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 Topic: Hitchens....Dawkins....Harris....

 (Read 8965 times)
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  • Re: Hitchens....Dawkins....Harris....
     Reply #90 - July 07, 2011, 02:04 PM

    Kurds?  Cheesy

    I don't know whether he cares or not about Kurds (I can't look into his mind) but I can tell you that everyone has a legitimate sounding excuse, Bush wanted to 'liberate' Iraq (good job my friend), and Cheney wanted to 'defend America' (from what?). Bush and Cheney really wanted to make money and flex muscles.

    So the fact that Hitchens says Kurds won't make me jump up and down in support.

    Oh, and this leads me back to my earlier question, there are hundreds of oppressed and genocided groups in the world, Assyrians in Iraq have it worst than Kurds, Kurds have it worst in Syria and have it quite bad in Turkey, Palestinians literally live in an open prison, I have a list longer than my arm, so saying 'Kurds' is a bit arbitrary, I like how any supporter of a war will randomly assign a group that needs protection. (hazaras, tajiks and women were assigned during Afghanistan, jews during WW2-not that I don't support WW2, but we all know it wasn't about the holocaust, Russia said it needed to protect the North Ossetians from Georgia etc etc-a good sob story will always provide more reason for an otherwise injustifiable invasion of a country).

    "Nobody who lived through the '50s thought the '60s could've existed. So there's always hope."-Tuli Kupferberg

    What apple stores are like.....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8QmZWv-eBI
  • Re: Hitchens....Dawkins....Harris....
     Reply #91 - July 07, 2011, 02:27 PM

    Kurds?  Cheesy

    I don't know whether he cares or not about Kurds (I can't look into his mind)

    well no one can look in to any one's mind., did Allah/god look in to Prophet's minds??  NO., . Whether Hitchens  really  like Kurds or not,  "no one can tell that" but he certainly hates ISLAM and Islamic mind sets, Islamic rulers  like Saddam or for that matter any with with Saddam's mindset.. That much is sure.

    Quote
    but I can tell you that everyone has a legitimate sounding excuse,

    may be..
    Quote
    Bush wanted to 'liberate' Iraq (good job my friend), and Cheney wanted to 'defend America' (from what?).

    Yes Bush  wanted to liberate Iraq from Saddam . he did it., and Yes Cheney wanted to 'defend America' he did it.,
    Quote
    from what??

    from Fools and rogues like those who flew planes in to building in the name of Allah.. By the way I AM NO SUPPORTER OF BUSH/CHENEY  AMERICAN POLICIES..
    Quote
    Bush and Cheney really wanted to make money and flex muscles. [

    that is true Bush/Cheney and their team  wanted to flex muscles.. and they did it. It is same as Saddam wanted to flex Muscles ro Osama wanted to flex Muscle .. but they don't have Muscles. "ISLAM HAS NO CALIPH AND NO MUSCLE.. it is all dead meat.  As far as "MONEY IS CONCERNED".. how much money did they make?? and how much money they  need for rest of their lives??

    That is silly..
    Quote
    So the fact that Hitchens says Kurds won't make me jump up and down in support.

    well you can jump all you want but that is what Hitchens  says. And he is doing that to oppose Islam, Saddam and his goons....
    Quote
    Oh, and this leads me back to my earlier question, there are hundreds of oppressed and genocided groups in the world, Assyrians in Iraq have it worst than Kurds, Kurds have it worst in Syria and have it quite bad in Turkey,

    Well if they were as powerful as Saddam and HIS OIL THAT SUPPORTS WESTERN INTERESTS and if they become dictators acts the way Saddam acted and are looking for atomic weapons to support Baath party like Saddam... Sure they will have war with America..

    Ask the Armies of these countries to stop the oil flow from gulf to west. trust me there will be war..
    Quote
    Palestinians literally live in an open prison, I have a list longer than my arm,

    yes you have list big list ... but you can do nothing and I can do nothing  except  cry.,

     I said many times.. let me say this again.. "REMOVE ISLAM FROM PALESTINE"  .. I will make them rule Israel..
    Quote
    so saying 'Kurds' is a bit arbitrary, I like how any supporter of a war will randomly assign a group that needs protection. (hazaras, tajiks and women were assigned during Afghanistan, jews during WW2-not that I don't support WW2, but we all know it wasn't about the holocaust, Russia said it needed to protect the North Ossetians from Georgia etc etc-a good sob story will always provide more reason for an otherwise injustifiable invasion of a country).

    yes..yes.. Islamic  women.. women   Islamic hazaras,  Islamic  tajiks ,  Islamic pakistan,  Islamic  India, Islamic Indonesia.. Islamic London.. so what?? you want American to go for war on all those countries??

    What are you talking interested212?? Talk about Hitchens and his videos and his books..

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: Hitchens....Dawkins....Harris....
     Reply #92 - July 07, 2011, 02:48 PM

    So the fact that Hitchens says Kurds won't make me jump up and down in support.

    He hasn't just said "Kurds!" though. It's easy to bash him if you oversimplify his argument and ridicule the simplified version, but it's also lazy and uninformed to do so.

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Re: Hitchens....Dawkins....Harris....
     Reply #93 - July 10, 2011, 09:17 PM

    So, I've been thinking about it-and I'm probably going to get called names, but are these guys really necessary? Ex-Muslims (atheists/agnostics in general) seem to automatically ally with these hyped up assholes simply because they happen to call themselves atheists and denounce religion-in the case of Dawkins, he is also a scientist so I can understand the following there (although he is a biologist so his authority on science should be limited to biology). Hitchens is a classic example, I can think of three people who still support the war in Iraq/Afghanistan, three people and 2 corporations, Cheney, Bush, Hitchens. The former two are complicit and venal, what's Hitchens' excuse? He is basically a neo-con, I don't know about you but anyone who considers themselves left of centre already knows that neo-cons are scum of the earth. Harris is basically a soft spoken Robert Spencer/if he weren't famous he'd be on FFI writing articles. Dawkins....less of a problem, but he has a one track mind, he's obsessed with religion. Don't get me wrong, religion can be an issue, but there are far greater issues at play, faith/superstition problems need to be remedied, but not at the expense of the glaring issues...economy, politics, environnment, war, overpopulation, resources, geopolitics etc etc...it seems all three men (and many other aggressive atheists) are only concerned with religion as some sort of fetish of theirs.

    I personally would much rather ally with a religious/semi-religious person like Chris Hedges (with whom I share political positions) than a neo-cunt like Hitchens (he may call himself a socialist-but we all know it's crap). I don't get why people insist on being part of an atheist/nontheist community, I can understand if you live in America, but in the UK and Europe there is no need, most people are non-religious, and it becomes as banal and trivial as whether you have a red car or whether your name is bob.

    Sorry if there is already a topic on this.

    And sorry for the rant.

    Let the name calling and mud slinging begin (and I apologise in advance to any right wingers I'm going to offend)


    One doesn't have to agree everything they say, however, a lot of what these have written makes complete sense.   Your comparision of Sam Harris to Robert Spencer (Christian fundamentalist) is flawed. 
  • Re: Hitchens....Dawkins....Harris....
     Reply #94 - August 04, 2011, 07:04 PM

    harris & hitchens are amazing
  • Re: Hitchens....Dawkins....Harris....
     Reply #95 - August 05, 2011, 07:17 PM

    harris & hitchens are amazing


    Thank you for that asinine comment we are all refreshed and challenged by your puerile degeneracy. Next time please kindly refrain from posting.   
  • Re: Hitchens....Dawkins....Harris....
     Reply #96 - August 05, 2011, 07:27 PM

    KT- Hmmm- I'm intrigued now. What is it exactly that you disagree with or hate about Hitchens & Harris? I don't know much about Harris but I've watched some of Hitchens' debates & he puts across some very strong arguments although he does have an arrogant demeanor.

    When truth is hurled against falsehood, falsehood perishes, for falsehood by its nature is bound to perish.
  • Re: Hitchens....Dawkins....Harris....
     Reply #97 - August 05, 2011, 09:00 PM

    Harris is awesome, my favorite. Hitchens is the best rhetorician. Dawkins too is good in communicating with the audience/rhetorics.
  • Re: Hitchens....Dawkins....Harris....
     Reply #98 - August 05, 2011, 09:44 PM

    gotta love hitchens and dawkins. though I dont necessarily agree with everything they have
    to say, they are convincing when giving their talks  Smiley
  • Re: Hitchens....Dawkins....Harris....
     Reply #99 - August 08, 2011, 12:33 AM

    People ought to give Harris' The Moral Landscape a chance. It's good stuff.

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Re: Hitchens....Dawkins....Harris....
     Reply #100 - August 08, 2011, 02:54 PM

    what ever there political views they are spot on about religion

    as Harris says its "one of the most perverse misuses of intelligence we have ever devised."
  • Re: Hitchens....Dawkins....Harris....
     Reply #101 - June 08, 2012, 05:41 PM

    well this was old thread that was discussing the four horse men.. namely The Four Horsemen: Dawkins, Dennett, Harris, Hitchens

    So in 2012 that wonderful outspoken Hitchens is sadly missed by every one but he is replaced by Ayaan Hirsi Ali .. that is from April 2012..


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sOMjEJ3JO5Q



    Yes YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT Mr. Dawkins., "The threat of  your head is  cut off is somewhat of a deterrent in criticizing Islam/Quran/Muhammad " and it worked well .. still works in the so-called Islamic world.

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: Hitchens....Dawkins....Harris....
     Reply #102 - June 09, 2012, 02:54 PM

    I've read the thread and to be honest, I found the use of "pro-Imperialist" + "atheist" = Hitchens quite funny.
    Being that Hitchens was anything BUT a neo-con and pro-imperialism.

    And it was quite revealing that ALL of the problematic regions, where human rights violations occur were strictly from Islamic countries. Is that a coincidence?  Wink

    Hitchens has been to Pakistan/Iraq/Iran, etc... and has seen what's going on there and wasn't interested in politics since 9/11. I guess some of the anti-Hitchenians simply forget that.

    Iran is an obvious problem. Not only to Israel or the stability of the region, but first and foremost, to IT'S OWN PEOPLE. I don't know if many of you are aware of the Iran's history pre- and post-1979.

    When Saddam was the 2nd man in Iraq, he indeed looked like a force for good, or at least a secular leader with an appetite for power, or shall we say simply "the better of two bad options".

    Hitchens was always interested in the life/role of the Kurds in the region and saw them as the victims of all states involved: be it Turkey/Iraq or Iran.

    Iran had too much influence on Afghanistan and its evil Taliban terrorists, who not only thought that women have no souls, but who also thought that selling heroin and opium to Iran is a great business model. No wonder, given that roughly 5 million Iranians today are addicted to either opium or heroin.
    So guess why Iran and the US are the biggest investors in today's Afghanistan.

    Why were the US interested in Iraq? Given that they have a decent relationship with Turkey, as a strategic partner and can bribe the Pakistanis enough to keep them in check (while terrorists and Taliban can roam the countryside of Pakistan as they wish) Iraq's domination of the region was too dangerous, as time went on.
    Was invading Iraq and getting rid off Saddam an "imperialist agenda" or actually a GOOD thing?
    Whoever says it wasn't a good thing should've lived in Saddam-rule Iraq.

    What about the Kuwaitis and Saudis paying the US 60bn dollars for protecting them from Saddam in the 1st Gulf War? Right, right, that was a honorable thing to do.
    But other than that, we should make these scumbags continue to oppress their own people and destabilize the region, while they build up their intelligence agencies, armies and prepare for their "holy wars" (symbolically and literally). Nope, won't happen.

    The Iraqis welcomed the US army and were thankful for getting rid off Saddam. Well, until they realized that the leadership is up for grabs and billions of dollars worth of oil...........and they started to bomb and kill eachother.
    I was "glad" to see that when you free Islamic countries of their dictators, all of a sudden they turn into peaceloving pacifist.

    Ehmmm..........*cough* Iran post 1979 *cough* Taliban in Afghanistan *cough* Iraq post-Saddam.

    Of course non-interventionalism is the way to go UNLESS the dictators take over the country, because then it's a.) they are just puppets of the Juice (of course, what else) or b.) "they don't really care about us".
    Once they intervene to ALSO PROTECT THEIR OWN INTERESTS, it's a.) & b.) and c.) "they want to kill all Muslims!!!".

    So basically, no matter what you do, you lose as a Western country.

    The question is: do you go for the lesser evil (protect the people & your own interests) or do you not do anything at all AND listen to the liberal pseudo-pacifists, who think that killing the political opposition, oppressing women, taking away all of the people's freedoms and generally creating a HELL for them to live in........should be considered "respecting their "different" culture".

    I think we should follow the glorious example of all muslim-majority states, which are fearless in fighting injustice in the world and couldn't sleep at night, unless their brothers and sister (including the non-Muslims), leave in freedom................OH WAIT!!! That never happens, because Muslims don't care about anybody else but themselves (and by that I mean, their own countries), or they live under a dictatorship, which doesn't about anybody else but themselves and oppressing their own people.

    The perfect example of "anti-imperialist, freedom loving Super Muslim Freedom"-reasoning is the objection to getting rid off Gadaffi and his goons.
    Think about it (if you can) - either we get rid off them, or they will spread like a cancer across Norther Africa, Turkey and the Middle East and not only threaten us here, in the West, but first and foremost, oppress and terrorize their own people, who are fed up with the injustice and corruption. Just watch Iran over the next 2-3 years and you will see what I mean. Just imagine what would happen if the Irania people throw over the government and become allies with the US/Western powers and stop threatening the Juice in Israel.  grin12

    After all, if the "evil imperialist West and the Zionist Juice" were as evil as many of the pseudo-liberals think (including some in this thread), nuking every major city and region in the countries they wanted to take over wouldn't be a problem. And how many times did that happen?

    Now something to consider for the haters of the Juice.
    Roughly 6 million Jews and 3 million Poles were killed in 6 years (1939-1945).
    Unbelievable terror, pain and loss of lives.

    Since 1945, how many terrorist attacks on German soil were carried out by Jewish and/or Polish terrorists.
    Ponder this for a while.

    As far as the "New Atheism" goes:

    Dawkins = "I don't understand how people can be this stupid and follow religions!"
    Hitchens = "I don't care how stupid you are, that doesn't excuse your beliefs one bit!"
    Harris = "I don't care about your peaceful religion that much...........I learned that from the Buddhists!"
    Dennet = "I don't care about theology, I choose philosophy!"

     grin12
  • Re: Hitchens....Dawkins....Harris....
     Reply #103 - June 09, 2012, 03:29 PM

    LArc.. Greetings and my good wishes  LArc., What happened??  you are using strange words ....
    I've read the thread and to be honest, I found the use of "pro-Imperialist" + "atheist" = Hitchens quite funny.
    Being that Hitchens was anything BUT a neo-con and pro-imperialism.

    ....................
    ........stop threatening the Juice in Israel.  grin12

    ......................the haters of the Juice.
    .........................

    As far as the "New Atheism" goes:

    Dawkins = "I don't understand how people can be this stupid and follow religions!"
    Hitchens = "I don't care how stupid you are, that doesn't excuse your beliefs one bit!"
    Harris = "I don't care about your peaceful religion that much...........I learned that from the Buddhists!"
    Dennet = "I don't care about theology, I choose philosophy!"

     grin12

    Juice.. Juice.. well  I don't know.. These Islamic Baboons never use common sense., If they eliminate all Jewish folks across the globe then how can they find a juice Jewish women to drink the juice??   And that is the reason I tell all over Islamic web discussions that these baboons  should  marry  their daughters to good Jewish guys so Future Muslim heroes will always have juice to drink..

    Anyways i like your
    As far as the "New Atheism" statements., May I correct a bit on that outspoken Hitchens    

    Hitchens = "I don't care how stupid you are, that doesn't excuse your beliefs you  bitch!" AND THAT HE WOULD HAVE SAID  TO FELLOWS LIKE   this pussy cat

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Hitchens....Dawkins....Harris....
     Reply #104 - October 22, 2020, 12:57 PM

    well long ago... some 8years ago ... I wrote in this folder at https://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=16504.msg458957#msg458957  on James Randi...  He was also one of those skeptics of faiths .. faith healers .. etc.. etc.. characters ., well Hitchens died and todays BBC  news says ..James Randi passed away..

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-54642107

    Quote
    James Randi: Magician and sceptic dies aged 92
     
     One of the best known magicians in the entertainment industry, James Randi, famous for exposing claimants of the paranormal, has died in the US aged 92. Known by just his surname, Canadian-born Randi earned a reputation as one of the world's foremost sceptics of matters from ghosts to UFOs.

    His performances inspired legions of admirers, including the likes of TV and stage illusionists Penn & Teller. He also joined rock star Alice Cooper on tour in the early 1970s, carrying out fake executions of the singer on stage.

    But Randi always reminded his audiences that his acts were based on tricks and not magic, and soon turned his attention to debunking claims by others who claimed paranormal powers.

    In 1972, he helped the US network NBC's Tonight Show prepare for an appearance by Uri Geller, the illusionist best known for bending spoons.

    With neither Geller nor his team able to access the props in advance, the magician failed to carry out any tricks - although the attention from Randi and other sceptics did nothing to harm his career.

    Randi also exposed faith healers, including televangelist Peter Popoff, who claimed to be receiving messages from God about his audience but was actually wearing an earpiece.

    The magician's own foundation went on to offer an award of $1m (£750,000) to anyone who could prove paranormal powers under controlled conditions. However, by the time of Randi's retirement from the foundation in 2015, the amount had still not been claimed.


    was a great guy.. great contribution to educate public and expose nonsense ..on that let me watch him again


    Homeopathy, quackery and fraud | James Randi

     https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c0Z7KeNCi7g

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WSzQC1zKesU

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kor_L12bBB0

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djKBUDg-v-M

    indeed youtube immortalize people.. great guy ... was a great guy

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
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