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Theme Changer

 Topic: UK Election 2015

 (Read 19909 times)
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  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #150 - May 11, 2015, 05:01 PM

    Skywalker, I feel bad because I nominated you for JoTM but then voted for galfromusa because she actually had me wondering if one could flood out a volcano, but next month, I swear, I won't waver. Grin
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #151 - May 11, 2015, 05:16 PM

    Ahh so thats what the knife is doing in my back.
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #152 - May 11, 2015, 05:17 PM

    I know! I'm sorry.  Embarrassed
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #153 - May 11, 2015, 05:20 PM

    Ahh so thats what the knife is doing in my back.

    That's cold.

    Now you know better than to trust Lua!  Cheesy
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #154 - May 11, 2015, 05:24 PM

    I voted Labour in case anyone's interested. I was thinking about Greens - and even Lib Dem because of their pledge to direct more funding to NHS services like mental health. But in the end I was persuaded by the constant bashing Ed Miliband got from the Rupert Murdoch press. It was so disgusting, cheap and low, it just made me so angry and want to react.


    Me too.  And I am absolutely devastated by the result.  Honestly, it was like a personal wound in my heart.

    I am so disappointed with the electorate, or the voting system, I am just so fucked off with it all. 

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #155 - May 11, 2015, 05:32 PM

    I'm going to miss Miliband, he really should have got this vote..   ah well, Labour were doomed this time.
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #156 - May 11, 2015, 07:50 PM

    The British people sees the world. Notices how much of it is filled with shit-heads, causing suffering and misery to other humans. Decides to be shit-heads too in their own way and vote conservative.
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #157 - May 11, 2015, 08:18 PM

    Scotland isn't a monolith where every resident is a card carrying SNP member hell bent on breaking up the UK and neither are we incapable of putting some thought behind our decisions and actions, so less of the sweeping generalisations that those living in Scotland are brainwashed, silly and somehow infantile in our choices.

    The SNP has always supported independence for Scotland, so of course their ultimate aim is to see ...... an independent Scotland! They do have other policies as they not such a one dimensional political party, which is why they were elected twice in a row to form the Scottish government - first as a minority and second as a majority.

    The SNP wasn't the only political party to support independence for Scotland during the referendum - the Scottish Green Party, the Scottish Socialist Party, even an offshoot from the Labour Party - Labour for Independence, and lots of people who aren't affiliated to any specific group, various activist groups etc.

    The people who voted for and against independence had various (and sometimes complex) reasons, from one end of the spectrum to the other, like purely Scottish nationalism for independence at any cost to purely British nationalism against independence at any cost, with lots of nuances in between - principle of self determination like many other countries around the world, feeling that real positive progress would move at a snail's pace as long as Westminster held all the cards and purse strings, not caring much for the union as a concept but voting no as they were more worried about the economic and political implications of independence, or feeling more British rather than Scottish and wanting to stay part of the union and hoping that change can come from within etc.

    So politicians, celebrities and the media constantly said we should stay, we were valued in the democratic processes of the UK, we would get 'significant' devolved powers (whatever that means) etc. So 55% voted No for a plethora of reasons.

    However the behaviour of the Labour party historically as well as during the referendum has angered and disgusted many of their supporters. Most people have no confidence that Labour can actually represent and stand up for Scotland within the UK (or even ordinary people across the UK), as they seem to take Scottish Labour votes for granted and actually think they have some uncontested divine right to them - as opposed to actually having enough humility to realise that you need to earn votes not demand them.

    And it is this void that the SNP cleverly fills. It is a sad indictment for Labour when then SNP, which isn't really that much of a radical party compared to some others like the TUSC, appear to be more left wing than Labour!

    So if the Conservatives, Lib Dems, UKIP and Labour are unpalatable options for you, who do you choose to represent your constituency? If you are genuinely sick and tired of the way UK politics is going and want to see some real change in the political establishment, who can you actually vote for? It appeared to be either SNP or the Greens, hence the surge in votes for both of them.

    Then there was the growing hysteria from various political parties and media, as if democratically elected SNP MPs would descend onto England, raping, pillaging and leaving a trail of destruction. Nevermind the fact that SNP MPs have been elected to Westminster before and their position on independence was the same then as now. If the Scottish MPs were Labour or Conservative that would have been ok I suppose. As long as we keep our heads down and do as we're told.

    English votes for English laws? Last time I checked, Westminster was for the entire UK. And only the SNP have historically abstained from voting on English only issues, as a matter of party principle. None of the Scottish Labour and Scottish Conservatives did that though... probably because, you know, we're part of this Union people keep banging on about, or maybe they don't feel guilty or unprincipled about trying to have a say on English only issues, few as they may be. And given the current political structure of the UK, there are actually very few issues that are genuinely English only. Most issues have a knock on effect on other parts of the UK.

    Union politicians constantly talk about how bad and evil the SNP is, as if a party that talks about reducing austerity is infinitely worse than one that seeks to crush British people with cuts and reductions to social welfare.
    A party that has talked about reforming the election system, even though they might lose votes that way, you know, as a matter of principle, while the two biggest UK parties didn't want it because it suited them just fine all these years .... until now.

    There are things I disagree with when it comes to the SNP and their policies, but seeing the Union parties hoisted by their own petard with First Past the Post is delicious.
    And the fact that even if Scotland voted Labour, we'd still have a Tory government - which is what people in Scotland have been saying all along. At least now it is plain for everyone to see, even if they refuse to acknowledge it because it is easier pointing the finger at someone else.

    However, all of this is overshadowed by the fact that this is a dark time for the UK, and it pains me to see the election result and knowing we all have some very tough times ahead.

    Rant over. It's been building up for weeks, if not months Grin


    This was lucid and well-written, in terms of for someone like me, an outsider, non-Brit Canuckistani, to better understand the motivations of many who voted in Scotland. Thanks for writing it up Afro

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #158 - May 11, 2015, 08:58 PM

    The British people sees the world. Notices how much of it is filled with shit-heads, causing suffering and misery to other humans. Decides to be shit-heads too in their own way and vote conservative.

    Yes, Brits are great people, except when they don't vote for the party I like, then they're stupid and a bunch of shit-heads. It's not like there are other reasons people didn't vote Labour. /s
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #159 - May 11, 2015, 09:03 PM

    Me too.  And I am absolutely devastated by the result.  Honestly, it was like a personal wound in my heart.

    I am so disappointed with the electorate, or the voting system, I am just so fucked off with it all. 


    Me too.

    I've really learnt a lot more about our politics over the past few weeks as i was voting for the first time, really frustrated with the result, makes me want to get involved.
  • Re: UK Election 2015
     Reply #160 - May 11, 2015, 10:16 PM

    I know! I'm sorry.  Embarrassed

    Im just kidding

    Though if you didn't vote ...I dont know who did Huh?
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #161 - May 12, 2015, 07:45 AM

    This was lucid and well-written, in terms of for someone like me, an outsider, non-Brit Canuckistani, to better understand the motivations of many who voted in Scotland. Thanks for writing it up Afro


    Thanks allat. I'm sure there are much better articles and analysis that explain Scottish and UK politics, and there's probably many more things I have missed out, but that's what I've learned and understood from living here for almost a decade. The last year or so has really opened my eyes to how low political establishments can sink and how much they are beholden to big businesses and media. I've always known / suspected, but to see it happening in your face, is pretty upsetting and infuriating.

  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #162 - May 12, 2015, 07:54 AM

    Me too.

    I've really learnt a lot more about our politics over the past few weeks as i was voting for the first time, really frustrated with the result, makes me want to get involved.


    That's the spirit!  Afro  Anger is a good thing, if it is channelled in the right direction.
    The thing I learnt the most from the Scottish independence referendum is to ask yourself this one question - what kind of society do I want to live in?
    Unless you are a selfish cunt, most people, irrespective of their political persuasion, want jobs that pay well, good housing, a reliable health service, good quality of life for all etc etc.

    If you know how society should be then you start to find ways to make that happen and you start to reach out to those who want the same things, and you learn to stop being a passive citizen and instead become an active one.  Smiley

  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #163 - May 12, 2015, 01:25 PM

    Quote from: Jedi
    Scotland is partially to blame


    Scotland is not to blame at all.  There are only 59 seats in Scotland and Labour lost by over 100 seats.  Now do the math, as the Americans say - even if every single Scottish constituency had returned a Labour MP, the Tories would still have won.

    "Befriend them not, Oh murtads, and give them neither parrot nor bunny."  - happymurtad's advice on trolls.
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #164 - May 12, 2015, 01:28 PM

    Scotland isn't a monolith where every resident is a card carrying SNP member hell bent on breaking up the UK and neither are we incapable of putting some thought behind our decisions and actions, so less of the sweeping generalisations that those living in Scotland are brainwashed, silly and somehow infantile in our choices.

    The SNP has always supported independence for Scotland, so of course their ultimate aim is to see ...... an independent Scotland! They do have other policies as they not such a one dimensional political party, which is why they were elected twice in a row to form the Scottish government - first as a minority and second as a majority.

    The SNP wasn't the only political party to support independence for Scotland during the referendum - the Scottish Green Party, the Scottish Socialist Party, even an offshoot from the Labour Party - Labour for Independence, and lots of people who aren't affiliated to any specific group, various activist groups etc.

    The people who voted for and against independence had various (and sometimes complex) reasons, from one end of the spectrum to the other, like purely Scottish nationalism for independence at any cost to purely British nationalism against independence at any cost, with lots of nuances in between - principle of self determination like many other countries around the world, feeling that real positive progress would move at a snail's pace as long as Westminster held all the cards and purse strings, not caring much for the union as a concept but voting no as they were more worried about the economic and political implications of independence, or feeling more British rather than Scottish and wanting to stay part of the union and hoping that change can come from within etc.

    So politicians, celebrities and the media constantly said we should stay, we were valued in the democratic processes of the UK, we would get 'significant' devolved powers (whatever that means) etc. So 55% voted No for a plethora of reasons.

    However the behaviour of the Labour party historically as well as during the referendum has angered and disgusted many of their supporters. Most people have no confidence that Labour can actually represent and stand up for Scotland within the UK (or even ordinary people across the UK), as they seem to take Scottish Labour votes for granted and actually think they have some uncontested divine right to them - as opposed to actually having enough humility to realise that you need to earn votes not demand them.

    And it is this void that the SNP cleverly fills. It is a sad indictment for Labour when then SNP, which isn't really that much of a radical party compared to some others like the TUSC, appear to be more left wing than Labour!

    So if the Conservatives, Lib Dems, UKIP and Labour are unpalatable options for you, who do you choose to represent your constituency? If you are genuinely sick and tired of the way UK politics is going and want to see some real change in the political establishment, who can you actually vote for? It appeared to be either SNP or the Greens, hence the surge in votes for both of them.

    Then there was the growing hysteria from various political parties and media, as if democratically elected SNP MPs would descend onto England, raping, pillaging and leaving a trail of destruction. Nevermind the fact that SNP MPs have been elected to Westminster before and their position on independence was the same then as now. If the Scottish MPs were Labour or Conservative that would have been ok I suppose. As long as we keep our heads down and do as we're told.

    English votes for English laws? Last time I checked, Westminster was for the entire UK. And only the SNP have historically abstained from voting on English only issues, as a matter of party principle. None of the Scottish Labour and Scottish Conservatives did that though... probably because, you know, we're part of this Union people keep banging on about, or maybe they don't feel guilty or unprincipled about trying to have a say on English only issues, few as they may be. And given the current political structure of the UK, there are actually very few issues that are genuinely English only. Most issues have a knock on effect on other parts of the UK.

    Union politicians constantly talk about how bad and evil the SNP is, as if a party that talks about reducing austerity is infinitely worse than one that seeks to crush British people with cuts and reductions to social welfare.
    A party that has talked about reforming the election system, even though they might lose votes that way, you know, as a matter of principle, while the two biggest UK parties didn't want it because it suited them just fine all these years .... until now.

    There are things I disagree with when it comes to the SNP and their policies, but seeing the Union parties hoisted by their own petard with First Past the Post is delicious.
    And the fact that even if Scotland voted Labour, we'd still have a Tory government - which is what people in Scotland have been saying all along. At least now it is plain for everyone to see, even if they refuse to acknowledge it because it is easier pointing the finger at someone else.

    However, all of this is overshadowed by the fact that this is a dark time for the UK, and it pains me to see the election result and knowing we all have some very tough times ahead.

    Rant over. It's been building up for weeks, if not months Grin


    Good post.   thnkyu

    "Befriend them not, Oh murtads, and give them neither parrot nor bunny."  - happymurtad's advice on trolls.
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #165 - May 12, 2015, 03:10 PM

    I've said it before but in my view this government simply doesn't have a mandate.

    Is this what democracy looks like? Not in my opinion...

    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/ampp3d/general-election-results-just-900-5682492
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #166 - May 12, 2015, 03:19 PM

    This one shows it better. http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/ampp3d/general-election-result-who-would-5659167

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #167 - May 12, 2015, 03:21 PM

    Bush wasn't too worried about a mandate during his 8 years in office, so I wouldn't really think too hard on that.

    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #168 - May 12, 2015, 03:22 PM

    Come to think of it, neither was Hitler.

    I'll get my coat.

    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #169 - May 12, 2015, 03:28 PM

    As I understand it Hitler had a huge mandate. In any case, he wasn't pretending to be head of a democratic state.
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #170 - May 12, 2015, 03:43 PM

    He was.

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #171 - May 12, 2015, 04:02 PM

    Being a mod has nothing to do with it, I've observed that about you long ago, and would've told you last week if the subject came up in time. If you want to say you've never personally insulted others on here in the past, I'm likely equally disheartened by you, but that's fine, if that's what you want to do. As for the variety comment, I'm aware, and that's why I've said abundantly in both of my comments to you that I quite like and appreciate your posts for the most part.

    I disagree that David's comment was grounds to mock him and call him ignorant. And, if you want to talk about assumptions, assuming his opinion came from a place of ignorance. And it was a bummer to see David get annoyed like that because, honestly, he's one of the most relaxed posters on here, and I understood why he took it the way he did.

    So, considering, I figured maybe if I honestly and calmly explained my observations to you as another member of the forum, you'd be willing to respect my opinion, and perhaps not try to use my mod status against me for it--but you know the rest. Grin If you don't want to take the advice, don't take it. Like I said, do your thing, and if this is how you think you'll get productive conversation, more power to you. But in this case, I just had to say something.


    Productive conversations like the one you're having with me? You are overreacting as I said before. I wish I hadn't replied to you or what you said.


    No free mixing of the sexes is permitted on these forums or via PM or the various chat groups that are operating.

    Women must write modestly and all men must lower their case.

    http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthread.php?425649-Have-some-Hayaa-%28modesty-shame%29-people!
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #172 - May 12, 2015, 04:04 PM

    He was.



    Ssssshhhhh!
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #173 - May 12, 2015, 04:13 PM

    Productive conversations like the one you're having with me? You are overreacting as I said before. I wish I hadn't replied to you or what you said.


    Hm? Productive? I suppose we can agree that unless I'm taking sides with you--which, again, I usually do--the conversation may not be, but I figure you and I disagree on any further details. Grin I wouldn't have bet on it being productive, but I did maintain hope you would take criticism in stride, even if you disagreed with it.
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #174 - May 12, 2015, 04:35 PM

    As I understand it Hitler had a huge mandate. In any case, he wasn't pretending to be head of a democratic state.


    He had a plurality his first election. I think he built a coalition, but to say he had a mandate would probably be stretching it.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_presidential_election,_1932

    Edit: Not even a plurality actually.

    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #175 - May 12, 2015, 04:39 PM

    Perhaps that is the case.

    No free mixing of the sexes is permitted on these forums or via PM or the various chat groups that are operating.

    Women must write modestly and all men must lower their case.

    http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthread.php?425649-Have-some-Hayaa-%28modesty-shame%29-people!
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #176 - May 19, 2015, 11:50 AM

    Defeat of Galloway

    Quote
    IN the 2015 British elections, Respect Party leader George Galloway, previous MP for Bradford West, lost his seat to a newcomer on the scene, Labour Party member Naseem (Naz) Shah, by a majority of over 11,000 votes. Galloway’s sexist behaviour towards his opponent, a British woman of Pakistani origin, brought about his political defeat and highlights the difficulties that Pakistani women, even in Western countries, face when entering the political field.

    Quote
    Galloway counted on the support of the socially conservative British-Pakistanis in Bradford to win this race. To appeal to their emotions, Galloway ran a “sexist smear campaign” against Naz Shah, where he said she lied that she was forced into an unwanted marriage at the age of 15. This sordid episode illustrates all too well that women’s personal and private lives are still public property, to be used as grounds to reject a woman no matter how well-qualified for the job she might be.


    Never one to shy away from controversy, Galloway was expelled in 2003 for bringing the Labour Party into ‘disrepute’ when he made statements against the British government about the lies Tony Blair told about Saddam Hussein and Iraq. He is the darling of many Muslims for his support of the Palestinian cause and opposition to the Gulf War. Yet his grandstanding is often seen as self-serving, rather than truly focused on achieving any concrete advances for his constituents.

    For political advantage, Galloway represents himself as a champion of the Muslims within the British political scene, calling out Israel for its barbarity and Western countries for their hypocrisy in their dealings with Muslim countries. In 2013 he came to give a keynote speech at the Karachi Literature Festival; Karachi’s elite fell all over themselves to listen to him give his usual statements about the duplicity of the West and the moral superiority of the Muslim world.

    Quote
    A smear campaign against did not keep Naz Shah from winning.

    When Naz Shah, the daughter of Pakistani immigrants to Bradford, was chosen by the Labour Party to contest the Bradford West elections, she wrote an open letter about her difficult childhood. Her father walked out on the family when she was six, leaving her mother for a 16-year-old neighbour. Aban­doned and destitute, her mother fell under the influence of an abusive drug dealer, and then went to jail for his subsequent murder.

    Shah herself was forced into marriage when she was not yet legally an adult, and suffered domestic violence too, finally taking her young children and leaving in order to carve out a life with some dignity and peace. She was inspired to stand for elections after becoming politically involved with women’s groups that campaigned for her mother’s release. With her first-hand knowledge of how women fall through the cracks of the government’s social service systems, she promised to bring change in an area where poverty, abuse and the ill-treatment of women are still grave issues.


    Her life brings to mind the tales of immigrants in Nadeem Aslam’s epic novel Maps for Lost Lovers, where Pakistanis live along the margins of mainstream British life, steeped in cultural constraints and trapped by honour-based social conventions. Yet Galloway accused Naz Shah not just of lying about her age at marriage, but of “reinforcing every bad stereotype about Pakistanis”. At a public meeting, Galloway dramatically announced that Shah had lied about her age, and that she was actually 16 when the marriage took place, brandishing what he claimed to be her ‘real’ marriage certificate. Galloway was later accused of having sent someone to pose as Shah’s father in order to get the certificate from the authorities in Pakistan.

    As Shah said, “What does my marriage have to do with Bradford West?” But Galloway clearly thought that this was enough ammunition to harm her chances of being elected. He thought that conservative British-Pakistanis would rather stand with him than support a divorced woman with so much ‘scandal’ in her life. He spoke about her in the most sexist terms possible, telling her to “stop barking”. Happily, Galloway’s calculations didn’t win out, and Naz Shah, in her post-election statement, told Galloway: “You have been sent on your way.”

    The defeat of George Galloway shows that voters recognised dragging Naz Shah’s past out to be judged and criticised as nothing more than a dirty political trick which had no real merit in the election. Naz Shah’s courageous rejection of Galloway’s sexist political smears and her victory at the polls should encourage Pakistani women both at home and abroad who want to become more politically involved. ..............

    well that is a good one on Gallaway.,  that is  from that never tiring always smiling Been Shah

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #177 - May 23, 2015, 01:18 PM

    Okay my jaw dropped to the ground when I found out that the conservatives have won. I was so flabbergasted. O_O

    TBH I really did not know who to vote for. It is was like picking your poison.
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #178 - May 23, 2015, 01:24 PM

    I would of been more surprised if they didn't. I knew I should have put a few quid on it.

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • UK Election 2015
     Reply #179 - May 23, 2015, 04:29 PM

    Really?  you're good then, I actually entertained some hope of a different outcome.  Grin


    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
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