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 Topic: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?

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  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #60 - August 29, 2011, 01:23 PM
    Quote from: debunker on August 29, 2011, 12:43 PM
    no, and no. i discussed this plenty of times before, and i'm only here briefly, and honestly, i'm not interested in discussing Islam any more.


    I respect that.

    I'm just trying to understand your beliefs, really, even if it sounds like I'm being antagonistic.

    If it's not too much trouble, would you mind passing on a few of those posts you made that you feel express your position well?
    قل للمليحة في الخمار الأسود
    مـاذا فـعــلت بــناسـك مـتـعـبد

    قـد كـان شـمّر لــلـصلاة ثـيابه
    حتى خـطرت له بباب المسجد

    ردي عليـه صـلاتـه وصيـامــه
    لا تـقــتـلــيه بـحـق ديــن محمد
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #61 - August 29, 2011, 02:17 PM
    Quote
    no, and no. i discussed this plenty of times before, and i'm only here briefly, and honestly, i'm not interested in discussing Islam any more.


    There is only so much you can do then it becomes all banal and pointless...
    Little Fly, Thy summer's play
    My thoughtless hand has brushed away.

    I too dance and drink, and sing,
    Till some blind hand shall brush my wing.

    Therefore I am a happy fly,
    If I live or if I die.
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #62 - August 29, 2011, 04:36 PM
      strongest argument  against the Quran  -  

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-9lyMmHeaDs
    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim     
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #63 - August 29, 2011, 05:51 PM
    hello debunker  Smiley 
    ''we are morally and philisophically in the best position to win the league'' - Arsene Wenger
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #64 - August 29, 2011, 06:25 PM
    Quote from: debunker on August 29, 2011, 12:43 PM
    no, and no. i discussed this plenty of times before, and i'm only here briefly, and honestly, i'm not interested in discussing Islam any more.


    You seem like a nice guy, but I actually find it a bit strange that you came in this thread to join in the roasting of Whoman. I've read a number of pages on that thread you've posted and you guys seem very similar - ostensively nice guys who have developed extremely convoluted defences of the Quran in order to stay muslim.

    (Especially the part where you justify the idea that a 'merciful and caring' creator would choose to bring into existence humanity, knowing that large numbers of them would be mercilessly tortured in the same hell that he created).


     
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #65 - August 29, 2011, 06:27 PM
    You seem like a nice guy, but I actually find it a bit strange that you came in this thread to join in the roasting of Whoman. I've read a number of pages on that thread you've posted and you guys seem very similar - ostensively nice guys who have developed extremely convoluted defences of the Quran in order to stay muslim.
    ..............

    And you want to take this defence away?
    Little Fly, Thy summer's play
    My thoughtless hand has brushed away.

    I too dance and drink, and sing,
    Till some blind hand shall brush my wing.

    Therefore I am a happy fly,
    If I live or if I die.
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #66 - August 29, 2011, 06:32 PM
    Quote from: Gladfly on August 29, 2011, 06:27 PM
    And you want to take this defence away?


    WTF gladfly?  Huh?

    The main reason I asked the question was because I was surprised that he wanted to jump on board the roast when they seem to have a similar perspective.

    I put that part about hell because it's only the second time in my life I've ever read that defence of hell (that debunker gave in the thread), and I find it shocking and morally abhorrent. That was it, I wasn't looking to start a long debate with the guy if that's what you were implying.


    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #67 - August 29, 2011, 06:35 PM
    He is obviosly avoiding any form of engagement. We should let that be.
    Little Fly, Thy summer's play
    My thoughtless hand has brushed away.

    I too dance and drink, and sing,
    Till some blind hand shall brush my wing.

    Therefore I am a happy fly,
    If I live or if I die.
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #68 - August 29, 2011, 06:38 PM
    Quote from: Gladfly on August 29, 2011, 06:35 PM
    He is obviosly avoiding any form of engagement. We should let that be.


    He's free to decide if he wants to reply or not, he doesn't need you to protect him from questions. This is an internet forum dude.  Huh?
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #69 - August 29, 2011, 06:40 PM
    Quote from: strangestdude on August 29, 2011, 06:25 PM
    You seem like a nice guy, but I actually find it a bit strange that you came in this thread to join in the roasting of Whoman. I've read a number of pages on that thread you've posted and you guys seem very similar - ostensively nice guys who have developed extremely convoluted defences of the Quran in order to stay muslim.


    1- I'm no Quranist.
    2- it's easy to make blanket statements like yours without actually quoting what I actaully said. Unlike Quranists, i don't arbitrarily interpret Quran. Ask AbuYunus (blade Gunner) and Hassan about me.... or you can start by showing me where I made an arbitrary interpreatation of the Quran.  

    Quote
    (Especially the part where you justify the idea that a 'merciful and caring' creator would choose to bring into existence humanity, knowing that large numbers of them would be mercilessly tortured in the same hell that he created).

    A quote would be nice.

     
    A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #70 - August 29, 2011, 06:41 PM
    OK dude i shall let you be. Smiley
    Little Fly, Thy summer's play
    My thoughtless hand has brushed away.

    I too dance and drink, and sing,
    Till some blind hand shall brush my wing.

    Therefore I am a happy fly,
    If I live or if I die.
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #71 - August 29, 2011, 06:41 PM
    Quote from: strangestdude on August 29, 2011, 06:32 PM

    I put that part about hell because it's only the second time in my life I've ever read that defence of hell (that debunker gave in the thread), and I find it shocking and morally abhorrent. That was it, I wasn't looking to start a long debate with the guy if that's what you were implying.


    Of course, you're the morally superior humanist!anyway, quote and discuss.
    A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #72 - August 29, 2011, 06:43 PM
    Quote from: Blade Gunner on August 29, 2011, 05:51 PM
    hello debunker  Smiley 


    Abuyunus!  dance
    A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #73 - August 29, 2011, 06:47 PM
    @ dude

    besides, in case you have missed it, i already explained to harakat that the whole comment was meant to tease AbuYunus (since he was a Quranist whom I predicted his apostasy for his Quranistic views). Plus, whoman is the one who's longing for a discussion.... your acceptance would only please him (so no harm done on my part from this perspective either). 
    A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #74 - August 29, 2011, 07:02 PM
    Who are you debunker?



    Little Fly, Thy summer's play
    My thoughtless hand has brushed away.

    I too dance and drink, and sing,
    Till some blind hand shall brush my wing.

    Therefore I am a happy fly,
    If I live or if I die.
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #75 - August 29, 2011, 07:03 PM
    I didn't write you were a Quranist.

    Whoman (like yourself) argues that his understanding of the Quran isn't arbitrary, he claims it's based on reason - just like yourself. That really was my point, he claims to be doing exactly what your doing - using reason and research to understand the Quran.

    No offence but it personally reminded me of the inter-sect accusations I used to come across when I was a muslim - each sect accusing and ridiculing the others of twisting Islam to fit their whims, and only their way is based on classical teachings and rationality.

    It still irritates me, I suppose it's a hang up from my muslim days.

    Here's the defence you made for hell that shocked me (took me a while to find)...

    Quote from: debunker on January 13, 2011, 03:12 AM
    Injustice? No, I think even if God burned me, all of humanity (along with the prophets) and all the angels in heaven for all eternity in the deepest pit in Hell, WHILE giving Satan and the rest of demons eternal bliss, then that's still just, simply because God owes His creation ABSOLUTELY nothing. He only owes it to Himself (and no one else) to be *merciful*.


    Like I wrote, it's only the second time in my life I've ever heard/read that defence of hell.

    I meant what I wrote, you seem like nice guy and I wasn't looking to drag you into a drawn out debate.
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #76 - August 29, 2011, 07:04 PM
    Quote from: debunker on August 29, 2011, 06:41 PM
    Of course, you're the morally superior humanist!anyway, quote and discuss.


    I originally just put a  Roll Eyes here, but I'll quickly explain.

    I don't think that simply believing that eternal torture is wrong, means I'm arrogant. That kind of sarcastic comment is a common one I'm seen muslims make 'you think you know/are better than Allah/Muhammad?'.

    I'm willing to openly state that yes I'm morally superior to Allah, I wouldn't choose to bring human beings into existence knowing that large numbers of them would be tortured for eternity. And I couldn't enjoy heaven (if I were to go) whilst hearing the screams of people being tortured in hell.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjAGEI3Zu6E

    (damn it I wasn't looking to draw you into debate but I wanted to respond to that cheap shot)
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #77 - August 29, 2011, 07:50 PM
    Quote
    I'm willing to openly state that yes I'm morally superior to Allah, I wouldn't choose to bring human beings into existence knowing that large numbers of them would be tortured for eternity.

     
    oh, so that's what you meant? then there's no need for a discussion. I said it before, and I'll say it again, I do not think that even the worst criminals in humanity would allow the eternal torture of other men. Ok, I'll stop right there because i hate repeating myself.

    Quote
    And I couldn't enjoy heaven (if I were to go) whilst hearing the screams of people being tortured in hell.

    oh come on! I bet you could enjoy the most expensive luxuries in life from time to time while fully knowing that sacrificing a tiny bit would lessen the intensity of the cries of a few sufferers in this world, yet, you'd prefer to buy that expensive perfume or bottle of champaign, etc, over spending the luxury money on some unfortunate souls. Now, just imagine how far you're capable of enjoying your fortunes when you already know there's nothing you can do to help ease the suffering of others!

    So unless you're the kind who actaully spends the bare minimum to meet their most basic needs, in order to be able to save the rest of your fortune to help sufferers of this world, please drop this pretentious self-righteous act.... it's nauseating.
    A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #78 - August 29, 2011, 07:51 PM
    Good to see you again, debunker. Smiley
    How are things?  You a married man now?  Tongue
    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #79 - August 29, 2011, 08:01 PM

    debunker!

    Has a month of pointless starvation / binge eating / halitosis for the desert god brought you to your senses?

    No matter, even if you are still a believer, its good to see you  Afro
    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    Quote from: arX on May 01, 2011, 03:33 AM
    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #80 - August 29, 2011, 08:06 PM
    Quote from: ateapotist on August 29, 2011, 07:51 PM
    Good to see you again, debunker. Smiley
    How are things?  You a married man now?  Tongue


    nope, not yet... i've been engaged and un-engaged quite a few times alrerady :(
    A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #81 - August 29, 2011, 08:12 PM
    Quote from: billy on August 29, 2011, 08:01 PM
    debunker!

    Has a month of pointless starvation / binge eating / halitosis for the desert god brought you to your senses?

    No matter, even if you are still a believer, its good to see you  Afro


    hey there, billy! I see you're carrying something that used to belong to me! You know that object we both fiercely competed for and which I easily won after I demolished you! I could do it again too should I ever wish to win it back!  yes
    A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #82 - August 29, 2011, 08:16 PM
    debunker I am only looking after it in your absence  Afro
    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    Quote from: arX on May 01, 2011, 03:33 AM
    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #83 - August 29, 2011, 08:28 PM
    Quote from: debunker on August 29, 2011, 08:06 PM
    nope, not yet... i've been engaged and un-engaged quite a few times alrerady :(

    damn,  that sucks.  Good luck, bro.
    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #84 - August 29, 2011, 08:28 PM
    Quote
    debunker I am only looking after it in your absence  

     

    actaully that's a good idea! I can't stand the thought that my crown could be defiled again by you know who (yzve)..... besides, to be honest, your winning it actaully adds more to its value!
    A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #85 - August 30, 2011, 12:31 AM
    Quote from: debunker on August 29, 2011, 07:50 PM
    oh come on! I bet you could enjoy the most expensive luxuries in life from time to time while fully knowing that sacrificing a tiny bit would lessen the intensity of the cries of a few sufferers in this world, yet, you'd prefer to buy that expensive perfume or bottle of champaign, etc, over spending the luxury money on some unfortunate souls. Now, just imagine how far you're capable of enjoying your fortunes when you already know there's nothing you can do to help ease the suffering of others!

    So unless you're the kind who actaully spends the bare minimum to meet their most basic needs, in order to be able to save the rest of your fortune to help sufferers of this world, please drop this pretentious self-righteous act.... it's nauseating.

    LOL would love to see you and Gary (Inmendham) go at each other on blogtv dance

    Btw awesome seeing you back here again, even if it's just for a little while. Smiley
    I know someday you'll have a beautiful life, I know you'll be a star
    In somebody else's sky, but why, why, why
    Can't it be, can't it be mine

    https://twitter.com/AlharbiMoe
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #86 - August 30, 2011, 12:38 AM
    who invited debunker here?
    Now the thread will keep going in pointless back and forth arguments.
    Admin of following facebook pages and groups:
    Islam's Last Stand (page)
    Islam's Last Stand (group)
    and many others...
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #87 - August 30, 2011, 12:59 AM
    As opposed to how it was before?
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #88 - August 30, 2011, 01:13 AM
    Quote from: debunker on August 29, 2011, 07:50 PM



    So unless you're the kind who actaully spends the bare minimum to meet their most basic needs, in order to be able to save the rest of your fortune to help sufferers of this world, please drop this pretentious self-righteous act.... it's nauseating.


    good point
    At evening, casual flocks of pigeons make
    Ambiguous undulations as they sink,
    Downward to darkness, on extended wings. - Stevens
  • Re: 5 strongest arguments against the Quran - debate challenge for all?
     Reply #89 - August 30, 2011, 01:22 AM
    The idea that strangestdude wouldn't worry about the suffering of the eternally tormented in hell if he were in heaven does nothing to dilute his real point which was that he feels morally superior to a god who would exact such a cruel punishment in the first place.

    Just because I don't donate all of my earnings to help alleviate suffering in a famine struck region, that doesn't make me morally equivalent to the warlords who torched the fields in the first place.
    Quote from: yeezevee on February 11, 2016, 02:05 PM
    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
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