Planning to marry a Muslim

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- INcePtion
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Reply #30 - July 08, 2014, 09:17 PM

Quote from: Jedi on July 08, 2014, 08:58 PM
It's not to the extent that Christians in this country do.

That's the difference.

@topic I agree with what the others said.
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Reply #31 - July 08, 2014, 09:31 PM

Quote from: Jedi on July 08, 2014, 08:55 PM
Put it in context, I was responding to people who said do not marry simply because she is Muslim and he is not and because the child being raised Muslim will have a detrimental effect on him. There's no evidence of this other then anecdotes.

If he doesn't want to be with then he should man up and make that decision.

Fair enough if that's all you meant. We can agree on the last part, but as for saying if he's in love just go for it, I will have to disagree given his circumstances.

He should be very sure that he can happily deal with her expectations of him. Then again, I was quite sure as well, and it's been more challenging than I thought it'd be, and it's not due to a shortage of love or compromise...
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Reply #32 - July 08, 2014, 09:38 PM

what love.. what marriage? the guy is in 3rd year college ..

Stop it... stop the game....

no marriage no talking until you guys get jobs....

Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything
I renounced my faith to become a kafir,
the beloved betrayed me and turned in to a Muslim
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Reply #33 - July 08, 2014, 09:44 PM

"I Knew who I was this morning, but I've changed a few times since then." Alice in wonderland

"This is the only heaven we have how dare you make it a hell" Dr Marlene Winell
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Reply #34 - July 08, 2014, 09:45 PM

yeezevee is giving some real advice. Slow down a bit, you don't want to rush this.

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. - Terry Pratchett
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Reply #35 - July 08, 2014, 09:48 PM

Then again I may have commitment issues. So don't read what I wrote, and go and have religiously confused babies. Wish you the best of luck.

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. - Terry Pratchett
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Reply #36 - July 08, 2014, 09:48 PM

Quote from: Jedi on July 08, 2014, 08:58 PM
You're wrong. There are many Muslims out there who don't take it literally, and some who may believe in the myths but it has no real impact on their life. There are also some that would say certain elements are metaphorical. It's not to the extent that Christians in this country do, but when I mentioned Christian I meant practising catholic Christian.

Still on average the practicing mainstream catholic Christian is far more liberal than the average practicing mainstream muslim.

If OP's potential wife's parents weren't intolerant fundamentalists she wouldn't need to ask him to pretend to be muslim infront of them.

In my opinion a life without curiosity is not a life worth living
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Reply #37 - July 08, 2014, 09:49 PM

Quote from: yeezevee on July 08, 2014, 09:38 PM
what love.. what marriage? the guy is in 3rd year college ..

Stop it... stop the game....

no marriage no talking until you guys get jobs....

Ya it seems like everyone forgot that not so little detail
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Reply #38 - July 08, 2014, 11:47 PM

Will agree with those saying you shouldn't do this, for all of the reasons mentioned already. Biggest thing is that there are examples of people already suffering through such an arrangement. It doesn't seem like it has much hope of ending out well in the long-term, and this is exactly the kind of commitment you guys are trying to create. Better to break it off sooner, and spare one another the hurt and pain.

Quote from: yeezevee on February 11, 2016, 02:05 PM
how fuck works without shit??

Let's Play Chess!

harakaat, friend, RIP
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Reply #39 - July 09, 2014, 02:00 AM

I just read that he's a third year college student. That means he's like only around twenty or so ?

If I recall correctly most people don't mentally mature until around 25. Early twenties is waay to young to be thinking about marriage...

In my opinion a life without curiosity is not a life worth living
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Reply #40 - July 09, 2014, 03:35 AM

Will take too long to reply to each piece of advice so thank you all for those who did. I'm 22, she's 20, and as far as age is concerned in relation to marriage, I guess a few years down the line would be better, but I did mention the pressure of my parents are immense and they already know about her and my intention to marry her. Another risk of breaking up with her would be my parents reaction.

It seems like I painted a bad picture of my relationship with her which was unintentional and totally nothing to do with the fact that I was currently in an argument with her

Some of you seem to have taken offense with what I said that she's great in that she'll do the things I don't like to do. This is actually something she always talks about, how that once we marry she can iron my clothes etc. They are trivial things really and I find myself liking her even more in that she would find so much enjoyment in doing these things for me. That's all I meant by this.

I can also add great listener, great under the bedsheets, and has motherly qualities that I also find very attractive about her, so I'm sorry for the bleak picture I painted about us.

I guess the problem only reallyy lies in raising my children. I did speak to her about this since my initial post and she really dislikes talking about my apostasy, it's something kept locked in the basement really.

The talk was good however and that I don't need to pretend to be a Muslim in front of them was the end product of our talk. I'm pretty sure that my children raised by a let's say very relaxed and modern Muslim and a father figure who doesn't associate himself with any religion will give them a whole lot more freedom than I ever had as a child.

Once again thanks for the great advice guys and I'm sorry about some of the misunderstandings I created. Let's hope she stays true to her word.

Should have stayed in. Read a book instead.
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Reply #41 - July 09, 2014, 03:37 AM

It might not happen right away, but when your children are born your wife won't even matter anymore. There is no question in my mind that most parents love their kids more than anyone or anything else on this or any other planet.
Do you want to lie to your children, and watch them become brainwashed? I don't think so. How are you going to feel about your wife, perpetuating a mythology to your children, as fact? Feelings change, and children change everything in a hot minute.
When it is a daughter, you really have to decide what is best for her future. Do you want her to grow up in Islam?

Don't let Hitler have the street.
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Reply #42 - July 09, 2014, 03:46 AM

Saying my wife won't matter at all? Wow that's a bit of jump isn't it.

I'm also pretty confident that I can keep the concept of hell away from the child as long as possible. That's one big factor, a deal breaker if you will in what I'll allow my wife to teach them.

Should have stayed in. Read a book instead.
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Reply #43 - July 09, 2014, 04:08 AM

Quote from: Nas on July 09, 2014, 03:35 AM
I did speak to her about this since my initial post and she really dislikes talking about my apostasy, it's something kept locked in the basement really.

Red flag. You really sure you want to get married to someone who feels uncomfortable with a part of who you are as a person ?

In my opinion a life without curiosity is not a life worth living
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Reply #44 - July 09, 2014, 04:38 AM

What jumped out at me was you saying (if I remember correctly) that she would want you to not only keep up a pretence for her parents, that's not a big deal, but that if you have children you'll have to lie to them and keep up a pretence every day, pretend to be someone you're not and raise them that way. That's what jumped out at me, hence me saying you need to have a chat with her and if possible come to an agreement that you'll both tell them what you do and don't believe and why, answer them honestly if they have questions, and let them grow up to decide for themselves.

Like I said yesterday, I really would advice you to have this conversation with her.

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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Reply #45 - July 09, 2014, 04:47 AM

It sounds to me like you've more or less made up your mind, Nas. I really do hope everything works out well for both of you. I agree with TDR, that's a huge red flag, but if you're set on pressing on, that's all there is to it. Do try to resist the pressure to get married immediately if you can, and make sure you both put everything on the table beforehand.
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Reply #46 - July 09, 2014, 06:31 AM

I echo Quod's view, ugh. More so will you present the implications that spiritually you and your children could be separated for eternity beyond the mortal lifespan. That there is a possibility that of their father will be in Hell as an unbeliever. Will you also introduce the idea that God and religion are merely paragons and social based rituals humans constructs?
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Reply #47 - July 09, 2014, 06:33 AM

We've had a lot of ex Muslims on this site who had good Muslim partners just like yours. They also said they knew of their apostasy, that they were accepting, but were in general uncomfortable to talk about it (omg RED FLAG if anything). They all ended up messy, because people promise a lot before marriage, but when you're there and it really matters, things change. What makes you think that your case will be that unique one that ends up with a happy Disney ending? I'm interested, because I suspect you may not have thought about that much.

I can just speak to you as a woman. I also had no problems with catering to my man, but I asked him for everything a MUSLIM man should do in return. You not goin to the masjid, you not conforming (will you?) to the typical Muslim male role model etc, will create resentment sooner or later. It did for me. And every single Muslim I've met or heard of became much more religious and devout as soon as they got married and had kids. Don't know how much she practices Islam now, but you will have to be prepared for all it entails at one point as it's a possibility.

Also, dude, 23 years? Take it from someone who married young. Don't do it. Wait a couple of years more, at least till you 25-26. Believe me. You will thank yourself later if you do.

"The healthiest people I know are those who are the first to label themselves fucked up." - three
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Reply #48 - July 09, 2014, 06:41 AM

Quote from: Nas on July 09, 2014, 03:35 AM

Some of you seem to have taken offense with what I said that she's great in that she'll do the things I don't like to do. This is actually something she always talks about, how that once we marry she can iron my clothes etc. They are trivial things really and I find myself liking her even more in that she would find so much enjoyment in doing these things for me. That's all I meant by this.

I can also add great listener, great under the bedsheets, and has motherly qualities that I also find very attractive about her, so I'm sorry for the bleak picture I painted about us.

I still don't think the picture you paint of her is much better here to be quite frank. It's so archaic it's not even funny.

You have nothing in common with her which is what you said, no shared interests or anything.

Your good qualities you mention about her are that she wants to cater to you, iron your clothes, is great in the sack, and is a mumsy type figure.

All in all, I kind of feel quite sorry for her, for only being valued for how well she fits some ridiculous feminine ideal.

Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
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Reply #49 - July 09, 2014, 07:42 AM

I think you want to marry her bc you think you will never find another girl that loves you like that and also bc of your parents but that is not a good reason for why you love her. Is it really love?

I wouldnt want my kids if I decide to have any anywhere near Islam.

Work on your confidence and know that there are a lot of beautiful girls out there who have things in common with you and can make you happy. Thats whats important. Dont worry about your parents bc they're arnt marrying the girl you are. You gotta live with that the rest of your life so chill.

Also, someone who is romantically obsessed is never healthy usually those kinds of people are quick to later on dismiss you when before it was OMG I LOVE YOU SOOOOO MUCH, you know the type.

You gotta have the fundamentals of a relationship down and I dont see that here. Your worldviews have to be similar on the core beliefs for it to succeed.

Also, remember Islam is not like Christainity or Judaism where couples get married and are liberal. Islam controls every aspect of your life and requests absolute compliance you cant say you dont believe in the quran being the word of god and get away with being a muslim while christians and jews can. Also consider family members who will think it their right to pass on Islam and certain cultural ideas that you might not support will your girl back you or back them?

Find an ex muslim, or a non muslim most muslims even the so called "moderate" ones get fanatical about the core beliefs of Islam.

Oh my Christopher Hitchens its a fihrrrrrrrrrrrr
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Reply #50 - July 09, 2014, 08:35 AM

^ ^ lol i never thought of it that way.. clothes presser, motherly, great in bed, great listener what more does a man want in life : )

I married young too, can't have regrets but i think it is best to wait until you are a bit older to get married, it takes a few years to get to know yourself and what you want in life : ) i still don't lol xxx
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Reply #51 - July 09, 2014, 09:07 AM

Quote from: lua on July 09, 2014, 04:47 AM
It sounds to me like you've more or less made up your mind, Nas. I really do hope everything works out well for both of you. I agree with TDR, that's a huge red flag, but if you're set on pressing on, that's all there is to it. Do try to resist the pressure to get married immediately if you can, and make sure you both put everything on the table beforehand.

What Lua said

Also in my honest opinion it seems you are looking through rose colored glasses and painting a reality you think will happen instead of facing the possibilities of whaat could actually explode in your face. Personally I think you are very young and need to really think about it objectively and if then you still want to go on then good for you

In any case we all have to learn our own lessons at the end of the day

"I Knew who I was this morning, but I've changed a few times since then." Alice in wonderland

"This is the only heaven we have how dare you make it a hell" Dr Marlene Winell
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Reply #52 - July 09, 2014, 09:19 AM

Quote from: confusedagno on July 09, 2014, 09:07 AM
What Lua said

...........it seems you are looking through rose colored glasses and painting a reality ..............

No.. he is not looking through rose colored glasses., the guy is just looking for some girl who can Iron his clothes, clean dishes and cook some tasty food . And..and Do bit of work what his mother used to do when he was a little boy...

you guys are wasting too much time on Nas's simple problem

Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything
I renounced my faith to become a kafir,
the beloved betrayed me and turned in to a Muslim
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Reply #53 - July 09, 2014, 09:25 AM

Lol true, sounds like what my ex husband wanted, meanwhile I wanted an actual partner

"I Knew who I was this morning, but I've changed a few times since then." Alice in wonderland

"This is the only heaven we have how dare you make it a hell" Dr Marlene Winell
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Reply #54 - July 09, 2014, 11:32 AM

I'm sorry but Berberella you seem to be mistaking my gf for someone who she really isn't. Yes, so I like those traditional female stereotypes present in a woman, sue me? I also like lots of other qualities in a woman that aren't so womanly which she doesn't have, which is where the we 'don't have much in common' part comes in. Just because I listed some feminine qualities that I like doesn't suddenly make me a Victorian. Those aren't the only qualities I want, but I'm glad she has them.

I'm just as willing to do the dirty work for her, I just don't go telling her it as much as she does to me.

No need to feel sorry for her but she has pride in those qualities more than I admire them.

And the nothing in common part, well I've made some small changed I guess to that. Such as introducing her to some of my dramas and shows. A lot of my movies, she has now seen. She is exposed to football on a daily basis, she has yet to share these interests yet, becasue it's not like she would now watch a football match without me or choose Goodfellas over Dear John on a movie night. On the plus side, she does like my Radiohead CD's.

Yeah, I'm being a huge optimist in all of this,and you all are quite pessimistic which is obvious cos most of you have gone through the heartbreak, I haven't.

Should have stayed in. Read a book instead.
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Reply #55 - July 09, 2014, 11:39 AM

I really think you should re-think again why you think your particular case will be any different than any other we have read on the forum before. Exactly what is different with you that will make your marriage to end up with a happy ending, while every other person who has been, or still is in a similar marriage, are more or less miserable.

And really, I couldn't care less about what type of relationship you have (she catering to you, whatever). Because it's really none of our business. But it's just worrying that you think you will be happy with having a devout wife who 1. doesn't even want to discuss your apostasy when brought up with the intention to discuss your future marriage 2. wants you to fake in front of your future children (wtf man?!). Your wife's attitude and reaction sounds very similar to some I've read on this forum and on other forums as well... and they ended up with resentment and the ex-Muslim asking himself if it really was worth it...

But as someone said, it seems you've already made up your mind. I wish you the best.

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Reply #56 - July 09, 2014, 11:49 AM

Come on girls, if I was that type of guy, why would I be starting this thread? I listed a few things that I like about our relationship, that doesn't mean that's all I care about. Once again, I wouldn't be here if that was the case.

...and by motherly qualities I don't mean cooking at all, whoever it was who decided to put words into my mouth. She's a terrible cook actually, I'll be doing the cooking if anything.

------------------------
Oh so silly of me, we both study Psychology! There's a huuuuge interest we share. As a matter of fact, we both want to move into the same field of Psychology later on in life when it comes to picking a career.

Should have stayed in. Read a book instead.
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Reply #57 - July 09, 2014, 11:50 AM

Guyss, I just posted last night that we had this conversation and she no longer cares if I keep up appearances in front of our children! I guess I didn't make myself clear enough. That is one barrier I'm over. The biggest one, in fact.

Should have stayed in. Read a book instead.
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Reply #58 - July 09, 2014, 12:32 PM

Good to hear.

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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Reply #59 - July 09, 2014, 01:15 PM

we were only joking about the ironing and cooking etc...(so get practising) You sound like a smart guy...

if this is really what you want and it feels right then go for it... I wish you both well.. !!!! (not that it matters what we think lol)

xxxxxxx
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