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Theme Changer

 Topic: Hello and ramadhaan mubarak

 (Read 3631 times)
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  • Hello and ramadhaan mubarak
     OP - June 15, 2015, 06:20 PM



    Hello and ramadhaan mubarak. 

    Been lurking around here for a little while and after being inspired by your stories i wanted to introduce myself to the community.

    I became a closet skeptic, over a year ago! I am a former hard core ideological (but completely peaceful) islamist. I gave up Islamism and since then I've been on a lonely and bizarre journey that has taken me all the way through the belly of the beast and farted out of the other end. All of this only in my head of course. 

    Coming from very traditional tablighi background I've always had a strong attachment to my faith that has continually evolved and changed all throughout my youth,  crazy uni days, professional and married life and now as a parent. I've always prayed and fasted since I was a kid. Did hajj and paid zakat as soon as I could afford it. I love reciting the book and even memorised parts of it.

    However, I've always struggled with mainstream ignorance and traditionalist understanding of things.  I have always tried to have a rational approach to faith and application of fiqh. I suppose I'm from that generation of British Muslims that had to assert our identity after the satanic verses and then some of us picked up pride in Islam that was fed by the likes of Ahmed Deedat and all the comparative religion debaters that followed.  Lucky i was never sucked into salafism which is where many of that generation ended up.  Instead i got into the  edgy and exciting world of islamist political movements that gave us ideology and the quest for world domination. Ironically those two trends rubbed off on each other to the point  of actually ejaculating a real ugly salafi islamist khilafah in iraq. Incidentally i think this is the single biggest turn off to islam even for all those British muslims that spent the last 20 years supposedly 'working for khilafah'.

    Over the years,  intellectual boldness,  has allowed myself like many i have seen,  to open enough conceptual and fiqhi loopholes to allow us to drift away from these very demanding and life usurping islamist cults and try to live normal lives as much as possible.
     
    So what has made me skeptical? Well, as difficult as it was to even think this;  after decades of reconciling revelation with the intellect, carefully and secretly chipping bits off after sincere study and thought.  Bits like superstitions, fundamentalism,  political Islamism, sufism, literalism, fiqh and eventually even hadith. For a short while i toyed with the idea of Quranism as a way to hold on to the faith. But even without hadith, it became difficult to reconcile with reason. Finally I came to the point where I am no longer able to defend the Quran. Although I think all people,  not just Muslims, have an almost unlimited capacity to twistedly reconcile faith with reason, for me it became impossible to distinguish the message of islam from the delusions of a schizophrenic that got hijacked by king makers then empire builders.

    At the moment I don't envisage ever coming out as I wouldn't want upset family relationships and as an introvert i don't have any desire whatsoever to be in the limelight.   I suppose I'll just live out my days as a cultural Muslim like all those coconut uncles I've always hated! But seriously; i have found that after the fear, guilt, anger subsides,  one becomes more hopeful of affecting reform from within. I see my Islamic heritage as part of the greater human heritage.  So my islamic heritage is as much a part of me as what i inherent  from india,  persia,  greece and rome; warts and all.  I am optimistic for a  reformation of the Muslim world but like the reformation of Christian Europe it will be slow and possibly painful.


    I know that us introverts find it very difficult to speak up even on an online forum,  but please do PM me whatever background you are from, I am very keen to make your  acquaintance.




  • Hello and ramadhaan mubarak
     Reply #1 - June 15, 2015, 06:42 PM

    Welcome.  parrot bunny
  • Hello and ramadhaan mubarak
     Reply #2 - June 15, 2015, 06:59 PM

    Welcome aboard.
                                 
  • Hello and ramadhaan mubarak
     Reply #3 - June 15, 2015, 07:23 PM

    Welcome to the forum binrushed, have a rabbit!  bunny

    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
  • Hello and ramadhaan mubarak
     Reply #4 - June 15, 2015, 08:28 PM

    binrushed - love the name hehe  grin12

    Welcome  Afro
  • Hello and ramadhaan mubarak
     Reply #5 - June 15, 2015, 08:36 PM


    ...... since then I've been on a lonely and bizarre journey .....

    ..... I've always struggled with mainstream ignorance and traditionalist understanding of things.  I have always tried to have a rational approach to faith and application of fiqh. I suppose I'm from that generation of British Muslims that had to assert our identity after the satanic verses and then some of us picked up pride in Islam that was fed by the likes of Ahmed Deedat

    .... Lucky i was never sucked into salafism which is where many of that generation ended up......

    .... i think this is the single biggest turn off to islam even for all those British muslims that spent the last 20 years supposedly 'working for khilafah'.

    Over the years,  intellectual boldness,  has allowed myself like many i have seen,  to open enough conceptual and fiqhi loopholes to allow us to drift away from these very demanding and life usurping islamist cults and try to live normal lives as much as possible.
      
    .... Bits like superstitions, fundamentalism,  political Islamism, sufism, literalism, fiqh and eventually even hadith. For a short while i toyed with the idea of Quranism as a way to hold on to the faith. But even without hadith, it became difficult to reconcile with reason. Finally I came to the point where I am no longer able to defend the Quran. Although I think all people,  not just Muslims, have an almost unlimited capacity to twistedly reconcile faith with reason, for me it became impossible to distinguish the message of islam from the delusions of a schizophrenic that got hijacked by king makers then empire builders.

    At the moment I don't envisage ever coming out as I wouldn't want upset family relationships and as an introvert i don't have any desire whatsoever to be in the limelight.   I suppose I'll just live out my days as a cultural Muslim....

    ... I see my Islamic heritage as part of the greater human heritage.  So my islamic heritage is as much a part of me as what i inherent  from india,  persia,  greece and rome; warts and all.  



    A lot of what you say in your introduction, mirrors my thoughts and experiences, maybe because I think we are from the same generation i.e. satanic verses and ahmed deedat shaping the identity of muslim teens. Unlike ex-muslim teens of today, who can forge a new identity and life for themselves by coming out and severing ties with their families, we have lived half our lives in this mess and it would not do us any good to make waves now.  Though I don't think reform is ever possible in islam, the more people try, the more the lunatics start to take over the asylum. But I'm a pessimist.  Anyway, welcome to the forum.
  • Hello and ramadhaan mubarak
     Reply #6 - June 15, 2015, 09:06 PM

     parrot

    What did Satanic Verses do?  To me it is a silly quite fun magical realism tale!  How would you cope if you woke one morning with hooves and a tale?

    When you are a Bear of Very Little Brain, and you Think of Things, you find sometimes that a Thing which seemed very Thingish inside you is quite different when it gets out into the open and has other people looking at it.


    A.A. Milne,

    "We cannot slaughter each other out of the human impasse"
  • Hello and ramadhaan mubarak
     Reply #7 - June 15, 2015, 09:08 PM

    After falling from a Jumbo Jet and ending up in Pevensey Bay?

    When you are a Bear of Very Little Brain, and you Think of Things, you find sometimes that a Thing which seemed very Thingish inside you is quite different when it gets out into the open and has other people looking at it.


    A.A. Milne,

    "We cannot slaughter each other out of the human impasse"
  • Hello and ramadhaan mubarak
     Reply #8 - June 16, 2015, 02:09 AM


    Welcome parrot. I appreciate your writing.

    Don't let Hitler have the street.
  • Hello and ramadhaan mubarak
     Reply #9 - June 16, 2015, 06:39 AM

     parrot

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Hello and ramadhaan mubarak
     Reply #10 - June 16, 2015, 01:42 PM

    Welcome parrot. I appreciate your writing.


    Thanks
  • Hello and ramadhaan mubarak
     Reply #11 - June 16, 2015, 03:14 PM

    Welcome to the forum, binrushed.

    And Ramadhaan kareem to you too Wink

    He's no friend to the friendless
    And he's the mother of grief
    There's only sorrow for tomorrow
    Surely life is too brief
  • Hello and ramadhaan mubarak
     Reply #12 - June 16, 2015, 06:32 PM

    Welcome bro, enjoy yourself round here
  • Hello and ramadhaan mubarak
     Reply #13 - June 16, 2015, 09:29 PM

    Welcome binrushed  parrot
  • Hello and ramadhaan mubarak
     Reply #14 - June 16, 2015, 10:55 PM

    "Although I think all people,  not just Muslims, have an almost unlimited capacity to twistedly reconcile faith with reason, for me it became impossible to distinguish the message of islam from the delusions of a schizophrenic that got hijacked by king makers then empire builders."

    Yes, and I would add that the vast majority of Muslims simply don't care about truth, as in they are not interested in pursuing their own truth. There are millions of "moderate" Muslims who, if they sat down to actually think this stuff through, would become ex-Muslims!

    Welcome parrot


  • Hello and ramadhaan mubarak
     Reply #15 - July 01, 2015, 12:45 AM

    binrushed - love the name hehe  grin12

    Welcome  Afro


    Thanks Hassan.

    I was explaining this to someone so I thought i would post it here in case anyone is interested in my username . 
     
    Ibn rushed is the twelfth century andalucian polymath philosopher know in the West as Averroes and  described by some as the  "founding father of secular thought in Western Europe".   All of Aristotals' philosophy  came to be known via him. When i was an islamist i /we used to consider him an apostate because of his philosophical positions on i can't even remember what.  So i chose this username to honour him in my apostacy.

    Ok so i also did a play on words from bin rushd to bin rushed,  as in; been rushed,  generally in life,  not had the time to consider things properly and mature.

  • Hello and ramadhaan mubarak
     Reply #16 - July 01, 2015, 02:55 AM

    I can't see an avatar.

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Hello and ramadhaan mubarak
     Reply #17 - July 08, 2015, 07:37 PM

    Welcome to the forum! Smiley  parrot parrot Keep reflecting, keep understanding, and welcome to the "cultural Muslim" clan  bunny bunny

    One only acquires wisdom when one sets the heart and mind open to new ideas.

    Chat: http://client01.chat.mibbit.com/#ex-muslims
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