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 Topic: Unethical/questionable hadiths and surahs

 (Read 79826 times)
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  • Unethical/questionable hadiths and surahs
     Reply #210 - February 13, 2014, 12:16 PM

    It's funny how often the revelations benefit Mo specifically.

    Something that even Aisha wryly commented on…

  • Unethical/questionable hadiths and surahs
     Reply #211 - February 13, 2014, 03:45 PM

    Not that the believers notice.

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Unethical/questionable hadiths and surahs
     Reply #212 - February 20, 2014, 01:39 PM

    2:223 of the Qur'an authorises a man to sodomise a woman, according to its oldest authoritative Islamic sources.

    6:60:50 Sahih Bukhari

    Narrated Nafi': Whenever Ibn 'Umar recited the Qur'an, he would not speak to anyone till he had finished his recitation. Once I held the Qur'an and he recited Surat-al-Baqara from his memory and then stopped at a certain Verse and said, "Do you know in what connection this Verse was revealed? " I replied, "No." He said, "It was revealed in such-and-such connection." Ibn 'Umar then resumed his recitation. Nafi added regarding the Verse:--"So go to your tilth when or how you will" Ibn 'Umar said, "It means one should approach his wife in .."

    6:60:51 Sahih Bukhari

    Narrated Jabir: Jews used to say: "If one has sexual intercourse with his wife from the back, then she will deliver a squint-eyed child." So this Verse was revealed:-- "Your wives are a tilth unto you; so go to your tilth when or how you will." (2.223) 

    ----------------------------
    Note how the hadith by Jabir was fully translated.  Note how the hadith above Jabir, by Ibn Umar, was not fully translated. Why? It is clear that Jabir's hadith has nothing to do with Ibn Umar, since this is the case.  Sunan Abu Dawud is a later and weaker source than Sahih Al-Bukhari.  The 30 volumes of Tafsīr al-Ṭabarī has the greatest authority of all tafsīrs in Sunni Islam, because the likes of Ibn Kathir used it for his own tafsīr. Ibn Kathir's tafsīr is perceived as a summary of Tafsīr al-Ṭabarī, but that's not completely accurate. Have all 30 volumes of Tafsīr al-Ṭabarī been translated into english?
    ---------------------------
     
    11:2159 Sunan Abu Dawud

    Narrated Abdullah Ibn Abbas: Ibn Umar misunderstood (the Qur'anic verse, "So come to your tilth however you will")--may Allah forgive him. The fact is that this clan of the Ansar, who were idolaters, lived in the company of the Jews who were the people of the Book. They (the Ansar) accepted their superiority over themselves in respect of knowledge, and they followed most of their actions. The people of the Book (i.e. the Jews) used to have intercourse with their women on one side alone (i.e. lying on their backs). This was the most concealing position for (the vagina of) the women. This clan of the Ansar adopted this practice from them. But this tribe of the Quraysh used to uncover their women completely, and seek pleasure with them from in front and behind and laying them on their backs. When the muhajirun (the immigrants) came to Medina, a man married a woman of the Ansar. He began to do the same kind of action with her, but she disliked it, and said to him: We were approached on one side (i.e. lying on the back); do it so, otherwise keep away from me. This matter of theirs spread widely, and it reached the Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him). So Allah, the Exalted, sent down the Qur'anic verse: "Your wives are a tilth to you, so come to your tilth however you will," i.e. from in front, from behind or lying on the back. But this verse meant the place of the delivery of the child, i.e. the vagina.   

    ---------------
    What did Ibn Umar supposedly misunderstand?  Since this hadith has clarified that 2:223 authorises a Muslim man to have sex with a woman from any position but it must be in the vagina, process of elimination leads us to conclude that 2:223 authorises a Muslim man to sodomise a woman, based on its oldest sources. There is no hadith in Sahih Bukhari forbidding anal sex.  All the hadiths refuting 6:60:50 comes from later sources.  The Pakistani printed edition of Sahih Al-Bukhari fills in the blanks of 6:60:50 with "Fi Dubur". Tafsīr al-Ṭabarī hadith number 3468 also confirms what 2:23 was about, and agrees with Ibn Umar.

    I cannot decide if I prefer the more-obvious interpretation of 2:223 in Sunni Islam, or the less-obvious-but-more-correct interpretation I have just pointed out   mysmilie_977

    "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Hence it is sometimes necessary to give the beholder a black eye of context and proportion."
  • Unethical/questionable hadiths and surahs
     Reply #213 - October 17, 2014, 12:29 PM


    Kaffirs have seven intestines, and Muslims shouldn't eat with them

    +++++

    Hadith Explanation

    Eating in Seven Intestines

    Narrated Nafi: Ibn Umar never used to take his meal unless a poor man was called to eat with him. One day I brought a poor man to eat with him. The man ate way too much, whereupon Ibn Umar said, "O Nafi! Don't let this man enter my house, for I heard the Prophet (sal Allahu alaihi wa sallam) saying, 'A believer eats in one intestine (is satisfied with a little food), and a kafir (disbeliever) eats in seven intestines (eats much food)." [Sahih Bukhari]

    In other ahadith hypocrites are mentioned, along with Kuffar, as eating in seven intestines. The reality of the matter is that hypocrites are also Kuffar. The difference is that hypocrites pretend to be Muslims and only Allah knows their reality, while the reality of those who openly disbelieve (Kuffar) is known to all.

    We can note from this hadith that the illustrious Sahabah did not even like hypocrites to enter their homes, so distasteful was their hypocrisy to the pious and so distant did they want to stay from the evil of hypocrisy.

    It also makes sense, when we learn of such ahadith, why Muslim parents tell their children not to eat too much at others homes and avoid doing so themselves too.

    http://dailyhadith.adaptivesolutionsinc.com/hadith/Eating-in-Seven-Intestines.htm

    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Unethical/questionable hadiths and surahs
     Reply #214 - October 17, 2014, 12:43 PM

    There must be a scientific miracle in there somewhere just waiting to be discovered.

    Danish Never-Moose adopted by the kind people on the CEMB-forum
    Ex-Muslim chat (Unaffliated with CEMB). Safari users: Use "#ex-muslims" as the channel name. CEMB chat thread.
  • Unethical/questionable hadiths and surahs
     Reply #215 - October 21, 2014, 07:55 PM

    Muhammad said its OK to kill a woman who was criticising him

    +++++

    Ibn 'Abbas narrated that :

    There was a blind man during the time of the Messenger of Allah [SAW] who had an Umm Walad by whom he had two sons. She used to slander and defame the Messenger of Allah [SAW] a great deal, and he would rebuke her, but she would not pay heed, and he would forbid her to do that, but she ignored him. (The blind man said) One night I mentioned the Prophet [SAW], and she slandered him. I could not bear it so I went and got a dagger which I thrust into her stomach and leaned upon it, and killed her. In the morning she was found slain. Mention of that was made to the Prophet [SAW] and he gathered the people and said: "I adjure by Allah; a man over whom I have the right, that he should obey me, and he did what he did, to stand up." The blind man started to tremble and said: "O Messenger of Allah [SAW], I am the one who killed her. She was my Umm Walad and she was kind and gentle toward me, and I have two sons like pearls from her, but she used to slander and defame you a great deal. I forbade her, but she did not stop, and I rebuked her, but she did not pay heed. Finally, I mentioned your name and she slandered you, so I went and got a dagger which I thrust into her stomach, and leaned on it until I killed her. The Messenger of Allah [SAW] said: "I bear witness that her blood is permissible."

    http://sunnah.com/nasai/37/105

    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Unethical/questionable hadiths and surahs
     Reply #216 - October 21, 2014, 10:53 PM

    It really is made-up bollocks, isn't it?
  • Unethical/questionable hadiths and surahs
     Reply #217 - August 03, 2015, 05:43 AM

    Found this in a post on on the ex-muslim reddit:

    Quote
    Narrated Ibn 'Abbas:

    'Umar asked about the decision of the Prophet (ﷺ) about that (i.e. abortion). Haml b. Malik b. al-Nabhigah got up and said: I was between two women. One of them struck another with a rolling-pin killing both her and what was in her womb. So the Messenger of Allah (ﷺ) gave judgement that the bloodwit for the unborn child should be a male or a female slave of the best quality and the she should be killed.

    Grade: Sahih (Al-Albani)
    Reference: Sunan Abi Dawud 4572

    Don't tell the Christian Right.

    Danish Never-Moose adopted by the kind people on the CEMB-forum
    Ex-Muslim chat (Unaffliated with CEMB). Safari users: Use "#ex-muslims" as the channel name. CEMB chat thread.
  • Unethical/questionable hadiths and surahs
     Reply #218 - August 03, 2015, 09:54 AM

    Seems like it would be a shorter list to list the ones that AREN'T objectionable/unethical lol.

    Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil, for I have a sonic screwdriver, a tricorder, and a Type 2 phaser.
  • Unethical/questionable hadiths and surahs
     Reply #219 - April 23, 2017, 11:02 AM

    Inaccurate mathematical descriptions on dividing inheritance

      There are many Quran verses concerning how to divide someone’s inheritance, just putting in a few “…The parents of the deceased get one-sixth of the inheritance each, if the deceased has left any children…. You get half of what your wives leave behind, if they had no children….They (your wives) get one-fourth of what you leave behind, if you had no children….” (Quran 4:11-4:12)
       It doesn’t take a middle school kid to see that appointing people a fixed fraction of the sum could possibly lead to a situation where the shares of all combined exceed the sum. The Quranic guide I was using mentioned the rule of al ‘awl: where the shares exceed the heritage, all the shares will be diminished proportionately. I bought that, even though I thought God could have done a better job.
       Today as I was looking for the source of al ‘awl, presuming that it should have been somewhere in the hadith, I found out quite surprisingly that IT IS NOT; it’s established during the reign of the second caliph (634 AD –644 AD) by scholars, and that while it’s accepted by the four Sunni schools, it’s not accepted by Imamiyyah.
       So during Muhammad’s lifetime, NO ONE noticed the inaccurate mathematical descriptions.

    another answer from islamweb
  • Unethical/questionable hadiths and surahs
     Reply #220 - April 23, 2017, 01:19 PM

    This one goes out to Aziz & BisonHumper

    Sahih Bukhari Volume 4, Book 52, Number 179:
    Narrated Abu Huraira:
    Allah's Apostle said, "The Hour will not be established until you fight with the Turks; people with SMALL EYES, RED FACES, and FLAT NOSES. Their faces will look like shields coated with leather. The Hour will not be established till you FIGHT with people whose shoes are made of hair."


       Actually I find that description quite accurate. At 7th century the Turks were more mongoloid than they are now (small eyes & plat noses). Even in the later era the Chinese Tang dynasty rulers found it necessary to formally forbid the Uyyyyghurs from wearing Chinese clothing and passing off as Chinese, which is an impossible task for most of the modern day Turks.
        Facial redness could be caused by the climate in the Eurasian steppe.
       And since Genghis khan was known to wash his face once a year, and to oil his skin with animal fat to prevent the harm of the strong and constant cold wind, I presume some of the Turkic nomads could have faces that look like shields coated with leather.


  • Unethical/questionable hadiths and surahs
     Reply #221 - July 14, 2017, 02:39 PM

    well millions of Muslim folks, 1000s of Islamic intellectuals and  even non-Muslim intellectuals who explore Islamic sayings of Quran and hadith   are the words from  the mouth of Prophet of Islam revealed by Allah/god., Unfortunately many  Unethical/questionable hadiths and surahs are there in present Islamic literature., That infact is a big jolt to those who consider Prophet of Islam  was the best and perfect model to all males  for all time and Quran is the word of Allah/god

    So here is better one  from Adnan Adil  on "the sayings and practice of the Prophet (PBUH) that reinforces the sanctity of life."

    Quote
    ISLAM upholds the sanctity and inviolability of human life.

    The Quran, which is the core of Islam, tells us that human life is sacred and cannot be taken in a manner that is unjust and unlawful. The Islamic faith holds the life of one person to be equal to that of the entire humankind.  The sanctity of human life is an essential corollary of the dignity that God has bestowed upon humankind. God has created humans with a definite preference over His other creations.

    The sayings and practice of the Prophet (PBUH) reinforce the sanctity of life.

    In Surah Al Isra’s verse 70, the Quran states: “We have honoured the sons of Adam; provided them with transport on land and sea; given them for sustenance things good and pure; and conferred on them special favours, above a great part of Our creation.”

    Islam accords a very high status to humankind as God has created human beings as His successive authority or vicegerent on earth. Verse 30 of Al Baqarah says: “Behold, thy Lord said to the angels: “I will create a vicegerent on earth....” In this concept is embedded the sanctity of human life. Human life is precious as in each human soul are hidden the signs of God.

    Verse 53 of Surah Fussilat says: “Soon will We show them our Signs in the (furthest) regions (of the earth), and in their own souls, until it becomes manifest to them that this is the Truth….”

    Quote
    According to the teachings of the holy book, a person’s life can be taken only as a death sentence for murder after the completion of due process of law or in a just, defensive war called jihad. For no other reason does the Islamic faith allow a Muslim to kill any person — be it a believer or a non-believer, a ‘good’ Muslim or a ‘bad’ Muslim.


    In the Quran, verse 68 of Surah Al Furqan enunciates the qualities of the believers as “Those who invoke not, with Allah, any other god, nor lay such life as Allah has made sacred except for just cause....” Here the prohibition against the taking of life is qualified: “except for just cause”.

    Surah Al Anam’s verse 151 also spells out the same theme. Verses 92 and 93 of Surah Al Nisa deal with the sanctity of the life of a believer.

    The strongest condemnation of killing a man comes in Surah Al Maida’s verse 32, where after telling the story of Cain and Abel, the Quran says: “On that account, We ordained for the Children of Israel that if anyone slew a person — unless it be for murder or for spreading mischief in the land — it would be as if he slew the whole people: and if anyone saved a life, it would be as if he saved the life of the whole people.…”

    In the words of scholar Muhammad Asad, the expression “We decreed to the Children of Israel” does not detract from the universal validity of this moral: it refers merely to its earliest enunciation.

    Quote
    However, in certain verses of the Holy Quran, God asks the Prophet (PBUH) to kill infidels such as in Surah Al-Tawbah (Repentance). This action can be taken under certain circumstances and strict conditions of jihad as described in other verses. These verses do not mean that any Muslim can declare any person an infidel and take his or her life. Different verses on the same subject found in different chapters of the Quran are put together to infer correct meanings from them in a coherent manner.


    The sayings and practice of the Prophet reinforce the sanctity of human life. In his sermon at Haj, the Prophet announced that the lives, property and honour of all people are sacred in the same way as Makkah and Islam’s religious symbols are sacrosanct.

    Quote
    In Madina, there was a group that was declared hypocrites or munafiqun by the Quran. This group opposed and criticised the Holy Prophet in the wars of Uhad and Tabuk and were disobedient to him on several occasions. Although the Quran strongly condemned their activities, they were allowed to live in peace as part of the Muslim community.

    Abd-Allah ibn Ubayy was the leader of the hypocrites. On his death, the Prophet led his funeral prayer at the request of his son.

    This was the level of tolerance and respect that was accorded to human life. It is clear from this practice of the Holy Prophet that no one has the right to harm another person on the pretext that he or she is not a good Muslim.


    In the light of the teachings of the Quran and the practice of the Prophet, we can see how erroneous are certain self-appointed soldiers of faith who take the lives of innocent people. In the language of the Quran, they are guilty of spreading fasad (discord, mischief and corruption) on the earth.

    well that is what  Adnan Adil  writes.,  and I am very certain  Adnan  is NOT reading quran properly in its context of alleged revelation .,   He is reading those verses  as revelation from allah/god and they are  fit to use  for all times everywhere anywhere in this universe ..  After all according Adnan  and MILLIONS OF WELLE EDUCATED SIMILAR FOLKS., Quran verses  are words of allah/god.... the super duper entity  that controls everything and anything  at any time in this universe ..

    In the next post let me read same verses within the context of alleged revelations and explain Adnan  and other readers how to read Quran...

    Do not let silence become your legacy  
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
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