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Theme Changer

 Topic: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right

 (Read 17930 times)
  • 12 3 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     OP - August 15, 2011, 11:18 AM

    15 August 2011

    A new report by One Law for All explores how the far-Right has attempted to hijack opposition to Islamism for its own ends. It focuses on the British National Party, the English Defence League and Stop Islamisation of Europe/America, and exposes how their activities, associations, opinions and intentions reveal a racist and inhuman worldview, which must be resisted and criticised with as much vigilance as Islamism itself. See report here

    Enemies Not Allies features:

    - Evidence of the BNP’s relationship with neo-Nazi and ‘white’ supremacist groups and individuals, including Blood & Honour, Combat 18 and former Klansman David Duke.

    - Proof that the BNP’s leadership believe Islamism is ‘the threat that can bring [them] to power’, and examples of how they have tried to use it for political gain.

    - Evidence of how senior BNP members have praised the National Front, applauded acts of violence and expressed ‘nostalgia’ for ‘Germany in the 1930s’, while its election candidates have made racist comments and fought with Asian youths.

    - Interviews with former members of the English Defence League who left due its bigotry and racism towards Muslims, which they believe is endemic and ‘increasing’.

    - Evidence of EDL spokespeople, including leader Tommy Robinson and Guramit Singh, making racist and bigoted comments, as well as justifying or endorsing violence.

    - A history of the umbrella group Stop the Islamisation of Europe and evidence of its racism and bigotry, as well as its collaboration with European neo-Nazis.

    - Evidence of Stop Islamisation of Europe/America’s racist and alarmist literature and its promulgation of conspiracy theories.

    - Documentation of Stop the Islamisation of Europe’s defence of and support for Serbian fascists and war criminals, including Stop Islamisation of America’s explicit denial of the 1995 Srebrenica genocide.

    The recent massacre in Norway carried out by Anders Behring Breivik, (who praised the groups discussed in this report), has placed a spotlight on the new ‘Islamisation’ and ‘Crusader’ strain within far-Right politics, and the groups and individuals who promote its conspiratorial worldview. One Law for All’s new report by Adam Barnett and Maryam Namazie provides crucial evidence for the struggles ahead, and argues for greater care in distinguishing between allies and enemies.

    NOTES:

    1. The report can be downloaded free of charge or a paperback copy purchased from One Law for All for £8.50. To purchase the book or donate to the work of One Law for All, please either send a cheque to our address below or pay via Paypal by visiting: Donate Page.

    2. The One Law for All Campaign was launched on 10 December 2008, International Human Rights Day, to call on the UK Government to recognise that Sharia and religious courts are arbitrary and discriminatory against women and children in particular and that citizenship and human rights are non-negotiable.

    3. For further information contact:
    Maryam Namazie
    Anne Marie Waters
    Spokespersons
    One Law for All
    BM Box 2387
    London WC1N 3XX, UK
    Tel: +44 (0) 7719166731
    onelawforall@gmail.com
    www.onelawforall.org.uk
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #1 - August 15, 2011, 11:20 AM

    One comment posted on the OLFA page:

    secularist
    Posted August 15, 2011 at 10:19 AM
    hi. what you wrote is coward and stupid. One can be a bad muslim or a bad person – not both. if one follows quran one is bad person, one discriminates against women, other religions, etc. If one thinks that quran doesn’t demand all that – one is plain stupid. One can’t be muslim and secular at the same time, as you try to pretend to be. Yes, devout muslims is a danger for our societies. And you have proven that by your post. You support your muslim identity above the values of the society you live in. And who will thank you for this, but your revengeful god and his pedofile messenger?
    One more note – don’t put together people who support freedom and neo-Nazis like BNP. By this cowardice you just weaken your cause – no one will stand for you except them, not sleazy politicians and not still ignorant and chauvinistic public for whom you try to appease by this post.

    Hope you be well and without sharia,
    Yours.
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #2 - August 15, 2011, 11:21 AM

    Another email sent to Maryam in reply to the article:

    Nationalism is the ONLY answer to the anti Christian forces invading our country. 
     
    I oppose all things Islamic as I believe it is Satan inspired, but also disagree whith your blinkered outlook.
     
     
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #3 - August 15, 2011, 11:24 AM

     I had been waiting for this since I heard the Norway deaths, knowing these issues needed to be addressed, well better late than never. Afro
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #4 - August 15, 2011, 11:24 AM

    One lady was so angry with what Maryam wrote she emailed Robert Spencer:


    Subject: Maryam Namazie's Report on Far-Right Enemies

    Message:
    http://www.onelawforall.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/Enemies-not-Allies-web-version1.pdf

    Dear Robert,

    The link about is to Ms. Namazie's report just sent to those,
    including me, who are on a mailing list of hers.

    I am sending it to you because of my concern in having read her
    labelling SIOA as a far-right, racist organisation and then
    cherry-picking a quote of yours (which I have yet to verify) as
    evidence of your "racist agenda."

    I hope you will rebut her claims.

    Sincerely,
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #5 - August 15, 2011, 11:24 AM

    Robert Spencer's reply:
     
    I just checked the quote. How exactly is that racist? What race is Islam? What I am saying in the quote is that the "extremists" are not one sect and the "moderates" another, such that they go to different mosques and have no truck with one another. In fact, they are all mixed up together, as numerous jihad plots in the US show -- the jihadist turns out to have attended a local mosque, which quickly disavows him. This is simply a fact. What exactly is either false or racist about that?
     
    In fact Namazie is a racist antisemite, who despite her posturing about opposing the jihad, aids and abets the jihad against Israel: http://maryamnamazie.blogspot.com/2008/12/stop-genocide-perpetrated-by-israeli.html
     
    Her attack on genuine anti-jihadists is just false flag hypocrisy.
     
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #6 - August 15, 2011, 11:25 AM

    Good report.


    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #7 - August 15, 2011, 11:25 AM

    Robert Spencer emails Maryam:

    Maryam Namazie: You discredit yourself by placing SIOA/SIOE, which eschews and denounces racism of any form, in league with the racist, neofascist and antisemitic BNP. Our "racist and inhuman worldview," as you put it, consists of defending the freedom of speech, the freedom of conscience, and the equality of rights for all people, including libelous character assassins like yourself. I hereby challenge you to substantiate your charges, or withdraw them and issue a public apology.
     
    Cordially
    Robert Spencer
     
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #8 - August 15, 2011, 11:27 AM

    Posted on Jihadwatch:

    http://www.jihadwatch.org/2011/08/maryam-namazie-antisemitic-supporter-of-jihad-against-israel-claims-to-be-anti-jihad-lies-about-spen.html

    Maryam Namazie, antisemitic supporter of jihad against Israel, claims to be anti-jihad, lies about Spencer, Geller, SIOA
    The One Law For All Campaign has published a new monograph, "Enemies not Allies: The Far-Right"


    (pdf here), which is essentially a hit piece on me, Pamela Geller, SIOA, SIOE, and several groups that we have never had anything to do with, such as the BNP, which we have consistently denounced.

    Not coincidentally, One Law For All is headed up by Maryam Namazie, a Marxist antisemite who claims to be anti-jihad but actually has attacked Israel and spread Palestinian jihad propaganda on numerous occasions. An anti-jihadist who doesn't support the country on the front lines of the global jihad? Pull my other leg.

    In the new report, Namazie includes one quote from me that has long circulated, and misrepresents its meaning -- and in light of the intense demonization that is going on lately, I thought it worthwhile to clarify it. This is the quote:

    ‘There is no distinction in the American Muslim community between peaceful Muslims and jihadists. While Americans prefer to imagine that the vast majority of American Muslims are civic-minded patriots who accept wholeheartedly the parameters of American pluralism, this proposition has actually never been proven.’ - Robert Spencer, Stop Islamization of America
    The report adds:

    The group’s American branch, currently run by Pamela Geller and Robert Spencer, was set up by SIOE’s leadership. In 2010 Spencer defended his and Geller’s ‘colleague’ Joseph John Jay, who had recommended the ‘wholesale slaughter’ of Muslim civilians, including children. Spencer has also written that there is ‘no distinction’ between American Muslims and Jihadists, and explained that Muslims must prove their innocence or else be considered guilty. Pamela Geller’s web log has featured conspiratorial articles regarding the President of America’s religion, his family, his sexual history, and the circumstances of his birth. Geller and Spencer have also defended Serbian war criminals.
    John Jay does not actually have any role in or position with SIOA, but be that as it may, the report is lying about him. In reality, he has written, in his inimitable fashion, "i do not advocate carte blanche killing one’s liberal relative, nor all muslims. to assert differently is a lie."

    Likewise false is the claim that "Spencer has also written that there is ‘no distinction’ between American Muslims and Jihadists, and explained that Muslims must prove their innocence or else be considered guilty."

    This is based on the quote from me above. Yet not only is that not what the quote means, but I have said just the opposite. See, to take one of many examples, here, where I say, in connection with mosques getting extra police protection, "This is a nation of laws, not vigilantes, and the principle of innocent until proven guilty still holds and must hold." And here, where I said that "everyone is innocent until proven guilty" and "many Muslims are not on board with this supremacist program."

    What I am saying in the quote is that the "extremists" are not one sect and the "moderates" another, such that they go to different mosques and have no truck with one another. In fact, they are all mixed up together, as numerous jihad plots in the US show -- the jihadist turns out to have attended a local mosque, which quickly disavows him. This is simply a fact. What exactly is either false or racist about that?

    As for the smears of Pamela Geller regarding Obama, and of Pamela and me regarding defending Serbian war criminals, Pamela Geller ably answers them here, and I have more on the Serbs and related matters here. For dishonest people and jihad-supporters, opposition to the jihad in the Balkans and skepticism about some of the charges made of Serbian war crimes equals support for Serbian war crimes. That is absurd and baseless.

    In reality, all we stand for and have ever stood for are the principles of the freedom of speech, the freedom of conscience, and equality of rights for all people.

    If Maryam Namazie's One Law For All claims to oppose the jihad while attacking anti-jihadists and supporting the genocidal jihad against Israel, then it is simply a false-flag operation. Maryam Namazie and One Law For All are no more anti-jihad than Hassan Nasrallah.
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #9 - August 15, 2011, 11:29 AM


    Someone needs to tell Robert Spencer that if you advocate for the EDL, don't be surprised if people question your judgment.

    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #10 - August 15, 2011, 11:33 AM

    This is good publicity for us and the fact that Roberts Spencer. jihadwatch, SIOE/A hate us, shows we're on the right track - I would be seriously worried if these scumbags in anyway agreed with us on anything.

    I'm also glad that if anyone who thought CEMB and Spencer/Geller's mob were in any small way associated or on the same page - will now see the reality.

    Those who find that a problem - good!
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #11 - August 15, 2011, 11:44 AM

    What I am saying in the quote is that the "extremists" are not one sect and the "moderates" another, such that they go to different mosques and have no truck with one another.


    He's a lying fuck! No truck with one another? Yeah lump all Muslims in one boat. While we're at it Baruch Goldstein also attended regular Synagogues with ordinary Jews - obviously then ordinary Jews and Synagogues are complicit in Baruch Goldstein's massacre of 29 worshippers at a Mosque in Hebron.

    This is an example of the Spencer mobs most mischievous propaganda effort. Islam and Muslims are not one homogenous entity - and to portray them as such is to portray all Muslims as a "Fifth Column" - which is of course what they want to do - because despite Spencer's protests they are a bigoted group who just hate Muslims and want to push their own bigoted agenda.
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #12 - August 15, 2011, 12:07 PM

    I have never liked Robert Spencer. Hassan if its ok could you post Maryams answer to Robert Spencer mail?

    "Beauty is truth, truth beauty," - that is all
            Ye know on earth, and all ye need to know.

    - John Keats
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #13 - August 15, 2011, 12:15 PM


    This is an example of the Spencer mobs most mischievous propaganda effort. Islam and Muslims are not one homogenous entity - and to portray them as such is to portray all Muslims as a "Fifth Column"


    The problem with the Jihadwatch / FFI types is that they deal with the issues on the terms of the Islamists. The zero sum, devoid of nuance assertions that they make are of a piece with how the Ummah Identity Politics, and Islamists view the world. They view Muslims as a single, undifferentiated mass without individuation, they assert various degrees of sectarian reckoning that segue into notions of collective responsibility, they assert binary / manichean ways of looking at the world.

    Literalism begets literalism here.


    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #14 - August 15, 2011, 01:16 PM

    I have never liked Robert Spencer. Hassan if its ok could you post Maryams answer to Robert Spencer mail?


    Will do when she responds to him.
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #15 - August 15, 2011, 01:38 PM

    Hassan... come to the states for the 2012 election.

    The far right is looking at a friggin mormon for prez lol

    When one door of happiness closes, another opens; but often we look so long at the closed door that we do not see the one which has been opened for us.
    Helen Keller
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #16 - August 15, 2011, 02:12 PM

    OK I want to post this as a reply to Robert Spencer on jihadwatch. I've just scribbled it down and would like anyone to suggest changes:

    My name is Hassan and I am an Ex-Muslim and a member of the Council of Ex-Muslims. I congratulate Maryam for making a clear distinction between our stand against the Islamists on the one hand and your position and that of Pam Geller and groups like SIOE/A on the other.

    I find it amusing how you throw "Anti-Semite" at her much like some Muslims throw "Islamophobe" at anyone who dares criticise Islam, simply because she criticised Israel's tactics during the invasion of Gaza. It seems you have the attitude of anyone criticising Israel's political and military policies is an anti-semite. Just as some Muslims have the attitude that anyone criticising Islam hates Muslims.

    But worse than this your saying that moderates have "no truck" with extremists. I was Muslim most of my life, (I am 52) and my family and friends are Muslim and to imply that I never had - nor Muslims in general have - any problem with people who massacre innocent civilians or behead innocent people is deeply offensive to me. Do you also think the Synagogues and Jews Baruch Goldstein prayed with had "No truck" with him massacring 29 worshippers at a Mosque in Hebron? I suspect not. I guess guilt by association only applies to Muslims - right?

    Unlike you, Maryam and CEMB don't lump all Muslims (or any religious believers) in one boat, nor do we see Islam as a single homogenous entity. We were Muslims and we know about Islam and Muslims very well and have a much better understanding of the issues we face than you. Although we don't believe in Islam, we have no problem with Muslims who wish to follow their own interpretations of Islam so long as they are peaceful and do not try to impose their beliefs on others. Just as we have no problem with those of other faiths who follow it peacefully.

    We are only against the Islamists and harsh, literalist and violent interpretations of Islam and those who seek to impose it on others.

    Contrary to what you may think there is no such thing as "True Islam". There are many different traditions and interpretations and many personal versions of Islam that differ from Muslim to Muslim.

    Of course every Muslim will tell you there is a "True Islam" and it just so happens to be the version they follow. But it is obvious they would say that since they are compelled to preserve the integrity of a religion they believe is revealed by God. But those of us who do not believe that Islam was the carefully planned work of an Omniscient and Omnipotent Creator, but the rather less carefully planned work of the human mind, are under no obligation to defend it's integrity and consistency against all reason, when it is obvious that Muslims have very differing interpretations.

    Even when one looks solely at the basic sources - the Qur'an and Hadith - it is clear that what Muhammad himself did and said varied at different points of his lifetime and according to the circumstances and each group is selective in how they interpret them.  Nor is Abrogation - that you love to bring as evidence of the harsh verses superseding the peaceful one - as simple and straightforward as you make it out to be.

    Anyone with the slightest knowledge of abrogation will know it creates more anomalies than it solves, and today huge numbers of Muslims reject the idea completely - as I did when I was a Muslim.

    Regardless of how you or I wish to define Islam - it is not up to us but those who call themselves Muslims. I would no more impose my view that Christianity clearly considers homosexuality a sin, on a Christian who does not regard it as a sin - than I would impose my view that the Qur'an clearly allows a man to hit his wife on a Muslim who interprets; "Hit" as; "Leave her alone" - regardless of how absurd I may think those views to be.

    We stand against Political Islam and the Islamists who hold harsh and violent views and who have a political agenda to impose Islam and Islamic Laws on others.

    I agree that until the Islamists are defeated, it is extremely difficult for ordinary Muslims to live their lives according to their own 'personal Islam', and this is one reason we fight this battle, for all humanity - including Muslims themselves - who are the greatest victims of the Islamists.

    I find it perverse that people like you want to convince everyone - including Muslims - that moderate forms of Islam are wrong and that the true version is the terrorists' version and that Muslims that appear moderate are just practising "Taqiyyah".

    Of course I realise it is because you need to justify your agenda towards Muslims in general. To convince the public that ordinary Muslims are in league with the terrorists, they cannot be trusted and harsh and restrictive measures must be imposed on them all.

    Even though you say you are against violence against Muslims it is clear from the sorts of people you attract and quote you, that your words have given great encouragement to those who do want to justify violence and aggression against ordinary Muslims.

    You need to look closely at yourself and the the consequences of some of the things you say and the sorts of people supporting you - if you truly care about humanity.
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #17 - August 15, 2011, 02:21 PM

    Good luck with getting any kind of reasonable debate in response to your post there.


    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #18 - August 15, 2011, 02:38 PM

    ^^^Yeah. I'm just happy the various important distinctions in the politics of CEMB and right wing neo-con nutbags is being emphasised.

    Focusing on your response, Hassan. It seems Maryam's opposition to Israel's wholesale slaughter tactics (which is what they were) in Gaza are a focal point here so that issue should be thoroughly adddressed, which is where the accusations of 'anti-semite' are stemming from. It seems these idiots have adopted the political correct attitude of anyone criticising Israel's political and military policies is effectively antisemitic.

    "The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims. The most perfect slaves are, therefore, those which blissfully and unawaredly enslave themselves."
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #19 - August 15, 2011, 02:45 PM

    OK added a bit - don't want to go on too long lol
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #20 - August 15, 2011, 02:47 PM

    I would leave off or change the part about justifying hate with the taqiyyah.  Not because I disagree with it but because it will add to his victimhood complex.  He'll say ' they think I hate all Muslims because I speak the truth about taqiyyah see verse X Y Z and here are some saying from X extremist saying D, E, F. See I'm right they want to smear me!!!"

    So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
    My political philosophy below
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
    Just kidding, here are some true heros
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #21 - August 15, 2011, 02:51 PM

    I'd leave the last line out.

    It's a bit snide, and detracts from the clarity of your arguments.
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #22 - August 15, 2011, 02:55 PM

    I modified it a bit - is it better?
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #23 - August 15, 2011, 02:56 PM

    I'd leave the last line out.

    It's a bit snide, and detracts from the clarity of your arguments.


    Yes, your right - done!
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #24 - August 15, 2011, 03:08 PM

    OK Posted it:

    http://www.jihadwatch.org/2011/08/maryam-namazie-antisemitic-supporter-of-jihad-against-israel-claims-to-be-anti-jihad-lies-about-spen.html
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #25 - August 15, 2011, 03:14 PM

    Skim read it, good report.  Afro
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #26 - August 15, 2011, 03:18 PM

    I'm pretty sure Spencer will take note of your post Hassan.  Afro
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #27 - August 15, 2011, 03:29 PM

    His reply was rather good, apart from the snide last line.
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #28 - August 15, 2011, 03:38 PM

    Robert Spencer's reply to my post:

    Hassan:

    Your organization appears to be deeply dishonest: once again you misrepresent my positions.

    I have never said there is a "true Islam," and challenge you to produce a quotation from me to the contrary. In fact, you will find many denials from me of just what you claim I affirm.

    And as for the "no truck" business, you completely misunderstand it, whether willfully or not, I do not know. But again: what I meant was that there is no institutional distinction, so jihadis move freely in Muslim circles among those who oppose them and claim to do so. This is a manifest fact, but does not mean that there are no Muslims who oppose jihad and Islamic supremacism, which is what you apparently take it to mean.

    I have never advocated any kind of violence or illegal activity, and challenge you to find any quotation from me to the contrary.

    I stand by my charge of antisemitism in your repetition of false jihadist propaganda against Israel.

    If your organization had any decency or interest in truth, you would retract your charges against me, Geller, and SIOA/SIOE. But I do not think that you will, because I know what you are.

    Cordially
    Robert Spencer
  • Re: Enemies Not Allies: The Far-Right
     Reply #29 - August 15, 2011, 03:43 PM

    Quote
    ...because I know what you are.


    Yeah, take that, Hassan, ya big taqiyyah-practicing stealth jihadist  Tongue
  • 12 3 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »