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 Topic: Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?

 (Read 6705 times)
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  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     OP - September 03, 2015, 07:24 PM



    Culture is what we are. The arts and other manifestations of human intellectual achievement regarded collectively as culture. And multiculturalism is the coherence of multiple cultures in one single platform.
    On the other hand feminism is the belief that women are and should be treated as potential intellectual equals and social equals to men. Feminist people can be either male or female or just human beings, who ideologically comply with this belief.
     Now talking about Hijab, it’s a veil used for covering female body parts or more specifically covering the head and sometimes their countenance which supposedly upheld their personal identity. And the reason of wearing hijab is just to save woman from the avarice sexual desire of their male counterpart. It’s like a carapace for woman. It implicates the uncertainty they feel.
     In medieval era contemporary women of Mohammed used to be considered as an object of sex and a machine to reproduction.  During their billowing insecurity woman used to wear excess fabrics so as to seek extra security as well as to signify their social standard. Later on Mohammed found that idea to be an effective tool to subjugate woman and to establish & obdurate patriarchy in his society.
     But in this modern civilized world, no woman faces the same insecurity like that time and there are cops to ensure their safety. Today the congeniality of that carapace has been diminished and could have been the best time for woman to feel free & dress at their own will. Unlike Mohammed, most of the males today held a better attitude and respect towards woman, and they are openly accepted as human being rather than a sex toy or incubator machine. Then what is the necessity of wearing Hijab, can you explain rationally?
    Hijab is not a part of culture. It is not a manifestation of human intellectual achievement, rather a sign of insecurity and uncertainty of woman. Every Hijab wearing woman needs to be stopped and inquired, what type of insecurity they are actually feeling? If they really feel any, prompt action needs to be taken by the authority for their aid. But if they don’t, then they need to go to some place in their beloved Muslim world where they does feel insecure enough to wear that bullshit.

    Hijab doesn’t fits with feminism either. Every female as a human being, has the full right to decide what they should wear and which amount of their body part they gonna show in public. If they don’t wanna show anything, regardless the disappointment of the most of the man, we all need to accept their choice. But there are certain places like office or school where fixed dress code is applicable to boast acceptability and uniformity. You have the freedom of dressing, doesn’t mean you can dress and act like a cop even though you are actually not an officer. It doesn’t mean you can wear a bombsuit and mock around in a metro. Cause it will freak the shit out of other peoples. You do have the right to wear whatever you like but you don’t have the right to harass other people by your gaudy badinage. Imagine as a children you are being taught by a teacher fully covered with hijab and niquab. Can you really concentrate on the study without watching the face of your tutor? Is it okey to scare those little kids by posing as a faceless creature? As a woman isn’t it derogatory to your self esteem to hide your own face of identity? How can you ever justify it with feminism and freedom of dressing?
        

    God didn't created us in his Image. We created God as our own reflection.
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #1 - September 03, 2015, 08:08 PM

    I agree that the niqab/burka should be banned in certain places. In my country I think it's forbidden to work in many places and enter stores, hospitals, etc with your face covered. I see no logical reason to ban the use in the streets.

    The way I see it I think the hijab became the muslim "gear" rather then a feminin statement. Most converts use it to show their new faith. I see no logical reason to ban it in any place. I don't know if the majority of the muslim born use it or not. I do believe religion is losing power in society. If islam will follow the trend only time will.

    "The onus is on you to say why; the onus is not on the rest of us to say why not." - Richard Dawkins
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #2 - September 03, 2015, 08:12 PM

    In my country I think it's forbidden to work in many places and enter stores, hospitals, etc with your face covered.


    Where are you from, man who looks like the vocalist from Korn? England?
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #3 - September 03, 2015, 08:13 PM

    Portugal.

    And it is indeed the vocalist of Korn  yes . Great singer, awesome band.

    "The onus is on you to say why; the onus is not on the rest of us to say why not." - Richard Dawkins
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #4 - September 04, 2015, 01:30 AM

    If every woman has a right to decide how to dress, then no one has the right to question her about it or accuse her of insecurities. Hijab is up to the individual, for whatever their reasons might be. It is not a sign of low self esteem to wear hijab or any headcovering, and I resent the insinuation that women who cover their heads are victims. Women and men have been covering their hair for eons all over the world in various ways.
    Either give them the right or don't. But don't say in one breath that they should wear what they want and then criticize them for doing so in the next breath. 

    Don't let Hitler have the street.
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #5 - September 04, 2015, 01:35 AM

    If every woman has a right to decide how to dress, then no one has the right to question her about it or accuse her of insecurities. Hijab is up to the individual, for whatever their reasons might be. It is not a sign of low self esteem to wear hijab or any headcovering, and I resent the insinuation that women who cover their heads are victims. Women and men have been covering their hair for eons all over the world in various ways.
    Either give them the right or don't. But don't say in one breath that they should wear what they want and then criticize them for doing so in the next breath. 



    Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil, for I have a sonic screwdriver, a tricorder, and a Type 2 phaser.
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #6 - September 04, 2015, 09:55 AM


    Culture is what we are. The arts and other manifestations of human intellectual achievement regarded collectively as culture. And multiculturalism is the coherence of multiple cultures in one single platform.

    On the other hand feminism is the belief that women are and should be treated as potential intellectual equals and social equals to men. Feminist people can be either male or female or just human beings, who ideologically comply with this belief.
     Now talking about Hijab, it’s a veil used for covering female body parts or more specifically covering the head and sometimes their countenance which supposedly upheld their personal identity. And the reason of wearing hijab is just to save woman from the avarice sexual desire of their male counterpart. It’s like a carapace for woman. It implicates the uncertainty they feel.

     In medieval era contemporary women of Mohammed used to be considered as an object of sex and a machine to reproduction.  During their billowing insecurity woman used to wear excess fabrics so as to seek extra security as well as to signify their social standard. Later on Mohammed found that idea to be an effective tool to subjugate woman and to establish & obdurate patriarchy in his society.

     But in this modern civilized world, no woman faces the same insecurity like that time and there are cops to ensure their safety. Today the congeniality of that carapace has been diminished and could have been the best time for woman to feel free & dress at their own will. Unlike Mohammed, most of the males today held a better attitude and respect towards woman, and they are openly accepted as human being rather than a sex toy or incubator machine. Then what is the necessity of wearing Hijab, can you explain rationally?

    Hijab is not a part of culture. It is not a manifestation of human intellectual achievement, rather a sign of insecurity and uncertainty of woman. Every Hijab wearing woman needs to be stopped and inquired, what type of insecurity they are actually feeling? If they really feel any, prompt action needs to be taken by the authority for their aid. But if they don’t, then they need to go to some place in their beloved Muslim world where they does feel insecure enough to wear that bullshit.

    Hijab doesn’t fits with feminism either. Every female as a human being, has the full right to decide what they should wear and which amount of their body part they gonna show in public. If they don’t wanna show anything, regardless the disappointment of the most of the man, we all need to accept their choice. But there are certain places like office or school where fixed dress code is applicable to boast acceptability and uniformity.
    Quote
    You have the freedom of dressing, doesn’t mean you can dress and act like a cop even though you are actually not an officer. It doesn’t mean you can wear a bombsuit and mock around in a metro. Cause it will freak the shit out of other peoples. You do have the right to wear whatever you like but you don’t have the right to harass other people by your gaudy badinage. Imagine as a children you are being taught by a teacher fully covered with hijab and niquab. Can you really concentrate on the study without watching the face of your tutor? Is it okey to scare those little kids by posing as a faceless creature? As a woman isn’t it derogatory to your self esteem to hide your own face of identity? How can you ever justify it with feminism and freedom of dressing?

        

    well I read some good words. some silly words and some angry words from Dr. vet.

    Well that is what  we expect from ANIMAL DOCTORS.. they are good people but they are dealing with poor animals day in and day out.. So they get frustrated  hence  Doc Vet is venting frustration in CEMB forum.. and I am glad to read dr.vet.

    Hellllooooo Doc Vet.. formal greetings and my good wishes to you and welcome to CEMB..  And I wonder whether you are LIVING/TRAVEL to Bangladesh??

    with best wishes
    yeezevee

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #7 - September 04, 2015, 01:49 PM

    If every woman has a right to decide how to dress, then no one has the right to question her about it or accuse her of insecurities. Hijab is up to the individual, for whatever their reasons might be. It is not a sign of low self esteem to wear hijab or any headcovering, and I resent the insinuation that women who cover their heads are victims. Women and men have been covering their hair for eons all over the world in various ways.
    Either give them the right or don't. But don't say in one breath that they should wear what they want and then criticize them for doing so in the next breath. 


    Agreed! I could never see myself wearing a hijab again but that's my choice and I fought so hard to have it respected. Who are we to question the choices of women who wear hijab? Girls I've spoken to have given me different reasons why they wear it and they are all valid (not that they need reasons).
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #8 - September 04, 2015, 09:22 PM

    Glad to see you are still alive Dr. Vet.
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #9 - September 04, 2015, 10:27 PM

    Hijab is a strange one because the majority of the time it's worn, even in the West, by young women its not a decision made with one's autonomy. I have no idea how to deal with that issue, but I do know that's definitely a restriction on women's choices.

    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #10 - September 06, 2015, 10:27 PM

    Muslims consider this as an obligation but I'm unable to find anything in Qur'an or sunnah that makes it fard.  Scholars obligate it based on traditions.   
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #11 - September 07, 2015, 03:25 AM

    Burqa

    I think this becomes an issue when it clashes with the local law, for example when you need to be identified, have a photo ID, etc.  I can see people wearing it being upset when they are required to show their face for identification or take it off when entering certain places as someone else had mentioned. My opinion is that the local law should obviously override any religious laws. You have moved here/been born here - it doesn't matter - you got to accept the law. The problem arises when the religious law is more important to people than the local law. If you really believe in supernatural being - of course you will be upset that some mere human is telling you to abandon what the god has asked you to do Wink In that case - it is impossible to battle.

    This is the thing. I understand that it is a big part of the tradition and if there was no history and evidence of males simply imposing that on females because they don't trust themselves and their urges (misconception? correct me if I'm wrong) then it wouldn't be an issue. If people treated this JUST as a traditional outfit without getting righteous about their beliefs and how it overrides everything else - it wouldn't be an issue.

    Hijab

    It's like a hat. The only issue there is again males requiring women to wear it and women not having the actual choice, in some cases. Sorry but whatever you believe in, you cannot override the law. But that's much wider topic. If it's their choice, why would anyone have problem with that?
    Analogically, a man wearing a hat is ok, but if man has to wear a hat because if he doesn't - his wife will beat him up - that's against the law and he should leave and sue that bitch Tongue
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #12 - September 09, 2015, 04:52 AM

    Either give them the right or don't. But don't say in one breath that they should wear what they want and then criticize them for doing so in the next breath. 

    I disagree very strongly with this. It's OK to support freedom of choice while criticizing certain choices.

    For example, I believe in freedom of speech, including speech that I don't agree with, as long as that speech isn't inciting violence or abuse against someone. If my neighbor is a right-wing fundamentalist who thinks that white people are superior to other races, I believe in his right to espouse whatever views he wants without censure as long as he isn't actively hurting someone or promoting actual violence against others. But I still reserve the right to criticize him and his views, and the right to rally against his views. This has nothing to do with my support of freedom of speech/expression--the two are mutually exclusive.

    Same thing goes for dress and hijab. I can support a person's right to choose to wear whatever he or she wants, but I am also free to criticize their choices.
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #13 - September 09, 2015, 05:45 AM

    If a woman feels liberated and happy in her hijab then what is there to criticise? She is not harming you or anyone else, there is nothing hateful about choosing to wear a piece of cloth on her head so that cannot be compared to White supremacists exercising their right to free speech at all. When I took mine off, some Muslim women thought that I did so because I was insecure and wanted attention from men. I hated how they criticised my choice to wear what I want and what made me feel liberated and it would be hypocritical to do what was done to me to a hijabi.
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #14 - September 09, 2015, 06:30 AM

    I disagree very strongly with this. It's OK to support freedom of choice while criticizing certain choices.

    For example, I believe in freedom of speech, including speech that I don't agree with, as long as that speech isn't inciting violence or abuse against someone.

    Same thing goes for dress and hijab. I can support a person's right to choose to wear whatever he or she wants, but I am also free to criticize their choices.


    Criticizing a woman's choice of dress is abusive.
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #15 - September 09, 2015, 06:39 AM

    If a woman feels liberated and happy in her hijab then what is there to criticise? She is not harming you or anyone else, there is nothing hateful about choosing to wear a piece of cloth on her head so that cannot be compared to White supremacists exercising their right to free speech at all. ..

    Ya  yes.. AGirl.....yes.,  ha! no one is there in the room damn I got scared that my keys fell off from key holder..  How did it happen?? earth quake?  Dammit I got scared  thinking Allahgod might be giving warning to me  for what I do in these forums ..

    I agree with you 100% there, Hijab is just piece of cloth on head   and often it looks good on women folks ....may be at best it may be symbolism for Islam and  that person could be  Muslim........  Big deal  I use muffler all the time in winter  looks like Hijab 

    but tell the women  not to scare me in public places with that Niqab



    That is scary ...



    no one knows  what is under it....


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZgzQjIDTic

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #16 - September 09, 2015, 06:41 AM

    Criticizing a woman's choice of dress is abusive.


    true..  I always tell them they don't know how to choose proper colors for their dress and they don't care  finmad

    errrrrrrrrrr.....     no one cares what I say suki...............

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #17 - September 09, 2015, 06:50 AM

    If a woman feels liberated and happy in her hijab then what is there to criticise? She is not harming you or anyone else, there is nothing hateful about choosing to wear a piece of cloth on her head so that cannot be compared to White supremacists exercising their right to free speech at all. When I took mine off, some Muslim women thought that I did so because I was insecure and wanted attention from men. I hated how they criticised my choice to wear what I want and what made me feel liberated and it would be hypocritical to do what was done to me to a hijabi.


    Criticizing her choice. Because it's a choice. It's nothing that she cannot change like skin color, ethnic background.
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #18 - September 09, 2015, 07:03 AM

    Quote
    true..  I always tell them they don't know how to choose proper colors for their dress  and they don't care  finmad

    errrrrrrrrrr.....     no one cares what I say suki...............



    Naw I'm just talking about the ones who choose to wear it (and the ones forced to wear it i suppose), they shouldn't be subject to criticism and insults, no one should tell a woman what to wear, especially a man.  I am against forced hijab, of course !     : )

    x
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #19 - September 09, 2015, 07:07 AM

    Suki, why they shouldn't be subject to criticism if they choose to do that?
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #20 - September 09, 2015, 07:21 AM

    Why don't you explain first why she should be criticised. 
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #21 - September 09, 2015, 07:27 AM

    Because it's a choice.
    In fact my problem with your post is "shouldn't"
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #22 - September 09, 2015, 07:31 AM

    Why the fuck should someone be criticised for choosing to wear a piece of religious garb? They aren't forcing you to wear it as well.

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #23 - September 09, 2015, 07:35 AM

    Because it's a choice. And you have no right, absolutely no right to ask someone not to criticize someone's choice whatever he/she decides to wear, hijab, red pants, red shoes or he/she choose.
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #24 - September 09, 2015, 08:23 AM

    Why the fuck should someone be criticised for choosing to wear a piece of religious garb? They aren't forcing you to wear it as well.


    Depending on where you live people have the right to criticize anything they please. People make bad choices all the time. One could argue that this choice is just acceptance and propagation of a religious driven gender stereotype. I can agree they have a choice, are free to make a choice but I can take issues with their reasons. However I think when it comes to prioritizing issues this is one that is lower on the list.
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #25 - September 09, 2015, 08:59 AM

    Of course everyone has the right to criticise, but that does not make them any less of an arsehole.
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #26 - September 09, 2015, 09:18 AM

    Yah pretty much it
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #27 - September 09, 2015, 09:23 AM

    Because it's a choice. And you have no right, absolutely no right to ask someone not to criticize someone's choice whatever he/she decides to wear, hijab, red pants, red shoes or he/she choose.

    But why would you?
    Depending on where you live people have the right to criticize anything they please.

    I didn't mention the right to criticise, I simply asked for what reason you (in this case nbhb) would.

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #28 - September 09, 2015, 09:25 AM

    Of course everyone has the right to criticise, but that does not make them any less of an arsehole.


    Fitting answer, yes?
  • Why hizab has no space in multiculturalism and feminism?
     Reply #29 - September 09, 2015, 09:34 AM

    You're saying nbhb is an arsehole? parrot

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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