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 Topic: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?

 (Read 10575 times)
  • 12 3 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     OP - June 12, 2010, 08:09 AM

    Ok, so I want to spend the next few months working on my childrens vague understanding on belief systems and why mummy is an atheist.

    I'm looking for good childrens books on evolution, or really well presented documentaries that my kids will focus on.  One is almost 12 so some stuff can be more advanced for him, the other 2 are almost 8, and 6.  I'm thinking for them it needs to be tailored to children more.

    The last few weeks my kids have been coming back from their dads house saying the usual bullcrap about jinn, and how they shouldn't whistle in this house as the angels won't come anymore.  015  you know, all of that crap that young kids are fed as muslims, and no doubt their father will always repeat this shit to them as he is pretty stupid.

    So anyway, I want to nip this in the bud now, I already tell them alot, but me telling them isn't enough, I want to be able to educate them better.

    Any documentaries you would recommend that we can watch together as a family?

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #1 - June 12, 2010, 09:33 AM

    Carl Sagan's Cosmos is a great start for a soothing documentary about science space and other stuff. I think its easily available on youtube. Your 12 year old, if he is into science etc, will love Sagan.

    Pakistan Zindabad? ya Pakistan sey Zinda bhaag?

    Long Live Pakistan? Or run with your lives from Pakistan?
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #2 - June 12, 2010, 09:49 AM

    Also: http://www.atheistparents.org/

    Pakistan Zindabad? ya Pakistan sey Zinda bhaag?

    Long Live Pakistan? Or run with your lives from Pakistan?
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #3 - June 12, 2010, 10:04 AM

    Doesn't Richard Dawkins have a series called "Growing up in the Universe" where he explains evolution to kids? Not quite sure if it's called that.
    You should definitely check it out. It's even interesting for adults. Wink

    German ex-Muslim forumMy YouTubeList of Ex-Muslims
    Wikis: en de fr ar tr
    CEMB-Chat
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  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #4 - June 12, 2010, 10:53 AM

    I don't have children, but I tend to agree that a scientific approach would probably be most helpful, using texts designed for children.  parrot

    Also, what about a Museum visit for your eldest son? The British Museum have exhibits ranging from Ancient Greek to Islamic, along with the Englightment afaik. Just walking around and showing him real historical artefacts from different cultures and civilisations might make it easier for him to put religious ideas into context. The same goes for visits to religious places like Churches, Synagogues, Hindu and Buddhist temples as a way of demystifying their ideas - introducing children to religion from a rational perspective rather than letting someone else (read: religious people) do it.

    Each of us a failed state in stark relief against the backdrop of the perfect worlds we seek.
    Propagandhi - Failed States
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #5 - June 12, 2010, 11:01 AM



    Interesting site, thanks man.   Afro  Just reading a few articles over there.  I will look up sagen wonce my kids have tidied their rooms, so we can sit and watch some today. 

    Doesn't Richard Dawkins have a series called "Growing up in the Universe" where he explains evolution to kids? Not quite sure if it's called that.
    You should definitely check it out. It's even interesting for adults. Wink


    Just looked it up, sounds like it's interesting. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Growing_Up_in_the_Universe

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #6 - June 12, 2010, 11:03 AM

    I don't have children, but I tend to agree that a scientific approach would probably be most helpful, using texts designed for children.  parrot

    Also, what about a Museum visit for your eldest son? The British Museum have exhibits ranging from Ancient Greek to Islamic, along with the Englightment afaik. Just walking around and showing him real historical artefacts from different cultures and civilisations might make it easier for him to put religious ideas into context. The same goes for visits to religious places like Churches, Synagogues, Hindu and Buddhist temples as a way of demystifying their ideas - introducing children to religion from a rational perspective rather than letting someone else (read: religious people) do it.


    Yeah, we've done museums in the past, but we shall being doing them again as part of our planned summer activities.  This time I intend to use them to point out more about those things, than just standing around lost in my own dream world of awe at the past. Grin

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #7 - June 12, 2010, 11:34 AM


    Just teach them love, respect for all people, pluralism, tolerance, and remind them of the sharpest sides and intolerances of religion, especially Islam, and they will be fine!

    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #8 - June 12, 2010, 11:56 AM

    What billy said and so I think science/logic/rational thinking should be enough.

    As for meme infections due to hatred and fear of Islam like jinns ... hmm ... best to just reassure them they don't exist and not to worry. Children are too susceptible for that unfortunately, and it is probably harder to convince them otherwise. This might sound dramatic, but it might be worth having a look at advice on nightmares if they end up getting really scared of jinns, satan, etc.

    http://www.athealth.com/Consumer/farticles/Siegel.html
    http://www.ich.ucl.ac.uk/gosh_families/advice_and_support/ask_dr_jane/n/nightmares.html

    Good luck and I'm confident with a mum to ask the questions as they grow up they'll eventually realize the truth.
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #9 - June 12, 2010, 12:32 PM

    *sigh* why do you choose to teach kids silly stuff like whistling during night is bad.. i didn't even know any of this stuff until i was much older, i mean surely there are other things you can focus on when it comes to Islam? Respect for parents, treat people good?
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #10 - June 12, 2010, 12:37 PM

    Just teach them love, respect for all people, pluralism, tolerance, and remind them of the sharpest sides and intolerances of religion, especially Islam, and they will be fine!


    This is what I do now, but I want to provides some facts on evolution too.  Even I wouldn't be able to argue my point well if someone started tackling evolution in a debate with me lol it just would be me saying that it's true cos its true. Grin

    I want to give my kids some tools to be able to defend their ideas more..........and me too lol.

    I can tackle the abuses no problem, but we as a family need more.   dance

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #11 - June 12, 2010, 12:41 PM

    What billy said and so I think science/logic/rational thinking should be enough.

    As for meme infections due to hatred and fear of Islam like jinns ... hmm ... best to just reassure them they don't exist and not to worry. Children are too susceptible for that unfortunately, and it is probably harder to convince them otherwise. This might sound dramatic, but it might be worth having a look at advice on nightmares if they end up getting really scared of jinns, satan, etc.

    http://www.athealth.com/Consumer/farticles/Siegel.html
    http://www.ich.ucl.ac.uk/gosh_families/advice_and_support/ask_dr_jane/n/nightmares.html

    Good luck and I'm confident with a mum to ask the questions as they grow up they'll eventually realize the truth.


    Fortunately no nightmares yet, which is good considering my ex once told my son that he was possessed (as in my son was) 015

    It's more those silly rules, like the angels and whistling, or the devil sleeping up your nose.  Stupid little things.   Roll Eyes

    I'm not in anyway forcing my belief on my kids, I allow questions all the time, give them loads of different perspectives on belief systems, and always point out the abuses and compare them to my childrens nicer morals.  I'm just influencing where there mind ends up, and trying to give them the tools they need to see through the bullshit themselves.

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #12 - June 12, 2010, 12:42 PM

    *sigh* why do you choose to teach kids silly stuff like whistling during night is bad.. i didn't even know any of this stuff until i was much older, i mean surely there are other things you can focus on when it comes to Islam? Respect for parents, treat people good?


    For me yes lol plus an innapropriate humour level.  Embarrassed  you should hear my eldest son sometimes lol and there is no point saying "where did he get that from"  cos I'm his mum.  Cheesy

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #13 - June 12, 2010, 12:42 PM

    This is what I do now, but I want to provides some facts on evolution too.  Even I wouldn't be able to argue my point well if someone started tackling evolution in a debate with me lol it just would be me saying that it's true cos its true. Grin

    I want to give my kids some tools to be able to defend their ideas more..........and me too lol.


    I reckon you've got it all covered Berbs, all the things you are doing are a great education for kids anyway!


    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #14 - June 12, 2010, 01:03 PM

    For me yes lol plus an innapropriate humour level.  Embarrassed  you should hear my eldest son sometimes lol and there is no point saying "where did he get that from"  cos I'm his mum.  Cheesy



    Grin
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #15 - June 12, 2010, 01:25 PM

    This book should be good for your 12 yo son
    http://www.amazon.co.uk/Really-Short-History-Nearly-Everything/dp/0385614802/

    There is also this old French cartoon series (Once Upon a Time...), I am pretty sure there are English versions of the cartoon.
    If you can't find DVDs/Links PM me and I might be able to help Wink


    Inb4 French jokes

    "In every time and culture there are pressures to conform to the prevailing prejudices. But there are also, in every place and epoch, those who value the truth; who record the evidence faithfully. Future generations are in their debt." -Carl Sagan

  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #16 - June 12, 2010, 01:52 PM

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCAdb7JdygA

    Pakistan Zindabad? ya Pakistan sey Zinda bhaag?

    Long Live Pakistan? Or run with your lives from Pakistan?
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #17 - June 12, 2010, 08:35 PM

    Exactly  Afro

    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #18 - June 12, 2010, 08:44 PM

    Berbs, I'd recommend as others have done, Carl Sagan's Cosmos series. Also, Stephen Hawking's A Brief History of Time, and also Nova http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/origins/, or anything by Neil deGrasse Tyson

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #19 - June 12, 2010, 08:59 PM

    I'd recommend the Teletubbies. cool2

    German ex-Muslim forumMy YouTubeList of Ex-Muslims
    Wikis: en de fr ar tr
    CEMB-Chat
    I'm on an indefinite break...
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #20 - June 12, 2010, 10:09 PM



     Cheesy so true.... Wish we have more people like GC.

    ...
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #21 - June 12, 2010, 10:22 PM

    Ok, so I want to spend the next few months working on my childrens vague understanding on belief systems and why mummy is an atheist.

    I'm looking for good childrens books on evolution, or really well presented documentaries that my kids will focus on.  One is almost 12 so some stuff can be more advanced for him, the other 2 are almost 8, and 6.  I'm thinking for them it needs to be tailored to children more.

    The last few weeks my kids have been coming back from their dads house saying the usual bullcrap about jinn, and how they shouldn't whistle in this house as the angels won't come anymore.  015  you know, all of that crap that young kids are fed as muslims, and no doubt their father will always repeat this shit to them as he is pretty stupid.

    So anyway, I want to nip this in the bud now, I already tell them alot, but me telling them isn't enough, I want to be able to educate them better.

    Any documentaries you would recommend that we can watch together as a family?


    What children hear they forget - what they see they remember.
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #22 - June 13, 2010, 02:45 AM


    Carlin is God.
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #23 - June 13, 2010, 03:08 AM

    berber.. there are some AWESOME anthro videos from natgeo.com, historychannel.com, and discoverychannel.com.  I think its the history channel or discovery channel that has a series on the evolution of dinasours that is absolutely fantabulous!  Kids seem to love dinasours, and may inspire many questions, as well as being a wonderful education for them.  Steven Hawkings ROCKS!!!  Cept not sure how easily children would understand him.  Other videos include "Eve" "Ice World"  "Hunt for a Killer"  The absolute best video i think may help
    is called, "Walking with cavemen"  A documentary that starts out with "Lucy" on through
    the progression of homonids until us.  I cannot emphasize how incredible it is.  While
    they have found more evidence of other homonids since then, this would be an outstanding
    starter to compell your kids to ask questions.

    When one door of happiness closes, another opens; but often we look so long at the closed door that we do not see the one which has been opened for us.
    Helen Keller
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #24 - June 13, 2010, 03:40 AM

    Meh. Simplifying evolution is difficult. The problem is that the basic concepts are quite simple but the details aren't. This is why creationism is appealing: it skips all the difficult stuff in favour of plausible soundbites. You can see that on any board where creationists are debated. The creo will throw up some silly point in a few sentences, then people will spend pages explaining in detail why it's bollocks. Making stupid assertions is a lot simpler than disproving them.

    What this means is that if you want you and your kids to have a really thorough understanding of evolution then you'll have to wade through a lot of Really Sciency Shit. Realistically they are still not going to be able to defend the idea against a halfway capable sophist unless they do the leg work first. You can acquaint them with the principles easily enough but if challenged to argue the point they will still be up in the air.

    Find something on Tiktaalik though. That fossil was a really good example because it was found as a result of prediction. They knew pretty much when that sort of critter should have evolved and they knew what sort of environment it would have lived in, so they dug in strata that had those characteristics and sure enough, one yay critter.  parrot

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #25 - June 13, 2010, 03:42 AM

    And a very beautiful one at that Smiley
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #26 - June 13, 2010, 05:32 AM

    Oh yeah, this blog is awesome for cool sciency stuff presented in an easy-to-digest format.

    http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience parrot

    One of the latest posts is this: Prehistoric sea dragons kept themselves warm

    Quote
    When dinosaurs ruled the land, other groups of prehistoric reptiles dominated the waters. Their bones have also fossilised and they reveal much about how these ‘sea dragons’ lived. They tell us about the shape of their bodies, the things they ate and even how they determined their sex. And according to Aurélien Bernard from the University of Lyon, they can tell us whether these reptiles could control their body temperature.

    The majority of reptiles are ‘cold-blooded’. Unlike mammals and birds, they can’t generate and retain their own heat, and their body temperature depends on their surroundings. But Bernard thinks that at three groups of marine reptiles – the dolphin-shaped ichthyosaurs, the crocodile-shaped mosasaurs, and the the paddle-flippered plesiosaurs – bucked this trend. Whether in tropical or cold waters, they could maintain a constant body temperature that reached as high as 35-39 degrees Celsius.

    Bernard estimated the body temperature of these ocean-going predators by studying their teeth. He took samples from 40 plesiosaurs, ichthyosaurs and mosasaurs as well as several prehistoric fish. The specimens came from five continents, and a range of periods from the Triassic to the Cretaceous.  In every tooth, he measured the amount of different oxygen isotopes, a value that depends on the animal’s body temperature and the composition of the water it swallows.

    The data from the fish helped to calibrate the reptile data. By and large, fish body temperatures reflect the temperatures of the surrounding seawater. If the reptiles’ teeth had the same composition of oxygen isotopes as those of the fish, their bodies were also similarly as warm as their surroundings and they were probably cold-blooded. Any differences reflect a different means of regulating body heat.

    Using a mathematical model, Bernard calculated that both ichthyosaurs and plesiosaurs managed to keep a constant balmy body temperature from around 24-35°C, even when swimming through waters as cold as 12°C. The abilities of mosasaurs were less clear, but it seems that they had at least some control over their body temperature.

    These results fit with the portraits of ichthyosaurs and plesiosaurs as active, fast-swimming hunters, which needed warm bodies for their fast chases and deep dives. Likewise, the ambiguity around the body temperature of mosasaurs is consistent with the idea that they were ambush predators, whose sit-and-wait strategies wouldn’t have demanded such high metabolisms.

    So ancient critters we thought were reptiles appear to have evolved an exothermic metabolism (wot are a sciency thing that means they had warm blood like mammals). This is sorta surprising. Mind you there is evidence that a lot of dinosaurs were warm-blooded too, particularly theropods (which modern birds came from).

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #27 - June 13, 2010, 05:47 AM

    What stupid ideas.

    Look, here's what you do-- you buy a handgun and write "Religion" on it (you'll probably want a large-frame automatic for this purpose). You also write "Atheism" prominently on a bowl/plate which is used exclusively to serve their favorite meal. Then you hire someone to come into your house, preferably a homeless foreigner, with the gun marked "Religion" (only one round in it) and shoot the kid's favorite stuffed animal. Then you smash the "Atheism" bowl/plate over their head, and also stab them in the chest with a knife marked "Atheism is way cool, kids". Then you put the body in a bag labeled "God", throw it in the trunk of your car, and drive the kids out to a remote wooden area, and hand them shovels that say "Secularism" on them and make them dig a grave. In the meantime, smash the dead stuffed-animal killer's teeth out with a hammer that says "Berbs is always right" on it, then cover the body with lime to aid decomposition (especially make sure to get the head and hands), fill the grave with dirt, and lay down some squares of grass you previously obtained from the same area, and toss some leaves and twigs on top. Then wash out the trunk of your car, and set the whole car on fire.

    That'll teach 'em.

    fuck you
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #28 - June 13, 2010, 11:56 AM

     Cheesy Cheesy
  • Re: Right, advice on how to reinforce atheism in my children?
     Reply #29 - June 13, 2010, 12:58 PM

     Cheesy

    When one door of happiness closes, another opens; but often we look so long at the closed door that we do not see the one which has been opened for us.
    Helen Keller
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