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Theme Changer

 Topic: CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed

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  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #390 - December 21, 2015, 06:29 AM

    Some of this stuff needs to be memorized and written down on pieces of bark.
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #391 - December 21, 2015, 06:38 AM

    I know, right. Just incase this forum shuts down for some reason.. lol.

    We'll preserve the ex-muslim faith.. Start putting it on Sheep skins or something.

    "If you don't like your religion's fundamentalists, then maybe there's something wrong with your religion's fundamentals."
    "Demanding blind respect but not offering any respect in reciprocation is laughable."
    "Let all the people in all the worlds be in peace."
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #392 - December 21, 2015, 08:57 AM

    ...........................

    We'll preserve the ex-muslim faith.. ...................


    by definition,  ex-muslims have no faith dear ExMuslimVlogGuy,   ...

    They are in fact Faithless people happened to be muslims/related to muslims  in the past..  in principle they don't care about faiths but they care about people,,,

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #393 - December 21, 2015, 09:06 AM

    I have received revelation from the Ex-Muslim God!

    You shall all follow my command!  Tongue

    There will now be an Ex-Muslim faith! If you guys don't donate to this forum, I will come after you like Abu Bakr did!

    "If you don't like your religion's fundamentalists, then maybe there's something wrong with your religion's fundamentals."
    "Demanding blind respect but not offering any respect in reciprocation is laughable."
    "Let all the people in all the worlds be in peace."
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #394 - December 21, 2015, 05:12 PM

    I had that view of converts before, that they were amazing and bright haing converted, and more genuine than Muslims. But when you see the religion for what it is, converts, particularly former atheists, become the most baffling creatures. They embody all the faults of believers (servility, reductionism, etc ) but in much more acute form. On top of that, they have to adopt all the backward cultural traits. So I came to the conclusion that all converts were looking for a club and new set of friends, or had grown up around Muslims and wanted to join their ranks.

    Converts from other religions, however, are a fairly reasonable and easy to understand phenomenon.



    The truth is that no one knows how many people convert each year or how many people leave each year and what gender or race they are.  Plenty of people convert, live, and leave as solitary Muslims on the fringe of a community.  But based on what I've seen over the years of my adulthood, I think the reason female converts who leave seem more obvious is because it often coincides with the end of a marriage.  Not that women are leaving just because they get divorced, but rather, the divorce is the result of the apostasy.  Also, again in my experience, you see women waiting until their kids are grown and then 'suddenly' they get a divorce and leave Islam.  Of course, they were just waiting until they could be assured that there wouldn't be a 'Not Without my Daughter' situation.


    Quote
    You see an Asian really into it, and it's 'Oh right, yeah,' but if you see a convert who's really into it, it's 'Oh, they converted and now they're more Muslim than the Muslims'.  The converts who don't get into the religion too much, and there are a lot of them, are much less visible, on the other hand, because they do blend into the regular society.  Also, I have to point out that there is a lot more pressure placed on converts by the Muslim community to be super-religious, whereas an Arab or Asian brother can go off and sell liquor in his store and have a girlfriend and nobody bats an eye.  Because of the natural lack of knowledge, it's probably natural then for a convert to be 'super Islamic' at least for a while. I knew plenty of converts who started out 'super Muslim' and gradually became more relaxed or liberal the way lots of Arab, Turkish, and Asian people were as they learned more or practised more of the religion


    Quote
    However, to be honest, I think that a lot of people who convert to Islam do have emotional and mental issues.  Not all, but a fair amount. Is that a cause?  I have definitely seen a lot of people who converted to Islam with mental illnesses, and I think they desired the comfort of a highly structured life where decisions are made for you - how to dress, how to eat, and so on.  


    "If you don't like your religion's fundamentalists, then maybe there's something wrong with your religion's fundamentals."
    "Demanding blind respect but not offering any respect in reciprocation is laughable."
    "Let all the people in all the worlds be in peace."
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #395 - December 21, 2015, 05:48 PM

    Thanks again for teaching us so much, those posts are really top notch insight and understanding. Sociology realness.
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #396 - December 22, 2015, 12:00 PM

    ...I like the system that protects one's rights to be an asshole and also my right to tell them they're an asshole. .....lua


    Damn so many assholes in this forum....

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #397 - December 28, 2015, 10:16 PM

    Quote from: Cornflower, in the shoutbox
    I have an oral re-exam tomorrow I have to pass or else I'm fucked.

     whistling2

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #398 - December 28, 2015, 10:51 PM

    The only time anyone finds it worth quoting me is when making fun of me. Fine! I'm and idiot. Happy now?   Cry
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #399 - December 28, 2015, 11:00 PM

    Come on, that was too good. Cheesy Cheesy
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #400 - December 28, 2015, 11:04 PM

    Get your minds out of the gutter, I would advice  nyanya
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #401 - December 28, 2015, 11:08 PM

    But Cornflower, the gutter is my mind's natural habitat. Surely you wouldn't wish to evict unique species from their natural habitats.

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #402 - January 10, 2016, 10:26 PM

    If we're really talking about practicing Muslims, you'll inevitably be accused of having become a "different person" because to them you are. You no longer pray, nor fast, nor believe in the same things (thus, being able to relate when topics of faith, the hereafter and other related issues come up for discussion). All those things are practices you do together in a community, group activities more or less. The social aspect of Islam can be gold, but it can also be an immense burden that imprisons the individual.

    So yes, on one hand I'm really the same person. I've always had the interests I've had. At least now, I can fulfill them all and continue trying out new things. I've always more or less had the same or similar values, I've just broaden my perspectives with age. But the core values, my core personality, is exactly the same.

    But imagine this scenario:

    A woman in niqab, very faithful with strong belief. She spends all her time memorizing, learning, and teaching the Quran and the religion. She spends all her time with other Muslim women with children. She starts having lectures in the masjid. You can't really do much except certain child activities because that's not halal, or it's not OK for us women because of this or that. All her friends are Muslims. She might engage in intellectual conversations about theology, science or social issues. Very well, she might not hold opinions that most would assume a Muslim would. Even dares calling herself a feminist, questioning bits and pieces of the patriarchy that literally beats her down everyday... But she tries really hard to stay within the circle of Islam. Because, you know. She doesn't want to step out of the fold of Islam. What if someone calls her a mubtadi?

    Then all of a sudden, like lightning from the sky.

    She doesn't want to wear the niqab, she wants to take it off. She even gives hints that the hijab itself is becoming a burden. She criticizes and questions Islam, in all possible ways. She expresses opinions about science and theology that are way out of Islam's comfort zone. She even makes fun of the fundamentalists; is that humour she uses when parodying the mujahideen? Astaghfirullah! She stops hanging out with her Muslim friends, says she wants to make new friends. What's up with stopping reciting the Quran, ukhtee why you not memorize the verses of Allah? Hey, I haven't seen her pray in a very long time. Does she really pray when she's in her room? Why you not pray in group no more, ukhtee? When's the last time you opened your fiqh or hadeeth books, ukhtee?

    BAM!

    She ain't Muslim no more.

    She dresses like everyone else, actually spends a lot on her wardrobe and shoes. Geez, what obsession with dunya. Is that a designer bag? She wears skimpy clothes, hangs out with men.  She drinks, she even eats khanzeer for crying out loud. She has more ambitions than just being a mother. Ehrmergaaahd she does sports! A guy's sports, nonetheless! She doesn't even believe in god, she went from a pious niqabi mother and wife, seeker of knowledge... to an atheist, single mom, who thinks Islam is pretty shitty, and who even drinks and has sex outside marriage.

    Hasbiallah wa ni'mal wakeel. Ukhtee, you really changed. You're not my ukhtee anymore. You are the enemy of Allah.

  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #403 - January 10, 2016, 11:31 PM




    my goodness gracious ., that is one of the finest real life narrative of enlightened ex-Muslim woman  I ever read on internet..

    Thank you toor for putting that here

     

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #404 - January 11, 2016, 01:43 AM

    Love it too CF..
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #405 - January 11, 2016, 10:16 AM

    That was really good Cornflower  happydance
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #406 - January 11, 2016, 10:29 AM

    Thanks ya'll  Smiley
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #407 - January 11, 2016, 01:20 PM

    If we're really talking about practicing Muslims, you'll inevitably be accused of having become a "different person" because to them you are. You no longer pray, nor fast, nor believe in the same things (thus, being able to relate when topics of faith, the hereafter and other related issues come up for discussion). All those things are practices you do together in a community, group activities more or less. The social aspect of Islam can be gold, but it can also be an immense burden that imprisons the individual.

    So yes, on one hand I'm really the same person. I've always had the interests I've had. At least now, I can fulfill them all and continue trying out new things. I've always more or less had the same or similar values, I've just broaden my perspectives with age. But the core values, my core personality, is exactly the same.

    But imagine this scenario:

    A woman in niqab, very faithful with strong belief. She spends all her time memorizing, learning, and teaching the Quran and the religion. She spends all her time with other Muslim women with children. She starts having lectures in the masjid. You can't really do much except certain child activities because that's not halal, or it's not OK for us women because of this or that. All her friends are Muslims. She might engage in intellectual conversations about theology, science or social issues. Very well, she might not hold opinions that most would assume a Muslim would. Even dares calling herself a feminist, questioning bits and pieces of the patriarchy that literally beats her down everyday... But she tries really hard to stay within the circle of Islam. Because, you know. She doesn't want to step out of the fold of Islam. What if someone calls her a mubtadi?

    Then all of a sudden, like lightning from the sky.

    She doesn't want to wear the niqab, she wants to take it off. She even gives hints that the hijab itself is becoming a burden. She criticizes and questions Islam, in all possible ways. She expresses opinions about science and theology that are way out of Islam's comfort zone. She even makes fun of the fundamentalists; is that humour she uses when parodying the mujahideen? Astaghfirullah! She stops hanging out with her Muslim friends, says she wants to make new friends. What's up with stopping reciting the Quran, ukhtee why you not memorize the verses of Allah? Hey, I haven't seen her pray in a very long time. Does she really pray when she's in her room? Why you not pray in group no more, ukhtee? When's the last time you opened your fiqh or hadeeth books, ukhtee?

    BAM!

    She ain't Muslim no more.

    She dresses like everyone else, actually spends a lot on her wardrobe and shoes. Geez, what obsession with dunya. Is that a designer bag? She wears skimpy clothes, hangs out with men.  She drinks, she even eats khanzeer for crying out loud. She has more ambitions than just being a mother. Ehrmergaaahd she does sports! A guy's sports, nonetheless! She doesn't even believe in god, she went from a pious niqabi mother and wife, seeker of knowledge... to an atheist, single mom, who thinks Islam is pretty shitty, and who even drinks and has sex outside marriage.

    Hasbiallah wa ni'mal wakeel. Ukhtee, you really changed. You're not my ukhtee anymore. You are the enemy of Allah.


    I don't even care that toor beat me to it.

    "God will say, "O Jesus, son of Mary, did you say to the people, 'Make me and my mother gods beside God?" Qur'an 5:116

    "I told them clearly that I am a man...and that they should never make a mistake in assuming or pretending that the human being is emanated from a deity." - Haile Selassie
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #408 - January 11, 2016, 01:26 PM

    Quote
    Ehrmergaaahd


     Cheesy Cheesy
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #409 - February 11, 2016, 11:41 AM

    It blows my mind that you genuinely think you're "asking questions". You're either so self-unaware that you have no idea what you're doing, or you have a problem with English comprehension, because asking a loaded rhetorical question and answering it yourself with a claim that someone is a kafir is not "asking questions". You're accusatory, disrespectful, and incredibly self-righteous. On top of that, you're anti-Semitic.

    If you want to post here, you need to respect this website as a space for ex-Muslims. No one gives a fuck about your Islam or your Allah. No one gives a fuck about your non-existent right to be self-righteous and disrespectful. Yes, we are most certainly kafir. We wear that label with pride—because of people like you. We've reclaimed that label. It's not derogatory, not insulting. It doesn't put us down. It makes us proud of who we are. We're kafir, and we hope you seethe inside that you no longer wield power over us with that word.

  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #410 - February 12, 2016, 12:16 PM

    ............."Yes, we are most certainly kafir. We wear that label with pride—because of people like you. We've reclaimed that label. It's not derogatory, not insulting. It doesn't put us down. It makes us proud of who we are. We're kafir, and we hope you seethe inside that you no longer wield power over us with that word"............ Absurdist

    Hmm.... Absurdist is on roll ...Oops nbhb already pasted whole post...

    Whole post has a big hole  Cheesy  so let me do it again with relevant part of his post...

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #411 - February 12, 2016, 01:05 PM

    You also brought forth a nugget yeez. Although I hope it's not the kind you fuck with!  grin12

    how fuck works without shit??


    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #412 - February 20, 2016, 03:48 PM

    Thanks to Bolton 34 for bringing our attention to this old gem of a post from three:

    I have met some people who lived their lives to please someone else. None of them are happy. They have happy moments, but they are overall not happy. Often they blame everything they are not happy about on their parents, or whoever they were trying to please. This creates a lot of resentment. You start out doing your parent's bidding out of love and you end up hating them for it.
    You can have all the best intentions, but when you hand the reins of your life over to someone else, you reap the results of decisions that you never made. You have to live with that forever.
    Take the responsibility to live your life by your own choices. If you are dependent on your parents, then choose your timing for when you are capable of independence. That is the safest route.
    You did not ask to be born. You did not ask to be born intelligent. But this is now your life. You do not owe anyone else the control of it. Make your own mistakes, hold no one but yourself accountable for them. Also create your own successes, and take the credit for them. 
    The ever watching eye of Allah is a hard habit to break. Keep reading, and logic your way out of it. I have a habit of viewing things as halal and haram even when I know these are fabricated categories. It is a habit. Do not let it become a bludgeon you use to beat yourself with when you go to bed at night. There are entire successful and moral countries who do not recognize sin as we have. That is proof to me that it is a lie.
    And go easy on yourself. Change is hard on a person. Give it some time, and be a friend to yourself during this transition.


    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #413 - February 27, 2016, 11:18 PM

    Sharing this Lua on FB. I will keep it anonymous.

    Hell is an absurd & wicked fiction. You're not a bad person for rejecting something that's cruel, irrational, unjust & lacks evidence. You have nothing to fear. Nothing to feel ashamed about. Enjoy your life. Do the best you can. Make yourself & others happy.
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #414 - February 28, 2016, 12:36 AM

    Well, thank you. I hope it is helpful for some of those who read it.

    I don't want to be good anymore. I want to be right.
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #415 - March 17, 2016, 03:22 AM

    My own spacing if not paragraphing, and my own italicisation.

    Well, I am a sucker for outright declarations of affection. Nice to see some positive emotion out here.

    But really I think y´all are viewing Islam very differently and therein lies the contrasting opinion. We have to remember that Islam predates the information age by quite a bit and historically many Muslim cultures did not understand or know of much fiqh at all.

    If you look at Islam as a series of communities, what I usually try to term as the Ummah, then you have a huge difference between codified and collected Arabic canon (Islam) and the vast generations of self-declared Muslims who practiced religion as they understood it (Islam).

    A quick read on this thread makes it look like y´all are just arguing fiqh versus ummah. Both make Islam, and both can make very different kinds of Islam, every kind, really, because there is probably that much diversion among text and that much diversion among people. 

    I have always argued that people softened the canon throughout the ages by interpreting it more humanely than they had to, more sympathetically than it was written, because they are [sic] kind hearted.

    The information age has thrown that on it´s ear, now. No one can claim not to understand a text anymore, or claim it means something nicer than it does.

    I feel both sides are technically correct. Islam has a rich history of interpretation, and a sad history of codification. Y´all just seem to be arguing the meaning of Islam, whether the followers define it, or whether the canon does. I vote the former and fear the latter to be true.

  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #416 - March 17, 2016, 09:53 AM

    This belongs here as maybe every one of your posts.

    I can bore everyone more but I think I have made my methodological resistance clear enough in my previous post above.

    Another thing I find interesting to think about though is the problem of Islamic violent extremists about whom we are talking all along if indirectly. That is to say, is it contentual or contextual?

    So far, political leaders and so-called ‘moderates’ tell us it is conclusively contextual i.e. they have genuine situational grievances such as racism, poverty, precariatism, dysfunctional families, single-parent families, bad neighbourhoods, lack of education and or employment opportunities etc. that make them self-actualise by turning to jihad in the name of Islam. “This”, they point to X, Y or Z act of mass killing or civilian bombing “is not Islam”. It so happens that this gets followed not necessarily all the time by the non-sequitur “Islam is a religion of peace”.

    I get the fact that in political calculations, it is foolish for any country, blighted by acts of Islamic bombings, to throw the front line widely open with 1.5 billion people by calling their faith terrorism. Indeed it is foolish for a Western government advisor, let alone secretary or minister, to tie such acts up with anything but contextual ideation — and progressive agendas — because they’d probably face the chop and be speedily officially dissociated with. To complete this dramatis personae, now the role of the ‘moderates’ kicks in; you see them with their Taqiyahs and non-Western attire on television screens, on different channels, making the exact claim “this is not Islam”. The fact of these ‘moderates’ having beards or not is moot. But the unmistakable traditionalist imagery being projected is usually to legitimise and give the exact claim “this is not Islam” contentual compliance.

    Others say that the problem of Islamic violent extremists is contentual. That is, it is the content of the Islamic texts that justifies and encourages such acts of barbarism. For such thinkers, there’s no point in trying to fight verses with other verses. Revealed Mecca or in Madina.

    Thus, no amount of fanciful interpretations can contextualise the stench of permanent Jihad against the Kuffs found in this Madina verse in At-tawbah [9:29]:

    قاتلوا الذين لا يؤمنون بالله ولا باليوم الآخر ولا يحرمون ما حرم الله ورسوله ولا يدينون دين الحق من الذين اوتوا الكتاب حتى يعطوا الجزية عن يدٍ وهم صاغرون

    Officially and on governments’ level, the West cannot say or accept contentualising terrorism because of political considerations, some of which I have eluded to above. In addition to this, freedom of religion is guaranteed in law and this freedom is all encompassing and would render banning certain aspects of contentual Quran as unlawful.

    Not to forget policies of social cohesion. I speak as the co-author of a legal report to Family Court in the UK on the validity of an Islamic marriage and how the court was being encouraged by the professor and legal jurist I was assisting to consider social cohesion and practise its discretionary powers not to send the wrong message upsetting governmental cohesive policies.   

    It’s really interesting that it has fallen to the Egyptian President Abdul Fatah Al Sisi to say unequivocally that the problem of Islamic violent extremism is contential. His speech was plastered all over the news and was the headline on many news websites online, including those showing signs of what some would call regressive leftism. It is as if everybody was waiting for wa shahida shahid mi ahhliha. As if Sisi himself was an authority in such matters for Muslims in Egypt and elsewhere.

    Indeed, it is not far-fetched to suggest that the issues being dealt with in My Ordeal with the Quran are contentual in nature. To confuse its contentuality for what is largely incidental is to miss the point in its entirety.

    Although I have come to see the Islamic violent extremism problem to be partially contextual, it remains for me to be massively contentual. I myself had believed it was my contentual duty to aid my Muslim brothers and sisters in Afghanistan against the West. If my father didn’t learn about my plans and didn’t confiscate my passport, I would really have been one of those Islamic violent extremists.

    When the chance came again in Iraq, six out of my thirsty Quranic students crossed the Syrian border to Iraq and died fighting in the way of Allah. My brother in-law was one of those fighters who attacked Abu-Gouraib Prison facilitating detainees’ mass escape.

    All of this was under the influence of a contentual duty.

    My brother in-law managed then to fight in Yemen before finally opting for a sedentary life on civvy street. He is happily married now but still believes it is his Islamic contentual duty to hate and fight the filthy kuffars anywhere they may be. His somewhat early retirement from fabulous Jihad is something he puts down his laziness and weakness. Not ideological or contextual.

    I appreciate this is now turning autobiographical, in the same manner the previous post risked appearing glossological. I am thinking here and though I've always been an auto-didact, I am no didact. Only standing up for a method of truth discovery which, at least, enjoys a modicum of rigour and academic respectability against experimental approaches to traditional Islam.

    Contextual or contentual. It is a bit of both and in practice a lot of either. This 'either' for now at least I'm persuaded to say it is the content of the Quran for a lot of the otherwise educated, affluent violent extremists.

  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #417 - March 22, 2016, 12:43 PM

    That's really kind of you to say, nbhb.
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #418 - March 30, 2016, 11:30 PM


    Heidegger? Is that you Heidegger? Some of what you said seems to be very similar to post-modern Christianity based upon Heidegger and later work based on his views. Have you read Time and Being?

    One of the approaches of post-modern Christianity is not to view the stories in which God is a character as a literal act of God within the world but a reference to the human condition and our ability to transcend what and who we are. Each story about God is used to motivate inquiry into self thus is far more subjective than mainstream ideas. It takes the view that doctrine, tradition and dogma have been used to teach people the "right" thoughts about God rather than for them to develop their own ideas. You must think X about God because each factor claims it is the only way to think. If you do not think as they do something is wrong with you. For example the sacrifice of Isaac in mainstream views is used to show absolute faith in God. The gotcha I was just bluffing is ad hoc. From a PM-C view point Abraham failed the test as he blindly followed God's commands even when he had moral issues with the commands. In the end God pulled his gotcha showing that there was never any intention for Issac to die. He should of told God to stuff his plans like he did with Sodom and Gomorrah. In that story Abe blasts God for willing to kill the righteous with the wicked. The point being to kill everyone for the guilt of even a majority is wrong. The "innocents" were removed from harm but this rises the question were they saved only due to Abraham's point. Another example are the acts of genocide which make God a moral monster. A lot of doctrine has lead to horrible acts and ideas especially when it comes to religious justification for violence. God allows genocide and violence. As long as people claim the pretenses required for the act they justify it.  Doctrine and dogma which advocate violence are telling you what to think and what to do based on their point of view rather than your own point of view. It dehumanizes not only the victims but also you as it covertly tells you not to trust your own reasoning. It tells you something that is morally wrong is morally right because God did it, special pleading included.

    Miracles are also dismissed as all have negative consequences for God. One is God is always acting in the past never the present. He wasn't freeing Christian slaves from the Ottomans or Americas. It shows a God that acts on whims, emotions and favoritism. More so the doctrine and dogma developed by prosperity doctrine based on favoritism has created horrible views regarding success and failure of an individual as an act of God. Children starving to death? God must not favor them. Bloated Americas? God is on your side. Nation is in a recession, God must be anger about something. These views have been used to embrace capitalism to a point that Christianity is part of capitalism in many nations. More so one only needs to look at the religious right (Canada/America) that embrace greedy millionaires or bought politicians that claim to be Christian but are not. The very idea of Christians interacting with Christians that embrace greed, profit, etc is against the NT and Paul's views.

    It dismisses the claims of empiricism based on arguments for God in philosophy and apologetic claims of literal acts. Claim such as the Quran was dictated by God to Gabriel to Muhammad establishes a chain of causality. The problem with such a claim is that causality is empirical and has been for centuries. This applies to metaphysics as well. If one invoke principles of causality to infer God exists all you have done is make metaphysics empirical, supernatural is now natural. To have an effect on the empirical is to be empirical. God becomes defined as an object rather than God is or a being. God becomes restricted by the very principles used to as evidence of existing. Existing is defined by specific parameters thus God becomes part of the universe rather than transcending it. God becomes a powerful but limited entity. Hence why God in literalist views never transcends the human condition but merely reflect it. It never rises above it's human environmental and cultural origins since it is defined by both.

    To me it seems like a similar approach in which modern issues are actually addressed rather than returning to a nostalgia based view of a past golden age that never existed. People seem to think a return to the old will magically solve problem yet they ignore that these system were in place when modern issues started to increase and failed as a solution when it has not only the majority to do so but the power to enact it.








    I thought this was a superb post by Bogart.

    "God will say, "O Jesus, son of Mary, did you say to the people, 'Make me and my mother gods beside God?" Qur'an 5:116

    "I told them clearly that I am a man...and that they should never make a mistake in assuming or pretending that the human being is emanated from a deity." - Haile Selassie
  • CEMB Greatest Hits - posts you may have missed
     Reply #419 - March 31, 2016, 03:52 AM

    So is post modern Christianity essentially just treating the Bible as if it was a piece of literature like Shakespeare or Animal Farm that is to be read and analyzed as fiction to get moral lessons out of it ?


    In my opinion a life without curiosity is not a life worth living
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