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Theme Changer

 Topic: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed

 (Read 25351 times)
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  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #90 - July 25, 2011, 11:45 PM

    Throughout the entire 3 part series, there was not a single mention of something which is mentioned repeatedly in the Quran.  Namely, that the disbelievers are going to burn in hell according to the oh-so-peaceful Muhammad.

    A lot of subjective buzz words like "equality" and "justice" were thrown about in this documentry but the fact is that Muhammad was an imperialist fascist who wanted his God to prevail over all others.

    He did NOT put and end to the barbaric punishments which were carried out in pre Islamic Arabia.  Muhammad endorsed stonings, flogging, chopping hands off... (but lets give him credit for saying the females shouldn't buried alive I guess).  Roll Eyes

    Interesting that Tariq Ramadan denies that Aisha was 6 when Muhammad married her.  When they spoke about Muhammads marriage to Aisha I almost thought the BBC were going just tell it like it is for once... but they just had to cause confusion and doubt what Aishas real age was.

    The end of the 3rd part today, where they were talking about the sermon on the mount with victory music in the background and the highly enthusiastic Karen Armstrong getting all excited had me reaching for the sick bucket.

    .
  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #91 - July 26, 2011, 12:04 AM


    You forgot to mention the other elephant in the room - the death taboo that is ever present over criticism of Mohammad. A death / blasphemy taboo that meant this documentary could not really have presented anything other than effectively a hagiography.

    It was ever going to be thus, a propaganda for Mo and Islam.

    Karen Armstrong sounds like she was on a special dawah mission as well, what a trooper.



    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #92 - July 26, 2011, 12:32 AM

    A lot of important events were missed out, like the muslims who migrated to Abyssinia refused to bow to the Christian king (it'd be shirk innit) which was like a law, a lot of muslims/Islamists use this example to prove that a muslim MUST abide by sharia and not by the laws of a nation that might go against Islam. And when Surah Al-Kafiroon was 'revealed'.
  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #93 - July 26, 2011, 12:37 AM

    Nothing about Asma bint Marwan either.

    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #94 - July 26, 2011, 12:40 AM

    Can anyone provide evidence to prove that Islam gave women the right to own property?  I keep hearing this bullshit.

    .
  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #95 - August 01, 2011, 08:51 PM

    Thanks Musivore. Feel at home already.  :-)

    I am better than your god......and so are you.

    "Is the man who buys a magic rock, really more gullible than the man who buys an invisible magic rock?.......,...... At least the first guy has a rock!"
  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #96 - August 01, 2011, 09:03 PM

    Hey Adey, you took your time coming back... it's good that you have, because you've reminded me that I was gonna have a stab at giving Chris the info he asked for in his last post.

    Hi
  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #97 - August 01, 2011, 09:10 PM

    Can anyone provide evidence to prove that Islam gave women the right to own property?  I keep hearing this bullshit.


    Same thing i told the last imam that tried to convince me up till now  i have never heard from him again

    "I'm standing here like an asshole holding my Charles Dickens"

    "No theory,No ready made system,no book that has ever been written to save the world. i cleave to no system.."-Bakunin
  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #98 - November 06, 2011, 04:53 PM

    One thing I DID learn from this documentary, was that the islamic claim to the temple mount, is entirely based on a dream (the white horse flying story) that Mo was supposed to have had. I used to think (in my igorance) that there was a real justifiable territorial claim to that temple, but now I am astounded that it is all based on a dream.

    It kind of shifts my view-point a little on the theological arguments Israel/Palestine situation.

    Or have I got this all wrong?

    I am better than your god......and so are you.

    "Is the man who buys a magic rock, really more gullible than the man who buys an invisible magic rock?.......,...... At least the first guy has a rock!"
  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #99 - November 06, 2011, 06:48 PM

    btw read what they say about Tareq Ramadan on ummah.com - they hate his guts and call him all sorts of names - simply because he has tried to tweak Islam a little for the modern age!


    Those lot on Ummah.com are a bunch of despicable twats.
  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #100 - November 08, 2011, 05:11 PM

    During my angry atheist phase, I went on an Islam bashing rampage on forums, citing all the hadith that they had to justify. They were giving examples of good hadith, and I told them how it's bullshit by researching the methodology of hadith collection. Then realising, if the good is bullshit, then so is the bad. Then I chilled out, and realised that all hadith are potentially wrong or fabricated, the methodology I once assumed was rigorous and complex. I grew up hearing about the 'science' of hadith. But actually looking at Bukharis methodology, it's shockingly amateur, and considering it's over a hundred years, to 200 years after, listening to what is frankly gossip - I came to a realization, I had no idea who Muhammad was. We might as well ask someone in the year 2150 what Churchill was like as a person, purely from their memory of stories told from their grandparents, who learned from their grandparents.

    Honestly, using the methodology, it is sahih that Obama is a Muslim, and that NASA going to the moon, is disputed.

    The only thing I can say with confidence is that Muhamamd created a unified Arabia by trying to unite monotheistic religions. Having a unified nation with Jews calling Jesus a fraudster and Christians calling Jews Christ killers is difficult.

    Islam: Jesus was sent by God, but not divine, Jews didn't kill Jesus after all. Maybe a talented warrior poet, who had schizophrenia and genuinely heard voices. My theory is command auditory hallucinations.

    "Acting on Command Hallucinations: A Cognitive Approach
    Beck-Sander, A., M. Birchwood, & P. Chadwick. British Journal of Clinical Psychology, Feb. 1997, 36(Pt 1):139-48.
    This study explores factors influencing compliance with command hallucinations. The most widely acknowledged factor is the content of the command. Three categories of command content were found to be discrete in terms of compliance: "innocuous' commands, "severe' commands and commands to self-harm. This study takes a cognitive approach and highlights the importance of the beliefs individuals hold about their voices. Beliefs appear to be important in determining whether or not individuals comply with commands and the affect generated. A belief that the voice is benevolent was associated with compliance with both innocuous and severe commands. In addition, participants who believed they retained subjective control over their voices were less likely to comply with all types of command. Furthermore, qualitative evidence suggested that several other beliefs may influence compliance with command hallucinations such as beliefs about the effects of transgression, beliefs about the power and authority of the commander, beliefs about the social acceptability of the action (which may be closely correlated or synonymous with severity) and its effectiveness in achieving a valued goal. Further research is necessary to investigate the importance of these beliefs and their interrelationships more fully."

    http://www.julianjaynes.org/related-articles_command-hallucinations.php

    Does the above not sound like divine revelation in the 7th century desert? People often assume, one is either telling the truth, or is false. Often, one can do both at the same time.

    60% of schizos will attempt suicide at least once, mostly male. Muhamamd is said to have done so.

    Quote
    There has been no general agreement on the definition of late onset. Some studies chose 40 years of age as the cutoff,


    http://www.acnp.org/g4/GN401000138/CH135.html

    --------------------------------------------------------------------

    No way of testing obviously, but there is enough written stuff that has no MOTIVE for fabrication (a suicide attempt isn't really good PR) to gain some insight.

    I was working on this hypothesis for a week, a year ago. Quite an experience being Muhammad's therapist.  hope



    Before Jesus was, I AM.
  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #101 - November 08, 2011, 05:41 PM

    If he also had alexia accompanied with it...

    "The hallucinations consisted of grammatically correct, meaningful written sentences or phrases, often in the second person and with a threatening and command-like nature (syntacto-semantic visual hallucinations)"

    http://www.julianjaynes.org/pdf/ffytche-lappin-philpot_visual-command-hallucinations.pdf

    Of course such a combination of symptoms would be extremely rare, but then people who founded world religions, are extremely rare!

    Before Jesus was, I AM.
  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #102 - November 08, 2011, 05:49 PM

    Those lot on Ummah.com are a bunch of despicable twats.


    They seem like a decent, rational bunch to me. Smiley

    Formerly known as Iblis
  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #103 - November 08, 2011, 06:49 PM

    post human:

    many thanks for the article; it looks fascinating!

    Interested in Buddhism? Check out http://www.accesstoinsight.org/!
    Consider Nalanda University, and never let it happen again.
  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #104 - November 08, 2011, 06:53 PM

    It's not an article, just a post of mine, with some links.  Undecided


    Before Jesus was, I AM.
  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #105 - November 08, 2011, 06:57 PM

    Well, I clicked on the link to an article that I wouldn't have known about and am interested by its contents. So I still offer many thanks.

    Interested in Buddhism? Check out http://www.accesstoinsight.org/!
    Consider Nalanda University, and never let it happen again.
  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #106 - November 08, 2011, 07:02 PM

    Oh your perfectly welcome. sloshed

    Before Jesus was, I AM.
  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #107 - November 09, 2011, 12:08 PM

    They seem like a decent, rational bunch to me. Smiley


    Nope, most of them are judgemental and self-righteous morons.
  • Re: Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #108 - November 10, 2011, 10:09 AM

    Just watched all 3 parts in one go. It does give a bit of an objective look at his life, but I didn't appreciate the whole underlying bias (it was obv trying to please a Muslim audience) throughout the documentary..who could blame em though really. Was still a decent watch though.

    "Live a good life. If there are god(s) and they are just, you will be rewarded based on virtue. If they're unjust, then you shouldn't want to worship them. If there are no gods, you will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of others."

    -Re-interpretation of Marcus Aurelius
  • Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #109 - May 16, 2015, 07:20 PM

    This series is airing on Danish state TV channel 2 (DR2) currently. On Saturday nights so only lonely introverts will happen to watch it (each episode can be streamed within Denmark for a week though).

    Thanks to the contributors in this thread as I just read it through Smiley

    Here is the whole series on YouTube if anyone wants to take a peek:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7FvfFSIQZnI

    Danish Never-Moose adopted by the kind people on the CEMB-forum
    Ex-Muslim chat (Unaffliated with CEMB). Safari users: Use "#ex-muslims" as the channel name. CEMB chat thread.
  • Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #110 - May 26, 2015, 10:34 PM

    at 2015 Hay Festival - Tom Holland gives The Christopher Hitchens Lecture: De-radicalising Muhammad

    https://www.hayfestival.com/p-9673-tom-holland.aspx




    I am better than your god......and so are you.

    "Is the man who buys a magic rock, really more gullible than the man who buys an invisible magic rock?.......,...... At least the first guy has a rock!"
  • Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #111 - May 29, 2015, 12:48 AM

    I personally don't care for documentaries. I just read academic books when I want to find some serious information.
  • Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #112 - May 29, 2015, 11:46 AM

    Bully for you.
  • Tonight's BBC2 documentary on muhammed
     Reply #113 - May 30, 2015, 04:01 PM

    I'm a visual learner so I much prefer documentaries. I watch youtube clips on philosophy and science all day Tongue
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