Back to being a Muslim

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- Hananii
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #30 - July 14, 2011, 10:19 PM

Welcome to the forum Maria!

Quote from: Maria on July 14, 2011, 08:51 PM
I left Islam 2 years ago because I was in a serious relationship and my religion was pretty much offensive to him.

He brainwashed me enough to consider leaving and actually fully HATE Islam and what it stood for.

This is actually wut began my questioning about religion.
He didnt brainwash me or anything, but since he wasnt Muslim he kinda got me to think about other religions and then research.
My (ex) bf just plainly hated Islam and would constantly mock it wen ii was Muslim.
He obviously was just hateful, it wasnt even anything about rationality.

But anyway,
When you really push what everyone else around u taught you aside, and u question wut YOU believe, is wen u find the truth.
At least thats how it is from my end.
I stop listening to everyone else, and actually thought "....do I really believe this and everything that comes with it?"

But yeah, again, welcome to the forum.
Enjoy ur stay!
- Maria
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #31 - July 14, 2011, 10:22 PM

Every religion has the same purpose - security, dealing with pain and suffering, and most importantly feeling loved, etc.

Religion IS powerful and so it is and will continue to be abused! What is the source of all this pain and suffering anyway?

It's from our selfish desires. Yes, I am quoting Buddha because I truly believe in that principle and it also runs parallel to

Islamic views. For instance, a Hindu wants the same thing or purpose as a Muslim and vice versa.

All paths, religions, instructions are but a finger pointing to the moon. Unfortunately, we get lost in the journey

and can never see beyond.
- deusvult
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #32 - July 14, 2011, 10:28 PM

All people want generally the same things, religious or irreligious. So why do they discriminate so much between believer and non believer, sacred and wicked, ecstasy of paradise and pain and punishment of hell?

So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
My political philosophy below
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
Just kidding, here are some true heros
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
- Maria
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #33 - July 14, 2011, 10:30 PM

Hello. Nice to meet you! I'm glad we were both on the same boat and you can understand

the kind of force love has over us! I truly believe that the power of love can overcome

anything and bridge gaps as wide as the universe. Love truly is a novelty.

There are times where I still can't come to terms with Islam. My mom

can be overbearing with her religious rituals and that can be annoying.
- deusvult
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #34 - July 14, 2011, 10:32 PM

I edited some more in oh and I

So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
My political philosophy below
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
Just kidding, here are some true heros
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
- Maria
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #35 - July 14, 2011, 10:44 PM

Because it's their EGO talking. Islam asks you to respect others and their faiths.

We cannot be discriminating or hating people who are NOT Muslim. Noone has

that God-given right! Maybe all these disputes between religions has a purpose.

It leads us to the Truth - whatever that may be.
- deusvult
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #36 - July 14, 2011, 10:57 PM

Quote
Because it's their EGO talking. Islam asks you to respect others and their faiths.

We cannot be discriminating or hating people who are NOT Muslim. Noone has

that God-given right! Maybe all these disputes between religions has a purpose.

It leads us to the Truth - whatever that may be.

I have to respectfully disagree, but not in the way you think. I think Islam, Christianity, and other faiths speak, very often, in disparaging terms of other religions and/or consign them in the hereafter to some very terrible places. I don't think people who emphasis this aspect in religion such as the takfiri Jihadis or the Anjem Choudary's of Islam and the Statue of Liberty is a heathen god Christian preachers are not necessary abusing Islam or Christianity. I think it is a built in part of religions to emphasis solidarity IN their group while distancing themselves from OTHER groups. That is why you have the Dar al Islam and the Dar al Harb and not a universality in either Islam or Christianity ( Christians and pagans respectively) . I think many Muslims and Christians and whomever do feel an urge to universal humanity though and for those reasons and generally just being good people tend to ignore the more unpleasant sides of religion until it becomes necessary to embrace it.

I do think though that Islam and Christianity and other religions DO have very good aspects such as taking care of the poor, the sick, the afflicted, and to solidarity to each others wants and needs. The brotherhood and warmth afforded isn't something trivial to be thrown away. Muslims and Christians do apply this not only to themselves but also to others on occasion and that is a good thing.

To the last part I think the Truth in regards to religions is fairly obvious, but as human beings we are not all that interested in the Truth ( capital T) but in the truth of our situation as well. We can lie to ourselves quite convincingly and that isn't necessarily a bad thing. I think that is something we wrestle with every day.

So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
My political philosophy below
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
Just kidding, here are some true heros
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
- Alex Lam Meem
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #37 - July 14, 2011, 11:08 PM

Have to respectfully disagree withe deus and support the tolerant muslim: I've always loved the tolerance in 20 or so ayas preceding the famously tolerant 2:62 and 20 or so ayas after it.

"That it is indeed the speech of an illustrious messenger" (The Koran 69:40)
- deusvult
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #38 - July 14, 2011, 11:13 PM

I think you missed the point of what I said, it's not either tolerance or intolerance proposition, it's an " and " proposition.

So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
My political philosophy below
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
Just kidding, here are some true heros
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
- Maria
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #39 - July 14, 2011, 11:18 PM

Chrisitianity and Islam are both dualistic religions. There's GOD up stairs and YOU below.

It's a personal God that caters to our needs in times of despair. And awaits our thanks

when we forget Him or Her because we're too busy spending our money or enjoying

ourselves. Other paths, so to speak, such as Hinduism are universal with their God or

Goddesses. In Hinduism, you are a manifestation of God. God is one and you're a

part of the holiness which I honestly find to be beautiful and the way Islam should

have been!

I agree that the truth is something we all must struggle with consciously on a daily
basis. We all want to believe we'll be saved and we take that thought to bed with
us everynight. It's the only hope some people have.
- Maria
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #40 - July 14, 2011, 11:23 PM

Quote from: deusvult on July 14, 2011, 10:57 PM
To the last part I think the Truth in regards to religions is fairly obvious, but as human beings we are not all that interested in the Truth ( capital T) but in the truth of our situation as well. We can lie to ourselves quite convincingly and that isn't necessarily a bad thing. I think that is something we wrestle with every day.

But religion is not a ritual. And religion is not a ceremonial thing, it is not a social formality.

It's a gamble. It needs guts. It needs you to put your whole being at stake - and to stake

that which you know for that which you don't know needs real courage, because you cannot

in any way predict the outcome. It is leaving that which you know for that which you don't know.

And you never know whether you are going to be a loser or a winner.

All is vague. Great courage is needed.
- Alex Lam Meem
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #41 - July 14, 2011, 11:27 PM

I'm not sure if I misunderstood you, deus, I just wanted to see if Maria interprets the Koran the same way I do

@Maria,

In your dualism, where is Shaytan located at? Upstairs or down below?

"That it is indeed the speech of an illustrious messenger" (The Koran 69:40)
- Maria
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #42 - July 14, 2011, 11:42 PM

Shaitan was kicked downstairs!!!
- Alex Lam Meem
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #43 - July 15, 2011, 12:14 AM

But he was made by the guy upstairs, like the rest of us downstairs, right? Let's assume Shaitan deserved being "kicked downstairs", but why were you born "below/downstairs" before you even had a chance to sin? If you're going to sin, isn't it because you were created this way? Who's responsible for that?

"That it is indeed the speech of an illustrious messenger" (The Koran 69:40)
- yeezevee
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #44 - July 15, 2011, 12:37 AM

Quote from: Maria on July 14, 2011, 06:54 PM
Hello Everyone. My name is Maria and I just joined CEMB.

Huh! your name is Maria and you joined the forum with your original name?? I wonder whether you are this Maria_b., if you are your designs are really good.. Just kidding Maria.. Maria is such a common name in Islam., Muslim males wants every woman behave like Mary/Maria.. lol..
Quote
I know that it is very hard to come out and tell your loved ones about your decision because I know that I couldn't.

That is true but why tell everything to your loved ones?? there is no need to wear a t-shirt around with words "I am Ex-Muslim"
Quote
I can honestly say that being a Muslim, especially a Pakistani one, was the root of most of my personal problems. My parents were very controlling and overprotective of me. My parents wished that I was born a male so that I wouldn't be a burden for the next 20 something years until I got married (arranged by them, of course).

Well that is true not only in Pakistan about all over middles east, south east and far east., That is very unfortunate Maria., but folks like you could change that stupid perception of this society..

I am glad to read you and welcome to CEMB..

with best wishes
yeezevee

Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything
I renounced my faith to become a kafir,
the beloved betrayed me and turned in to a Muslim
- crazyislam
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #45 - July 15, 2011, 01:35 AM

Welcome to CEMB Maria!

To add to the questions above:

In the quran, it clearly states, atheists are made that way by Allah:

002.007
Quote
YUSUFALI: Allah hath set a seal on their hearts and on their hearing, and on their eyes is a veil; great is the penalty they (incur).
PICKTHAL: Allah hath sealed their hearing and their hearts, and on their eyes there is a covering. Theirs will be an awful doom.
SHAKIR: Allah has set a seal upon their hearts and upon their hearing and there is a covering over their eyes, and there is a great punishment for them.

Now, as we unbelievers are all destined to eternal torture, how could you justify this? Eternal damnation is in NO way justified, even for Hitler, let alone unbelievers. Now what kind of psycho would make someone us this way and enjoy torturing them for eternity?

Youtube
- Jinn and Tonic
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- Ex-Muslim
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #46 - July 15, 2011, 11:48 AM

ive been researching quantum intelligence, and I think the idea of it
has some valid theories, Some are far fetched, but not quite
unreachable. More plausible than a big sky daddy at any rate

When one door of happiness closes, another opens; but often we look so long at the closed door that we do not see the one which has been opened for us.
Helen Keller
- strangestdude
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #47 - July 15, 2011, 12:20 PM

Quote from: Jinn and Tonic on July 15, 2011, 11:48 AM
ive been researching quantum intelligence, and I think the idea of it
has some valid theories, Some are far fetched, but not quite
unreachable. More plausible than a big sky daddy at any rate

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HOAj90FPnDs

An alternative to religion;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
- Jinn and Tonic
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- Ex-Muslim
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #48 - July 15, 2011, 12:31 PM

omg strangedude! I LOVE THAT GUY! I have heard him many times (wish i could meet him)
and never tire of his theories and thoughts! tyvm for that!

When one door of happiness closes, another opens; but often we look so long at the closed door that we do not see the one which has been opened for us.
Helen Keller
- Hallakuf
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #49 - July 15, 2011, 12:52 PM

Good story! Ididn't know this guy, and I think his direction of thought is very much like mine. Religion and science can both exist together, as long as scientists don't discuss religion (which most don't) and religions don't discuss science (which most do).

Religion is organized superstition
- Cato
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #50 - July 15, 2011, 12:59 PM

Quote
In Hinduism, you are a manifestation of God. God is one and you're a

part of the holiness which I honestly find to be beautiful and the way Islam should

have been!

Maria, Have you ever come across a term called "Pantheism". If so tell me what you think about it?

"I'm standing here like an asshole holding my Charles Dickens"

"No theory,No ready made system,no book that has ever been written to save the world. i cleave to no system.."-Bakunin
- Maria
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #51 - July 15, 2011, 07:25 PM

Maria, Have you ever come across a term called "Pantheism". If so tell me what you think about it?

Hello. No, I have never heard of "Pantheism", but it's quite similar to Hinduism and Taoism.

Hinduism and Taoism literature both contained ideas that were pantheistic. In Hinduism,

Brahman (not to be confused with Brahma) is the sum total of all that ever is, was, or will be.

Personally, I do not agree with Pantheistic views because I think God can not be equated

to the universe ALONE. God is an Anaamika that is undefined and unconfined in nature.
- Maria
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #52 - July 15, 2011, 07:37 PM

Quote from: Alex Lam Meem on July 15, 2011, 12:14 AM
But he was made by the guy upstairs, like the rest of us downstairs, right? Let's assume Shaitan deserved being "kicked downstairs", but why were you born "below/downstairs" before you even had a chance to sin? If you're going to sin, isn't it because you were created this way? Who's responsible for that?

According to Islam and what I know of it, Shaitan WAS N OT made like the rest of us.

He was an angel, no? He refused to bow down before God and was therefore kicked out of

Heaven. It's the oldest tale in the world! Secondly, God made us human beings, not angels!

It's in our nature to sin! He knows we're not perfect and that we have feelings and urges!
- Maria
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #53 - July 15, 2011, 07:46 PM

Quote from: crazyislam on July 15, 2011, 01:35 AM
Welcome to CEMB Maria!

To add to the questions above:

In the quran, it clearly states, atheists are made that way by Allah:

002.007

Now, as we unbelievers are all destined to eternal torture, how could you justify this? Eternal damnation is in NO way justified, even for Hitler, let alone unbelievers. Now what kind of psycho would make someone us this way and enjoy torturing them for eternity?

Thanks for the welcome. The Koran is silent on the punishment for apostasy.

It speaks repeatedly of people going back to unbelief after believing, and gives

advice on dealing with hypocrites. I don't believe any God or entity can be so

cruel as to punish humans for eternity. God is forgiving and loving.

He is not a sadistic either!
- Maria
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #54 - July 15, 2011, 07:51 PM

Quote from: yeezevee on July 15, 2011, 12:37 AM
Huh! your name is Maria and you joined the forum with your original name?? I wonder whether you are this Maria_b., if you are your designs are really good.. Just kidding Maria.. Maria is such a common name in Islam., Muslim males wants every woman behave like Mary/Maria.. lol..

Thanks for the Welcome. Yes, Maria is my real name. It's my legal name.

I've been Maria allll my life. Nothing unusual or strange about it. I joined CEMB

as Maria because that's my name and I didn't have a reason to use a fake name.

There ARE alot of Maria's and Mary's and Mariams. I just happen to be one of them!
- Alex Lam Meem
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #55 - July 15, 2011, 07:53 PM

Quote from: Maria on July 15, 2011, 07:37 PM
According to Islam and what I know of it, Shaitan WAS N OT made like the rest of us.

He was an angel, no? He refused to bow down before God and was therefore kicked out of

Heaven. It's the oldest tale in the world! Secondly, God made us human beings, not angels!

It's in our nature to sin! He knows we're not perfect and that we have feelings and urges!

I did not mean to say that Iblis is like us. I meant to say that both us and Iblis have the same creator. You shout that it is in our nature to sin yet I never disagreed. I just said that creator (assuming there is one) should be responsible for the nature of the creatures, no?

"That it is indeed the speech of an illustrious messenger" (The Koran 69:40)
- Maria
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #56 - July 15, 2011, 08:16 PM

You shout that it is in our nature to sin yet I never disagreed. I just said that creator (assuming there is one) should be responsible for the nature of the creatures, no?

Yes, God is responsible for the nature of His creatures but the creatures

were given a path and guidance. God can't be responsible for our actions

and what we choose to do. We have our own minds and brains to apply.
- Alex Lam Meem
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #57 - July 15, 2011, 08:32 PM

@Maria

Let's say I agree with you so far. But do we really have our minds to decide right from wrong when something clashes with our nature, or should we just follow what God/Allah says is right? Where is that guidance you talk about? Is it inside of us or is it in the Koran?

"That it is indeed the speech of an illustrious messenger" (The Koran 69:40)
- Cato
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #58 - July 15, 2011, 08:59 PM

Quote
In Hinduism, you are a manifestation of God. God is one and you're a

part of the holiness which I honestly find to be beautiful and the way Islam should

have been!

Quote
Personally, I do not agree with Pantheistic views because I think God can not be equated

to the universe ALONE. God is an Anaamika that is undefined and unconfined in nature.

Hmmmm......i find these statements inconsistent

"I'm standing here like an asshole holding my Charles Dickens"

"No theory,No ready made system,no book that has ever been written to save the world. i cleave to no system.."-Bakunin
- crazyislam
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Re: Back to being a Muslim
Reply #59 - July 15, 2011, 11:23 PM

Quote from: Maria on July 15, 2011, 07:46 PM
Thanks for the welcome. The Koran is silent on the punishment for apostasy.

It speaks repeatedly of people going back to unbelief after believing, and gives

advice on dealing with hypocrites. I don't believe any God or entity can be so

cruel as to punish humans for eternity. God is forgiving and loving.

He is not a sadistic either!

I'm not talking about what you believe, but rather what is in the quran.

I'm not even talking about apostasy. I'm talking about afterlife.

Okay, let me make it clear for you:

Allah has sealed the heart of unbelievers, as the verse in questions says. So Allah clearly knows that unbelievers are destined to hell.

Now what on earth would you call a person who would do that and torture people other than a sadistic prick? How on earth is this merciful?

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