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 Topic: Fuck Saudi Arabia

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  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #60 - December 01, 2015, 06:09 PM
    Quote from: AGirlWithDoubts on November 30, 2015, 01:10 PM
    That's true, but it also does with Finland and is still an Eastern country.

    It's all wordplay because somehow Greece is classified as part of Western Europe while countries like Poland which are closer to the west of Europe are Central Europe. Even more bizarrely Australia is somehow "The West" when if we were to go by location Japan would be as well in this case. All that being said Central and Eastern Europe aren't really viewed as part of the West.


    Greece is classified as Western since it is the society that started so-called Western civilization, along with Rome. Although now "Western" includes social norms, traditions, etc common in most of Europe. Russia, Poland, etc are Western Nations due to these factors. It is only due to the Cold War that Russia and the former Soviet block are not considered Western. Australia is Western since it was colonized by people that were already considered Western. They have many of the same traditions, values, philosophy, etc. You mixed everything up by first not knowing about Greece being the foundation of the Western World then use the Cold War view as if it still mattered. The term itself is vague enough that many nations fall into the category of "Western"

    Australia, New Zealand, North America, South America and Europe (all of it except for Muslim nations) are part of the "Western World"
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #61 - December 01, 2015, 09:53 PM
    There is a difference of opinion regarding Latin America and Eastern Europe. It is not the general consensus that they are part of the West. You should go back and read my post as well as the one after it because I said that it was odd that Greece was considered to be part of Western Europe given its location, not the West. The West is not exclusive to Western Europe, though the two correlate.

    Furthermore I addressed why Australia is considered to be part of the West, and that it was mostly wordplay with little to do with geography. Wherever this mix up is supposed to be, I do not see it.

    You're very mistaken if you think that traditions and values are the same everywhere in Europe.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #62 - December 02, 2015, 07:57 AM
    Quote from: AGirlWithDoubts
    You're very mistaken if you think that traditions and values are the same everywhere in Europe.

    What values and traditions Germany has and Slovenia, Poland or Bulgaria doesn't have? Just curious.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #63 - December 02, 2015, 09:53 AM
    One thing I'm surprised at is the lack of criticism aimed at the Saudi Royals and other UAE rulers from Muslims internationally. Their lavish displays of wealth and pride are surely a stark contradiction to a religion that stresses piety and action on behalf of the poor. A Muslim friend of mine hates them intensely and froths with venom for these very reasons. Similarly you'd expect more of an outcry with all the modern and commercial constructions they've erected around Mecca which is perhaps symptomatic of this wider 'paradox'.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #64 - December 02, 2015, 03:06 PM
    Quote from: nbhb on December 02, 2015, 07:57 AM
    What values and traditions Germany has and Slovenia, Poland or Bulgaria doesn't have? Just curious.


    An example: Western European nations are currently doing a better job than most nations at protecting the human rights and fundamental freedoms of people under their jurisdiction. Bulgaria on the other hand has shown far less commitment to upholding these values, particularly when it comes to prisoners and vulnerable groups like the Romani minority.

    That's not to say that I view certain nations through rose-coloured glasses; they certainly have problems of their own which I have no problem criticising. But since the EU has expanded to half of the countries in Europe there has at times display of incompatibility with the values promoted by the EU and some of its member states.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #65 - December 02, 2015, 04:07 PM
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=EfWqM1hMTho&ebc=ANyPxKrf7UOb8iKYNjmL_erGkZHOmfQVyw8IeZPIgXxS64a4yiR4PlpecRQUppQDFpA0roQJMHgm
    Quote
    Saudi-born singer Shams Bandar, also known as "Shams the Kuwaiti," recently declared that she was renouncing her Saudi and Kuwaiti nationalities for the sake of European citizenship. In a September 22 interview with the Egyptian Dream TV channel, she defended her decision, saying: "What can these wretched [refugees] do with their Arab citizenship?" "All the Arab countries have closed their borders to them." Shams further said: "Why do we pin all our problems on the West? For 1,400 years we have been slaughtering one another, just because one of us prays one way and another prays a different way."

    Which side are you on?
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #66 - December 02, 2015, 04:26 PM
    Quote from: zeca on December 02, 2015, 04:07 PM
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=EfWqM1hMTho&ebc=ANyPxKrf7UOb8iKYNjmL_erGkZHOmfQVyw8IeZPIgXxS64a4yiR4PlpecRQUppQDFpA0roQJMHgm


    And in to those hands the political power of Saudi Arabia must move from the sauds of sand land..


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nSMT048jAA8


    Her words are as beautiful as she sings..
    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim     
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #67 - December 02, 2015, 04:44 PM
    Quote from: bogart on December 01, 2015, 06:09 PM
    Greece is classified as Western since it is the society that started so-called Western civilization, along with Rome. Although now "Western" includes social norms, traditions, etc common in most of Europe. Russia, Poland, etc are Western Nations due to these factors. It is only due to the Cold War that Russia and the former Soviet block are not considered Western. Australia is Western since it was colonized by people that were already considered Western. They have many of the same traditions, values, philosophy, etc. You mixed everything up by first not knowing about Greece being the foundation of the Western World then use the Cold War view as if it still mattered. The term itself is vague enough that many nations fall into the category of "Western"

    Australia, New Zealand, North America, South America and Europe (all of it except for Muslim nations) are part of the "Western World"

    I don't think people usually talk about Orthodox Christian countries as part of the west. The medieval west developed out of the interaction of post-Roman barbarian states with Latin Christianity. Greece had very little to do with it. The west was largely cut off from Greek language and culture for a thousand years, while the traditions lived on in the Greek and Syriac speaking Christian worlds, and in part in the Arabic speaking Muslim world. The later western appropriation of Greek history is really just another origins myth, though one that has become historically important in its own right. Modern Greece is obviously part of the same world as modern Turkey and Armenia, and before the arrival of nationalism, with the resultant ethnic cleansing and genocide, the Greek, Turkish and Armenian populations were hopelessly mixed. Accepting a myth of Greece being western just means that you'll find the Greeks themselves don't live up to it. A friend from when I lived in Greece said that her mother, brought up in Germany in the 30s and 40s, was insistent that the ancient Greeks had been blonde haired and blue eyed and that modern day Greeks were the degenerate result of later immigration - a view of a western classical Greece that at least has the merit of making its assumptions clear.
    Which side are you on?
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #68 - December 02, 2015, 04:46 PM
    Just saw the title of this thread and had to show my approval  grin12
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #69 - December 02, 2015, 04:56 PM
    Quote from: zeca on December 02, 2015, 04:44 PM
    The later western appropriation of Greek history is really just another origins myth


    This.

    And good to see you, Hassan!
  • Re: Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #70 - December 02, 2015, 06:15 PM
    Quote from: zeca on December 02, 2015, 04:44 PM
    I don't think people usually talk about Orthodox Christian countries as part of the west. The medieval west developed out of the interaction of post-Roman barbarian states with Latin Christianity. Greece had very little to do with it. The west was largely cut off from Greek language and culture for a thousand years, while the traditions lived on in the Greek and Syriac speaking Christian worlds, and in part in the Arabic speaking Muslim world. The later western appropriation of Greek history is really just another origins myth, though one that has become historically important in its own right. Modern Greece is obviously part of the same world as modern Turkey and Armenia, and before the arrival of nationalism, with the resultant ethnic cleansing and genocide, the Greek, Turkish and Armenian populations were hopelessly mixed. Accepting a myth of Greece being western just means that you'll find the Greeks themselves don't live up to it. A friend from when I lived in Greece said that her mother, brought up in Germany in the 30s and 40s, was insistent that the ancient Greeks had been blonde haired and blue eyed and that modern day Greeks were the degenerate result of later immigration - a view of a western classical Greece that at least has the merit of making its assumptions clear.




    I understand your point. This is one phase of the definition of Western. Later on it came to include the Reformation, the Enlightenment, the Cold War. However Greece in it's antiquity form was considered Western, due to foundation nature for the term itself, while Modern Greece may not be. Just as Rome without it's Christian aspects were considered Western. Italy, like Greece, is not the continuation of the previous culture but a new one. So while one could claim ancient Greece is Western they could point out, as you have, that Greece culture changed. Also keep in mind many Roman aspects were continued into the Middle Ages without it being founded by Christianity merely assimilated by it, the Feudal system for example. My point was more about the foundation of knowledge; philosophy, science, engineering, etc not the strict religious aspect. Each phase added a new parameter to what people considered Western. For example under your parameters Poland would be Western due to Catholic dominance yet the Enlightenment, the Renaissance and Cold War periods would not place Poland within this identification. For the two former parameters Poland was a minor contributor while with the later is strictly due to political changes due to war and occupation.

    I think the term "Western" is flawed as many different cultures/nations that do not fall under this identification did contributed to the development of the "West". Cultures change, adapt and assimilate. Cultures have changes forced upon them for various reasons. The term is in flux as much any culture is. However I think you are focusing on those that communicated these ideas, Latin Christianity fellowship, while I am focusing on the ideas. Idea regarding methodology, philosophical thought, etc. In a similar way "Western" is like Western Philosophy. It projects the image it now holds of itself on to the foundation and people of said image.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #71 - December 02, 2015, 06:28 PM
    Quote
    However Greece in it's antiquity form was considered Western, due to foundation nature for the term itself, while Modern Greece may not be.

    This is later myth making though. I don't think anyone in ancient Greece saw themselves as part of a west which, as far as it then existed, was where the barbarians lived. Actually I'd put the emphasis on the continuity in Greek culture, not the change. It was Rome that fell not Constantinople.
    Which side are you on?
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #72 - December 02, 2015, 06:43 PM
    Exactly. It presupposed it's own image on to the foundation of said image. Another issue is the Reformation brought (back) Greek manuscripts and Greek Orthodoxy into Latin Christianity. A few Protestant leaders, Martin Luther for example, open dialogues with the Orthodox Church. So how many of the new Catholic/Orthodox mix in forms of Protestants could still be Western if one of the major ties to "Western", Latin Christianity, became a minority or only part of the current culture of the time. Western can not be confined to a single parameter as basic interaction between a form of Christianity and post-Rome states.

  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #73 - December 12, 2015, 12:17 AM
    Don't know if this is real or not, but yeah.. "The hijab protects you from sexual harassment." Bullshit.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwNVWa_5Gco
    "If you don't like your religion's fundamentalists, then maybe there's something wrong with your religion's fundamentals."
    "Demanding blind respect but not offering any respect in reciprocation is laughable."
    "Let all the people in all the worlds be in peace."
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #74 - December 12, 2015, 12:21 AM
    Saudi wife may be jailed for catching her husband cheat with the maid.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4dhYSk79DSQ
    "If you don't like your religion's fundamentalists, then maybe there's something wrong with your religion's fundamentals."
    "Demanding blind respect but not offering any respect in reciprocation is laughable."
    "Let all the people in all the worlds be in peace."
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #75 - December 12, 2015, 12:30 AM
    Quote from: ExMuslimVlogGuy on December 12, 2015, 12:17 AM
    Don't know if this is real or not, but yeah.. "The hijab protects you from sexual harassment." Bullshit.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwNVWa_5Gco


    That's horrific! But I would not be surprised if it was true because sexual harassment is rampant in Saudi if a woman dares to step out of her home unaccompanied by a man. It's so bad that they had to ban the younger men from going into malls and the family sections of restaurants unless they had a female relative with them. That didn't stop them from crowding outside of malls and waiting for girls to walk out do that they could harass us.

    I think there was a thread a while back about the maid. Domestic workers are treated like subhumans so I am not surprised that the husband was given a free pass :/
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #76 - December 12, 2015, 12:51 AM
    The argument that I hear in support of Saudi Arabia (obviously from Muslim apologists), is that just like anyone who conspires against the Govt, is held guilty of treason, Saudi Arabia is absolutely sure of their God and hence anyone who conspires against it is guilty of treason.

    Just different governments and different rules. What do you think is the flaw in that argument?
    The illiterate of the 21st century will not be those who cannot read and write, but those that cannot learn, unlearn, and relearn. - Alvin Toffler
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #77 - December 12, 2015, 01:15 AM
    An evil country that dupes Muslims into supporting it by claiming to be a holy land. Gosh, where have we heard that one before... oh yes, the tactics of obnoxious televangelists.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #78 - December 12, 2015, 01:24 AM
    Quote from: Bolton34 on November 28, 2015, 07:50 PM
    An evil country that dupes Muslims into supporting it by claiming to be a holy land. Gosh, where have we heard that one before... oh yes, the tactics of obnoxious televangelists.


     Cheesy
    "If you don't like your religion's fundamentalists, then maybe there's something wrong with your religion's fundamentals."
    "Demanding blind respect but not offering any respect in reciprocation is laughable."
    "Let all the people in all the worlds be in peace."
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #79 - December 14, 2015, 02:53 AM
    Swedish feminist foreign minister has dared to tell the truth about Saudi Arabia:: what happens now concerns us all.

    http://new.spectator.co.uk/2015/03/swedens-feminist-foreign-minister-has-dared-to-tell-the-truth-about-saudi-arabia-what-happens-now-concerns-us-all/
    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #80 - December 14, 2015, 03:29 AM
    I was wondering what would happen with that.
    Don't let Hitler have the street.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #81 - December 14, 2015, 03:39 AM
    Quote from: Quod Sum Eris on December 14, 2015, 02:53 AM
    Swedish feminist foreign minister has dared to tell the truth about Saudi Arabia:: what happens now concerns us all.

    http://new.spectator.co.uk/2015/03/swedens-feminist-foreign-minister-has-dared-to-tell-the-truth-about-saudi-arabia-what-happens-now-concerns-us-all/


    It's a great step.  Afro
    "If you don't like your religion's fundamentalists, then maybe there's something wrong with your religion's fundamentals."
    "Demanding blind respect but not offering any respect in reciprocation is laughable."
    "Let all the people in all the worlds be in peace."
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #82 - December 14, 2015, 03:52 AM
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTk7EkAhpFo
    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim     
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #83 - December 14, 2015, 04:12 AM
    Quote from: three on December 14, 2015, 03:29 AM
    I was wondering what would happen with that.

    Apparently bugger all, since it happened months ago and nobody seems to be taking any notice.
    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #84 - December 15, 2015, 04:10 AM
    Yes, that is exactly why I was wondering. I thought she had been forced to backtrack, actually. Perhaps I remember wrong.
    Don't let Hitler have the street.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #85 - December 15, 2015, 04:23 PM
    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-35099318  news there says with this picture of son of sand king



    Quote
    Saudis announce Islamic anti-terrorism coalition

    Saudi Arabia has said 34 mainly Muslim nations have joined a new military alliance to fight terrorism.
    A joint operations centre is to be established in the Saudi capital, Riyadh, state media reported.
    Countries from Asia, Africa and the Arab world are involved in the alliance but Saudi Arabia's main regional rival Iran is not.

    It comes amid international pressure for Gulf Arab states to do more in the fight against so-called Islamic State. Saudi Defence Minister Mohammed bin Salman said the new alliance would co-ordinate efforts against extremists in Iraq, Syria, Libya, Egypt and Afghanistan. Neither Iraq nor Syria, whose governments are close to Shia-ruled Iran, are in the coalition, nor is Afghanistan.

    The list of 34 members: Saudi Arabia, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Benin, Chad, Comoros, Djibouti, Egypt, Gabon, Guinea, Ivory Coast, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Libya, Malaysia, Maldives, Mali, Morocco, Mauritania, Niger, Nigeria, Pakistan, the Palestinians, Qatar, Senegal, Sierra Leone, Somalia, Sudan, Togo, Tunisia, Turkey, United Arab Emirates and Yemen.

    where is Palestine??

    great Now it is Caliph time.. we can fight and fund terror in Shia lands.. China .. USSR and what not..  and other news at aljazeera.com/

    Quote
    Saudi Arabia's 2015 beheadings the most in 20 years  The government has already put 151 people to death  

    Saudi Arabia has executed at least 151 people so far this year - the most put to death in a single year since 1995. The stark rise in the number of executions has seen, on average, one person killed every two days, according to the human rights group, Amnesty International.

    "The Saudi Arabian authorities appear intent on continuing a bloody execution spree," Amnesty's report released on Monday said, quoting James Lynch, deputy director at the Middle East and North Africa programme. It is the most people put to death in the kingdom in one year since 1995, when 192 executions were reportedly carried out.

    n total, 71 people executed so far in 2015 have been foreigners. The majority were migrant workers from poorer countries who are often sentenced to die without any knowledge of the court's proceedings because they don't speak Arabic and do not receive translations.

    Most recent years have had between 79 and 90 people killed by beheadings annually for crimes including "nonlethal offences, such as drug-related ones," according to the London-based rights group.

     offcourse there are women in that beheading group ..




    if the there was NO INTERNET .. many people like Raif Badawi could have been in that fucking list
    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim     
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #86 - December 17, 2015, 03:26 AM
    Yes.
    And fuck the UK's pathetic toadying government as well . Perhaps they'll have some ethics thrust on them .....         http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/uk-could-be-prosecuted-for-war-crimes-over-missiles-sold-to-saudi-arabia-that-were-used-to-kill-a6752166.html
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #87 - December 17, 2015, 06:00 AM
    Saudi Arabia exports its interpretation of Islam around the world, the result is the violence in the Islamic world.
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #88 - December 17, 2015, 07:45 AM
    And Saudi is slick about spreading their Wahhabi version of Islam in America. They target Americans who are financially poor and socially retarded, making them think, "this is the real Islam" and that they have to "purify" the Muslims in America.

    All designated by the King.. Slick.
    "If you don't like your religion's fundamentalists, then maybe there's something wrong with your religion's fundamentals."
    "Demanding blind respect but not offering any respect in reciprocation is laughable."
    "Let all the people in all the worlds be in peace."
  • Fuck Saudi Arabia
     Reply #89 - December 17, 2015, 09:44 AM
    Quote from: aife on December 17, 2015, 03:26 AM
    Yes.
    And fuck the UK's pathetic toadying government as well . Perhaps they'll have some ethics thrust on them .....         http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/uk-could-be-prosecuted-for-war-crimes-over-missiles-sold-to-saudi-arabia-that-were-used-to-kill-a6752166.html

    Not that anything will come of it. Saudi Arabia is a legally recognised sovereign state, if they want to arm themselves, that's their business. The UK can't be held responsible for what their customers get up to. Just look the other way and keep supplying so long as the money is good.
    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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