Skip navigation
Sidebar -

Advanced search options →

Welcome

Welcome to CEMB forum.
Please login or register. Did you miss your activation email?

Donations

Help keep the Forum going!
Click on Kitty to donate:

Kitty is lost

Recent Posts


Qur'anic studies today
Today at 08:44 PM

Lights on the way
by akay
Today at 04:40 PM

اضواء على الطريق ....... ...
by akay
Today at 12:50 PM

Do humans have needed kno...
Today at 04:17 AM

What's happened to the fo...
by zeca
Yesterday at 06:39 PM

New Britain
Yesterday at 05:41 PM

Do humans have needed kno...
Yesterday at 05:47 AM

Iran launches drones
April 13, 2024, 09:56 PM

عيد مبارك للجميع! ^_^
by akay
April 12, 2024, 04:01 PM

Eid-Al-Fitr
by akay
April 12, 2024, 12:06 PM

Mock Them and Move on., ...
January 30, 2024, 10:44 AM

Pro Israel or Pro Palesti...
January 29, 2024, 01:53 PM

Theme Changer

 Topic: Fucking swearing and its implications.

 (Read 6367 times)
  • 12 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Fucking swearing and its implications.
     OP - March 03, 2011, 08:22 PM

    Right, because there's a direct correlation between obscenities and intelligence.


    Hmm ... interesting proposition.

    http://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20101228125725AArfQEh
  • Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #1 - March 03, 2011, 08:28 PM

    I think it's fucking bullshit.

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #2 - March 03, 2011, 08:34 PM

    Stephen Fry on the joys of swearing:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_osQvkeNRM

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #3 - March 03, 2011, 08:42 PM

    Hmm ... what about, emotional intelligence and swearing?

    http://www.ebwonline.com/News/Article/Using_your_Emotional_Intelligence_to_improve_your_influence_may_mean_swearing_03_02_2011.aspx
  • Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #4 - March 03, 2011, 08:43 PM

    Yes he does make the point well. I thought of that vid but couldn't be fucked finding it again.  Wink

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #5 - March 03, 2011, 08:44 PM

    Hmm ... what about, emotional intelligence and swearing?

    Why would that be any different? Can you present a solid case or are you just idly speculating in an attempt to support your preconceptions?

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #6 - March 03, 2011, 08:48 PM

    No preconceptions Oz. Just exploring. I think there is something to it. Brb.
  • Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #7 - March 03, 2011, 09:14 PM

    I think it's a pretty complicated topic.

    There are certain cultural relative values:
    - National language norms: E.g. Shit in England wouldn't make it to a children's cartoon, yet in Germany "Scheiße" will.
    - Social class norms: Football supporters will swear far more than the audience of a tennis or F1 race, from my experience. Oh, ballet too.
    - Fashion: e.g. makes a teenager look cool. Or when pop stars used them (but this is more attention, see below).
    - Swear word inflation: Certain swear words become so widely used they lose their effectiveness resulting in them being considered not a swear word. *Personal experience and understanding of words bloomin' and crap.

    As for EQ, I think the level of swearing increases with the following negative EQ qualities:
    - Emotional intelligence with respect to anger
    - Emotional intelligence with respect to self control
    - Emotional intelligence with respect to empathy

    But, I think one can tactfully use swear words for emotional impact and influence:
    - To really communicate they are pissed in order to drive fear into people to get them moving (and hence influence like a mad-dog trader or boss)
    - To get attention like a pop star
    - To make a good scene in a movie/TV show (Sopranos, haha!)

    How's that for all my preconceptions, Oz?  grin12
  • Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #8 - March 03, 2011, 09:19 PM

    I think it's a pretty complicated topic.

    There are certain cultural relative values:
    - National language norms: E.g. Shit in England wouldn't make it to a children's cartoon, yet in Germany "Scheiße" will.
    - Social class norms: Football supporters will swear far more than the audience of a tennis or F1 race, from my experience. Oh, ballet too.
    - Fashion: e.g. makes a teenager look cool. Or when pop stars used them (but this is more attention, see below).
    - Swear word inflation: Certain swear words become so widely used they lose their effectiveness resulting in them being considered not a swear word. *Personal experience and understanding of words bloomin' and crap.

    As for EQ, I think the level of swearing increases with the following negative EQ qualities:
    - Emotional intelligence with respect to anger
    - Emotional intelligence with respect to self control
    - Emotional intelligence with respect to empathy

    But, I think one can tactfully use swear words for emotional impact and influence:
    - To really communicate they are pissed in order to drive fear into people to get them moving (and hence influence like a mad-dog trader or boss)
    - To get attention like a pop star
    - To make a good scene in a movie/TV show (Sopranos, haha!)

    How's that for all my preconceptions, Oz?  grin12

    Not bad. Now try to support them. Afro

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #9 - March 03, 2011, 09:20 PM

    Not bad. Now try to support them. Afro


    Why don't you refute them instead  Afro
  • Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #10 - March 03, 2011, 09:21 PM

    And can we spawn another thread Mr you have the power!!   Tongue Smiley
  • Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #11 - March 03, 2011, 09:23 PM

    Why don't you refute them instead  Afro

    They are your claims.

    Spltting topic now. Hold on to your hats.

    ETA: Splitterationisation complete.

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #12 - March 03, 2011, 09:30 PM

    Why don't you refute them instead  Afro


    "What can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof"

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Re: Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #13 - March 03, 2011, 11:50 PM

    - Social class norms: Football supporters will swear far more than the audience of a tennis or F1 race, from my experience. Oh, ballet too.


     Cheesy Ya think?

    "This is the worst fuckin production of Swan Lake I've ever fuckin seen! Get off the fuckin stage, bitch! Tchaikovsky is rollin in his fuckin grave! Booooooooo! Go back to Moscow ya cunts!"

    fuck you
  • Re: Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #14 - March 04, 2011, 10:37 AM

    well i'm fucking stupid and i swear, therefore fucking swearing makes you fucking stupid.

    proof by examples are the best proofs
  • Re: Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #15 - March 04, 2011, 11:15 AM

    Stephen Fry on the joys of swearing:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_osQvkeNRM


    I was about to post that but you got there before me!

    Swearing is a very important part of vocabulary, and does not necessarily denote a poor vocabulary. I swear like a docker yet I don't think I have a bad vocabulary.

    Has anyone noticed how people who don't swear (Islamic Extremists, Christian Extremists etc) are normally more angry, violent, and highly strung than other people?

    Religion - The hot potato that looked delicious but ended up burning your mouth!

    Knock your head on the ground, don't be miserly in your prayers, listen to your Sidi Sheikh, Allahu Akbar! - Lounes Matoub
  • Re: Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #16 - March 04, 2011, 07:17 PM

    Right, so that conclusively disproves HO's assertion that swearing is proportional to anger, lack of self control, and lack of empathy.  dance

    Given that religious fundies are angry, frequently lack self control, and are notorious for a paucity of empathy, it should be obvious that swearing like buggery is bloody well related to higher levels of self control and empathy and shows lower levels of anger.  parrot

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #17 - March 04, 2011, 07:37 PM

    More factors, I think :
    - rebellion factor
    - enjoyment of being rebellious
    - humour

    But also,  I think there is a differences in the intent.

    Well if you would like a discussion, cool. If you just want to feel good in affirming your ego, good for you.
  • Re: Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #18 - March 04, 2011, 07:38 PM

    Ta,btw, for splitting threads.
  • Re: Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #19 - March 04, 2011, 07:45 PM

    More factors, I think :
    - rebellion factor
    - enjoyment of being rebellious
    - humour

    As in the selection of the title for this thread.

    Quote
    But also,  I think there is a differences in the intent.

    Yup.

    Quote
    Well if you would like a discussion, cool. If you just want to feel good in affirming your ego, good for you.

    Both, just like you. Wink

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #20 - March 04, 2011, 10:44 PM

    It's quite a complex topic the more I think about it. I'll say it plainly: using swear words does not imply stupid. However I do think there are cases in which it reveals a form of stupidity - namely emotional, the lack of higher EQ. Some examples:

    Sport

    Footballers swear pretty badly, right? English football is mixed in with a culture where supporters on average are mid to low socio-economic by status (ahem, with a slight problem of restless young males and hooliganism). Moreover players swear often at the referee and the watching football crowd swear in their songs.

    Compare this to F1. A sport which usually attracts more mid to high socio economic groups (ahem, Monaco GP). Even when your average F1 driver is close to being forced into a wall at 180 mph ...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7MTtudbPVQ8

    ... Barrichello reacted on the radio with: 'Horrible,' he screamed. 'He should be black-flagged.' . F1 drivers are frankly more intelligent that your average footballer right? Not only would this be for car set-up, data analysis, physics, calculating risk but also the technicians and engineers these drivers have to communicate with. As a result, they will apply a certain amount of EQ to engage with their teams in order to be the fastest on the track ... hence why they don't want to piss off their team members and they operate with higher levels of professionalism ... and low and behold ... no swearing by Barrichello over the radio, I reckon.

    Finance/Banking

    This one is pretty ugly. Finance being a highly pressured environment inevitably has traders, production IT managers who will swear like sailors. While swearing infrequently puts a strong point across, swearing all the time would not only piss others off but has even led to the Protection from Harassment Act 1997 to cover verbal harassment and bullying. Though this angle is focussed on the intent of the swearing, the Green Vs Deutsche Bank case highlights the mental breakdown that can occur due to it. Green was awarded £800,000 in damages..

    One other thing about finance: like football, lives are not at risk. However, like F1, NASA is an organisation where lives are at risk. I don't think you'll find mission control people swearing and blinding for the same reason that an F1 driver needs to keep good relationships with his/her team members. This correlates back to EQ.

    Male dominated industries/Catering industries

    As mentioned in the article above, swearing is pretty prevalent in unprofessional/male dominated industries. I think there is a cultural element to it with the underlying that male men are aggressive, and when then can't resort to staying calm, they'll swear. Moreover, I don't think in unprofessional industries the perception and tact skills are in place to recognize when people are upset or angry, and this lack of empathy then requires someone to swear in order for the recipient to get the point. Serious low EQ going on here, both with the receiver and producer of the swearing.

    As for Gordon Ramsay - although I think applying aggression to work harder will lead to success (I personally swear at things a lot), I'm not convinced swearing at your workers day in day out is beneficial in the long term. But then again - it depends on te user of the swear word. If someone does something wrong, a manager could say:

    "You fucking idiot, don't do it again"
    OR
    "That's exactly what you should not fucking do"

    The intent is different. The first puts personal blame, the second makes it clear the person did something wrong. I would say I have to think a bit more about this aspect.

    But I hope at least with the NASA and F1 arguments; I think we can see the consequential benefits of not swearing and how higher EQ/professionalism leads to less swearing.

    Now Oz, if you wish to discuss below the shallow layer, please feel free to write and I'm happy to read and learn things. On the other hand if you prefer a 2-5 word answer to caress your ego, then good for you.
  • Re: Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #21 - March 04, 2011, 10:53 PM

    Meh, fairly true: http://www.worketiquette.co.uk/swearing-workplace.html
  • Re: Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #22 - March 04, 2011, 10:57 PM

    "What can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof"


    This is a pretty difficult topic to give exact evidence on, surely? Swearing isn't exactly a science.
    Moreover if the points raised so far are so retarded then you can easily refute them.
  • Re: Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #23 - March 04, 2011, 11:13 PM

    lol - just thought of one industry where live are at risk and swearing goes on all the time: the ARMY!!!!
  • Re: Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #24 - March 04, 2011, 11:35 PM

    lol - 9 pages worth of some interesting ideas on the topic of "Profanity in the workplace": http://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=467306

    This one being the highlight:

    Quote
    ... I just want to put a few things I've noted thus far:

    We have two sides here, one is that the perception of those around you is irrelevant and it is purely how you intend the word to be heard and then we have the other side which is that perception of those around you does matter and that how you mean the word is only valid to the point of the person you are directly addressing.

    Now, I'm curious as to why people feel the perceptions of those around you is irrelevant? Mainly because I'm thinking along the lines of words have a meaning to people, if that person is not party to the conversation and over hears a word that they dislike, they won't understand the use and will take it as a negative.

    The study I posted defines perception and the associated terms (improvement etc) very well. It shows that when using profanity in a discussion it has no positive impact on your speech. Now this applies to a workplace certainly. You can give all the rights regarding free speech you like, but those will not have an impact on your speech so far as a positive / negative effect goes. The key with the study is that it is referring to how people perceive what you are saying along with your credibility, it doesn't care for using one word instead of ten.

    Now you can argue regarding the meaning / irrational reactions of these words all you want, but in today's society, there is a reason presidents and prime ministers don't swear in debates - it lowers the tone of what they are saying and diminishes public opinion of them.

    We are all aware of the negativity associated with these words and to try and deny they have this image is ridiculous.


    http://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=467306&page=8
  • Re: Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #25 - March 04, 2011, 11:41 PM

    lol - just thought of one industry where live are at risk and swearing goes on all the time: the ARMY!!!!


    Well - I'd relate this to the similarity of lower wage male industries, whereby because of male aggression and lack of empathy means swearing results A) Due to anger and is needed B) In order to get a point across which C) leads to an acceptable culture of swearing all round. This is vastly different to highly professional sectors of the defense industry, e.g. try swearing at an Interview for Thales or Boeing or Lockhead Martin who carry out the R&D and invent all the warfare equipment. Professionalism again is required whereby cultivating good relationships with people is needed in order to solve very hard problems ... and like NASA or F1 - people there will not swear unlike the foot soldiers. (Sorry to say).
  • Re: Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #26 - March 04, 2011, 11:52 PM

    I think I'm reaching some conclusions then for forum users who swear here:

    - if a forum user swears against other people in an offensive manner (and does it often), then they lack empathy and/or are aggressive
    - if a forum user swears in a "pleasant way" e.g. she's fucking gorgeous! - then that's their fashion statement and/or used  for humour
    - if a forum user swears occasionally to get a point across, e.g. one f-bomb for several paragraphs to give it some kick, then this is fashion and/or rebellious liking for usage and/or used for humour
    - if a forum user infrequently uses swear words to assert anger at a negative group e.g. "The EDL are fucking cunts"; then this is their way of gaining attention or they're way to express their emotion

    ... yeah ... something among those lines.

    So when I said at the start swearing can have something to do with EQ, I think it does in specific areas.
  • Re: Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #27 - March 05, 2011, 02:20 AM

    You're overanalyzing it HO. Swear words are just words, like any other, but for, whatever reason (seems pretty random to me) polite society has deemed these words inappropriate. Some of us came up in environments where casual swearing was common so we don't think twice about casually swearing in most situations. Why do you care anyways?

    fuck you
  • Re: Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #28 - March 05, 2011, 02:47 AM

    Besides, it's the fucking internets br0.

    Your speculation is hardly relevant.

    "Life is not a matter of holding good cards, but of playing a poor hand well."
    - Robert Louis Stevenson
  • Re: Fucking swearing and its implications.
     Reply #29 - March 05, 2011, 07:40 AM

    It's quite a complex topic the more I think about it. I'll say it plainly: using swear words does not imply stupid. However I do think there are cases in which it reveals a form of stupidity - namely emotional, the lack of higher EQ. Some examples:

    Sport

    Footballers swear pretty badly, right? English football is mixed in with a culture where supporters on average are mid to low socio-economic by status (ahem, with a slight problem of restless young males and hooliganism). Moreover players swear often at the referee and the watching football crowd swear in their songs.

    Compare this to F1. A sport which usually attracts more mid to high socio economic groups (ahem, Monaco GP). Even when your average F1 driver is close to being forced into a wall at 180 mph ...

    ... Barrichello reacted on the radio with: 'Horrible,' he screamed. 'He should be black-flagged.' . F1 drivers are frankly more intelligent that your average footballer right? Not only would this be for car set-up, data analysis, physics, calculating risk but also the technicians and engineers these drivers have to communicate with. As a result, they will apply a certain amount of EQ to engage with their teams in order to be the fastest on the track ... hence why they don't want to piss off their team members and they operate with higher levels of professionalism ... and low and behold ... no swearing by Barrichello over the radio, I reckon.

    I see. So of course footballers don't have to get on with other team members. Right. And they don't have to consider strategy or anything else. Of course not.

    And F1 drivers are not selected for primarily on the basis of ultra-fast reactions, superb vision and fitness. And of course you have comprehensive and reliable studies comparing the intelligence of footballers and F1 drivers.

    You have provided one example of an F1 driver not swearing out of all the F1 drivers ever. I'm sure I could find one example of a footballer not swearing too.


    Quote
    One other thing about finance: like football, lives are not at risk. However, like F1, NASA is an organisation where lives are at risk. I don't think you'll find mission control people swearing and blinding for the same reason that an F1 driver needs to keep good relationships with his/her team members. This correlates back to EQ.

    Poor analogy, which is going to get further hammered with regard to your next point. However, in F1 the people putting your life at risk are generally yourself and other drivers, not your team members. They just do their job on the pits. Swearing at someone who is about to force you into a wall may not bother your team members as you aren't swearing at them. Whether it does bother them or not is going to largely depend on how much they swear themeselves. If they have programmed themselves to be offended every time someone says fuck then it'll be a problem.


    Quote
    Male dominated industries/Catering industries

    As mentioned in the article above, swearing is pretty prevalent in unprofessional/male dominated industries. I think there is a cultural element to it with the underlying that male men are aggressive, and when then can't resort to staying calm, they'll swear. Moreover, I don't think in unprofessional industries the perception and tact skills are in place to recognize when people are upset or angry, and this lack of empathy then requires someone to swear in order for the recipient to get the point. Serious low EQ going on here, both with the receiver and producer of the swearing.

    This is where you get hammered. Cheesy

    I take it that you haven't really worked in "male dominated industries". I have. Some points for your consideration.

    First, such industries are often potentially life threatening. I'm not joking. To stay alive and uninjured requires that everyone on site has a professional attitude and a high degree of awareness. So, don't make the mistake of calling these people "unprofessional" just because they don't wear ties. That's pure snobbery and ignorance on your part.

    Second, on a fucking buildng site every cunt fucking swears all the bloody time without thinking about it. It has nothing to do with staying calm, nor does it necessarily have anything to do with agression (although of course it can). It is just part of the dialect, so to speak. I've heard plenty of blokes use "fukn" like "ummm" is used in more genteel circles: as a filler halfway through a sentence while they gather their thoughts.

    In fact, when someone almost seriously injures or kills you (and I have had this happen to me and seen it happen to others) quite often the reaction wont involve swearing. A quiet "if looks could kill" stare at the offender is likely, along with some ostensibly mild comment, and this from a person who normally swears like a trooper. So this is a case of high stress situations resulting in less or even no swearing, whereas in casual and even humorous circumstances there is heaps of swearing.

    Third, such people seem to have no trouble at all telling when a workmate is annoyed whether that person is swearing or not. Sure, people may swear when they are annoyed, but since they're swearing all the time anyway you couldn't tell just by their language. This means that to discern how your workmates are feeling you need to apply other methods like observing body language, tone of voice, and all the usual social cues that any normal person uses daily. So no, there is not seriously fucking low EQ going on here. Their ability in that respect is probably every bit as good as yours. Again, your attitude simply demonstrates ignorance and snobbery.


    Quote
    Now Oz, if you wish to discuss below the shallow layer, please feel free to write and I'm happy to read and learn things. On the other hand if you prefer a 2-5 word answer to caress your ego, then good for you.

    Feel free to start learning from the above. If you prefer a wall of text to caress your ego, then good for you.

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • 12 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »