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 Topic: Riots in London

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  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #330 - August 11, 2011, 12:10 PM

    So... we came through Enfield at around 12 last night while coming home from my grandparents' in Chingford. I don't think I've ever seen the pavements so empty, apart from the odd lot of guys with more testosterone than even I have marching down the streets looking for rioters to riot back at (or whatever that guy who was swearing into the Sky News camera was saying). It was kinda spooky, but I guess better than watching things being smashed/set on fire/etc.

    Also, have you guys heard the rumours about the burqa-clad robber with her accomplices? My mum says I'm not to open the door to any burqa wearers, which is probably not very Muslim of her.  whistling2

    "It's all witticisms until someone loses an eye."
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #331 - August 11, 2011, 12:14 PM

    Apparently Sikhs were guarding a mosque while Pakistani (punjabi) Muslims were prying trevi inside, and then I'm watching sangat.tv and I see a whole Punjabi of sikhs defending a temple, and someone asks: "do you think you'll be able to protect the gudwara" and some Punjabi Muslim dude shouts from the back: "Inshallah! Allukbar!" and am thinking "WTF?" 
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #332 - August 11, 2011, 01:26 PM

    ^^ how ironic that sikhs were protecting mosques from getting burnt when muslims think sikhs will burn in hell for eternity
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #333 - August 11, 2011, 02:35 PM

    i don't think a few gentlemanly Sikh people gurading a couple of mosques/temples prevented race rioting - although it was a heck of a nice gesture. i think all the community, the muslim community, the black community and all other ethnic groups realised that race rioting would be completely and utterly senseless in the context of the current riots. i think a lot of credit in particular should go to the muslim community for not looking to seek any 'revenge' attacks. i think the father of one of the the victims played a large hand in that though. just hope it stays this way.

    ''we are morally and philisophically in the best position to win the league'' - Arsene Wenger
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #334 - August 11, 2011, 02:38 PM

    lol, finally some unity between Sikhs and Muslims....'Dont trust whitey' ,lol  Cheesy
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #335 - August 11, 2011, 03:50 PM



    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/8693842/London-riots-BBC-apologises-for-accusing-Darcus-Howe.html

    ''we are morally and philisophically in the best position to win the league'' - Arsene Wenger
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #336 - August 11, 2011, 03:56 PM

    News article; says Slaying of 3 Muslims lays bare divisions on that LONDON riots..


    from left, Haroon Jahan, Shazad Ali and Abdul Musavir who were killed when a car crashed into them on Tuesday, Aug. 9, 2011, as they protected their community from looters in Birmingham, England

    Quote
    BIRMINGHAM: With police nowhere to be seen, the Muslims of Dudley Road armed themselves with bricks and stones, clubs and cricket bats to fend off carloads of marauding gangs.

    Their vigilante stand in Birmingham's west end saved a humble row of family-run shops and a red-brick mosque from the looters but at a terrible cost.

    Quote
    A carload of rioters sped into a fleeing crowd of shop defenders, witnesses said, hurling three young men into the air and killing amateur boxer Haroon Jahan, 21, and brothers Shazad Ali, 30, and Abdul Musavir, 31.

    We all had stones in our hands. But we had no defence to stop a car. They revved their engines and drove right at us as fast as they coul; Mohammed Ibrahim, 23, told The Associated Press. These black men deliberately tried to kill us all.


    Wednesday 1 am slaughter has laid bare racial tensions underlying this weeks riots in Birmingham, Britain  ;second-largest city and its most ethnically diverse. A fifth of the city's 1 million , Brummies are Muslims, most commonly of Pakistani origin. About 7 per cent are black, mostly Caribbean, in background.

    Quote
    While the riots that have swept England this week have involved looters of every creed and hue, the street anarchy also sometimes has exposed the racial fault lines that run beneath the poorest urban quarters.

    Resident after resident of Dudley Road and its surrounding Winson Green district commented pointedly to The AP that the attackers were black and accused them of targeting Muslim shops.

    The passions echo streetfights from previous years, such as in 2005, when a neighbouring Birmingham district suffered two nights of violence between Caribbean and Asian gangs over unsubstantiated rumours that a gang of Pakistani men had raped a 14-year-old Jamaican girl. Two men were stabbed to death, firefighters faced machete-wielding mobs, and Muslim graves were desecrated during those clashes. The west side also suffered riots in 1981, 1985 and 1991 fueled by minority hatred of white police and black resentment of the Asians  ;dominant position as shopkeepers.

    Quote
    We will hunt down these black men, cut off their heads and feed them to our dogs; said Amir Hawid, 20, who lives just a hundred yards (meters) from the killing scene and heard the screams of the crowd at the moment of impact.

    As forensics specialists combed the bloodied, rock-strewn pavement for clues, hundreds of local Muslims and Sikhs., some wearing ceremonial daggers at their waists; packed into a community hall Wednesday to confront three white police commanders who had come seeking to calm tensions. Twice as many Muslims, many in robes and kufi caps, stood outside.


    Speaker after speaker complained that they had pleaded by phone for police protection the previous night, when black gangs raided local markets and chased bar staff onto the roof of one pub, yet police failed to respond. Some argued that the police had warned them not to attempt to defend their own streets, yet had offered no alternative...........


    yes.. yes.. We will hunt down these black men, cut off their heads and feed them to our dogs; ...,

     I was wondering who were these rioters and what the problem is.. ;The link gives some answers..

    So it is BROWN verses BLACK RACISM.. Huh!?? No.. EDL here??  London Sounds Like Idi Amin Uganda ., Off course SOME Rascals from Indian subcontinent with out doubt BIGGEST RACISTS DICK HEADS ON THIS EARTH..

    Freedom of Expression is a Fundamental Right  
    Release The bloggers from Jails.  Protect The Bloggers from  Baboons
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #337 - August 11, 2011, 04:25 PM

    lol, finally some unity between Sikhs and Muslims....'Dont trust whitey' ,lol  Cheesy



    Nothing to do with whitey. The tensions in that part of the city are between 'Asians' and black Afro-Carribeans. The looters and rioters were black, attacking 'brown' owned shops.


    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #338 - August 11, 2011, 04:32 PM

    i don't think a few gentlemanly Sikh people gurading a couple of mosques/temples prevented race rioting - although it was a heck of a nice gesture. i think all the community, the muslim community, the black community and all other ethnic groups realised that race rioting would be completely and utterly senseless in the context of the current riots. i think a lot of credit in particular should go to the muslim community for not looking to seek any 'revenge' attacks. i think the father of one of the the victims played a large hand in that though. just hope it stays this way.


    Well, it was nice of the Sikhs to go there and participate in the process at the vigil rather than stay at home and do nothing. In the Lozells riots of 2005 they were caught in the middle.

    The fact is, most Muslims are like the father of the young man who was killed - don't want anything other than peace, and don't hold 'collective guilt' ideas about black people or any other group just because of the actions of one person.

    The kind of 'Muslim' to worry about are the individuals quoted in the article by yeeezeevee - who are basically gangster minded simpletons and bigots, who are itching to fight and even kill people simply because they are a different ethnicity or religion - because they believe in collective punishment and collective guilt. Just like the EDL, for example, think towards them. Those are the nasty, belligerent bigots who are to be worried about, because in a city like Birmingham, shit can get out of control really quickly.

    I hope the humanity and peaceful message of Mr Jehan over rides these menacing individuals. And whatever helps to focus and disseminate that amongst the youth is to be commended.


    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #339 - August 11, 2011, 07:08 PM

    Congrats Brits!

    Ex Igne Resurgam

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMWJXWrenm0

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzXkbV4lEKU

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXbkY6ey0fs&feature=related

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Np92OSY3YBc

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-LB94Kwlws


    "In battle, the well-honed spork is more dangerous than the mightiest sword" -- Sun Tzu
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #340 - August 11, 2011, 09:28 PM

     Afro
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9pAC0YSmK0g
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #341 - August 11, 2011, 09:32 PM

     Roll Eyes

    Condell doing what he does best-- lumping everyone into a group and demonizing them.

    Living in Scotland has turned IA into a grumpy old conservative apparently.

    "In battle, the well-honed spork is more dangerous than the mightiest sword" -- Sun Tzu
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #342 - August 11, 2011, 09:35 PM

    Roll Eyes

    Condell doing what he does best-- lumping everyone into a group and demonizing them.

    Living in Scotland has turned IA into a grumpy old conservative apparently.

    Most of the rioters were not rioting for any reason other than causing trouble and looting. Certainly all of those from outside London. The exception is the people at the peaceful demonstration on Saturday in Tottenham.
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #343 - August 11, 2011, 09:38 PM


    Roll Eyes

    Living in Scotland has turned IA into a grumpy old conservative apparently.


    Every time some says Iraqi Atheist's initials as IA I think of Insha Allah instead. furious

    [/offtopic]
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #344 - August 11, 2011, 09:42 PM

    Roll Eyes

    Condell doing what he does best-- lumping everyone into a group and demonizing them.

    Living in Scotland has turned IA into a grumpy old conservative apparently.


    Mate, the rioting resulted in 3 innocent men - British Pakistani guys - being killed defending their street from looters and rioters.

    The people who suffered most are working class people, black, white, asian, and immigrants, who were burnt out of their homes and livelihoods.

    Nothing to celebrate here.

    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #345 - August 11, 2011, 09:44 PM



    +1

    Agree with him 101%  Afro

    Formerly known as Iblis
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #346 - August 11, 2011, 09:50 PM

    Most of the rioters were not rioting for any reason other than causing trouble and looting.


    Right because generalized spontaneous rebellions of the underclass against police oppression and capitalist society are always well-organized and well-focused, the targets well selected, and criminal elements never exploit such situations towards their own ends.  Roll Eyes

    Let's just have the capitalists' thugs who sparked this uprising to begin with crack some fuckin heads and have them use the same tactics they've used for years in militarily-occupied lands like Northern Ireland in mainland Britain. CCTVs on every fucking corner, the City of London's "wall of steel" and an endemic state surveillance culture aren't enough-- you guys need APCs and plastic bullets being fired into crowds of people too. Fuckin awesome.

    Mate, the rioting resulted in 3 innocent men - British Pakistani guys - being killed defending their street from looters and rioters.

    The people who suffered most are working class people, black, white, asian, and immigrants, who were burnt out of their homes and livelihoods.

    Nothing to celebrate here.



    See above. This is the nature of spontaneous underclass rebellion, and it's ugly, but you're nuts if you think I'm siding with your imperial police state on this one. Your country has been raping and bullying other countries, and helping to sow civil strife like what you see now all over the globe, even arming the combatants-- forgive me if I don't cry a river over the chickens coming home to roost.

    "In battle, the well-honed spork is more dangerous than the mightiest sword" -- Sun Tzu
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #347 - August 11, 2011, 09:50 PM

    England riots: Cameron says police admit to wrong tactics

    Quote
    The police admitted they got their riot tactics wrong, the prime minister has said, as he announced measures to help homeowners and businesses.

    David Cameron told MPs the riots in cities across England were "criminality pure and simple", but there were "far too few police" on the streets.

    In an emergency recall of Parliament, he announced a crackdown on facemasks and a review on the use of curfews.

    More than 1,500 arrests have been made since the unrest began on Saturday. .....There were simply far too few police deployed on to our streets and the tactics they were using weren't working," said the prime minister

    "Police chiefs have been frank with me about why this happened.

    "Initially the police treated the situation too much as a public order issue - rather than essentially one of crime.

    "The truth is that the police have been facing a new and unique challenge with different people doing the same thing - basically looting - in different places all at the same time." ..


    London riots: More than 900 arrested over disorder .. watch the Video in that link..

    Freedom of Expression is a Fundamental Right  
    Release The bloggers from Jails.  Protect The Bloggers from  Baboons
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #348 - August 11, 2011, 09:53 PM

    Worst thing is, I have a feeling half of those arrested will even see any real jail time given the state of the over-crowded prison system. I do strongly believe in rehabilitation but looking at these events has made it clear that these youths are clearly entrenched in a culture and mentality which promotes violence, ruthlessness and entitlement which will take more than one year of rehab to seed out.


    "The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims. The most perfect slaves are, therefore, those which blissfully and unawaredly enslave themselves."
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #349 - August 11, 2011, 09:54 PM

     
    RIGHT  because generalized spontaneous rebellions of the underclass against police oppression and capitalist society are always well-organized and well-focused, the targets well selected, and criminal elements never exploit such situations towards their own ends.  Roll Eyes ..

    right.,  communist societies have NO UNDER CLASS and NO POLICE OPPRESSION & no  spontaneous rebellion.  It is only the combination of democracy and some wealthy upper class individuals that are responsible for this police oppression.

    Go and   roll your eyes like little girl and go & rape raccoons or play with guns  dear Raccoon Rapist

    Freedom of Expression is a Fundamental Right  
    Release The bloggers from Jails.  Protect The Bloggers from  Baboons
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #350 - August 11, 2011, 09:57 PM

    Also, I want to say that the responses on this thread are a good example of why it's so difficult to maintain a free society and limited state and why the police state continues to expand in first world countries-- the minute people feel threatened they're willing to let the state do whatever nasty business they deem necessary to provide order and security. Freedom requires more people to have spines than actually do.

    EDITED TO ADD: this is probably also why Ishina is one of the few people on this thread not losing their heads over this and demanding a massive military-style crackdown, despite not being a crazy far-lefty like me-- she's one of the few people here who actually has a set of balls on her.

    "In battle, the well-honed spork is more dangerous than the mightiest sword" -- Sun Tzu
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #351 - August 11, 2011, 09:59 PM

    See above. This is the nature of spontaneous underclass rebellion, and it's ugly, but you're nuts if you think I'm siding with your imperial police state on this one. Your country has been raping and bullying other countries, and helping to sow civil strife like what you see now all over the globe, even arming the combatants-- forgive me if I don't cry a river over the chickens coming home to roost.


    Three men protecting their neighbourhood from rioters who are killed is 'chickens coming home to roost'?

    Families of immigrants barely escaping with their lives when their homes are set on fire is 'chickens coming home to roost'?

    Peoples lives ruined, beaten up, all of them innocent, is 'chickens coming home to roost'?

    OK, comrade.




    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #352 - August 11, 2011, 10:01 PM

    You're right-- call out the capitalist thugs and declare martial law so they can further brutalize the underclass thugs.

    OK, reactionary.

    "In battle, the well-honed spork is more dangerous than the mightiest sword" -- Sun Tzu
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #353 - August 11, 2011, 10:04 PM



    Condell is himself, an angry Brit. I don't blame him. He may be harsh sometimes, but he is defending Atheism.

    Religion is organized superstition
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #354 - August 11, 2011, 10:04 PM

    Here's a reactionary's take on it, RR.

    You might even agree with him.

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/peteroborne/100100708/the-moral-decay-of-our-society-is-as-bad-at-the-top-as-the-bottom/



    Apologies. I don't know how to embed links to make them shorter, as instructed a while back.
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #355 - August 11, 2011, 10:13 PM

    Heh, yeah-- that was actually good. Thanks for sharing.

    "In battle, the well-honed spork is more dangerous than the mightiest sword" -- Sun Tzu
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #356 - August 11, 2011, 10:13 PM

    You're right-- call out the capitalist thugs and declare martial law so they can further brutalize the underclass thugs.

    OK, reactionary.


    I'm not advocating anything you seem to think I am.

    I'm just wondering, how does 3 working class Pakistani men from Birmingham, being killed defending their neighbourhood from rioters and looters represent 'chickens coming home to roost'?

    I just can't see it myself.



    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #357 - August 11, 2011, 10:26 PM

    I hate leftists and their ridiculous romanticization of the 'underclass'. There was a time when being among the lower class was a genuinely oppressed and downtrodden segement of society - when being 'working class' actually meant something. In the modern west most of our 'underclass' are precisely what Condell calls them.. "parasitic scum". I don't care what you call em, if you can afford a fucking blackberry you really aren't that poor.

    These are not the proletariat rising up Q-man. This is a mass mugging disguised as a riot. Steel toed boots to their faces. NOW.

    Formerly known as Iblis
  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #358 - August 11, 2011, 10:31 PM

    Quote
    Steel toed boots to their faces.


    I don't agree with that either. There's got to be a middle way between romanticising violence and an over reaching counter reaction.


    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: Riots in London
     Reply #359 - August 11, 2011, 10:39 PM

    I'm not advocating anything you seem to think I am.

    I'm just wondering, how does 3 working class Pakistani men from Birmingham, being killed defending their neighbourhood from rioters and looters represent 'chickens coming home to roost'?

    I just can't see it myself.


    They represent casualties in a general insurrection-- these types of crimes will happen during underclass revolts. It sucks for them, it sucks for their families, they did not deserve it, and those who killed them deserve to be punished-- HOWEVER that is not a reason to vilify all of the rioters. The overwhelming majority of the rioters haven't killed anyone. And three people? REALLY? In several days of rioting all over England ONLY THREE people have been killed? And you want these heinous but isolated murders to represent the riots in general? Man, more people are gonna get killed over the weekend here in Philly over bullshit shootings than that-- should we take that to be representative of people in Philadelphia in general?

    And before you get to burning of working-class homes, let me address it now. Also not justified, but, again, things like this happen in these situations, and it does not represent all the rioters. Out of all the people gathering and smashing up storefronts or whatever, how many do you figure have set out to intentionally burn down working-class abodes? Exactly how many working-class homes have been intentionally set ablaze out of an estimated how many number of rioters might give us an idea-- I'm guessing that this accounts for a very, very small percentage of the rioters/rebels.

    Finally, let's address the motivation of the rioters, as has often been done on this thread since it began. We will take it as a given that some portion of the rioters were criminals before the riots began and are simply using the riots as convenient cover for criminal activity. We will also assume that some portion of the rioters may not have a criminal history but are essentially involved in the riots not out of any anger at the police, political or economic establishment, but simply for fun or to steal shit or whatever.

    But since no comprehensive survey has been done as to the motivation of the rioters to my knowledge, and we don't know what portions these two groups make up of the rebels, I'm fucking flabbergasted as to how many people here seem quite certain that is the motivation for ALL the rioters. Fact is that many people involved in the riots have told reporters, with varying degrees of clarity and articulation, that they are rioting in protest of the police, of government policies, of the economy, or whatever. Now it's easy enough for people to dismiss these explanations as rationalizations or outright lies, but unless the people being interviewed are actually known to the person doing the dismissing, just seems like a way to reinforce what their perception of the rioters is already.

    I hate leftists and their ridiculous romanticization of the 'underclass'. There was a time when being among the lower class was a genuinely oppressed and downtrodden segement of society - when being 'working class' actually meant something. In the modern west most of our 'underclass' are precisely what Condell calls them.. "parasitic scum". I don't care what you call em, if you can afford a fucking blackberry you really aren't that poor.

    These are not the proletariat rising up Q-man. This is a mass mugging disguised as a riot. Steel toed boots to their faces. NOW.


    See above and nice to know you hate me.

    "In battle, the well-honed spork is more dangerous than the mightiest sword" -- Sun Tzu
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