Carolina condominium on Feb.10, was no ordinary murder, nor is the criminal who killed them an ordinary thug. The context of the killings, the murder itself and the media and official responses to the horrific event is a testimony to everything that went wrong since the United States unleashed it’s long-drawn-out “war on terror,” with its undeclared, but sometimes declared enemy, namely Islam and Muslims.
    Horrific as it was, the killing of a husband and wife, Deah Shaddy Barakat, Yusor Abu-Salha and her sister, Razan Abu-Salha, by homegrown terrorist, Craig Stephen Hicks, is the kind of violence that can only fit into a greater media and official narrative, which designates millions of innocent Muslims, in the US or across the world as enemies or potential terrorists.
    Countless television hours and endless space in numerous media has been dedicated to vilify and demonize Muslims throughout recent years. Muslims’ attempts to distance themselves from every militant grouping, ideology and tendency have done them no good. A Muslim is a terrorism suspect until proven innocent, especially if a bearded, brown man, or a headscarf-clad woman.

    The end result of that dehumanization has been racism, racial profiling, extrajudicial killings and war. It was only a matter of time before that violence reached the nominally safe Muslim communities in the US itself. The episode of dehumanization is long, complex and The ongoing enthusiasm for more military interventions means that supposed “moral awakening” inspired by the advent of President Barack Obama rarely registered in the collective psyche of the nation. While there is ample evidence that Americans are “tired” of war, that very war fatigue should not be conflated with a departure of the type of dialectics that rationalized war in the first place.

    In fact, while the cheerleaders for war might change political camps, ideology or even religious philosophy, ultimately, they are the same breed of people: A mostly white, male dominated and chauvinistic tribe of well-funded politicians and media pundits, with an unquenchable thirst for “intervention.”

    Hicks, the terrorist who killed the three young Muslims, subscribes to a school of thought known as New Atheism, what religious scholar Reza Aslan refers to as the school of “anti-theism.” It is, in part, another hate-filled platform, and despite its supposed disdain for all religions, their malicious energy mostly targets Muslims.
    They, of course, are different from the majority of atheists, who don’t use that designation to foment hate against a specific religious group. The anti-theist idols include the likes of Richard Dawkins and Sam Harris, who, according to Aslan, respond “to religion with the same venomous ire with which religious fundamentalists respond to atheism.”

    In one of his Facebook posts, Hicks, a lover of guns, quoted Dawkins:

    “The last vestige of respect for the taboo disappeared as I watched the ‘Day of Prayer’ in Washington Cathedral, where people of mutually incompatible faiths united in homage to the very force that caused the problem in the first place: Religion.” But of course, not any religion, but Islam. Let alone that such ignorant breed pays no heed to any relevant political context, they so foolishly blame a whole religion for what is essentially a political conflict.

    Did they ever pause to wonder if it might be possible that invading countries, killing, raping, pillaging, destroying mosques and churches, and urinating on the dead, have something to do with why many Muslims hate US foreign policy and are willing to use violence in response?

    Hicks too hated the three Muslim kids based on that same foolish, murderous logic. But hating Muslims is not your everyday racism and prejudice, which has been “as American as apple pie and Napalm” (a funny, sad line from the American comedy, M.A.S.H). It is a readily available fodder for the ongoing war and future war in Muslim countries. It is the required amount of dehumanization needed to wage war. This is why Islam and Muslims are equated with terrorism, and why terrorism is used almost exclusively to describe violent acts committed or allegedly committed by Muslims. The same champions of this invalid logic are those who constantly push the line: “All Muslims are not terrorists, but all terrorists are Muslims.” The assumption might be inane, but the intention is anything but. It absolves those war criminals, who planned, executed and justified the war; the soldiers who did the fighting, and those who ensured that there can be no legal accountability for its numerous awful deeds.

    Instead, it puts the onus on ordinary Muslims who are set up to prove their innocence to no avail, to absolve themselves from a crime they never committed, in fact, to answer for someone else’s crimes. But Hicks, who walked into the flat of three students in Chapel Hill, NC and shot them, execution style, was not a Muslim. He comes from Christian heritage. He is not black or brown, but white. His name is not Ahmed, but Craig. That changes everything.

    Neither the police nor the media would describe his crime as a hate crime, let alone terrorism, although his terrorism is unique in a way. His type resides on the top of the food chain in terms of race, gender and other criteria. Yet, somehow he is politically frustrated. Go figure. He is not a member of a radicalized generation born into oppression, foreign invasion, poverty and other untold humiliation. If that was the case, one can, at least to a degree fathom the hate, deconstruct the anger, or even rationalize that violence is a natural outcome of a certain reality.

    Hicks is of the Fox News demographic, gun touting unreasonably and immeasurably angry, white American. Self-proclaimed atheist or otherwise, it matters little. So Hicks, we are told, killed the students “execution style” because of a dispute over parking spaces.

    The same way that Chris Kyle — “The American Sniper” — made 164 confirmed “kills” in Iraq, targeting “savages” because that’s what national heroes do. And US wars and sanctions on Iraq killed, starved and wounded millions to bring democracy to the Arabs. This selectively insane logic will persist, however, because there are millions of unrepentant politicians, extremist media pundits and well-armed men and women who refuse to see the recklessness of their “logic.”

    They will continue to feed violence — which unlike what Hicks is led to believe — didn’t start on 9/11 — and spit out the most dangerous of militant phenomena: Al-Qaeda, IS and all the rest. It is time for Muslims to demand that Obama issue more than a statement, but call the US government and hate-filled media to account. These outrageous double standards must end, before more innocent lives are taken.

    Ramzy Baroud is a consultant at Middle East Eye. He is an internationally-syndicated columnist, a media consultant, an author and the founder of PalestineChronicle.com. His latest book is My Father Was a Freedom Fighter: Gaza’s Untold Story

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #76 - February 18, 2015, 08:37 PM

    This was a horrific crime. It was certainly committed by an atheist, one who was fond of the "New Atheist" popular writers, including Dawkins, Harris and Hitchens.

    But there's no evidence that the crime was inspired by his atheism.  There's not even much evidence of anti-Muslim bias.  On his Facebook page, he went out of his way to support the so-called "Ground Zero" mosque, and calling the 9/11 hijackers "extremists" who "were not practicing Islam any more than Jim Jones and David Koresh practiced Christianity.”   http://www.breitbart.com/video/2015/02/12/report-chapel-hill-shooter-hicks-defended-ground-zero-mosque/

    I have no problem admitting that he was an atheist.  I don't even have a problem admitting that some of Harris' ideas are deeply disturbing (profiling, for example).  But this murder, while vicious, doesn't appear to be related to religion.  I'm of course open to revisiting the question if more evidence comes to light, but at the moment it looks like he had some sort of mental break.  And was, unfortunately, armed.
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #77 - February 18, 2015, 08:39 PM

    Yup! Mix of mental health system deficiencies, lax gun control, lack of anger management in the guy and potentially in his sub-conscious anyway a reaction to the headscarf (not proved).
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #78 - February 18, 2015, 08:47 PM

    But would he actually have pulled the trigger if they had been three run-of-the-mill white 'Muricans?

    While his lack of anti-Muslim bigotry with the available information is extremely evident I neither can nor will at this time dismiss that them "looking different" played a role in that last part where he actually went through.

    EDIT: As Llly wrote Tongue

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  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #79 - February 18, 2015, 08:53 PM

    I don't think we can even begin to imagine how anyone could execute three people over the hijab or parking disputes, because, thankfully, we are not sociopaths or experiencing some kind of psychotic break.  I just think that it is inappropriate to attribute anti-Muslim bias to this simply because he was an atheist.  Which is what I think is going on, by and large.

    Believe me, I have known atheists who were anti-Muslim, atheists who were racists, atheists who harbor all sorts of prejudices.  Not believing in God/Yahweh/Allah is not a remedy for all human moral failings.   I just don't think there's much demonstrable evidence of it here.
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #80 - February 18, 2015, 08:55 PM

    I don't think we can even begin to imagine how anyone could execute three people over the hijab or parking disputes, because, thankfully, we are not sociopaths or experiencing some kind of psychotic break.  I just think that it is inappropriate to attribute anti-Muslim bias to this simply because he was an atheist.  Which is what I think is going on, by and large.

    Believe me, I have known atheists who were anti-Muslim, atheists who were racists, atheists who harbor all sorts of prejudices.  Not believing in God/Yahweh/Allah is not a remedy for all human moral failings.  I just don't think there's much demonstrable evidence of it here.


    Absolutely! At least there is no sacred text to be interpreted to support this kind of stuff!
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #81 - February 18, 2015, 10:02 PM

    Yeah.  I don't think my copy of Michael Martin's Atheism: A Philosophical Justification lays out the atheist case for violence, thankfully. :-)

    That's why I find the coverage so dishonest.  If a Christian bombs an abortion clinic, I don't say "Theism is responsible," but I will probably point to the doctrines he was espousing, based on his reading of the bible, to show that it is a religiously motivated action.  But neither theism nor atheism come wrapped in dogma; that's the role of the religious ideologies. 
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #82 - February 20, 2015, 01:33 AM

    Sam Harris podcast on The Chapel Hill Murders and 'Militant' Atheism

    click and hear him...

    Quote
    Murder of Muslims In the land of ‘wild freedom’ writes Rabia Alavi

    News of the senseless execution-style murders of the three Muslim university students in North Carolina has made me sick in my heart. The country that we often idealize as “the land of the free,” now seems like the land of “wild freedom,” where a gun-toting neighbor can murder you just because he does not like the way you look, dress, speak, or no wait, just because he disapproves of your use of parking space in the neighborhood.

    While Craig Stephen Hicks is a self-declared atheist, who held all religions in disdain, the Muslim community — in the US and elsewhere — doubt that this was simply a parking dispute. And they are probably right, for this is a country where Islamophobia is a stark reality.

    Day after day, the average American sits down in front of his television to see a bigoted picture, a view that demonizes and alienates Muslim minorities all over the world. Media audiences are taught to equate all Muslims with a small minority of extremists who indulge in terrorist activities. Speakers such as Richard Dawkins are free to spew spiteful venom against Muslims, Congress members can, and do propose and pass anti-Shariah bills, and thousands of primetime news hours are spent vilifying Islam.

    Quote
    There is no such thing as objectivity in the manner that media agencies choose to tell a story, and their double standards allow them to pick and choose stories that ensure the propagation of only a particular viewpoint. When the perpetrators of a crime are Muslims, like they were in the Sydney siege, the Boston marathon, or even before, in the 7/7 or 9/11 attacks, mainstream media, and even many politicians belonging to this “land of wild freedom” take no time to demarcate the world, dividing it into “us” and “them,” with their loud headlines and minute-by-minute coverage.

    However, when the victims are Muslims, or thought to be Muslim, it becomes an isolated case: A deranged or upset man, in this case one with a general disregard for all religions (and neighbors), who found easy prey in the house of three practicing young Muslims.


    The crux of the tragedy that shook the families of the three Muslim students killed last week is probably that it was the outcome of the daily dose of suspicion and hatred of Muslims that is pumped into the average an American. Yet, in the polarized grounds laid down by this mixture of media bias and the global antipathy toward Muslims, there is something else that we now need to think about and come to terms with when we think about migration.

    Muslim migrants who make the choice to move to the US for the sake of quality education, better jobs or political stability, often lacking in our home countries, should know full well the challenges that await them. Granted that America is a democracy. While that means a voice and legal rights for everyone, the fact remains that it is one where Muslims are not the majority. It is also a country where others also use the very freedom that we set out to enjoy, to express their dislike of our presence there.

    Muslims are different, and we always will be. Even as we embrace some of the values and culture of our country of immigration, there will be strings of discord — in what we choose to wear, the language we speak and the rituals, values and beliefs that we carry forward. These differences might not be acceptable to everyone, and the deadly consequence of this dislike might result in some migrants paying a price as high as this: It can get you killed — perhaps defenseless, and in the sanctuary of your own home.

    well that is what she thinks....

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #83 - February 20, 2015, 02:09 PM

    This was a horrific crime. It was certainly committed by an atheist, one who was fond of the "New Atheist" popular writers, including Dawkins, Harris and Hitchens.

    But there's no evidence that the crime was inspired by his atheism.  There's not even much evidence of anti-Muslim bias.  On his Facebook page, he went out of his way to support the so-called "Ground Zero" mosque, and calling the 9/11 hijackers "extremists" who "were not practicing Islam any more than Jim Jones and David Koresh practiced Christianity.”   http://www.breitbart.com/video/2015/02/12/report-chapel-hill-shooter-hicks-defended-ground-zero-mosque/

    I have no problem admitting that he was an atheist.  I don't even have a problem admitting that some of Harris' ideas are deeply disturbing (profiling, for example).  But this murder, while vicious, doesn't appear to be related to religion.  I'm of course open to revisiting the question if more evidence comes to light, but at the moment it looks like he had some sort of mental break.  And was, unfortunately, armed.


    Anti-theism can be taken to extremes. Keep in mind there is a difference between an atheist and an anti-theist. Take Marx's view of "opium of the masses" as an example. Look up the history of opium and you can see why it was used. If religion is a drug then the believers are the users. Justice systems go after both. If you cut down on the amount of available users this harms the dealer. If you cut down on the amount of dealers the users will have more issues gaining access to the drug. It only take a few internal and/or external influences to push one to extremes. Also the appeal of mental issues as a cause are often a facade to cover up the reality in which one must live within; poverty, abuse of minorities, etc. Keep in mind I am not suggesting this happens to be true for this case. I just pointing out how easy mental issues are used as a scapegoat.
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #84 - March 04, 2015, 04:36 AM

    US prosecutor seeks death for suspect in killing 3 Muslims says SAND LAND  Arab news. com



    Jordanians take part in a demonstration in Amman on Feb. 17, 2015 in solidarity with the three Muslim American students murdered last week in the North Carolina university town of Chapel Hill. US prosecutors on Tuesday said they are seeking a death sentence for Craig Stephen Hicks, the accused killer.

    Quote
    CHAPEL HILL, North Carolina: Prosecutors plan to seek the death sentence for a man accused of killing three Muslim students in North Carolina last month.
    Durham County District Attorney Roger Echols filed papers in court that show he plans to seek the death sentence if Craig Stephen Hicks is convicted of first-degree murder.
    Hicks has been charged with killing 23-year-old Deah Shaddy Barakat; his wife, 21-year-old Yusor Mohammad Abu-Salha; and her sister, 19-year-old Razan Mohammad Abu-Salha, on Feb. 10.
    Police say the shootings were over a long-running dispute over parking at the condominium complex. The victims’ families have said religious bias played a prominent role in the shootings.
    A hearing is set for next month on Echols’ request to seek the death penalty if Hicks is convicted.


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NqnD1iDKEfQ

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #85 - March 04, 2015, 04:42 AM

    Demonstrations around the globe on that Muslim HATE CRIME

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VHc2RaVEbpg

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ORgIIjVfzb8

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-K9G5xVqQFo

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pn-NxoIN8Ic

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #86 - March 04, 2015, 05:11 AM

    This event is confusing the hell out of the American right wing, they don't know who they're supposed to hate more, the atheist or the Muslim. On the one hand, atheism is the world's greatest threat to humanity, and also the guy's a killer; on the other hand, Muslims are the world's greatest threat to humanity, and also those guys are probably terrorists.

    This guy figured it out:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ktg3HHF2Pbo

    Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil, for I have a sonic screwdriver, a tricorder, and a Type 2 phaser.
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #87 - March 04, 2015, 05:30 AM

    let me replace a word here... and add more tubes on that hate crime(if it is)
    .......... Muslims .. Islam and any unquestionable religions/beliefs are the world's greatest threat to humanity, .....


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_lRJExc5Gs

    Protests in Gaza over Chapel Hill killings
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2bKV5R_hdA

    Exclusive Interview: Brother of Chapel Hill shooting victims
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_FhSpw6Ichs


    AMRIKA is filled with nut cases., anger management problems cheap guns .. expensive Psychiatrists, expensive Psycho medications .. Add to that religious hate .. hate because others looks different   

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #88 - March 04, 2015, 05:36 AM

    let me replace a word here... and add more tubes on that hate crime(if it is)

    AMRIKA is filled with nut cases., anger management problems cheap guns .. expensive Psychiatrists, expensive Psycho medications .. Add to that religious hate .. hate because others looks different   


    I thought it was pretty clear from the thing I posted that I was just explaining what the American right wing nutjobs believe. Most of them are very religious, and were raised during the McCarthy era "fear the red menace" shit, and they soaked that up, and then they've soaked up all the shit since 9/11, including all of George Bush's shit.

    Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil, for I have a sonic screwdriver, a tricorder, and a Type 2 phaser.
  • Atheist terror attack in the US - three young Muslim students killed
     Reply #89 - March 05, 2015, 03:39 PM

    I thought it was pretty clear from the thing I posted that I was just explaining what the American right wing nutjobs believe. Most of them are very religious, and were raised during the McCarthy era "fear the red menace" shit, and they soaked that up, and then they've soaked up all the shit since 9/11, including all of George Bush's shit.

    Oops I missed galfromusa post.,

    Hello gal from usa..... glad to read your response ., ......Booornnn in usaaaa.... maaade in usssssaaa... you are absolutely right and indeed you are very clear in your words.   The  fault lies in me please forgive me for writing erratically.... not always but some times I write nonsense....

    Anyway on that shit "McCarthy era "fear the red menace" shit, and they soaked that up, and then they've soaked up all the shit since 9/11, including all of George Bush's shit. "

    no one can help you guys.. no one can help AMRIKANOOS..., It is not just Bush that is the problem .. but the mindset .. the Bushy mindset is the problem.. But I believe you Americans are brave ..

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CtpzIVAF3mk

    I have faith in freedom of expression So you will take your government back every 4 years.  Rest of the globe is not that lucky as you guys are.

    with best wishes
    yeezevee

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
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