Yes I am taking the baby to Tunisia, he's only 8 weeks old and 'dad' hasn't seen him yet apart from in the webcam. I've got his UK passport sorted and once in Tunisia I know my boyfriend is getting him a Tunisian one too.
Sorry, my opinion is that is not such a hot idea until *you* are eligible for a Tunisian passport. I have known and heard of far too many women in my time whose husbands got the kids "back home" passports, and as soon as they were back in the country, they have all the legal rights to the kids and they can keep them there. The British embassy will
not be able to assist you. If you are not a citizen of the country, you will have to leave. Why would you voluntarily buy into a system that says you, as the mother, do not have the right and are not competent enough to travel with your own child without a male relative (not just the father - male relatives) giving you permission like you are a 3 yr old child? Are you "less than" because of your womanhood? If you don't believe that, then why comply and go along with a system that says you are?
They can kick you out of the country, and you could not see your son again for a very, very long time. Forget his "right" to a worthless Arab passport*. The reason they want the kids to have Arab passports is so the family can claim legal rights to the child in family court in case there is a divorce later (or yes, in case the plan from the get go is to get the child and mother into the country so they can take the child... in Muslim culture, the children "belong" to the father and his family. The mother is seen as having minimal rights and her family as having none at all). Did you find out if Tunisia has mandatory military service for men? Getting him a passport could mean a big headache for him later when he's visiting grandma and is stopped in the airport for failing to serve. It
has happened and his British passport and lifestyle won't save him in that case.... you need to find this stuff out before you go burdening your child with this. Hey, and I am burdened with an Arab passport, so I know of whence I speak... in fact a great many people saying the same advice to you are also Arab passport holders...
(*by worthless I mean that it does not convey to the holder better ease of travel than, say, a British passport. There is really NO reason at all to have it if you are a dual citizen, unless you work there and need to stay without a visa or something).
At the very least, if you are a Tunisian passport carrier, you could stay there if he or his family (and a lot of times, it seems like it's the family behind it, egging on the husband or ex-husband) decide to keep the child from you or engage in a custody battle (and in the Arab countries, the rights of custody are with the father first and his family). Being liberal in terms of Islam does NOT mean that a country's laws are liberal when it comes to being Arabs. I know plenty of people who have liberal beliefs about Islam, don't wear hijab, etc. or they are Christians, but when it comes to their family or other things, they are old school ARABS, and that includes 100% the kids being the "property" of the father and not the mother.
I'm sorry, you asked for advice, and I'm giving you some, but as you said, you are opting to bury your head in the sand when it comes to Islam and perhaps when it comes to the realities for women in the Arab world. I hope it turns out better for you than it has for thousands of other girlfriends and wives of "liberal" "loving" Muslim men with "nice" families. Some of them are "nice" right up until the marriage, others until the wife doesn't convert (or
does convert) or until they get her in the house in their country. For you, this is your life and your experience, but for some of us, this is the thousandth time we've heard this story and we know how MOST of these stories end.
Not all of them. I'm sure many of us have also seen the women who marry younger men from North Africa, have sex with them, and then as soon as the visa is approved, the marriage goes south really, really quickly - totally by coincidence of course - and the husband moves out and moves on with a host of girlfriends or whatever. Maybe he's not like that.
I hope not, since there is a child involved. But you need to reach out to the wives, ex-wives, and ex-girlfriends of North African guys on this... poke around on the internet - there are support groups about this issue.
I wouldn't want to rain on your parade, but I'm trying, like others, to give you a realistic portrait of how things may be from
those of us who are from there or have been there. Maybe you haven't met someone till now who can give you the OTHER side. Understand this, and understand it again: Your rights as a woman, as a mother and wife will NOT be respected in the family courts there should his family decide to take the child or should he divorce you or should he "suddenly" forbid you from leaving b/c he can't get a visa to the UK and he's frustrated and has to exercise control and "manliness" over you the only way he knows how. Just understand that. Understand what you might be giving up and what you might face. It might NEVER happen. It might not happen. But it might.
We just want to be together and it just happens that the person I fell in love with is muslim. I know he would never leave Islam and, although he doesn't do all the stuff I know some do such as pray 5 times per day etc and he also smokes and drinks too, he does talk about Allah and the quran quite a lot. I wouldn't say he was liberal, probably errs on the conservative side.
It's not conservative if he has pre-marital sex with you. You know, there is nothing wrong with being a liberal. The world needs more liberal Muslims.
I would convert if that's what his religion requires of him
It DOESN'T and you shouldn't do something like that for him. He obviously didn't care about Islam's requirement that he be married to the woman he is having intercourse with, so why would this one matter? If you want to make a radical life change and worship and invisible desert god, do it for yourself and because you believe in invisible sky gods, not for a man. Islamically, it wouldn't even be a valid conversion anyway (although yes, I know you can lie to the imam about your convictions and people do it all the time).
I suppose the fact that I'm not really a religious person and don't believe in worshipping some invisible god would carry over no matter which "religion" I'm supposed to follow. I can't see me being much different than I am now in that respect. I realise that this isn't really being a muslim in the true sense of the word but does that really matter so much?
It matters to Muslims. You can't *be* a Muslim if you don't believe in their invisible friend. It's all hard wired into the very word "Muslim."
I've asked him about his, what I call wayward lifestyle according to the quran, (his drinking, smoking, sometimes eating in the day during ramadan, not praying etc) and he says he knows he's not a good muslim right now but that he can make up for this later and Allah will be ok with this. I guess my take on this is that if he enjoys doing these things now he isn't likely to change back again.
Um. No. Again, something some of us have seen thousands of times. All of you who were pot heads and became judgmental Muslim twats later, raise your hands. Or saw it happen to your dads, your brothers, your sisters, your mums, your cousins.
A friend of mine is now getting divorced from her "so liberal" husband who "saw the light of allah" after they had tons of pre-marital sex and got married and he became a "good Muslim" who exercised complete financial, emotional and social control over his family and threw his little temper tantrums as Islam encourages men to, and she was run into the ground. That's just the most recent of my friends anyway. A ton of guys "see their way back to allah" after the marriage... and they were total libertines before. So yes, it does happen ALL THE TIME especially with the rise of Islamism in the Arab world.
I don't feel it should have to be all about him relinquishing all that he is and believes in just because he's fallen for an English girl either. I am more liberal and whilst the ideal is that both of us accept each other for what we are, I do understand that it doesn't always work this way, especially if Islam has such a hold over him.
What are you calling "relinquishing all he is?" What does it mean to accept Tunisian culture and Islam in your life? Some nice tagine and rugs? Or the husband demanding that you ask his permission before leaving the house for anything - including going to the doctor or store? Does it mean that you accept that you are not allowed to answer back? Think about this carefully. What happens with a lot of western women who marry these guys -whether or not the wife is a Muslim - is that she reverts to a really nice 19th century Victorian style role and these guys are given complete control over the house, the woman, the children, the finances, etc. And she might appear all modern from the outside, but it's not what goes on at home. Don't give up yourself and what is essential to you, b/c giving up pork or beer isn't a big deal, but that's not all that you may be expected to do. If he comes to England, let him bring the food and the rugs and the music, but tell him to leave the patriarchal shit at home. Far too few western wives do this and eventually find themselves in the types of marriages that their great-grandmothers lived in.
Cross-cultural marriages are hard, hard work and very tough on both parties involved when there is absolutely no language barrier and they both live in the same country. You are talking about marriage to a man with whom you admit you have major communication problems, who has never lived in your country or you in his, and who, from what you are saying, has no conception of, let alone acceptance of, some common liberal values or understandings. How can you discuss your ideas on what rights a human being has if you can't speak the same language? If it's hard for those of us who speak the same languages and meet and marry and live in the same countries as our cross-cultural spouses and can discuss our commonly held beliefs as well as those things on which we differ, it's a 1000 times more difficult for those like you. I wish all the best to people who try it, I really do, but speaking from experience, I know very, very few women whose cross cultural marriages last more than a few years. I know a few whose marriages are into the decade and a half mark, but they're not happy marriages, and I have known more than a few women who "suddenly" divorced as soon as their kids turned 18.
With all due, it just seems like you're asking for opinions, but with your head buried in the sand by your own admission, I'm wondering if you just need to feel reinforced in a belief that it's you and him against the world, that people don't understand your love, and so forth. And converting to Islam without seriously reading up on it and reading up on what you are agreeing to is a massive mistake, especially when there are children and dual nationalities involved. Do what you like, for you are an adult woman in a country that recognizes the abilities and rights of adult women to make their own life decisions even if they opt not to become informed about those decisions ahead of time... but be ready to accept whatever consequences may come down the pike because of it.
Topic: From me to you