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Theme Changer

 Topic: Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran

 (Read 39881 times)
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  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     OP - June 05, 2011, 11:53 PM

    Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet  Muhammad's Life   from Quran

    So CEMB has 99 pages of threads where religious texts  are discussed and I am sure there are many folders that discuss Quran., But none of the threads seem to have focused just on Quran all 114 chapters, So let us read Quran here through its time course of revelations. It has been well established that the 114 chapters of the present book are not put together in sequential order,   in the order of time they were reveled  but all  those chapters were jumbled around. In some cases even the verses were mixed in to different chapters by those guys who put together this book. And this was done  way after death of Prophet Muhammad( at least 10 to 20 years after his death)  

    So this is  in parallel with "three44's" (what a nick)  thread on Judging Muhammad and scripture

     let us read Quran casually in its REAL ORDER,  not the order that you see in the present bookish form. first, Let me list all 114 chapters in the order of revelation.
    Quote
    1     96     Alaq         19     Meccan sura, reveled between 1 to 5th year of Prophet's mission
    2    68    Qalam    52    Meccan sura, reveled between 1 to 5th year of Prophet's mission
    3    73    Muzammil    20    Meccan sura, reveled between 1 to 5th year of Prophet's mission
    4    74    Mudathir    56    Meccan sura, reveled between 1 to 5th year of Prophet's mission
    5    1    Fatehah    7    Meccan sura, reveled between 1 to 5th year of Prophet's mission
    6    111    Lahab    5    Meccan sura, reveled between 1 to 5th year of Prophet's mission
    7    81    Takwir    29    Meccan sura, reveled between 1 to 5th year of Prophet's mission
    8    87    A'la       19    Meccan sura, reveled between 1 to 5th year of Prophet's mission
    9    92    Leyl       21    Meccan sura, reveled between 1 to 5th year of Prophet's mission
    10    89    Fajr       30    Meccan sura, reveled between 1 to 5th year of Prophet's mission
    11    93    Duha       11    Meccan sura, reveled between 1 to 5th year of Prophet's mission
    12    94    Inshira    8    Macca
    13    103    Asr       3    Macca
    14    100    Aadiyat    11    Macca
    15    108    Kauthar    3    Macca
    16    102    Takatur    8    Macca
    17    107    Alma'un    7    Macca
    18    109    Kafirun    6    Macca
    19    105    Fil       5    Macca
    20    113    Falaq    5    Macca
    21    114    Nas       6    Macca
    22    112    Iklas       4    Macca
    23    53    Najm       62    Macca
    24    80    Abasa    42    Macca
    25    97    Qadr       5    Macca
    26    91    Shams    15    Macca
    27    85    Buruj       22    Macca
    28    95    T'in       8    Macca
    29    106    Qureysh    4    Macca
    30    101    Qariah    11    Macca
    31    75    Qiyamah    40    Meccan  
    32    104    Humazah    9    Macca
    33    77    Mursalat    50    Macca
    34    50    Q'af       45    Macca
    35    90    Balad    20    Macca
    36    86    Tariq       17    Macca
    37    54    Qamr       55    Meccan sura 5th and 6th year of Prophet's mission
    38    38    Sad       88    Macca
    39    7    A'Raf       206    Macca
    40    72    Jinn       28    Meccan sura 5th and 6th year of Prophet's mission
    41    36    Ya'sin    83    Macca
    42    25    Furqan    77    Macca
    43    35    Fatir       45    Macca
    44    19    Maryam    98    Macca
    45    20    Ta Ha    135    Macca
    46    56    Waqiah    96    Macca
    47    26    Shuara    227    Macca
    48    27    Naml       93    Macca
    49    28    Qasas    88    Macca
    50    17    Bani Israil    111    Macca
    51    10    Yunus    109    Macca
    52    11    Hud       123    Macca
    53    12    Yousuf    111    Macca
    54    15    Hijr       99    Macca
    55    6    Anam    165    Macca
    56    37    Saffat    182    Macca
    57    31    Luqman    34    Macca
    58    34    Saba       54    Macca
    59    39    Zumar    75    Macca
    60    40    Mumin    85    Macca
    61    41    Hamim Sajdah 54    Macca
    62    42    Shura    53    Macca
    63    43    Zukhruf    89    Macca
    64    44    Dukhan    59    Macca
    65    45    Jathiyah    37    Macca
    66    46    Ahqaf    35    Macca
    67    51    Dhariyat    60    Macca
    68    88    Ghashiya    26    Madina
    69    18    Kahf       110    Macca
    70    16    Nahl       128    Macca
    71    71    Noah       28    Meccan sura 5th and 6th year of Prophet's mission
    72    14    Ibrahim    52    Macca
    73    21    Anbiya    112    Macca
    74    23    Muminun    118    Macca
    75    32    Sajdah    30    Macca
    76    52    Tur       49    Macca
    77    67    Mulk       30    Macca
    78    69    Haqqah    52    Macca
    79    70    Maarij    44    Macca
    80    78    Naba       40    Macca
    81    79    Naziat    46    Macca
    82    82    Infitar    19    Macca
    83    84    Inshiqaq    25    Macca
    84    30    Rum       60    Macca
    85    29    Ankabut    85    Macca
    86    83    Tatfif    36    Macca
    87    2    Baqarah    286    Madina
    88    8    Anfal       75    Madina
    89    3    Aal-e-Imran 200    Madina
    90    33    Ahzab    73    Madina
    91    60    Mumtahana 13    Madina
    92    4    Nisa       176    Madina

    93    99    Zilzal       8    Macca
    94    57    Hadid    29    Madina
    95    47    Muhammad    38    Madina
    96    13    Ra'd       43    Madina

    97    55    Rahman    78    Meccan  
    98    76    Dahr       31    Meccan sura 5th and 6th year of Prophet's mission
    99    65    Talaq    12    Madina
    100    98    Beyinnah    8    Madina
    101    59    Hashr    24    Madina
    102    24    Nur       64    Madina
    103    22    Hajj       78    Madina
    104    63    Munafiqun    11    Madina
    105    58    Mujadila    22    Madina
    106    49    Hujurat    18    Madina
    107    66    Tahrim    12    Madina
    108    64    Taghabun    18    Madina
    109    61    Saff       14    Madina
    110    62    Jumah    11    Madina
    111    48    Fath       29    Madina
    112    5    Maidah    120    Madina
    113    9    Taubah    129    Madina
    114    110    Nasr       3    Madina

    1st col= revelation order number  ..  
    2nd col=Surah number in the book or compilation order..
    3rd col= Surah name
    4th col= total number of verses
    5th col=  where it is revealed

    so if we add all those Madinan verses  there are around 1530 verses  and rest of the ~4700 verses allegedly come from Maecca

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet of Muhammad's Life strictly from Quran
     Reply #1 - June 09, 2011, 09:21 PM

    Good idea! But how do you know that your list is the real sequence?

    Religion is organized superstition
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #2 - December 25, 2012, 03:30 PM

    Good idea! But how do you know that your list is the real sequence?

     well Hallakuf left long ago and this thread went down the tube.. completely forgotten .. let me get this on top to inquire in to the history of early Islam and life of prohet of Islam through Quran. So to answer Hallakuf.,    Meccan suras are usually short  with relatively short ayat in comparison with Medinan suras. Another unique nature of Meccan suras are presence of those abbreviated Arabic letters  called Muqatta'at   or  fawātih ("openers" ), They are  are unique their Arabic meaning is meaningless .. I often call them Gibberish and Muslim intellectuals   consider as  divine secrets.

    for e.g they go like this..  [Al Quran ; 15:1]
    Quote
    الر ۚ تِلْكَ آيَاتُ الْكِتَابِ وَقُرْآنٍ مُبِينٍ (1)

    Alif Lam Ra. These are the signs of the Book and an obvious Quran.


    And I often write my own Quran to those who say that gibberish is divine.. and that goes like this

       a Seen Meem
        Kaf Ha Ya Ein Sad.
        Alif Lam Ra ..
        .Doom ....Dam... DoooomM  .KhaboomM....
        Meem... dum..dum
        ..Ta Ha....
     Alif Lam Mim
     Faa' Qaaf.  


    And the readers.. please don't blame me for that " Faa' Qaaf." Blame Hassan Randhawa

    Oh I forgot.. allah you too.... don't blame me ., That guy  Hassan.. he is the bad guy..

    Fools write nonsense make it as word of allah/god.. ga.. gooo...spaghetti monster....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60MQ3AG1c8o

    Hmm there is Korean god..  well if I remove letter "e" from Korean it becomes "Koran" .. Koran god from Korea..

    Anyways going back to that post, let me add the life of Prophet of right from the day he was born to death..

    Quote
    571: Birth of the Holy Prophet. Year of the Elephant. Invasion of Makkah by Abraha the Viceroy of Yemen, his retreat.
    577: The Holy Prophet visits Madina with his mother. Death of his mother.
    580: Death of Abdul Muttalib, the grandfather of the Holy Prophet.
    583: The Holy Prophet's journey to Syria in the company of his uncle Abu Talib. His meeting with the monk Bahira at Bisra who foretells of his prophethood.
    586: The Holy Prophet participates in the war of Fijar.
    591: The Holy Prophet becomes an active member of "Hilful Fudul", a league for the relief of the distressed.
    594: The Holy Prophet becomes the Manager of the business of Lady Khadija, and leads her trade caravan to Syria and back.
    595: The Holy Prophet marries Hadrat Khadija. Seventh century
    605: The Holy Prophet arbitrates in a dispute among the Quraish about the placing of the Black Stone in the Kaaba.

    610: The first revelation in the cave at Mt. Hira. The Holy Prophet is commissioned as the Messenger of God.
    613: Declaration at Mt. Sara inviting the general public to Islam.
    614: Invitation to the Hashimites to accept Islam.
    615: Persecution of the Muslims by the Quraish. A party of Muslims leaves for Abyssinia.
    616: Second Hijrah to Abysinnia.
    617: Social boycott of the Hashimites and the Holy Prophet by the Quraish. The Hashimites are shut up in a glen outside Makkah.
    619: Lifting of the boycott. Deaths of Abu Talib and Hadrat Khadija. Year of sorrow.
    620: Journey to Taif. Ascension to the heavens.
    621: First pledge at Aqaba.

    621-622; Prophet Migrates to Madina
    622: Second pledge at Aqaba. The Holy Prophet and the Muslims migrate to Yathrib.
    623: Nakhla expedition.
    624: Battle of Badr. Expulsion of the Bani Qainuqa Jews from Madina.
    625: Battle of Uhud. Massacre of 70 Muslims at Bir Mauna. Expulsion of Banu Nadir Jews from Madina. Second expedition of Badr.
    626: Expedition of Banu Mustaliq.
    627: Battle of the Trench. Expulsion of Banu Quraiza Jews.
    628: Truce of Hudaibiya. Expedition to Khyber. The Holy Prophet addresses letters to various heads of states.
    629: The Holy Prophet performs the pilgrimage at Makkah. Expedition to Muta (Romans).
    630: Conquest of Makkah. Battles of Hunsin, Auras, and Taif.
    631: Expedition to Tabuk. Year of Deputations.
    632: Farewell pilgrimage at Makkah.
    632: Death of the Holy Prophet

    That is the life of Prophet of Islam.  So looking in to the Quran and his life .,  From the first alleged revelation in the year  610 to the day allegedly he was migrated to Madina in the year 622, ~4700 verses verses of Quran was reveled in those  13 years ..   ~ 362 verses a year.. average ONE VERSE A DAY  .. great

    And in the rest of 10 years ~1400 verses were allegedly revealed . that is ~140 verses a year that means   some 2 verses comes out of Prophet of Islam every 5 days..  That is what it is..  I mean that is average...

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet of Muhammad's Life strictly from Quran
     Reply #3 - December 25, 2012, 03:37 PM

    Only yeezevee could incorporate Gangnam Style into a thread about the Quran and Mo.
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #4 - December 25, 2012, 03:49 PM

    Only yeezevee could incorporate Gangnam Style into a thread about the Quran and Mo.

      Noooooo00000       .. there are many..

    Islamic Gangnam Style..

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcBdOM1m61U

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoUtlOntmW0

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WMFtWJLRDAk

    crazy fooools.......

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet of Muhammad's Life strictly from Quran
     Reply #5 - December 25, 2012, 04:36 PM

    Wtf yeez  Cheesy those last two videos were insane; were they Sufis or what?
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #6 - December 25, 2012, 06:05 PM

    Wtf yeez  Cheesy those last two videos were insane; were they Sufis or what?

     well .. sufis and Sufi business are/is as divorce as Islam .. I mean 72sects

    This video is important so watch it..

    Look at these questions rascal..  . Such an Idiot .. I am going to cut him in to pieces..

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #7 - December 27, 2012, 03:32 AM

    So let us  read Quran through the((alleged)) revelation sequence of Quran , assuming  it was revealed to ( an alleged ) a  character who was chosen by allah  , The Prophet of Islam. (Again assuming he was real)..
    With god we have to assume so many things and that is true for all religions not just to Islam.

    So the first sura  is  chapter 96  in the book  with name AL-ALAQ (THE CLOT, READ)  and has 19 verses in it..
    Quote
    096.001 : Read in the name of your Lord Who created.
    096.002 : He created man from a clot.
    096.003 : Read and your Lord is Most Honorable,
    096.004 : Who taught (to write) with the pen
    096.005 : Taught man what he knew not.
    096.006 : Nay! man is most surely inordinate,
    096.007 : Because he sees himself free from want.
    096.008 : Surely to your Lord is the return.
    096.009 : Have you seen him who forbids
    096.010 : A servant when he prays?
    096.011 : Have you considered if he were on the right way,
    096.012 : Or enjoined guarding (against evil)?
    096.013 : Have you considered if he gives the lie to the truth and turns (his) back?
    096.014 : Does he not know that Allah does see?
    096.015 : Nay! if he desist not, We would certainly smite his forehead,
    096.016 : A lying, sinful forehead.
    096.017 : Then let him summon his council,
    096.018 : We too would summon the braves of the army.
    096.019 : Nay! obey him not, and make obeisance and draw nigh (to Allah).

    Unlike the Arabic Quran that one can listen   happily   say at  http://www.assabile.com/ .. It sounds good irrespective of what is there in it, and it is irrelevant whether we  understand the language or not, sounds nice to ears.  Now  turning  those Arabic words  in to English , unless you are rapper who can make song/sonnet from any words, this translated Quran  sounds as if it is headless tailless chicken making noise. Sounds horrible and  stupid  language with  4 or 5 worded statements.  But if we put together like this
    Quote
    096.001 to 19 :  Read in the name of your Lord Who created. He created man from a clot. Read and your Lord is Most Honorable, Who taught (to write) with the pen ., Taught man what he knew not. Nay! man is most surely inordinate, Because he sees himself free from want.. Surely to your Lord is the return.  Have you seen him who forbids ,  A servant when he prays? Have you considered if he were on the right way,  Or enjoined guarding (against evil)?  Have you considered if he gives the lie to the truth and turns (his) back? Does he not know that Allah does see?  Nay! if he desist not, We would certainly smite his forehead, A lying, sinful forehead. Then let him summon his council, We too would summon the braves of the army.  Nay! obey him not, and make obeisance and draw nigh (to Allah).  

     This is also equally bad.   we got remember here those bracketed underlined  words are added by the translators.  So I am going to make some sensible readable  5grader English statements out of those 19 verses.  In other words we have to write our own Tafsir..
    her we go..

    Quote
    (1 to 8 ).... Read in the name of your Lord Who created. He created the man from a clot.   Read, your Lord is Most Honorable.    Who taught   to write with the pen? Taught man what he knew not. Nay! man is most surely inordinate, Because he sees himself free from want.  Surely to your Lord is the return. .....

    Those are 1st 8 verses of  together and they make some sense.   "Lord created us. man didn't know anything , lord  taught us to read  and write  and we return to Lord at the end" .. may be we can rap around those words a bit and make a song out of it.

    Quote
    (9 to 18 )Have you seen him who forbids ,  A servant when he prays? Have you considered if he were on the right way,  Or enjoined guarding (against evil)?  Have you considered if he gives the lie to the truth and turns (his) back? Does he not know that Allah does see?  Nay! if he desist not, We would certainly smite his forehead, A lying, sinful forehead. Then let him summon his council, We too would summon the braves of the army.  Nay! obey him not, and make obeisance and draw nigh (to Allah).

     next 9-18 verse also we can put together ., Essentially  in these verses, our allah is ranting on some guy who didn't allow his servant to attend prayer in Mosque. or Pagan Temple... or under tree  or on street where ever Prophet of Islam was preaching his sermons.

    Now here is the problem.,To understand who that guy was who stopped his servant  and didn't allow his servant to attend the  preaching ceremony of Prophet of Islam. Here we have to go in to some sort of story mode and search in to hadith to figure out that guy(a land lord) name and the story around him.  So that is another problem with Quran.  Our Quran only Muslims will  miserably fail  to explain even     the 1st  surah without help of hadith..

    Anyways that is how I am going to read Quran..   now It is time to drink something...

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet of Muhammad's Life strictly from Quran
     Reply #8 - December 27, 2012, 03:45 AM

    Yeez, I'm not sure about your Arabic language skills, (mine are poor) but this is the second time I notice you mentioning words in brackets, put there by translators - there's usually a very very good reason to put those words there and usually the reason they are in brackets is because translators try too hard to translate literally to begin with. You probably knew that, if so, just ignore...

    "That it is indeed the speech of an illustrious messenger" (The Koran 69:40)
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #9 - December 27, 2012, 03:53 AM

    Yeez, I'm not sure about your Arabic language skills, (mine are poor) but this is the second time I notice you mentioning words in brackets, put there by translators - there's usually a very very good reason to put those words there and usually the reason they are in brackets is because translators try too hard to translate literally to begin with. You probably knew that, if so, just ignore...

    No..no   your comment is very important.   I knew that business  of transliteration but many readers don't know that  Alex., That is a very good point you mentioned.  I think  translating one language to another language keeping every word in the same sequence is nonsense. It is OK to start with but they have to move on to explain the people in a proper format.   Any ways I am worse than you in English  as well as in Arabic.. or  for that matter any language Alex..

    So please join the thread and correct the text wherever you think is necessary..  

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet of Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #10 - December 27, 2012, 05:06 AM

    Yeezeve, dear, what is it  exactly you're doing with this thread? Oh and how did it happen that 93rd revealed surah - azzzzilzal - was reWeeled in Macca though 92nd and 94th - in Madina? Wait, what? Oh my allah, I just noticed you saying shit about muqata'at. Take it back or have my jihad befall you when you most expect it!

    "That it is indeed the speech of an illustrious messenger" (The Koran 69:40)
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet of Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #11 - December 27, 2012, 06:54 AM

    Damn, wtf was that ? gross and yet, funny.  
    I think they belong right here

    But all these mystical experiences, can be easily explained by science. This is purely conditioning.  This is precisely what most of the faith healers in all religions do.  These mystical experiences are not from god, but from our own neurology. Altered states of consciousness. No need to be a sufi wasting all those years, just smoke some weed. You get the full experience. lol

    A British hypnotists and mentalist explains how faith healing works. It's a very good documentary/entertainment 1h :http://www.the-antitheist.com/derren-brown-faith-heale/

    lol the video, it's just haha
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet of Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #12 - December 27, 2012, 06:55 AM

    Al-Alethia : yea, I thought they were Sufi's as well. lol
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #13 - December 27, 2012, 01:57 PM

    Yeezeve, dear, what is it  exactly you're doing with this thread? ......

    Alex that is a good question to answer ., frankly speaking  I don't know why i am doing that  as i already read Quran umpteen times ..   but  looking at  the bottom of forum  screen  it says

    Quote
    Active in the last 15 minutes: yeezevee, ateapotist, Artemis, Pariah, paranoid, happymurtad, Just_Me, Fucked, Solara, arX


    I guess that is the answer  and   I am glad so far I have not seen any post from  " Fucked," anyways let us go to 2nd chapter  and that is chapter 68 in the book ., allegedly  revealed in Makka and has 52 verses in it
    Quote
    068.001 to 10 : Noon. I swear by the pen and what the angels write,  By the grace of your Lord you are not mad.  And most surely you shall have a reward never to be cut off. And most surely you conform (yourself) to sublime morality. So you shall see, and they (too) shall see,  Which of you is afflicted with madness.  Surely your Lord best knows him who errs from His way, and He best knows the followers of the right course.  So do not yield to the rejecters.  They wish that you should be pliant so they (too) would be pliant.  And yield not to any mean swearer.


    068.011 to 20  : Defamer, going about with slander , Forbidder of good, outstepping the limits, sinful,  Ignoble, besides all that, base-born;   Because he possesses wealth and sons. When Our communications are recited to him, he says: Stories of those of yore.  We will brand him on the nose.  Surely We will try them as We tried the owners of the garden, when they swore that they would certainly cut off the produce in the morning,  And were not willing to set aside a portion (for the poor).  Then there encompassed it a visitation from your Lord while they were sleeping.  So it became as black, barren land.


    well those are the 1st 10 verses.. Now I need coffee.. well add another 10 verses .. Boy what the hell is that.. Allah appears to ranting through Muhammad's mouth on some guy  who possess wealth and sons?   . Do I see some jealousy there?  anyways,  we will analyze  those words bit more carefully to figure out the story of the guys and his sons..

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet of Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #14 - December 27, 2012, 02:13 PM

    Alex that is a good question to answer ., frankly speaking  I don't know why i am doing that  as i already read Quran umpteen times ..  


    Fine, I will help you with this insane mission of yours, but I don't have much time to waste on it.
    I think to clarify what al-kitab is all about  we should start by deleting stuff and rearranging it the way we see fit, instead of strictly following  a silly revelation order of the chapters. We should continue the process until we have a readable document of 10-15 pages. I'm afraid that might be the true Koran once redundant and clearly disturbed or irrelevant stuff is removed. If you have the doubts whether the process is divinely ordained and if the book will remain holy, let me assure you - we will be divinely inspired and those who poses minds will be able to verify that the final product could only have come down to us from the Most High, through a built in mathematical miracle! Sounds good?

    "That it is indeed the speech of an illustrious messenger" (The Koran 69:40)
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #15 - December 27, 2012, 02:37 PM

    Fine, I will help you with this insane mission of yours, but I don't have much time to waste on it.
    I think to clarify what al-kitab is all about  we should start by deleting stuff and rearranging it the way we see fit, instead of strictly following  a silly revelation order of the chapters. We should continue the process until we have a readable document of 10-15 pages. I'm afraid that might be the true Koran once redundant and clearly disturbed or irrelevant stuff is removed. If you have the doubts whether the process is divinely ordained and if the book will remain holy, let me assure you - we will be divinely inspired and those who poses minds will be able to verify that the final product could only have come down to us from the Most High, through a built in mathematical miracle! Sounds good?

     what say Alex??   Hmm ... that  sounds like   "the speech of an illustrious messenger" ( ....  Alex L  M(PBUH)   xxx.xx)  lol..

    Alex take jokes as jokes..  well I am glad to hear that ., Off course time is limited but if we STOP FOOLING around the forum sure we will have more time to deal with Quran.  SO STOP FOOLING AROUND..

    Now your point of deleting verses/words from al-kitab.,    1st question is .. where do we start? what chapter to begin with., once you decide that then we can take  some 15 pages and run through them. What you have suggested does sound good and has some logic in it..  


    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet of Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #16 - December 27, 2012, 02:53 PM

    Where and how you ask... A divine inspiration cannot be confined by some rules, just do it. The more you practice the better you will get at it. One verse goes into improved new Koran, another into the book of collection of verses that could be fed to a goat; if by divine inspiration we later change our minds - who are we to question that inspiration? The forum has infinite distractions  though, send me your email - I will forward you my work on the subject.

    "That it is indeed the speech of an illustrious messenger" (The Koran 69:40)
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #17 - December 27, 2012, 03:48 PM

    Where and how you ask... A divine inspiration cannot be confined by some rules, just do it. The more you practice the better you will get at it. One verse goes into improved new Koran, another into the book of collection of verses that could be fed to a goat; if by divine inspiration we later change our minds - who are we to question that inspiration?

    You mean to say by reading/analyzing/writing all those 114 chapters  and at the end I m going to feed it to a GOAT?  Damn you Alex.. which  Bakhra?  Abu Bakhra??  I mean Bakr..  I used to name my goats with Caliph names..

    Quote
    The forum has infinite distractions  though, send me your email - I will forward you my work on the subject.

    Thanks I will.. but if it is  already on your  hard disk,  why don't you throw it on web or make it as little book?   that will be more useful than just me reading/using it Alex.

    Any way my point is slightly different., it is not for making that book more divine or less divine but looking in to the early history of Islam through Quran coupled to the hadith  that might have been collected during the time of Quran.

    well   I am glad you already went through such exercise with Quran.,  may be in a different angle..

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #18 - December 28, 2012, 12:48 AM

    in continuation of posts 1,2, 7 & 13  let me post rst f verses of that Surah -2  before I analyze its history and reasons for allah to deliver those two  surahs  through prophet of Islam..

    Quote
    068.021-30: And they called out to each other in the morning,  Saying: Go early to your tilth if you would cut (the produce). So they went, while they consulted together secretly, Saying: No poor man shall enter it today upon you.  And in the morning they went, having the power to prevent.  But when they saw it, they said: Most surely we have gone astray.,   Nay! we are made to suffer privation. The best of them said: Did I not say to you, Why do you not glorify (Allah)?  They said: Glory be to our Lord, surely we were unjust. Then some of them advanced against others, blaming each other.

    068.031-40 : Said they: O woe to us! surely we were inordinate: Maybe, our Lord will give us instead one better than it; surely to our Lord do we make our humble petition.  Such is the chastisement, and certainly the chastisement of the hereafter is greater, did they but know!  Surely those who guard (against evil) shall have with their Lord gardens of bliss.  What! shall We then make (that is, treat) those who submit as the guilty?  What has happened to you? How do you judge?  Or have you a book wherein you read,  That you have surely therein what you choose?  Or have you received from Us an agreement confirmed by an oath extending to the day of resurrection that you shall surely have what you demand?  Ask them which of them will vouch for that,

    068.041-50 : Or have they associates if they are truthful. On the day when there shall be a severe affliction, and they shall be called upon to make obeisance, but they shall not be able, Their looks cast down, abasement shall overtake them; and they were called upon to make obeisance indeed while yet they were safe. So leave Me and him who rejects this announcement; We will overtake them by degrees, from whence they perceive not.m, And I do bear with them, surely My plan is firm. , Or do you ask from them a reward, so that they are burdened with debt? ., Or have they (the knowledge of) the unseen, so that they write (it) down? ., So wait patiently for the judgment of your Lord, and be not like the companion of the fish, when he cried while he was in distress. ;  Were it not that favor from his Lord had overtaken him, he would certainly have been cast down upon the naked Found while he was blamed. ;  Then his Lord chose him, and He made him of the good. ;

    068.051 : 52 And those who disbelieve would almost smite you with their eyes when they hear the reminder, and they say: Most surely he is mad. ;  And it is naught but a reminder to the nations.


    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #19 - December 28, 2012, 03:30 PM

    So clubbing those two first 2 surahs( Chapters 96 & 68) that were reveled in Makka., let me try to understand and add some hadith that is relevant to it.  These Two surahs with some 71(19 +52)  verses  as usual pray allah/god of Prophet of Islam's  mosque/monastery/Islamic prayer place  in some 30 verses and Chide, insult, rant on some guy of the town who is rich, have sons and servants to work for him . Essentially both these surahs deal with the same  guy and the problem he may have created in the town to Prophet of Islam and his followers.  

    All the Islamic stories on that guy who was giving problems of to Prophet point out to a fellow often named as Abu Jahl.. We can read his story all over Islam and often it is also repeated to children in many Islamic schools.   Apparently This guys original name was Amr ibn Hisham, was one of the Meccan polytheist pagan Qurayshi leaders known for his hostility against the Islamic prophet Muhammad and the early Muslims in Mecca. He is often referred as Abu Jahl by Muslims.   who was killed by Muslims on March 17, 624 AD in that battle of badar

    Some links on Abu Jahl story from Islam..  And Story of  Amr ibn Hisham aka  Abu Jahl  alleged Enemy Prophet of Islam

    Quote

    The stories from those 6 pdf files are very often repeated to children in Islam in every Mosque and even in homes.

    And looking in to hadith + other Quran  verses on Amr ibn Hisham aka  Abu Jahl, often I read in the Islamic literature that Quran/Allah devoted some  ~ 84 verses on this guy.  In fact Moshin Khan's English transltation of Quran directly adds  Abu Jahl name in to many verses.. for.. eg.

    Quote
    1). Have you (O Muhammad صلى الله عليه وسلم) seen him (i.e. Abu Jahl) who prevents
    (  سورة العلق  , Al-Alaq, Chapter #96, Verse #9)
     
    2). Tell me if he (Abu Jahl) denies (the truth, i.e. this Qur'an) and turns away?
     
    3). Nay! If he (Abu Jahl) ceases not, We will catch him by the forelock -
    (  سورة العلق  , Al-Alaq, Chapter #96, Verse #15)
     
    4).  Nay! (O Muhammad صلى الله عليه وسلم)! Do not obey him (Abu Jahl). Fall prostrate and draw near to Allah!
    (  سورة العلق  , Al-Alaq, Chapter #96, Verse #19)


    And in Hadith we have this on that Abu Jahl guy

    Sahih Bukhari translation.(Book #4, Hadith #241)
    Quote
    Narrated 'Abdullah bin Mas'ud: Once the Prophet was offering prayers at the Ka'ba. Abu Jahl was sitting with some of his companions. One of them said to the others, "Who amongst you will bring the abdominal contents (intestines, etc.) of a camel of Bani so and so and put it on the back of Muhammad, when he prostrates?" The most unfortunate of them got up and brought it. He waited till the Prophet prostrated and then placed it on his back between his shoulders. I was watching but could not do any thing. I wish I had some people with me to hold out against them. They started laughing and falling on one another. Allah's Apostle was in prostration and he did not lift his head up till Fatima (Prophet's daughter) came and threw that (camel's abdominal contents) away from his back. He raised his head and said thrice, "O Allah! Punish Quraish." So it was hard for Abu Jahl and his companions when the Prophet invoked Allah against them as they had a conviction that the prayers and invocations were accepted in this city (Mecca). The Prophet said, "O Allah! Punish Abu Jahl, 'Utba bin Rabi'a, Shaiba bin Rabi'a, Al-Walid bin 'Utba, Umaiya bin Khalaf, and 'Uqba bin Al Mu'it (and he mentioned the seventh whose name I cannot recall). By Allah in Whose Hands my life is, I saw the dead bodies of those persons who were counted by Allah's Apostle in the Qalib (one of the wells) of Badr.


    from Sahih Muslim translation.(Book #019, Hadith #4394)
     
    Quote
    It has been narrated on the authority of Anas that when (the news of) the advance of Abu Sufyan (at the head of a force) reached him. the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) held consultations with his Companions. The narrator said: Abu Bakr spoke (expressing his own views), but he (the Holy Prophet) did not pay heed to him. Then spoke 'Umar (expressing his views), but he (the Holy Prophet) did not pay heed to him (too). Then Sa'd b. 'Ubada stood up and said: Messenger of Allah, you want us (to speak). By God in Whose control is my life, if you order us to plunge our horses into the sea, we would do so. If you order us to goad our horses to the most distant place like Bark al-Ghimad, we would do so. The narrator said: Now the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) called upon the people (for the encounter). So they set out and encamped at Badr. (Soon) the water-carriers of the Quraish arrived. Among them was a black slave belonging to Banu al-Hajjaj.

    The Companions of the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) caught him and interrogated him about Abu Sufyan and his companions. He said: I know nothing about Abu Sufyan, but Abu Jahl, Utba, Shaiba and Umayya b. Khalaf are there. When he said this, they beat him. Then he said: All right, I will tell you about Abu Sufyan. They would stop beating him and then ask him (again) about Abu Sufyan. He would again say', I know nothing about Abu Sufyan, but Abu Jahl. 'Utba, Shaiba and Umayya b. Khalaf are there. When he said this, they beat him likewise. The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) was standing in prayer. When he saw this he finished his prayer and said: By Allah in Whose control is my life, you beat him when he is telling you the truth, and you let him go when he tells you a lie. The narrator said: Then the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said: This is the place where so and so would be killed. He placed his hand on the earth (saying) here and here; (and) none of them fell away from the place which the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) had indicated by placing his hand on the earth.


    Abudawud translation. (Book #14, Hadith #2703)
    Quote
    Narrated Abdullah ibn Mas'ud: I passed when AbuJahl had fallen as his foot was struck (with the swords). I said: O enemy of Allah, AbuJahl, Allah has disgraced a man who was far away from His mercy. I did not fear him at that moment. He replied: It is most strange that a man has been killed by his people. I struck him with a blunt sword. But it did not work, and then his sword fell down from his hand, I struck him with it until he became dead.  

    Some of those Meccan Pagan names we see above such as "Abu Sufyan, but Abu Jahl. 'Utba, Shaiba and Umayya b. Khalaf"  are in a story of an event event that took place allegedly around the year 624 where as those first two surahs(Chapters 96 & 68 of the book) must have come out of prophet of Islam in the beginning of Islam that is around the years 610 /611.  So These 71 verses of these 2 chapters are allegedly revealed to prophet because of some problems he had in the town he was living.  Should we consider them as words of god for all times?  ., I don't know and I don't care as they don't have any relevance to the present day situations in 21st century.  And I don't see  any words of allah/god whatever in those  71 verses, what I see is the words of town leader who is trying to encourage  his followers to go and fight their so-called enemies of his own town..

    And what is up with this STUPID WRITING STYLE OF QURAN?

    Quote
    096.002 : He created man from a clot.
    096.003 : Read and your Lord is Most Honorable,
    096.004 : Who taught (to write) with the pen
    096.005 : Taught man what he knew not.
    096.006 : Nay! man is most surely inordinate,
    096.007 : Because he sees himself free from want.
    096.008 : Surely to your Lord is the return.
    096.009 : Have you seen him who forbids
    096.010 : A servant when he prays?


    what kind of verses are they with 4 or 5 words that have no head and no tail in sentence  yet fools in 21st century take some words like " 096.002 : He created man from a clot."  say it is  science if reproductive biology?  and turn the silly verses of a book  as revelations of basic facts in science from allahgod? ... Foooooools   And  what is the point  writing a book like that? can they put four or 5 allegedly reveled statements  together make it as readable, sensible statement of out of them?

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #20 - January 02, 2013, 12:08 PM

    So going to that revealed surah-3 in a sequence(which is chapter 73 in the book)  AL-MUZZAMMIL (THE ENSHROUDED ONE, BUNDLED UP)
    , it   has 20 verses in it and was allegedly revealed in Makkah  somewhere between 1 and 5th years after Prophet of Islam became messenger of Allah god in the year 610.  
     
     
    Quote
    073.001: O you who have wrapped up in your garments!
    073.002: Rise to pray in the night except a little,
    073.003: Half of it, or lessen it a little,
    073.004: Or add to it, and recite the Quran as it ought to be recited.
    073.005: Surely We will make to light upon you a weighty Word.
    073.006: Surely the rising by night is the firmest way to tread and the best corrective of speech.
    073.007: Surely you have in the day time a long occupation.
    073.008: And remember the name of your Lord and devote yourself to Him with (exclusive) devotion.
    073.009: The Lord of the East and the West-- there is no god but He-- therefore take Him for a protector.
    073.010: And bear patiently what they say and avoid them with a becoming avoidance.
    073.011: And leave Me and the rejecters, the possessors of ease and plenty, and respite them a little.
    073.012: Surely with Us are heavy fetters and a flaming fire,
    073.013: And food that chokes and a painful punishment,
    073.014: On the day when the earth and the mountains shall quake and the mountains shall become (as) heaps of sand let loose.
    073.015: Surely We have sent to you a Messenger, a witness against you, as We sent a messenger to Firon.
    073.016: But Firon disobeyed the messenger, so We laid on him a violent hold.
    073.017: How, then, will you guard yourselves, if you disbelieve, on the day which shall make children grey-headed?
    073.018: The heaven shall rend asunder thereby; His promise is ever brought to fulfillment.
    073.019: Surely this is a reminder, then let him, who will take the way to his Lord.

    073.020: Surely your Lord knows that you pass in prayer nearly two-thirds of the night, and (sometimes) half of it, and (sometimes) a third of it, and (also) a party of those with you; and Allah measures the night and the day. He knows that you are not able to do it, so He has turned to you (mercifully), therefore read what is easy of the Quran. He knows that there must be among you sick, and others who travel in the land seeking of the bounty of Allah, and others who fight in Allah's way, therefore read as much of it as is easy (to you), and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate and offer to Allah a goodly gift, and whatever of good you send on beforehand for yourselves, you will find it with Allah; that is best and greatest in reward; and ask forgiveness of Allah; surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

    well let us put the verses together to make some  sense., This surah interesting in the sense all 19 verses contain one line statement and suddenly you have a verse 20 that makes sense on its own..  so we will leave that alone.

    Quote
    073.001 to 009 : O you who have wrapped up in your garments!;  Rise to pray in the night except a little, ; Half of it, or lessen it a little, ; Or add to it, and recite the Quran as it ought to be recited. ; Surely We will make to light upon you a weighty Word. ; Surely the rising by night is the firmest way to tread and the best corrective of speech. ; Surely you have in the day time a long occupation. ; And remember the name of your Lord and devote yourself to Him with (exclusive) devotion. ; The Lord of the East and the West-- there is no god but He-- therefore take Him for a protector.

    All that saying is do little prayers to your lord at the end of the day.. Every religion says same thing not a big deal..

    Quote
    073.010 to 019: And bear patiently what they say and avoid them with a becoming avoidance.; And leave Me and the rejecters, the possessors of ease and plenty, and respite them a little.; Surely with Us are heavy fetters and a flaming fire,;  And food that chokes and a painful punishment,; On the day when the earth and the mountains shall quake and the mountains shall become (as) heaps of sand let loose.; Surely We have sent to you a Messenger, a witness against you, as We sent a messenger to Firon.; But Firon disobeyed the messenger, so We laid on him a violent hold.; How, then, will you guard yourselves, if you disbelieve, on the day which shall make children grey-headed?; The heaven shall rend asunder thereby; His promise is ever brought to fulfillment.; Surely this is a reminder, then let him, who will take the way to his Lord.

     well all those 10  verses are ranting against those who are not following Prophet of Islam/his congregation and his preachings..  it is a very common theme in Quran in its every chapter. Few verses asks the followers to Pray allahgod, few verses say follow the words of messenger and few verses send  the opponents of Prophet of Islam  in to hell fire and death and to that they added one or two statements from a story of old  testament  such as  "We sent a messenger to Firon.; But Firon disobeyed the messenger  so We laid on him a violent hold" .

    Again whole surah is nothing more than repetition of a style that we see in many chapters.. There is no science and nothing special in it  and there is NO HISTORY that one can extract to couple it to Islam of that time and Prophet of Islam. The verse 20, last verse is funny.,  It  appears as if these guys who put Quran together didn't know what to write in  it,  so they essentially repeated all first 9 verses  and put together and made another verse
    Quote
    073.020: Surely your Lord knows that you pass in prayer nearly two-thirds of the night, and (sometimes) half of it, and (sometimes) a third of it, and (also) a party of those with you; and Allah measures the night and the day. He knows that you are not able to do it, so He has turned to you (mercifully), therefore read what is easy of the Quran. He knows that there must be among you sick, and others who travel in the land seeking of the bounty of Allah, and others who fight in Allah's way, therefore read as much of it as is easy (to you), and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate and offer to Allah a goodly gift, and whatever of good you send on beforehand for yourselves, you will find it with Allah; that is best and greatest in reward; and ask forgiveness of Allah; surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

    the only thing difference in this is, All of you should  OFFER  A GIFT TO ALLAH, off course as usual part of it goes to messenger and other soldiers of the faith to propagate the faith.,  And that  also is is not really new as many religious  congregations   collect  money..  That is all what is, new in that and  the rest of it is same as the first 9verses  

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #21 - January 02, 2013, 11:30 PM

    Well let us move to that  surah-4  (which is chapter 74 in the book)  AL-MUDDATHTHIR (THE CLOAKED ONE, THE MAN WEARING A CLOAK) .  it   has 56 verses and was allegedly revealed in Makkah, again sometimes  between 1 and 5th years after Prophet of Islam became messenger of Allah god.

     
    Quote
    074.001; O you who are clothed!
    074.002; Arise and warn,
    074.003; And your Lord do magnify,
    074.004;: And your garments do purify,
    074.005; And uncleanness do shun,
    074.006; And bestow not favors that you may receive again with increase,
    074.007; And for the sake of your Lord, be patient.
    074.008; For when the trumpet is sounded,
    074.009; That, at that time, shall be a difficult day,

    074.010; For the unbelievers, anything but easy.
    074.011; Leave Me and him whom I created alone,
    074.012; And give him vast riches,
    074.013; And sons dwelling in his presence,
    074.014; And I adjusted affairs for him adjustably;
    074.015; And yet he desires that I should add more!
    074.016; By no means! surely he offers opposition to Our communications.
    074.017; I will make a distressing punishment overtake him.
    074.018; Surely he reflected and guessed,
    074.019; But may he be cursed how he plotted;
    074.020;: Again, may he be cursed how he plotted;
    074.021; Then he looked,
    074.022; Then he frowned and scowled,
    074.023; Then he turned back and was big with pride,
    074.024; ~Then he said: This is naught but enchantment, narrated (from others);
    074.025; This is naught but the word of a mortal.
    074.026; I will cast him into hell.

    074.027; And what will make you realize what hell is?
    074.028; It leaves naught nor does it spare aught.
    074.029; It scorches the mortal.
    074.030; Over it are nineteen.

    074.031: And We have not made the wardens of the fire others than angels, and We have not made their number but as a trial for those who disbelieve, that those who have been given the book may be certain and those who believe may increase in faith, and those who have been given the book and the believers may not doubt, and that those in whose hearts is a disease and the unbelievers may say: What does Allah mean by this parable? Thus does Allah make err whom He pleases, and He guides whom He pleases, and none knows the hosts of your Lord but He Himself; and this is naught but a reminder to the mortals.

    074.032; Nay; I swear by the moon,
    074.033; And the night when it departs,
    074.034; And the daybreak when it shines;
    074.035; Surely it (hell) is one of the gravest (misfortunes),
    074.036; A warning to mortals,
    074.037; To him among you who wishes to go forward or remain behind.
    074.038; Every soul is held in pledge for what it earns,
    074.039; Except the people of the right hand,

    074.040; In gardens, they shall ask each other
    074.041; About the guilty:
    074.042; What has brought you into hell?
    074.043; They shall say: We were not of those who prayed;
    074.044; And we used not to feed the poor;
    074.045; And we used to enter into vain discourse with those who entered into vain discourses.
    074.046; And we used to call the day of judgment a lie;
    074.047; Till death overtook us.
    074.048; So the intercession of intercessors shall not avail them.
    074.049; What is then the matter with them, that they turn away from the admonition
    074.050; As if they were asses taking fright
    074.051; That had fled from a lion?
    074.052; Nay; every one of them desires that he may be given pages spread out;
    074.053; Nay! but they do not fear the hereafter.
    074.054; Nay! it is surely an admonition.
    074.055; So whoever pleases may mind it.
    074.056; And they will not mind unless Allah please. He is worthy to be feared and worthy to forgive.

    well that is how  I am going separate the surah in to various sections and put together again to make some sense out of those verses

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #22 - December 25, 2013, 02:26 AM

    So let me rewrite  that revelation  Surah-4( compiled in to surah-74) again to make readable as  story. I often suggest to folks., do  not just read one verse and try to understand Quran.  You got to read around a bit to make it a sensible story out of these verses.  

    Quote
    074.001 to 009: O you who are clothed!;  Arise and warn, And your Lord do magnify,   And your garments do purify, And uncleanness do shun,  And bestow not favors that you may receive again with increase, And for the sake of your Lord, be patient.  For when the trumpet is sounded, That, at that time, shall be a difficult day,

    074.010 to 026: For the unbelievers, anything but easy. Leave Me and him whom I created alone,  And give him vast riches, And sons dwelling in his presence,  And I adjusted affairs for him adjustably;  And yet he desires that I should add more! By no means! surely he offers opposition to Our communications.   I will make a distressing punishment overtake him. Surely he reflected and guessed, But may he be cursed how he plotted; Again, may he be cursed how he plotted; Then he looked, Then he frowned and scowled,  Then he turned back and was big with pride, ~Then he said: This is naught but enchantment, narrated (from others);  This is naught but the word of a mortal.  I will cast him into hell.

    074.027-030:  And what will make you realize what hell is? It leaves naught nor does it spare aught. It scorches the mortal. Over it are nineteen.

    074.031: And We have not made the wardens of the fire others than angels, and We have not made their number but as a trial for those who disbelieve, that those who have been given the book may be certain and those who believe may increase in faith, and those who have been given the book and the believers may not doubt, and that those in whose hearts is a disease and the unbelievers may say: What does Allah mean by this parable? Thus does Allah make err whom He pleases, and He guides whom He pleases, and none knows the hosts of your Lord but He Himself; and this is naught but a reminder to the mortals.

    074.032-039: Nay; I swear by the moon,  And the night when it departs, And the daybreak when it shines; Surely it (hell) is one of the gravest (misfortunes), A warning to mortals, To him among you who wishes to go forward or remain behind.  Every soul is held in pledge for what it earns,  Except the people of the right hand,


    074.040 -056: In gardens, they shall ask each other  About the guilty: What has brought you into hell?  They shall say: We were not of those who prayed;  And we used not to feed the poor;  And we used to enter into vain discourse with those who entered into vain discourses.  And we used to call the day of judgment a lie;  Till death overtook us.  So the intercession of intercessors shall not avail them.  What is then the matter with them, that they turn away from the admonition  As if they were asses taking fright  That had fled from a lion? ; Nay; every one of them desires that he may be given pages spread out;  Nay! but they do not fear the hereafter. ; Nay! it is surely an admonition.  So whoever pleases may mind it. And they will not mind unless Allah please. He is worthy to be feared and worthy to forgive.

     Well that is our 4th surah..

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #23 - December 25, 2013, 02:49 AM

    Well let us put that nice Suarh the little one with 7 verses AL-FATIHA (THE OPENING)., In the compilation order it is suarh-1 where as its revelation order is 5

    Quote
    001.001 -007 : In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful. All praise is due to Allah, the Lord of the Worlds, The Beneficent, the Merciful. Master of the Day of Judgment. Thee do we serve and Thee do we beseech for help.  Keep us on the right path.  The path of those upon whom Thou hast bestowed favors. Not (the path) of those upon whom Thy wrath is brought down, nor of those who go astray.


    well that is a nice little prayer without any yahoo..yahoo.. yeehaaa shouting.,    that is our 5th surah..

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet of Muhammad's Life strictly from Quran
     Reply #24 - December 25, 2013, 10:59 AM

    I have to mention here that Hallakuf asked a simple and important question in this  thread  "Good idea! But how do you know that your list is the real sequence?" which I casually joked and moved on without answering it,  but that is an important question. Although we find Chronological order of Quran on web in sites like

    http://www.masjidtucson.org/quran/miracle/revelationorder.html
    http://www.qran.org/q-chrono.htm
    http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Chronological_Order_of_the_Qur'an

    and many others., they essentially copy from each other except that masjidtucson guy in  that first link.. The Egyptian Caliph .. the biochemist  from California "dr. Rashad Khalifa". That guy tried to go to original source.   Off course he was BRUTALLY murdered by the heroes of Islam in that Arizona desert.   Any ways  That question needs  a careful analysis and we will do it on the way after reading Quran..

    So let us read another little chronological chapter .. Chapter-6., It has only 5 verses and idiots who collated Quran as book put it as  chapter 111 in the present book.  

    5th chapter that was revealed by allah/god goes in to 111?? Who  did that and why?  finmad    RASCALS.,  Idiots can not even put the  Allah/almighty order correctly??

    Any ways let us read that Surah 111:  AL-MASADD (PALM FIBRE, THE FLAME) allegedly revealed in Mecca..

    Quote
    111.001: Perdition overtake both hands of Abu Lahab, and he will perish.
    111.002 : His wealth and what he earns will not avail him.
    111.003: He shall soon burn in fire that flames,
    111.004: And his wife, the bearer of fuel,
    111.005 : Upon her neck a halter of strongly twisted rope.

    well there is an important clue on the history of Quran because this little one has a proper name " Abu Lahab," .... Abu..abuuuu Allah/God allmighty , all knowing the one ruling all this universe with billion or so galaxies remembers Abu Lahab..   Why??

    well whatever .. let us read it again together
    Quote
    111.001 to 005:
    Perdition overtake both hands of Abu Lahab, and he will perish. His wealth and what he earns will not avail him. He shall soon burn in fire that flames, And his wife, the bearer of fuel, Upon her neck a halter of strongly twisted rope.

    what the hell was that ? that is one whole chapter??   well  let us move on. But I will write something later after reading few more chapters of Quran...

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #25 - December 25, 2013, 12:33 PM

    No..no   your comment is very important.   I knew that business  of transliteration but many readers don't know that  Alex., That is a very good point you mentioned.  I think  translating one language to another language keeping every word in the same sequence is nonsense. It is OK to start with but they have to move on to explain the people in a proper format.   Any ways I am worse than you in English  as well as in Arabic.. or  for that matter any language Alex..

    So please join the thread and correct the text wherever you think is necessary..  


    This may be a little off topic but, pretty much anywhere it says "is" or "of", they should have a bracket.
    Arabic contains no "is" or "of".
    An example is: هو ممتز. This means He (is) excellent. Huwa (هو) means he, and moomtaz  (ممتز) means excellent, but there is no "is".

    Tell people that there's an invisible man in the sky who created the universe, and the vast majority will believe you.

    Tell them the paint is wet, and they have to touch it to be sure.
    - George Carlin
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #26 - December 25, 2013, 12:44 PM

    And now we move on to Surah-7  Al-Takwir  has 29 verses allegedly was revealed in Mecca and some fools put that in to chapter 81 of present Quran.   

    Quote
    081.001 to 014 :

    When the sun is covered,
    And when the stars darken,
    And when the mountains are made to pass away, And when the camels are left untended,
    And when the wild animals are made to go forth,
    And when the seas are set on fire,
    And when souls are united,
    And when the female infant buried alive is asked, For what sin she was killed,
    And when the books are spread,
    And when the heaven has its covering removed,
    And when the hell is kindled up,
    And when the garden is brought nigh,
    Every soul shall (then) know what it has prepared.

    Well that is a nice sonnet but we can make it sound better. Again there is something special in those highlighted words.  Why did that verse come here when every thing sounds goody goody in that song/sonnet??  And can an Arabic poet of that time write such sonnets?

    Quote
    081.01-5:018:
    But nay! I swear by the stars, That run their course (and) hide themselves, And the night when it departs, And the morning when it brightens,

     "Swearing by stars  night departs   light comes out of sun"   is all nice but

    Why these next verse should be in that wonderful rhyming words?  
    Did any one say "you are NOT a honored messenger during that time?
    did any one say "your followers are rascals, ruffians and vagabonds?"

    anyways let us go down the path
    Quote
    081.019:025

    Most surely it is the Word of an honored messenger, he processor of strength, having an honorable place with the Lord of the Dominion, One (to be) obeyed, and faithful in trust. And your companion is not gone mad.  And of a truth he saw himself on the clear horizon. Nor of the unseen is he a tenacious concealer. Nor is it the word of the cursed Shaitan,


    well let us read rest of those last four verses..
    Quote
    081.026 -029:
    Whither then will you go?  It is naught but a reminder for the nations,  For him among you who pleases to go straight. And you do not please except that Allah please, the Lord of the worlds.


    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #27 - December 25, 2013, 01:27 PM

    This may be a little off topic but, pretty much anywhere it says "is" or "of", they should have a bracket.
    Arabic contains no "is" or "of".
    An example is: هو ممتز. This means He (is) excellent. Huwa (هو) means he, and moomtaz  (ممتز) means excellent, but there is no "is".

    Sam.. Noooooo., you are not off topic, you are within the topic and you have full freedom to correct whatever I write  Please join the thread help me out...

    So we did some 180 verses but we have not written any TAFSIR on those verses., well we write tafsir for all the verses together once we finish  reading some 5% of Quran. I assure you CEMB will do better than that Syed Abul Ala Maududi

    Any ways let us move on and read next chapter. which is al-Ala., it is chapter 87 in the book allegedly revealed in Mecca and has 19 verses.. But for us it is chapter-8 al-Ala ..

    Quote
    087.001 to 011

    Glorify the name of your Lord, the Most High,
    Who creates, then makes complete,
    And Who makes (things) according to a measure, then guides (them to their goal),
    And Who brings forth herbage,
    Then makes it dried up, dust-colored.
    We will make you recite so you shall not forget,
    Except what Allah pleases, surely He knows the manifest, and what is hidden.
    And We will make your way smooth to a state of ease.
    Therefore do remind, surely reminding does profit.
    He who fears will mind,
    And the most unfortunate one will avoid it,

    Quote
    087.012-013

    Who shall enter the great fire;
    Then therein he shall neither live nor die.


    Quote
    087.014-019

    He indeed shall be successful who purifies himself,
     And magnifies the name of his Lord and prays.
    Nay! you prefer the life of this world,
    While the hereafter is better and more lasting.
    Most surely this is in the earlier scriptures,
     The scriptures of Ibrahim and Musa.

    well those are our 19 verses of chapter-8  .. what do we have there?

    Allah knows the best...

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #28 - December 25, 2013, 02:13 PM

    well we did that al-Ala chapter and now let us move on to surah Al-Lail  ., In revelation order it is allegedly revealed as chapter-9., but some Islamic intellectuals put that in to a book as chapter-92

    So we read chapter-9 .. 92.. whatever., It is again revealed in Mecca and has 21 verses in it.

    Quote
    092.001-004

    I swear by the night when it draws a veil,
    And the day when it shines in brightness,
    And the creating of the male and the female,


    Quote
    092.004-007

    Your striving is most surely (directed to) various (ends).
    Then as for him who gives away and guards (against evil),
    And accepts the best,
    We will facilitate for him the easy end.


    Quote
    092.008 : 011

    And as for him who is niggardly and considers himself free from need (of Allah),
    And rejects the best,
    We will facilitate for him the difficult end.
    And his wealth will not avail him when he perishes.

    Damn it appears  that guy Abu is still in Allah mind even after 4-chapters of revelation. well let us move on..
    Quote
    092.012-21

    Surely Ours is it to show the way,
    And most surely Ours is the hereafter and the former.
    Therefore I warn you of the fire that flames
    None shall enter it but the most unhappy,
    Who gives the lie (to the truth) and turns (his) back.
    And away from it shall be kept the one who guards most (against evil),
    Who gives away his wealth, purifying himself
     And no one has with him any boon for which he should be rewarded,
    Except the seeking of the pleasure of his Lord, the Most High.
    And he shall soon be well-pleased.


    Well those are 21 verses from Chapter-9.., but warn who?  
    Abu Lahab guy?  
    who was that guy who was bothering Allah?
    or was he bothering Prophet?
    or was he bothering some leader of a street of Mecca of that time?

    Well so many questions to answers.. and we will in time..

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Reading Quran And Inquiring in to Prophet Muhammad's Life from Quran
     Reply #29 - December 25, 2013, 02:53 PM

    Boy ., Holidays are here,  every one is eating too much., every one is getting angry..  So let us read Quran Chapter-10., So our chapter-10 is Al-Fajr.,

    It has 30 verses in it and allegedly revealed in Mecca, AND THE RASCALS PUT IT AS CHAPTER_89 and they did it way after death of Prophet of Islam.     

    finmad   I am angry  so let us read the verses..
    Quote
    089.001-006
    I swear by the daybreak,
    And the ten nights,
    And the even and the odd,
    And the night when it departs.
    Truly in that there is an oath for those who possess understanding.
    Have you not considered how your Lord dealt with Ad,

    Quote
    089.007-012
    (The people of) Aram, possessors of lofty buildings,
    The like of which were not created in the (other) cities;
    And (with) Samood, who hewed out the rocks in the valley,
    And (with) Firon, the lord of hosts,
    Who committed inordinacy in the cities,
    So they made great mischief therein?

    Quote
    089.013-016
      Therefore your Lord let down upon them a portion of the chastisement.
     Most sure!y your Lord is watching.
     And as for man, when his Lord tries him, then treats him with honor and makes him lead an easy life, he says: My Lord honors me.
     But when He tries him (differently), then straitens to him his means of subsistence, he says: My Lord has disgraced me.

    Quote
    089.017-022
    Nay! but you do not honor the orphan,
    Nor do you urge one another to feed the poor,
    And you eat away the heritage, devouring (everything) indiscriminately,
    And you love wealth with exceeding love.
    Nay! when the earth is made to crumble to pieces,
    And your Lord comes and (also) the angels in ranks,

    Quote
    089.023-030
    And hell is made to appear on that day. On that day shall man be mindful, and what shall being mindful (then) avail him?
     He shall say: O! would that I had sent before for (this) my life!
    But on that day shall no one chastise with (anything like) His chastisement,
     And no one shall bind with (anything like) His binding.
      O soul that art at rest!
     Return to your Lord, well-pleased (with him), well-pleasing (Him),
     So enter among My servants,
     And enter into My garden.

    Well there is lots of stuff going on in that verse.. but over all our Allah seems to be ranting at some feudal guys of the town and  Heee Allah/God is using Muhammad's mouth to rant against rascals.  Any we will deal with tafsir at later time..

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
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