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Theme Changer

 Topic: just wondering..

 (Read 39365 times)
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  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #210 - September 16, 2010, 10:43 AM

    it's not about sexes, it's all about respecting other people's beliefs, that's what atheists claim to do and ask each one of us creationists to do, i thought u guys were like that. it's not hypocritical, it's just that there's limit to what a person can take and some of you crossed that limit long time ago. anywa, i already apologized for saying GT*O, i shouldn't have said it..

    I realise you apologised, but that was after the event & exchange of words.

    You started the abuse by saying "get the fuck out" - you surely cant expect a reasonable response from the person you directed this to?

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  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #211 - September 16, 2010, 12:48 PM

    Luna,
    A 12 year old girl from Yemen recently bled to death on her wedding night because she was "married" by her parents to some guy - she wasn't sufficiently physically developed to have intercourse.

    Do you believe that Yemen is a much colder than the place where your prophet had sex with Aisha?


    i'm sorry, but girls around the world have sex (without marriage) at the age of 12 and 13, why don't they bleed? this was just one unfortunate case
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #212 - September 16, 2010, 12:53 PM

    i'm sorry, but girls around the world have sex (without marriage) at the age of 12 and 13, why don't they bleed? this was just one unfortunate case

    yeah, shame about her but I still am not au fait with such young people getting married.  But then I guess your moral standards are owned by the Quran

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  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #213 - September 16, 2010, 01:06 PM

    Quote
    Then there is the question of mental maturity, as opposed to biological maturity.


    at that time, girls considered themselves too old at the age of 12, as i said aisha was engaged to some other guy before the prophet, the prophet married safiiya at the age of 16, and she was married twice before

    the law of iran states that the minimum age for the girl to be married is 16

    in angola, mexico, vatican state, and zimbabwe, the minimum age for girls to be allowed to have sex (without marriage)  is 12

    According to UNICEF’s “State of the World’s Children-2009” report, 47% of India's women aged 20–24 were married before the legal age of 18, with 56% in rural areas.[15] The report also showed that 40% of the world's child marriages occur in India

    islamic countries: Indonesia: 21, 19 for males and 16 for females with parental consent. (Indonesia's Civil Law)
    Iran: 18 for male, 16 for female[21]
    Iraq: 18, 15 with judicial permission if fitness, physical capacity and guardian's consent (or unreasonable objection on part of guardian) are established.
    Jordan: 16 for males and 15 for females,
    Pakistan: 18 for males, 16 for females

    the least age of consent is  in south africa (12).. tanzania (12), syria (13).. new hampshire (13)

    Quote
    The Prophet asked Abu Bakr for Aisha's hand in marriage. Abu Bakr said "But I am your brother." The Prophet said, "You are my brother in Allah's religion and His book, but she is lawful for me to marry."


    the reason for that is that abu bakr considered himself the brother of the prophet, and we all know it's not permissible to marry nephews and nieces , but the prophet made that clear by telling him they're brothers in islam
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #214 - September 16, 2010, 01:08 PM

    I realise you apologised, but that was after the event & exchange of words.

    You started the abuse by saying "get the fuck out" - you surely cant expect a reasonable response from the person you directed this to?


    lol okay, first of all can we please just drop this it's not worth it
    second of all, i didn't start this, the user abbas did by telling me to GT*O and i answered with the same manner

    is this how you get your facts about islam too?? by reading half of the truth ?!!
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #215 - September 16, 2010, 01:22 PM

    Didnt see that bit - in that case you're right, you'll have to accept my apologies  lipsrsealed

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  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #216 - September 16, 2010, 01:27 PM

    is this how you get your facts about islam too?? by reading half of the truth ?!!

    Like i said at the beginning you're approaching your quest for the truth from the wrong standpoint, youre not being objective and are assuming its true to begin with. Same applies with all the way you have phrased all your questions recently.

    You see we can all attempt to justify almost anything if we try hard enough, the question is only about our sincerity.  Personally I dont think you are ready yet to question, sounds like you want to believe its the truth rather than assume you have so far been suckered in by a lie.

    Not meaning to sound condescending, but I really think you should approach these questions when you are slightly older.

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  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #217 - September 16, 2010, 01:36 PM

    it's not about sexes, it's all about respecting other people's beliefs, that's what atheists claim to do and ask each one of us creationists to do, i thought u guys were like that. it's not hypocritical, it's just that there's limit to what a person can take and some of you crossed that limit long time ago. anywa, i already apologized for saying GT*O, i shouldn't have said it..

    Technically "atheists" as a group do not claim anything in particular.
    The common denominator of atheists is the LACK of claim that God(s) exist(s).

    Some are militant assholes, some do not give a crap about what anyone else believes or doesn't believe.

    Do not look directly at the operational end of the device.
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #218 - September 16, 2010, 01:38 PM

    Anyway Luna, I suggest you try and split your arguments into different threads.
    That will help avoid everyone ganging up against you with each one picking a different topic to criticize, with you being unable to follow, and everyone getting frustrated and whatnot ^_^

    Do not look directly at the operational end of the device.
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #219 - September 16, 2010, 01:43 PM

    Its called moderation Luna, we are not advocating binge drinking or alcoholism


    Moderate drinking is actually good for you. Studies have show that they live longer than non-drinkers.


    yes i know that alcohol has some benefits, but the disadvantages are way more than the advantages

    For men, moderate drinking is typically defined as consuming an average of 2 drinks per day. For women, moderate drinking is typically defined as consuming an average of 1 drink per day, who would abide by this? or who does?

    Alcohol affects every organ in the body. It is a central nervous system depressant that is rapidly absorbed from the stomach and small intestine into the bloodstream. Alcohol is metabolized in the liver by enzymes; however, the liver can only metabolize a small amount of alcohol at a time, leaving the excess alcohol to circulate throughout the body.

    also, the intensity of the effect of alcohol on the body is directly related to the amount consumed. (as u guys said)

    When Islam prohibited alcohol and drugs, it prohibited them whether they are taken in much or little amounts. If a person is allowed to take the little, the much will be taken later.
    in islam there's a rule that says "Of that which intoxicates in a large amount, a small amount is haram. (Ahmad, Abu Dawud and At-Tirmidhi)"
    which is true by the way, the christian faith allows alcohol only in small amounts, but as we can see, people aren't able to control themselves esp. when they have issues and need to forget

    alcohol is bad, it may be fun, but it's bad and leads to even worse things

    A number of disease conditions are wholly attributable to alcohol. These include alcoholic psychoses, alcohol-dependence syndrome, as well as some diseases affecting the nerves (alcoholic polyneuropathy), the heart (alcoholic cardiomyopathy), the stomach (alcoholic gastritis), and the liver (alcoholic liver cirrhosis).

    Alcohol can cause a number of different cancers:

    •The risks of developing lip, tongue, throat, oesophagus and liver cancer increases proportionally with the amount of alcohol consumed.
    •Even moderate alcohol consumption can cause breast cancer, according to recent research, and a series of studies confirm that the risk increases with the amount consumed.
    •Evidence of a possible link with alcohol consumption is weaker for cancers of the stomach, prostate, colon, rectum and ovaries

    Alcohol can have both a damaging role and a protective role in the development of cardiovascular disease. Alcohol consumption, particularly heavy drinking occasions, can contribute to high blood pressure, abnormal heart rhythms, heart failure, and strokes. At low levels of consumption (less than 40g of pure alcohol per day) without heavy drinking occasions alcohol may protect against strokes, at least in women. This is equivalent to 3 small glasses of wine or 1 litre of beer per day. Above this limit, the risks of cardiovascular disease increase dramatically.

    Alcohol is the main cause of liver cirrhosis in developed countries

    Alcohol appears to contribute to causing depression. Moreover, alcohol dependence and other mental conditions often go hand in hand, though the role of alcohol in these conditions remains unclear.

    On the one hand, low to moderate alcohol consumption may offer some protection against ischaemic stroke. On the other hand, alcohol consumption increases the risk of haemorrhagic stroke.

    Low to moderate levels of alcohol consumption can reduce the risk of coronary heart disease, one of the leading causes of death in the world. Most of the protective effect is gained by consumption of as little as one drink every other day. However, when people consume higher levels of alcohol, the risk of coronary heart disease is greater than when they abstain from drinking altogether.
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #220 - September 16, 2010, 01:52 PM

    I dont think thats the reason why alcohol is prohibited in Islam...

    Why is pork not allowed again?

    "We are never deceived, we deceive ourselves." - from Goethes Faust
    "Only the wisest and the stupidest men never change." - Confuzios
    "there is no religion of peace, only people who are peaceful while being religious."
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #221 - September 16, 2010, 01:57 PM

    Didnt see that bit - in that case you're right, you'll have to accept my apologies  lipsrsealed


    lol thank you Smiley

    Like i said at the beginning you're approaching your quest for the truth from the wrong standpoint, youre not being objective and are assuming its true to begin with. Same applies with all the way you have phrased all your questions recently.

    You see we can all attempt to justify almost anything if we try hard enough, the question is only about our sincerity.  Personally I dont think you are ready yet to question, sounds like you want to believe its the truth rather than assume you have so far been suckered in by a lie.

    Not meaning to sound condescending, but I really think you should approach these questions when you are slightly older.

    i think you're wrong, for me it's the best time to search for the truth

    i don't know if this is right, but some of you guys gave me the feeling that you don't want a religion, it's not about islam or aisha or the prophet, some of you just want to live, a life with no limits, and there's nothing wrong in that, but you don't have to keep blaming islam for this, it's a good religion.

    don't tell me am not being objective, i told you i always have been a muslim by name, we weren't raised even as moderate muslims, i chose this way, i keep reading about it and i keep choosing it over and over, on the other hand, my brother chose atheism.
     i always ask why, and there's always a because in islam, it's not enough to read the verse or the hadith or the story, what's important is to know what's behind it.

    oh and i only phrased one question, my other posts were answers.  
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #222 - September 16, 2010, 02:10 PM

    Quote
    i don't know if this is right


    Its not right.


    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #223 - September 16, 2010, 02:41 PM

    Can anybody explain to the class what the difference is between an early teen starting her period and a 9 year old child?

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #224 - September 16, 2010, 04:43 PM

    lol thank you Smiley
    i think you're wrong, for me it's the best time to search for the truth

    i don't know if this is right, but some of you guys gave me the feeling that you don't want a religion, it's not about islam or aisha or the prophet, some of you just want to live, a life with no limits, and there's nothing wrong in that, but you don't have to keep blaming islam for this, it's a good religion.

    don't tell me am not being objective, i told you i always have been a muslim by name, we weren't raised even as moderate muslims, i chose this way, i keep reading about it and i keep choosing it over and over, on the other hand, my brother chose atheism.
     i always ask why, and there's always a because in islam, it's not enough to read the verse or the hadith or the story, what's important is to know what's behind it.

    oh and i only phrased one question, my other posts were answers.  

    I am sure there are those that choose a hedonistic lifestyle over & above religion, but I cant think of any regular posters here that are like that.  Thats partly the reason we are here, and not getting pissed & drugged up to the eyeballs.  Its was a long process that was a large part of us, something I no doubt you would do if you were to ever (Allah forbid) to give up Islam.  Ignoring a straightforward fact that we would be tortured for eternity, fried & refried, is only something that stupid people would do. 

    I dont think we have stupid people of that calibre over here, but you will need to judge for yourself.  Does your brother belong to this category?

    Quote
    but you don't have to keep blaming islam for this, it's a good religion.

     
    There you go again, you are starting from this premise.  Like I said you are not on a journey, you journey is already complete.

    We are the same, all of the regulars here have completed their journey so some of the things they say will be off-the-cuff comments that appear biased.  But thats expected from somebody who has made their mind up, not somebody who is genuinely questioning.   I think you want to believe in a higher being, and because Islam makes the most sense to you, therefore its the one true religion (if there is such a thing)

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  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #225 - September 16, 2010, 05:34 PM

    Hey, speak for yourself... im a hedonist!  dance

    And im off to fuck random women (and men ((and animals))), drink alcohol, dance around naked, consume lots of drugs and just do hedonistic stuffs like that.  cool2

    "We are never deceived, we deceive ourselves." - from Goethes Faust
    "Only the wisest and the stupidest men never change." - Confuzios
    "there is no religion of peace, only people who are peaceful while being religious."
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #226 - September 16, 2010, 10:10 PM


    Luna, remember Nujood Ali the 8 year old Yemeni girl who got divorced ?

    Here is a picture of her, look how small and skinny she is. Makes me wonder what happened to girls grow and mature faster in a hot climate (you don´t get it much hotter than in Yemen) or has that somehow changed some time during the last 1,400 years ?



    Here are some other photos of her, look at the one where she is standing between 2 adult women, notice the difference in size.



    If by some freak of nature she had started menstruating and became pregnant, do you really think that her pelvis was developed enough and that she would be able to carry a pregnancy to term and give birth ?

    This is what might have happened :


    Quote
    A 12-year-old Yemeni girl, who was forced into marriage, has died after struggling to give birth to a baby for three days.

    Fawziya Abdullah Youssef died of severe bleeding on Friday while giving birth to a stillborn in Hodeida province, 140 miles west of the capital San’a.

    Youssef was only 11 when her father married her to a 24-year-old man who works as a farmer in Saudi Arabia, Sky News reported.


    http://dailycontributor.com/child-bride-12-dies-after-struggling-to-give-birth/7253/

    Or this :

    Quote
    Married as Children, Women With Obstetric Fistulas Have No Future

    by Sonny Inbaraj

    (March 2004) Wobete Falaga, who is from a village in the northern Gojam province in Ethiopia's Amhara region, was only 13 when she became pregnant. Married at 11, just before her first menstrual period, her small underdeveloped body was not ready for the stress of childbirth. After five days of grueling labor at home, her child was finally born, but it was dead.

    As a result of the long, strenuous labor, Wobete suffered crippling injuries. There was a hole, or fistula, between her bladder and vagina and another between her vagina and rectum. The damage left her body unable to control its normal excretory functions, and urine and feces were constantly dripping down her legs. Her husband quickly rejected her, sending her home to her family.

    Wobete's mother took her to the government health clinic in the province's main town, Bahir Dar, but the nurses there said they were unable to treat the girl. They advised Wobete's mother to take the girl to the capital Addis Ababa as soon as possible and said if her condition remained untreated, she would face death from infection and kidney failure. The family sold a cow to pay for the three-day bus journey and arrived penniless at the gates of the Addis Ababa Fistula Hospital with Wobete.

    These are common tales for the hospital's founder, Dr. Catherine Hamlin, an Australian gynecologist who has spent the last 44 years in Addis Ababa and is a pioneer in performing surgery for women with obstetric fistula.

    "All the women who reach the gates of the hospital feel that their lives have been ruined" says Hamlin. "They have no self-worth and have become social outcasts from their community at a very young age through no fault of their own. They've suffered all this injury unnecessarily because they haven't got enough obstetric care in the provinces."


    http://www.prb.org/Articles/2004/MarriedasChildrenWomenWithObstetricFistulasHaveNoFuture.aspx


     
    Quote
    AFRICA
    Pregnancy Illness Devastates 100,000 Women Yearly
    By Haider Rizvi

    UNITED NATIONS, Jun 19, 2003 (IPS) - Alarmed by a new study that found millions of African women continue to suffer and even die from the pregnancy-related condition fistula, U.N. officials and public health activists are asking rich nations for help in setting up treatment facilities on the continent.

     

    http://ipsnews.net/interna.asp?idnews=18886
     





    Like a compass needle that points north, a man?s accusing finger always finds a woman. Always.

    Khaled Hosseini - A thousand splendid suns.
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #227 - September 26, 2010, 09:16 PM

    Hello.. i apologize sincerely for the late reply but i've been bust with college stuff :$

    Anyway.. I read your questions, I dunno but it seemed to me you were talking about the bible not the Quran in some matters

    Quote
    "evolution of humans"  fact vs adam and eve well perhaps a metaphor tho i would doubt it , espicially the eve part


    What do you mean by the eve part?
     
    The Qur’an clearly states Allah also created Hawa (Eve) by His Hands from the same nature of Adam.
    O mankind! reverence your Guardian-Lord, who created you from a single person, created, of like nature, His mate, and from them twain scattered (like seeds) countless men and women.. (4:1)
    Hence, the Qur’an does not state that Eve was created from Adam’s rib. Yet, there is an authentic Hadith of the Prophet (PBUH) which uses the metaphor of the shape of a rib to describe women.

    The authentic Hadiths says:

    The Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) said: “Treat women kindly. Woman has been created from a rib and the most bent part of the rib is the uppermost. If you try to turn it straight, you will break it. And if you leave it alone, it will remain bent as it is. So treat women kindly.” (Bukhari and Muslim)
    Some scholars perceived the Hadiths in their literal meaning and accepted the idea that Eve was created from Adam’s rib. Yet many scholars, on the other hand, totally rejected this interpretation. They based their argument on the fact that in Arabic, the words “created from” do not necessarily refer to the substance of creation; they can also refer to the nature of something. These scholars sustain their argument with an example from the Qur’an in which Allah says “That man has been created from hastiness”. Of course, this does not mean that man’s substance is hastiness; it only refers to man’s nature and behavior.

    About evolution: there's nothing that contradicts the idea that creatures could have evolved through small stages into the complex organisms that exist today, there's nothing in principle that says we can't believe in that.
    However, there are two things we cannot agree with, we cannot believe that this process is accidental and has nothing to do with God, we can't accept that things happen randomly, Allah is the creator and he is the evolver, and everything happens with his power and permission, God just needs to say be and something is
    Also, we believe that humans were created miraculously,  we don't believe that we've evolved from apes.

    Quote
    noah story (thats why i had a post about it) no evidence to show a global flood that covered mountains


    i've heard abou this before, i looked it up just to make sure, but the only answer i found was that it doesn't state anywhere in the Quran that it was a global event
    the Qur'an speaks of a disaster that covered only the particular region where Noah and his people lived, not the whole of the earth:
    *{We sent Noah to his people. He said, "O my people! Worship Allah! You have no other god but Him. I fear for you the punishment of a dreadful day!
    The leaders of his people said, "Ah! We see you evidently wandering (in mind)."
    He said, "O my people! No wandering is there in my (mind): On the contrary, I am an apostle from the Lord and Cherisher of the worlds!"
    "I but fulfill towards you the duties of my Lord's mission: Sincere is my advice to you, and I know from Allah something that you know not.
    "Do you wonder that there has come to you a message from your Lord, through a man of your own people, to warn you,- so that you may fear Allah and haply receive His Mercy?"
    But they rejected him, and We delivered him and those with him in the Ark: But We overwhelmed in the flood those who rejected Our signs. They were indeed a blind people!}* (Al-A`raf 7:59-64)
    It is clearly stated here that those who rejected Allah's signs were overwhelmed in the flood, and not every living being on the face of the earth.

  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #228 - September 26, 2010, 09:16 PM

    Quote
    a man living for somewhile in a wahles stomach .. unable to procees that


    when talking about the events that happened at the time of prophet yunus, we're talking about miracles here, miracles only happen with the will of God, the Almighty, that makes them logical. Just like the miracles of moses and Jesus. i don't think we would be able to process any of those.
    Qur'an[16:40]
    Indeed, Our word to a thing when We intend it is but that We say to it, "Be," and it is.

    Quote
    suliman and his vast kindom again no evidence

    yea there's no proof yet about the kingdom of Solomon, but there's nothing to deny it either.
    These stories deny nothing, and I don't think we can take them as a metaphor like Christians do

    there's a recent discovery that might interest you.. i don't consider it though
    In February 2010 archaeologist Eilat Mazar announced the excavation of what she believes is a 10th-century city wall and royal structure that she suggests, because of writing in Hebrew, to corroborate the existence of a royal palace and fortified capital city under control of a Hebrew king in Jerusalem in the 10th-century BC. Not all archaeologists believe that there was a strong state at that time, and archaeologist Aren Maeir is dubious about Mazar's dating. In 2008, excavations at Khirbat en-Nahas in southern Jordan revealed ancient copper mines and related industrial remains that were radiocarbon-dated to the 10th century BC, the chronological time of Solomon. This discovery raised the question of whether the mines were part of Solomon's

    judge it yourself..

    Quote
    i have learnt that god knows everything according to islam ... so why the whole life test if he already knows the results


    a friend once told me:
    why do teachers make the students take exams when they already know who the bright & dumb students are?
    I can't answer this one, no one can, prophet Moses tried to ask God about this and He told him to stop questioning, all we know is that Allah is just and we will get what we deserve. We can ask Him when we get up there inshalla Smiley

    Quote
    the earth being flat & the geocentric model again it doesnt say that straight forward in arabic but there isnt a single verse about the earth orbiting, rotating, spining
    etc ....as about the moon and the sun

    6) here are some verses in the Quran talking about earth,sun and moon and  their movement:
    Surah 21, Ayah 33 "It is He Who created the night and the day, and the sun and the moon: All (celestial bodies) swim along, each in its rounded course (orbit)."

    Surah 36, Ayah 40 "It is not permitted to the sun to catch up the moon, nor the night outstrips the day: Each (just) swims along in (its own) orbit (according to Law)"

    but i don't understad, why should there be any verses concerning this?

    i also found some good link about the shape of earth, but it's complicated i can't translate that, if you understand arabic i can give it to you.. if interested

    you can take these as evidence, or you can take them as nothing at all, you be the judge.. Koran is not a book of science, it's a book of guidance, and there's nothing at all to contradict any scientific findings.

  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #229 - September 26, 2010, 09:17 PM

    now about your second post:

    Quote
    she said that el jizya is made on non muslims ... like zaka on muslims yet she failed to give the reason or perhaps hidding the reason .. in the quran it states they pay it  to be subordinate and no its not the same amount as the zaka + lets take my country egypt for an example during the jihad period .. why invade it in the first place then say we will apply the jezya so we can protect u  its obvious more taxes more money, simple!!

    as you know, we can't interpret the Quran literally.

    the Qur'anic verse quoted by some people in their attempt to prove that the jizyah is imposed to humiliate and insult the dhimmis reads,
     
    (Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the Latter Day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Messenger have prohibited, nor do they follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection.) (At-Tawbah 9:29)

    the majority of exegetes interpret it as meaning submission to the Muslim state and commitment to its laws in concordance with Muslims.

    if we compare the physical and financial obligations imposed on the Muslims with those imposed on the dhimmis, we will find that the Muslims undertake the heaviest burden. The Muslims pay zakah and strive for the sake of Allah and sacrifice their souls and properties. All of this brings a kind of safety and protection to the non-Muslims, so that they may work and produce without fearing for their souls or properties inside or outside the Islamic state.

    I've studied the history of islam in school, war by war, muslims started none of them, they went to other countries so that they can spread islam, the leaders of those countries attacked them and made sure they wouldn't get their message of islam to people, hence the war. There are many other reasons, but what I know is that Islam never started any war, islam hates the oppressors,
    "Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, and do not transgress limits (begin not hostility): For Allah loves not transgressors."

    Karen Armstrong, a monotheist argued "“Until the 20th century, Islam was a far more tolerant and peaceful faith than Christianity. The Qur’an strictly forbids any coercion in religion and regards all rightly guided religion as coming from God; and despite the western belief to the contrary, Muslims did not impose their faith by the sword.”

    Mahatma Gandhi: " I became more than ever convinced that it was not the sword that won a place for Islam in those days in the scheme of life. It was the rigid simplicity, the utter self-effacement of the Prophet the scrupulous regard for pledges, his intense devotion to his friends and followers, his intrepidity, his fearlessness, his absolute trust in God and in his own mission. These and not the sword carried everything before them and surmounted every obstacle."

    Quote
    she said women are different than men somewhat  i dislike this sterotyping  

    in my personal opinion, i think that islam handles this one correctly..i was talking about the nature of a woman and a man, which is true by the way, when you think of it, men's nature is really polygamous and dominant, they love to be in charge.. I'm not saying that these qualities should turn into something hideous, marriage is all about love and understanding.

    I live in Jordan, and I see how beautiful marriages are, I watch Egyptian series Tongue and that's the same over there..  it's not at all bad, family members respect one another in the most beautiful way..
    one more thing to think about, divorce rates in the arab/muslim world, for a religion that doesn't say no to divorce, that's an achievement
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #230 - September 26, 2010, 09:17 PM

    Quote
    about the covering up she said men cover up in islam from the knees till the navus , true but i beg to differ on one thing ,as a women dont u find muscular , goodlooking handsome guys abit ,well, SEXY!! brad pitt as a mere example covering his knee navus area is hmm still SEXY!! look at his face ... o the hair, the eyes ( i am not gay but just trying to prove a point)


    yes lol, many of us find men sexy, (not brad pitt though Tongue), we look at men but not the way men look at us.. I see the way when boys look at girls in university, it's disgusting, it's like they sleep with them in their own mind.. it's just not the same and that's a well-known fact.

    Quote
    about homosexuality ... people sexuality is a spectrum really if u combine all perversions like foot fetishism , etc
    u will get a higher % then the so called heterosexuals with no perversions  .. however thats a personal prespective of mine ... perversions are NATURAL!!

     Everything can be fixed nowadays, I've read about this once, and from what I understood is that with the help of a psychiatrist and a doctor everything can be cured. Homosexuality is becoming a trend nowadays, that's how I see it, girls spend their whole live attracted to men but then suddenly they decide to be attracted to girls, I don't see a justification for that.
    I know a guy who is gay, he says that he would take all the emotional pain just to satisfy Allah, he would never do anything wrong and at the same time would never get married. Now that’s a true Muslim

    Quote
    good morals are present in all religions so thats not a thing that should draw ur conclusion that its the true one

    of course all religions teach us morals, but not the way that islam does..Islam is complete.. also very under-estimated in my opinion

    Quote
    why isnt a country like saudiarabia in her opinion not "following islam" correctly?

    finally about Saudi Arabia.. the first and most important thing is royal family.. royalty is not from islam, they may follow Shari'a law to some extent, the laws can easily be overruled and overturned even if it does contradict Islam.
    Saudia Arabia is a very rich country, yet do you see them advanced in any field? They do nothing but betray our nation
    They make things hard and they make religion too difficult to follow, they make many mistakes that make life unbearable
    Look at the big picture, arab countries share the same language, same religion, same concepts, same culture, why aren't they united? It's because they left their religion behind and got distracted with this life, saddam the only person who stood up for us got killed, this is absolutely not islam.

    we can't DEFINE islam, literally it's submission to God, we hear and we obey.. but islam is one huge religion, i, a muslim myself, keep discovering new things in islam each and every day

    i really hope that i answered at least 20% of your questions..  have a good day
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #231 - September 26, 2010, 09:25 PM

    Quote
    yes lol, many of us find men sexy, (not brad pitt though Tongue), we look at men but not the way men look at us.. I see the way when boys look at girls in university, it's disgusting, it's like they sleep with them in their own mind.. it's just not the same and that's a well-known fact.


    Yes, it is generally known that, for evolutionary reasons, men court women much more than women court men, but to degrade into generalities negates a personal all knowing God who is able to read our thoughts and punish us for it.  Women do lust after men  occasionally lust after men far more than is reciprocated.  To say the former happens more than the latter and therefore justifies a blanket law turns the veil into a social custom, nothing more, and not the edict of an all knowing personal god.  


    So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
    My political philosophy below
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
    Just kidding, here are some true heros
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #232 - September 26, 2010, 09:29 PM


    [mo]

    So sexy, only one more year before I bone her.


    [/mo]

    19:46   <zizo>: hugs could pimp u into sex

    Quote from: yeezevee
    well I am neither ex-Muslim nor absolute 100% Non-Muslim.. I am fucking Zebra

  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #233 - September 26, 2010, 09:45 PM

    Quote
    Everything can be fixed nowadays, I've read about this once, and from what I understood is that with the help of a psychiatrist and a doctor everything can be cured. Homosexuality is becoming a trend nowadays, that's how I see it, girls spend their whole live attracted to men but then suddenly they decide to be attracted to girls, I don't see a justification for that.
    I know a guy who is gay, he says that he would take all the emotional pain just to satisfy Allah, he would never do anything wrong and at the same time would never get married. Now that’s a true Muslim


    This was the idea of American psychologists about 60 years ago when the classified homosexuality as a mental disease. They tried electroshock therapy, drugs, negative connotative techniques, etc.  Nothing "cured" homosexuality.  That is because in one sense it is biologically built into homosexual people and is a part of who they are, not some external influence that they choose.  A simple rhetorical question to prove the point is, "when do you choose to become strait?" Luckily homosexuality was removed from the list as a mental disease and freed  thousands of people from being tortured and drugged to combat a part of their personality that does no harm to anyone.  

    It does seem odd that we say that religious people claim that God creates mankind innocent, and that all evil influences comes from everything else in the world when there is plenty of evidence to show that homosexuality isn't strictly a choice.  There are methods being conceived that could theoretically stop a fetus from being born a lesbian and I am sure that religious people are jumping for joy at the prospect of ridding the world of homosexual people ( or at least lesbians ), but the fact that such a method leaves religious people with a choice.  Accept that homosexuals are created by God as part of the natural order  or admit that their own religious worldviews aren't sufficient to explain the world we live in.  

    So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
    My political philosophy below
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
    Just kidding, here are some true heros
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #234 - September 26, 2010, 09:47 PM

    Quote
    of course all religions teach us morals, but not the way that Islam does..Islam is complete.. also very under-estimated in my opinion


    Please list one moral statement that a Muslim could say, that I or another religion can't.  

    So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
    My political philosophy below
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
    Just kidding, here are some true heros
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #235 - September 27, 2010, 02:36 AM

    ok ... first of all i am an arab i understand arabic perfectly ... secondly i am talking about the quran

    1-about the noah story u left out (11:40-43) isnt this a part of the quran ... u shouldnt leave it out hun .. makes u abit misleading..
    since u know arabic that much why not tell us what it says ... cause according to my little knowledge of the arabic language i can almost certainly swear that i read something like (two pairs of each animal) , (waves like mountains) , (and noah's son telling him he will find a mountain to protect him form the flood yet noah told him nothing will) ... seems to me a total flood .. but yea might be regional ..after all the animals onboard are so important and the near by mountains in the"REGION" are small and pesky!!

    but hey its a miracle like that of youns's !!! i understand miracles are miracles ... but he (god)says  be and it is why not kill all unbelievers instantly (during noah's era)?? rather than going through all the trouble??... after all no evidence of the ark  in that location mentioned in the quran verse (11:44)

    2- how the f*** doesnt evolution contradict adam's story? ... can u pls explain verses (38:70-72) and how it DOESNT contradict evolution!!... + what about verses (2:3-32) what so adam knew all the names and communicated so well ... so does a single cell do that??  so according to ur "eve " interpretation she came from adam right "a same person"??  oo right i forgot its only humans "but not other animals" that never evolved but were poofed into existence!!

    but hey i bet in a couple of years from now it will be metaphorical   

    3-the solomon story .. good u dont think the research is true .. cause ITS NOT when it becomes peer reviewed, published and authenticated .. i will consider it  (p.s 10000 BC  is the Upper Paleolithic period (late stone age) , ie still harvesting grains and grinding them ... )
    but hey solomon already knew everything like adam i am betting

    4-the lovely teacher's anology ... FAILS considerably ... u r talking about a human teacher i am talking about GOD.
    difference is the human teacher / professor doesnt know the outcome of the test but GOD does!! the human teacher has to give the test to be fair in giving grades i.e (removing any subjective bias) ... god ultimalely KNOWS WAT WILL HAPPEN AND THE END RESULTS WOULDNT CHANGE UNLESS HE CHANGES THEM HIMSELF!!

    5-if ur evidence for a round earth is duhaha pls refer to other threads posted here or pls refer to http://www.baheth.info/all.jsp?term=دحاها
    and the verses u stated matches perfectly with the geocentric veiw!! <------ hope u know what that is...
    u know god can simply say "rounded .. rotates .. and spinning" instead of "fixed ... spread out and the moon and sun revolving in their own orbits"

    6-ok so its not for submission ... yet in arabic it literally mean sa3'ereen (to make them little .. literally) ... but if u wont take this literally why take anything else literally?? are u picking and choosing??
    and the claim that islam never transgressed is sorry my dear utter BS ... so tell me why did muslim's during the caliphate counquer hmm north africa / persia?? i bet they were not muslims back then and u now are better muslim

    and the whole fallacy of them protecting the other non-muslim citizens is a joke right?? if so why invade them in the first place?? oo i see to spread the religion of peace?? wow *something striking comes in mind* why not spread it USING ANY OTHER METHOD RATHER THAN INVASION?? 
    so let me ask u this if i am a sikh and i tell u 1-pay taxes and live by our rules 2-enter sikhism 3-war ?? whats ur response hun
    .... and by ur anology i bet the jews have every right to possess palastine after all they have divine scripture telling them they should do so , no?? oo yea i see its corrupted and so is the bible but not the quran its protected .. hmm *another wonderful idea comes to mind* WHY NOT PROTECT THE BIBLE FROM CORRUPTION ?? saving us the dilemma of the new revelation "quran"... u cant really trust people after corrupting the torah!! can u? again this is god he should know right??

    7-homosexualism is not a disease ... do u think foot fetishism is a disease too and other fetishes for that matter??

    8-marriages are really beautiful indeed ... if based on love not lust only.... and i bet it wouldnt be so beautiful if he remarried .. a young sexy girl over his first wife ... that hun is disloyality = to adulterey in the broader sense

    9-hmm so they (saudi arabia) implement sharia yet u r unhappy ... and u love saddam  wacko ... u think the royal family is corrupted so lets say they are!! how does it have to do with anything ??
    they have sharia from islamic prespective ... so yes this is an islamic country with islamic laws...


    in conclusion i think u r an apologist ... stetching ancient scriptures to suit watever u desire them to suit ... reminding me of hmm those whom u say are corrupted i.e christians & jews
    ...however if thats the only reason behind ur good morality ... by all means stick with it  Smiley

    Confucius:
    "What you do not like done to yourself, do not unto others."
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #236 - September 27, 2010, 03:47 AM

    If God already know what will happend, then why He still conduct the test? The answer is: justice. People who receive punisment will think it is not fair that they are punished on the things they didn't do and the people who receive reward think they do not worthy to receive it. So even that God already knew what they will do, the event must be conducted for justice.
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #237 - September 27, 2010, 04:00 AM

    no u missed the entire thing .... A-god made us because??
    ... 1-worship him/believe or 2-deny him   <----- if 1- is ur answer pls continue to the next question
    B-does he know what we will do?
    .... yes  or no                                          <------ if yes pls continue
    C-then why carry out the whole creation??
     no choices here pls *insert a rational / intelligent answer of ur liking*
    as answers like worship/believe  ... will denote a circular argument... pls refer again to question B ... i.e will cause us to move in circles between the 2 above question (B,C) without finding a RATIONAL answer

    Confucius:
    "What you do not like done to yourself, do not unto others."
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #238 - September 27, 2010, 05:37 AM

    If God already know what will happend, then why He still conduct the test? The answer is: justice. People who receive punisment will think it is not fair that they are punished on the things they didn't do and the people who receive reward think they do not worthy to receive it. So even that God already knew what they will do, the event must be conducted for justice.


    Yeah, its really quite disgusting isn’t it. I mean, the grand architect of the universe, with the whole glorious cosmos for a playground, and he’s writing lists of prudish rules and dictating the toilet habits of some flash in the pan ape species on a tiny ball of rock in some backwater part of the galaxy. So caught up with human sexual areas and his own inadequacies that he has to set up some shabby and long-winded rat-maze ‘test’ just to keep his lonely, whiney, lazy, sorry arse busy. Its no wonder so many people have no respect for him. Who in their right mind could respect such an entity? He’s more like a Bond villain than an actual master of the all the worlds and lord of creation.

    And of all the people to choose as his prophet, he has to choose some dirty, illiterate pervert who has only slightly less mood swings than himself. Pathetic. What a fucking idiot god. Honestly, is this the best he could do?

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Re: just wondering..
     Reply #239 - September 27, 2010, 07:43 PM


    the majority of exegetes interpret it as meaning submission to the Muslim state and commitment to its laws in concordance with Muslims.

    if we compare the physical and financial obligations imposed on the Muslims with those imposed on the dhimmis, we will find that the Muslims undertake the heaviest burden. The Muslims pay zakah and strive for the sake of Allah and sacrifice their souls and properties. All of this brings a kind of safety and protection to the non-Muslims, so that they may work and produce without fearing for their souls or properties inside or outside the Islamic state.

    I've studied the history of islam in school, war by war, muslims started none of them, they went to other countries so that they can spread islam, the leaders of those countries attacked them and made sure they wouldn't get their message of islam to people, hence the war.


    That's a very interesting perspective Smiley Unfortunately, there is a problem that we encounter with what you are saying.
     
    We already know that violence is not permitted in Islam, but there is a dire exception: violence is permitted when countering oppression. However, as great and lawful as that sounds, in Islam, the number one oppressive element through history has been the resistance to the spread of Islam.

    You confirmed this yourself: "they went to other countries so that they can spread islam, [and] the leaders of those countries attacked them and made sure they wouldn't get their message of Islam to people, hence the war."

    In cases like Banu Qurayza, for example, it is ludicrous to believe that the purpose of Muhammad's initial intervention was to make an independent peace with the people. No, it was to ally them under Islam. This was discovered and resisted and all the men of the tribe, except for those who converted to Islam (including poets and philosophers who stood against Islam), were beheaded and buried in mass graves, while the women and children were taken into slavery. The tribe had no intention of conquering Islam -- it only wished to be left alone after its homeland was ravaged by Roman forces.

    There really is no justification. There can't be.
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