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Theme Changer

 Topic: Path to Clarity and Hello

 (Read 6943 times)
  • 12 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Path to Clarity and Hello
     OP - May 06, 2010, 02:20 PM
    Every once in a while you think you have stumbled upon something great and then 'boom', an unexpected turn a twist and you
    are left to wonder 'have I stopped at the right station'.

    I have joined this forum under the impression that I will be joining a group of people who are enlightened. People will stop to think before stereotying other cultures, people who would be accepting of other faiths. After all being ex-muslims many of us have faced the 'sinister' glares of the closed soceity.

    I have over the last few days seen people mis represent cultures and beliefs over various threads, and it saddens me to see that. Where as being an apostate-atheist liberates one from the reins of religion it does not give one the right to dismiss another's faith. I disagree with Islam on many of its points however on this one idea (not quote, I hope I have made myself clear )  I take from the Koran I pledge my solidarity:

    'Hate the sin but not the sinner.'

    I do not hate Islam, I hate extremist Islamists, there is a suttle difference between the two. On a similar way I do not hate the Bangladeshi Soceity or the Pakistani Soceity, many of them have not had the oppurtunities most of us take for granted. I do not hate my parents because they are incable of accepting that I am an Atheist, I love them for what they have given me. They have given me life, given me the oppurtunities that I need to disover myself and for that I will be forever grateful.

    I do hope the 'dissapointing' posts I have read represents a minority, otherwise I guess some of the happiness I felt when I found out about this place will dissipate. Please correct me if I am wrong.
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #1 - May 06, 2010, 02:25 PM
    You will read views you disagree with on an Internet forum - that's life.
    "Befriend them not, Oh murtads, and give them neither parrot nor bunny."  - happymurtad's advice on trolls.
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #2 - May 06, 2010, 02:27 PM

    Thanks for the lecture  Afro

    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    Quote from: arX on April 30, 2011, 11:33 PM
    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #3 - May 06, 2010, 02:31 PM
    I guess being a theoretical physcist...i often forget its not an ideal world...
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #4 - May 06, 2010, 02:32 PM
    Welcome.

    People are multi-faceted. Try not to be so judgmental from just a few posts. If you have an opinion about a certain thread or conversation, feel free to post in that thread, instead of generalizing in your intro post. Most members here are pretty reasonable people who have complex views on things that can't be fully gauged from just 1 or 2 posts.
    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #5 - May 06, 2010, 02:45 PM
    Quote from: messiah on May 06, 2010, 02:20 PM
    I disagree with Islam on many of its points however on this one quote I make from the Koran I pledge my solidarity:

    'Hate the sin but not the sinner.'


    That is not a quote from the Qur'an.
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #6 - May 06, 2010, 02:50 PM
    I hope you're not expecting us to be cultural-relativists.

    Welcome to the forum.
    ~My story~
    ~Collection of unethical hadiths/surahs~
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #7 - May 06, 2010, 03:04 PM
    Quote
    'Hate the sin but not the sinner.'

    I do not hate Islam, I hate extremist Islamists


    According to this logic, the sinner is Islam and the sin is the extremists?
     Shocked

    Let me help you look at it another way. Hate not the sinner (Islamist extremist) for he/she is misguided.
    Hate that which misguides him/her.

    Welcome to the forum

    My style is impetuous, my defense is impregnable and I'm just ferocious. I want your heart. I want to eat your children. Praise be to Allah." -- Mike Tyson
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #8 - May 06, 2010, 03:15 PM
    Quote
    'Hate the sin but not the sinner.'

    Hahahaha, Submissive Bob got it right.

    By that logic, it should be "Hate Islam, but not Muslims", which I think is true for people here.

    Anyway, welcome.
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #9 - May 06, 2010, 03:22 PM
    Don't hate the playa, hate the game!

    Welcome.
    He's no friend to the friendless
    And he's the mother of grief
    There's only sorrow for tomorrow
    Surely life is too brief
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #10 - May 06, 2010, 03:22 PM
    Actually I rarely use the word hate for anything.
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #11 - May 06, 2010, 03:30 PM
    So what posts disturbed you?
    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #12 - May 06, 2010, 03:35 PM
    Quote
    'Hate the sin but not the sinner.'


    Thats from the Bible, not the Qur'an.
    "The more I study religions the more I am convinced that man never worshiped anything but himself."
    ~Sir Richard Francis Burton

    "I think religion is just like smoking: Both invented by people, addictive, harmful, and kills!"
    ~RIBS
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #13 - May 06, 2010, 04:04 PM
    Hi,

    First of all 'wow'. Its great to meet so many  'apostate-atheists'.

    Quote from: Abood on May 06, 2010, 03:15 PM
    Hahahaha, Submissive Bob got it right.

    By that logic, it should be "Hate Islam, but not Muslims", which I think is true for people here.

    Anyway, welcome.


    Islam for me is just a book. A book telling us a rather long story. Like the greek methology. I do not think whoever wrote the book meant it to be read in the way it is being taught by the current Islamic Preachers (if they can so be called). I am sure many of us read novels. I do not know how may of you have read Macbeth, however without reading the full play it would be impossible to generalise Macbeth's character. In the same way the Quran as a book can not be characterised by random verses being taken out of context. The relationship between god/allah and his prophets have to be regarded as a evolving one and not a static one. If the full scripture is read properly it will be obvious that god has not always made the right calls, and it is important we look at god as an evolving character himself rather than a static one. After all he has never been a father figure before. I think preachers now a days forget that this is the way it needs to be interpretted. Thereby when I express my solidarity with the above quote the sin will be the 'way in which the Quaran is regarded and interpretted' and the sinners ....


    Popular culture potrays medusa from greek mythology as a horroble, horrid creature but how many of us have read about the total person that was 'Medusa', if we did perhaps we would not be so happy when Perseus goes on to kill medusa.
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #14 - May 06, 2010, 04:09 PM
    Quote from: Cool Canadian on May 06, 2010, 03:35 PM
    Thats from the Bible, not the Qur'an.



    Hi sorry, I think my usage of the word qoute has been a bit unwise. The idea of hate the sin and not the sinner has not been stated explicitly in either of the scriptures. They are ideas that are implied as the scripture unfolds, i can refer you to some readings if you like. I will have to get my old notebook out. I don't know if you are intersted but there is a book called God: A Biography, I think its my Jack Miles. In the book the author tackles not what the scriptures say but the way in which they are interpretted. Its an interesting read and I would recommed it.
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #15 - May 06, 2010, 04:11 PM
    You are IslamMythology and I claim my five pounds.  Tongue
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #16 - May 06, 2010, 04:11 PM
    Quote from: messiah on May 06, 2010, 04:04 PM
    Hi,

    First of all 'wow'. Its great to meet so many  'apostate-atheists'.


    Yep, its nice to meet another one from the book (I mean God Delusion not the Quran Wink)

    Tell us about your route to apostacy, how you found us, and if you know any other apostates/doubters in real life..

    btw where are you from?
    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #17 - May 06, 2010, 04:13 PM
    Quote
    Islam for me is just a book. A book telling us a rather long story. Like the greek methology. I do not think whoever wrote the book meant it to be read in the way it is being taught by the current Islamic Preachers (if they can so be called). I am sure many of us read novels.

    You'd be hard-pressed to argue that the Quran doesn't have a lot of violence in it. Even some Muslim reformists admit that it does but say that they should be "put in context", historically speaking, i.e. remember at what time Muhammad lived.
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #18 - May 06, 2010, 04:17 PM
    Quote from: messiah on May 06, 2010, 04:09 PM
    there is a book called God: A Biography, I think its my Jack Miles. In the book the author tackles not what the scriptures say but the way in which they are interpretted.


    I've got a similar book called "Metaphor in the Qur'an" by Ima Weener, it explains that when God says he will horribly roast people and boil their brains out it really means: "I love you".
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #19 - May 06, 2010, 04:18 PM
     Cheesy
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #20 - May 06, 2010, 04:39 PM
    Quote from: Hassan on May 06, 2010, 04:17 PM
    I've got a similar book called "Metaphor in the Qur'an" by Ima Weener, it explains that when God says he will horribly roast people and boil their brains out it really means: "I love you".


    that's it JOTM!

    On another note, hi Messiah Smiley
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #21 - May 06, 2010, 04:47 PM
    Quote from: Abood on May 06, 2010, 04:13 PM
    You'd be hard-pressed to argue that the Quran doesn't have a lot of violence in it. Even some Muslim reformists admit that it does but say that they should be "put in context", historically speaking, i.e. remember at what time Muhammad lived.


    Quran has a lot of violence in it, no doubt but however first of all Quran is not my way of life. Second of all I dont think you clearly understood what I was saying. If the preachers are to use the quran as a source of guidence it can only be done if the whole book is read as a whole, not like an instruction manual but as a story. A story that tells one about the bloodshed and sorrow 'war' in al its form causes.

    Again the key idea is how we interpret the book and what we take from it.  King Ashoka lead a bloody war. But he learnt from the bloodshed in the war and declared he will not start another war. The quran is just a story, how we use it to guide oursleves is entirely upto its interpretation. The Haddith that a Muslims must follow were not written by mohammed himself but by people who intrepretted his actions and wrote a guide based on Mohammed's way of life. Who is to say that they were impartial in their representation, and they were able to completly able to understand his action.

    you will be hard pressed to find a muslim who agrees with this, but interpretation is the key word here.
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #22 - May 06, 2010, 04:59 PM
    Quote from: messiah on May 06, 2010, 04:47 PM
    King Ashoka


    I knew his brother, Prince Assholia.
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #23 - May 06, 2010, 05:02 PM
    Quote
    If the preachers are to use the quran as a source of guidence it can only be done if the whole book is read as a whole, not like an instruction manual but as a story.

    Yes, that's one way of going at it, but it's not how most Muslims today do. Again, like I said, Islam is what its representatives believe and how they act.
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #24 - May 06, 2010, 05:02 PM
    Hassan you're on a roll! Cheesy
    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #25 - May 06, 2010, 05:06 PM
    ROFL HASS!!!
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #26 - May 06, 2010, 05:10 PM
    Quote from: BlackDog on May 06, 2010, 04:39 PM
    that's it JOTM!

    On another note, hi Messiah Smiley


    i guess ur book  "Metaphor in the Qur'an" by Ima Weener kind of goes to show the capabalities of you intelligence. If you are incapable of having an intelligent conversation without profanities, i guess you should refrain from replying at all.

  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #27 - May 06, 2010, 05:11 PM
    Hey Messiah - do you want to have a go at replying to my post too?
    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #28 - May 06, 2010, 05:12 PM
    Quote from: messiah on May 06, 2010, 05:10 PM
    i guess ur book  "Metaphor in the Qur'an" by Ima Weener kind of goes to show the capabalities of you intelligence. If you are incapable of having an intelligent conversation without profanities, i guess you should refrain from replying at all.




    lol

    not my post bro

    its funny because you were talking about intelligence
  • Re: Path to Clarity and Hello
     Reply #29 - May 06, 2010, 05:14 PM
    Quote from: messiah on May 06, 2010, 05:10 PM
    i guess ur book  "Metaphor in the Qur'an" by Ima Weener kind of goes to show the capabalities of you intelligence. If you are incapable of having an intelligent conversation without profanities, i guess you should refrain from replying at all.


    Don't be dissin, Ima Weener!

    He happens to wank as high as the greatest scholars of Islam. (sorry I have a lisp)
  • 12 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »