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Theme Changer

 Topic: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)

 (Read 7287 times)
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  • Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     OP - November 30, 2010, 04:40 AM

    Eid al-Mubahila
     
    "Let us invoke the curse of God on the liars!" (3:61)

     
    This Quranic verse refers to the famous event of ' Mubahila ' which took place in the 10th year after the Hejira to Mecca against the Christians of Najran.

    A deputation of 60 Christians of Najran headed by Abdul Masih their chief monk priest came and discussed with the Prophet  the personality of Jesus. The Prophet told them not to deify Jesus for he was only a mortal created by God, and not God Himself. Then they asked who the father of Jesus was. By this, they thought that since he was born without a father the Prophet would helplessly accept Jesus' father being God himself. In reply to this question was revealed the Verse:

    “Verily, similitude of Jesus with God is as the similitude of Adam; He created him out of dust then said He unto him Be, and he became.”

    When the Christians did not find that this was the sharpest argument they had ever heard, the top-mentioned verse was revealed enjoining upon the Holy Prophet  to call the Christians to mubahila (a debate). To this the Christians agreed. They agreed to returned home and have the mubahila the next day.

    Early next morning the Prophet sent Salman al-Farsi to the open place that was fixed outside the city for the historic event to erect a small shelter for himself and those he intended to take along with him for the contest.

    At the appointed hour, the Christians witnessed the Prophet entering the field with Hussain in his lap, Hasan holding his finger, and Fatima walking beside him followed by Ali. The Prophet, on reaching the appointed spot, stationed himself with his daughter, her two sons and her husband, raising his hands towards the heaven said:

    “Lord these are the People of my House.”

    The Chief Monk, on learning who each of the holy ones were that Mohammed had assembled there, addressed the huge crowd of the people who had gathered on the spot, and addressed them saying:

    “By God, I see the faces which, if they pray to God for mountains to move from their places, the mountains will immediately move!

    O believers in the Jesus of Nazareth, I will tell you the truth that should ye fail to enter into some agreement with Mohammad and if these souls, whom Mohammad has brought with him, curse you, ye will be wiped out of existence to the last day of the life of the earth!”

    The Christians readily agreed to the advice counseled by their Leader. They beseeched the Prophet to give up the idea of the agreed debate and requested for themselves to be allowed to continue their faith rather than being put to death and offered to pay ' Jizya', the special tax for non-Muslim subjects of Muslim rule.
     
    Did you know?

    This feast is the origin of the phrase "the mountain coming to Mohammed."  On this day, Muslims congratulate each other on their keen powers of argument and practice honing their sharp grasp of logic.  Shiites, for whom the family of Mohammed is especially dear, make special cakes and dishes to honor the members of Mohammed's family on this day.   
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #1 - November 30, 2010, 06:56 AM

    Dude you're on the wrong forum.
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #2 - November 30, 2010, 07:47 AM

    No please let him stay I love learning new things Smiley

    Hi, welcome, tell us about yourself. How did you find us? What are your thoughts on our forum?
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #3 - November 30, 2010, 08:39 AM

    Interesting nick Matamoros.
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #4 - November 30, 2010, 08:56 AM

    Quote
    Matamoros

    The name Matamoros, meaning Moor-killer or Moor-slayer in Spanish (see Saint James the Moor-slayer)


    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matamoros
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #5 - November 30, 2010, 09:14 AM

    Or maybe the guy/girl is Mexican?
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #6 - November 30, 2010, 12:55 PM

    Dear Friends,

    Thanks for being a place to post a very key reminder of what today is in the Muslim calendar.  If you don't get it, who will?

    "Wrong Forum" - I'm both new and curious.  Is the topic off base - understanding the textual and narrative basis of Islam's supposed "victory" over Christendom?  Or is it too dense and academic?  I'm not trying to be flippant but I really don' t understand why your first reaction was to see my post as misplaced on this forum.

    My "handle"  - Santiago Matamoros is the patron saint of our collective enterprise here - whatever our creed or lack of one - and we don't - we must not - invoke his name that he might slay anyone.  But we earnestly pray with every fibre of our being that he slay their false and dark ideology.

    The point - The essential irrationality - the essential un-reasonableness - of this ideology is nowhere more clearly illustrated than in the "Feast of the Cursing" which was supposed to be a rational and reasonable argument between a Christian theologian and the leader of a new religious faith.

    Please look well to eid e mubalaha and see a microcosm of the gulf that separates Islam from human reason, the birthright of all free men - whatever their creed. 

    We can make this our eid if we broadcast it and make others aware of this irrational episode central to the formative narrative of the creed of slavery and submission!

    Thanks and , well, Happy Eid!

    Orlando M.
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #7 - November 30, 2010, 01:02 PM

    You wanna know something funny Smiley

    I've been a muslim my whole life, well almost, I'm an apostate now, but I've never heard of this eid or celebration until now. Funny huh? I love when Xtians teach me things I didn't know about Islam. Also, funny how my parents taught me to respect the Jewish and Christian Faith.

    V

    PS:

    I believe that He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named will one day return and slay all the unbelievers and free us from the shackles of the Muggle lovers. This is as realistic as your patron saint of murder Sergeant Mendoza.
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #8 - November 30, 2010, 01:04 PM

    I INVOKE THE NAME OF Santiago Matamoros

    I INVOKE THE NAME OF Santiago Matamoros

    I INVOKE THE NAME OF Santiago Matamoros
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #9 - November 30, 2010, 01:06 PM

    Wait...  Is there a third Eid?  I've never heard of this Eid before.

    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #10 - November 30, 2010, 01:12 PM

    Quote

    Saint James the Moor-slayer

    Saint James the Moor-slayer (Santiago Matamoros) – iconographic type of St. James, son of Zebedee in the Battle of Clavijo (Spain, 844) against Muslims, symbol of Reconquista.

    According to Spanish legend, Saint James appeared as a warrior on his white horse with white banner to help Christian armies of king Ramiro I in battle against the Moors. They won, and James became known as "Matamoros"; to this day he is Spain's patron saint.




    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_James_the_Moor-slayer

    I INVOKE THEE!

    I INVOKE THEE!

    I INVOKE THEE!
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #11 - November 30, 2010, 01:43 PM

    Matamoros, would you like to write a thread introducing yourself on the Introductions forum? Thats the usual practise, so we can get to know each other, and as an act of courtesy. Look forward to reading it Afro

    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #12 - November 30, 2010, 01:47 PM

    Dear Friends,

    Thanks for being a place to post a very key reminder of what today is in the Muslim calendar.  If you don't get it, who will?

    "Wrong Forum" - I'm both new and curious.  Is the topic off base - understanding the textual and narrative basis of Islam's supposed "victory" over Christendom?  Or is it too dense and academic?  I'm not trying to be flippant but I really don' t understand why your first reaction was to see my post as misplaced on this forum.

    My "handle"  - Santiago Matamoros is the patron saint of our collective enterprise here - whatever our creed or lack of one - and we don't - we must not - invoke his name that he might slay anyone.  But we earnestly pray with every fibre of our being that he slay their false and dark ideology.

    The point - The essential irrationality - the essential un-reasonableness - of this ideology is nowhere more clearly illustrated than in the "Feast of the Cursing" which was supposed to be a rational and reasonable argument between a Christian theologian and the leader of a new religious faith.

    Please look well to eid e mubalaha and see a microcosm of the gulf that separates Islam from human reason, the birthright of all free men - whatever their creed.  

    We can make this our eid if we broadcast it and make others aware of this irrational episode central to the formative narrative of the creed of slavery and submission!

    Thanks and , well, Happy Eid!

    Orlando M.

  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #13 - November 30, 2010, 03:00 PM

    Eid whatchyasaynow?
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #14 - November 30, 2010, 03:02 PM

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eid_al-Mubahila

    19:46   <zizo>: hugs could pimp u into sex

    Quote from: yeezevee
    well I am neither ex-Muslim nor absolute 100% Non-Muslim.. I am fucking Zebra

  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #15 - November 30, 2010, 03:08 PM

    lol I think it's some shia thing, I heard about this meeting with Xtians, Shia use it as a sign that Mohammad proved his family were holy or something.

    Where is the source for this:

    Quote
    Eid al-Mubahila in 2010 is celebrated on November 30 and is a sound primer for the faithful in Islamic techniques of argument.


    It doesn't have a reference.
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #16 - November 30, 2010, 09:00 PM

    Moving to the Religion and God board. parrot

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #17 - November 30, 2010, 09:38 PM

    lol I think it's some shia thing,

    Yep.

    I heard about this meeting with Xtians, Shia use it as a sign that Mohammad proved his family were holy or something.

    And that Muslims are superior to Christians.

    "Life is not a matter of holding good cards, but of playing a poor hand well."
    - Robert Louis Stevenson
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #18 - December 02, 2010, 03:22 PM

    I'm sure a debate between 7th century muslims and christians must have been really enlightening and loaded with reason and logic.

    anyway, it is kind of funny, since you seem to be ignoring something your lord Jesus said....Why do you see the speck in your neighbor's eye, but do not notice the log in your own eye? You will find many of the 'Feasts of the Saints' filled with much worst and sillier stories.

    The foundation of superstition is ignorance, the
    superstructure is faith and the dome is a vain hope. Superstition
    is the child of ignorance and the mother of misery.
    -Robert G. Ingersoll (1898)

     "Do time ninjas have this ability?" "Yeah. Only they stay silent and aren't douchebags."  -Ibl
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #19 - December 02, 2010, 03:31 PM

    I also haven't heard of this eid before.. but anyway, what exactly happened when the christians came to debate? They got scared of Mo sitting on top of the mountain or something? It doesn't make sense  wacko. Anybody have the real account of what happened?
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #20 - December 02, 2010, 04:10 PM

    It probably didnt.
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #21 - December 09, 2010, 10:38 PM

     mysmilie_977 I never hear of this debate before. Since it happened in Mohammed's life time it likely took place with apostate Christendom. So examining it would be of very little value if the hoped for out come was determining the superiority of life style Christians or Muslims. None the less the subject sounds interesting for the sake of expanding knowledge.

    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #22 - December 11, 2010, 08:41 AM

    Eid whatchyasaynow?


    Just picked some one to reply to.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eid_al-Mubahila

    I hope you are doing well Hassan.
    It is never a problem to be kind.
    Pauk was being just cruel and foolish.
    Hopefully not worse.

    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #23 - December 11, 2010, 08:46 AM

    I posted a link to Wikipedia. Take a look. Did it or didn't it really happen?

    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #24 - December 11, 2010, 09:00 AM

    Nopes, never heard of that one. And I still live in a hardcore religious Muslim country!

    ETA: never heard of it in a sense that no Muslim country celebrate it (to the best of my knowledge that is!).

    ...
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #25 - December 11, 2010, 09:22 AM

    Okay so it's not celebrated know.

    Did it happen?

    Did Muhammad invite this Christian to a debate (curse)?

    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #26 - December 11, 2010, 10:35 AM

    Okay so it's not celebrated know.

    Did it happen?

    Did Muhammad invite this Christian to a debate (curse)?


    The celebration? I don't think it is or was celebrated at all. I would have heard about it.

    But if you are asking about the debate issue, then it must have happened in Muhammad's time. It is mentioned in the Quran after all.

    Quote from:  3:61
    Then whoever argues with you about it after [this] knowledge has come to you - say, "Come, let us call our sons and your sons, our women and your women, ourselves and yourselves, then supplicate earnestly [together] and invoke the curse of Allah upon the liars [among us]." (61)


    ...
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #27 - December 11, 2010, 10:51 AM

    Shit is it that time of the year again?


    The language of the mob was only the language of public opinion cleansed of hypocrisy and restraint - Hannah Arendt.
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #28 - December 12, 2010, 07:12 AM

     mysmilie_977 For goodness sakes no!!!!

    YOU MISSED IT AGAIN. finmad

    It was NOVEMBER 30th this year.
    Next year it will appearently be some other random date to be announce at some future time. parrot

    Anyhow, well...

    Hummm...ahh...Thank you for the pretty card...

    But I really can't accept it.
    I never take part in interfaith celebrations.
    It is against my religion.

    I will however remember your great kindness of reaching
    out to curse me as belated as your efforts are.

      Big hug Big hug Big hug Big hug Big hug Big hug Big hug Big hug Big hugBig hug

    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Eid al-Mubahala - Feast of Cursing the Christians (Nov 30 2010/24 dhu al-Huja)
     Reply #29 - December 12, 2010, 07:24 AM

    Thanks RIBS,

    Yeh, I looked up some more stuff, seems like dead end subject. Nothing happening currently, at least not in the real world.

    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
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